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freagle ,

Study history, specifically Napoleon

freagle ,

I think perhaps you have no idea what you’re talking about. Napoleon invaded Russia THROUGH Ukraine. The Third Reich invaded Russia THROUGH Ukraine. NATO expanded it’s undemocratic transnational nuclear military founded by the USA and staffed with Nazi officers all the way across Europe, gathering Nazi collaborators into leave-behind militias through Operation Gladio and explicitly did not expand into Ukraine because everyone in the world knows that putting a military on the Ukraine border of Russia means invasion. Russia did not invade Ukraine to attack and occupy Europe. Russia attacked Ukraine to occupy the border region with activated military forces, securing it against further expansion of NATO along the exact border that Europe has used to kill millions of Russians multiple times.

freagle ,

The first one? Which first one?

freagle ,

Oh wow. I didn’t hear about this at all!!

freagle ,

Oh, man. Wait until you learn about how the USA was formed, developed, and expanded.

freagle ,

What a moronic take. As though whether or not Russia decides to take all of Europe is based on this one border conflict

freagle ,

Whooshed

freagle ,

Even if this were true and from a credible source within WikiLeaks, the idea that whistleblowers should be impartial is not something I have ever heard. Assange is trying to stop the world’s most violent and virulent warmachine. Working with Russia and likely China by proxy, there are sophisticated theories of action about how best to do that.

But honestly, Clinton was losing no matter what because her strategy was flawed, which we have ample evidence of because she still won the popular vote! You can’t have it both ways.

freagle ,

You have to understand that moderate positions or centrist positions are compromised positions. That means that you start with a position you have, then someone takes up a different position and then you change your position based on the relative location of their position. That’s not a great way to go about arriving at positions. In fact, it’s a guaranteed way to never actually get anywhere because your opponents merely need to go more extremely in one direction and you’ll just get dragged along.

What you think of as extremists on the side of communism are people with positions that have literally been around for over a century and have been based in an adherence to scientifically analyzing human society to arrive at their positions. Does that make them extreme? Would you say the same thing about climate scientists? Do you think it’s extremist to hold firm to positions that have been well and thoroughly analyzed and arrived at through rigorous study and debate?

freagle ,

The USA partnered with the German company, Siemens, to install hidden wiretaps into the phone equipment that was used by every embassy in the world. For years the USA had access to literally everything that ambassadors from every country were saying.

Then we have the USA Congress holding a trial after it was revealed that every telecom company in the country broke the law and spied on all internet traffic and gave it to the NSA. The result of that trial? Retroactive immunity for all involved and changes to the law to make it legal going forward.

Then we have the Snowden leaks that show the NSA has chosen “market solutions” for data gathering, meaning that they will collaborate with private companies, even funding them through the network of money, so that those private companies gather as much data as they can on citizens so the NSA can buy it. They also have major partnerships to install persistent vulnerabilities that they can exploit, and there are major revelations in the leaks about how they influence which companies but which companies in order to ensure control over the startup tech that doesn’t collaborate with military intelligence.

Prism, Raptor, Echelon - these are the programs we know about. There are undoubtedly a number we don’t.

Then you have Oracle, Palantir, AT&T, Verizon and many other tech companies that were either founded by, funded by, or wrre revealed to be infiltrated by military intelligence.

Military intelligence influences cryptography at the highest levels, pushing for specific algorithms to be adopted by ANSI and ISO as the default recommendations.

USA spies get jobs in American tech companies. That’s part of the program. High level State Department and Military Intelligence officials take executive jobs openly in companies like Facebook, Twitter, and Google.

And then they lie about it, have been lying about for decades, and create clear and obvious propaganda that belies their motivations. When TikTok was being accused of being Chinese spy tech, the USA forced TikTok to give control of its USA operations to a USA tech company with executives and staff from the USA State Department and Military Intelligence. Even after this happened, they continued to publish scare articles about TikTok being Chinese spyware even though in the USA it was controlled entirely by the government.

The USA has 600+ military bases around the world, it has secret black sites in dozens of countries where it conducts torture, bio experiments, and illegal operations explicitly to avoid legal troubles in the USA (because they aren’t there) and legal troubles in their host country (because they have immunity).

Compare that to China.

freagle ,

That’s a HUGE decrease. I thought the USA was trying to decouple from China, migrate European industry here, and build a weapons supply chain? What’s going on?

freagle ,

This is how proxy wars go. The Republicans aren’t bought out by Russia. The USA uses proxies for specific strategic goals. When the goal is achieved or becomes untenable, they cut off the proxy. That’s just how it goes.

To avoid showing voters the realpolitik they need some plausible reasons for cutting off the proxy. Usually it’s a combination of fiscal responsibility noise and isolationist noise. This is no different.

The USA was provoking Russia. Russia got provoked. The USA activated some sleeper cells, those cells got neutralized. The USA wanted to see Russian capabilities, they got what they could, including intel on hypersonic missile performance, but I don’t know if they got what they wanted.

And then multiple fronts got opened up against the West (Niger, Palestine, etc) and threat escalations emerged in unexpected locations (Iranian missiles im Venezuela). And it’s become clear the West can’t produce the war machine it needs for the conflicts that are coming. So, it’s time to cut off the proxy. Russia doesn’t have the means to occupy Ukraine. The USA is not worried about Russian expansion, so there’s no more reason to be there, except of course the rhetorical reasons that were used to mask the proxy nature of the conflict in the first place (russophobia, anti-communism, moral posturing, etc). So, to control the domestic mood, the Republicans get to play their part as dirt bags, make a bunch of rhetorical noise about why we can’t fund them anymore, and psyops adds some Russiagate flavor through networks of influence to mask the reality: the proxy has outlived its usefulness and the USA is cutting them off.

freagle ,

The average age of Ukraine’s army shot up by almost 10 years. They have depleted their troop count, a tragic example of killing off all the military aged males through war.

freagle ,

Just look at the rhetorical narratives in both the government and the media over the last 2 years and you’ll the narrative has been shifting this way for many months, and the foundation for that shift was the completely inconsistent and illogical political theater of the Rs vs the Ds

freagle , (edited )

You cannot reason with empire-building dictators that ignore all such restraints.

This is correct, which is why Russia ultimately invaded Ukraine, because after 30 years of trying, it was deemed impossible to reason with empire-building dictators in the West that ignore all restraint.

  • 600+ global military bases
  • pulling out of the intermediate nuclear missile treaty
  • killing state and military officials via executive order anywhere in the world
  • spending more on military than the next 10 countries COMBINED
  • imprisoning 5 times the number of people they represent in world population, and the most per capita than any other nation
  • wire tapping their entire citizenry, every single embassy, and accountable to no one
  • dozens of black site in countries around the world for torture, medical experimentation, and illegal operations
  • dropping more bombs on Korea than all forces combined dropped bombs in WW2
  • transferring nuclear technology to Israel
  • training hundreds of dictators and death squads throughout Latin America to kill indigenous, black, and left-leaning innocents
  • training terrorists all over the world, supplying them with arms and intelligence
  • protecting their oligarchs, making the richest people capitalism has ever produced, while life expectancy drops precipitously, maternal mortality grows past the worst in the developed world, homeless increases, and food insecurity spreads
  • withholding life saving medicines from the world’s majority to ensure profit margins for their oligarchs
  • launching wars for oil
  • being the only country to use a nuke against humans, doing it twice, and doing it against civilian population centers
  • enforcing collective punishment regimes for multiple generations to cause immense suffering and death in multiple countries
  • creating a transnational nuclear military without democratic accountability, staffing it with Nazis, protecting Nazis by distributing them all over the world, creating underground Nazi militias all over Europe, then vetoing and voting against every attempt at the UN to condemn the glorification of Nazis

You are 100% right that you cannot reason with empire-building psychotics, but you have the finger pointed in the wrong direction.

freagle ,

I ask this a lot, but why prefix fascist with Christo? ALL European fascism has always been Christian and explicitly so. It’s an inheritance from the Holy Roman Empire that dominated Europe and engaged in ethnic cleansing in the name of God. It’s the same Christian Manifest Destiny that genocide the indigenous in the western hemisphere. It’s the same Christianity that led to an explicit policy of rape by the Spanish all over Latin America to breed out the unclean blood and save as many souls as possible. It’s never NOT been Christian.

Just call it what it is. It’s fascism. It’s the same fascism.

freagle ,

But it sounds like it’s somehow different from regular fascism when you qualify it with a prefix.

freagle ,

You mean fasco-christianty? As in some Christianity is fascist but not all Christianity? That’s not the point. The point is that all fascism so far has been Christian. Qualifying fascism by saying this fascism is Christo fascism makes it seem like it’s somehow different from regular fascism

freagle ,

It’s liberal brain rot to rip everything out of context and just assume each concept is a perfectly impenetrable frictionless sphere that exists in the realm of forms.

The real reason for the comparison, however, is to allude to the way the USSR marched to Berlin, liberating most of Europe from the Nazis, defeating 80% of the Nazi forces, and did so through superior supply chains, superior manufacturing, and superior grand strategy (not just battlefield but also social, political, and economic), which creates the spectre of Russia continuing to expand Westward, which creates the case for expanding NATO funding, putting all of Europe on austerity and a war footing, and getting the Americans to show up and fight the Boogeyman.

U.S. racks up munitions costs in indefinite fight against Houthis (www.washingtontimes.com)

Those strikes come with a significant price tag. In some cases, U.S. forces have used Tomahawk missiles, which can cost about $2 million each. But even beyond the costs themselves, analysts warn that the U.S. is quickly depleting its weapons stockpiles, which were already running thin after years of military support for Ukraine...

freagle ,

Wtf?

freagle ,

Tibet and Xinjiang are literally autonomous ethnic regions that are under local governments of Tibetans and Uighurs, respectively. No one has any concerns about the poor donating plasma or Canadians pushing euthanasia to the poor, but you’re gonna just smear scientists because of Westoid propaganda?

freagle ,

Such fucking grotesque politician theater. They have the power to do so much more. They use their power, deliberately, on the smallest acts of symbolism. They are taunting us.

freagle ,

Is this that new Russian secret weapon?

freagle ,

The US has been prosecuting domestic genocide since it’s founding. They were forcing hysterectomies by law up to the 1970s. There was a fucking State Eugenics Board in North Carolina and the involuntary sterilization laws in that state weren’t repealed until 2003.

The USA has always been a psychotic bloodthirsty genocidal regime and everyone has known for a long time except most Americans, most Canadians, and average Brits. This particular genocide in Palestine is finally waking those people up to the truth.

freagle ,

It’s probably the extent of Russia’s operational support for African nations decolonial struggles, but it’ll be spun as Trump garbage

freagle ,

If it’s truly disruptive tech, and we know about it, we don’t want Russia to know we know.

freagle ,

I would like to learn why the indigenous vote is for the KMT, which is the party responsible for the 40-year white terror

freagle ,

Then why were nazi officers placed in charge of NATO? Why did the Vatican and the USA rescue hundreds of Nazi officers and give them secret identities, money, security details, and relocate them all over the world? Why did the USA and NATO create “leave-behind” militias from former Nazi groups and Nazi-aligned groups all over Europe? Can Scholz talk about Operation Paperclip, Operation Gladio, or even just the open history of Nazi officers in NATO?

freagle ,

You misunderstand history. Hitler wrote in Mein Kampf that he was following the USA’s program. His top leaders studied USA implementations of apartheid, eugenics (started in Britain), domestic control, and propaganda. The first gas chambers for large scale murder were the French gassing revolting slaves in Haiti. The USA isn’t run by zombie Hitler, it’s run by the people that Hitler was mimicking.

freagle , (edited )

It’s an unbroken continuous culture, my friend. Forced hysterectomies were official policy through the 1970s to sterilize a third of Puerto Rico and many indigenous women. Black people are overwhelmingly incarcerated, the USA still imprisons more of its population than any other country in history, and it uses those prisoners as slave labor to produce $11 billion in goods and services while also charging them $100 - $300 per day for being in prison. Child separation is still happening in 2024. Immigrants are kept in solitary confinement, which is torture. Alabama just gassed a man to death and every observer said it was torture.

The USA bombed peasants around the world for decades. North Koreans needed to live in caves to avoid the amount of napalm the USA dropped on them after destroying quite literally every bombable target in the country. The USA continues to engage in collective punishment and uses anti-communism as its reasoning, just like the Nazis did.

The Banderites in Ukraine. The neo-Nazis in the USA. The Brothers of Italy. It’s all happening right here in the present, in an unbroken line of politics and culture that predates the Third Reich by centuries. The empire the USA inherited from Western Europe (because the USA was led by people from Western Europe) was just as brutal, enslaving, raping, pillaging, and bloodthirsty as the USA was with oppressing the indigenous people who were here and are still here despite the genocide. The USA still supports that genocidal history and still upholds that the genocide gives them the right to the land and to destroy that land. The indigenous are still fighting for their lives against the same USA socio-poitical history that Hitler referenced in Mein Kampf as his model.

freagle , (edited )

That’s because, like a classic liberal, you jumped into a thread that was making a comment about Scholz, made some vague word noises that implied a position on that topic, and then when you were confronted about the topic with facts you can’t actually handle you need to jump back to the parent topic in order to change the context so you don’t have your fragile worldview challenged.

freagle , (edited )

Because Europe never invaded Russia through the border at Belarus. They always invade Russia through Ukraine. First Napoleon, then the Third Reich.

Russia was appeasing the fascist West as they expanded their multinational nuclear military without democratic accountability into territories populated with leave-behind armies of fascists that they created. Ukraine was the obvious redline because it is the dominant strategic border, as demonstrated by all European and Russian military strategists in history.

You’re confused about history because you don’t understand it.

freagle ,

That’s literally how all negotiations work. Hostage negotiations - you take hostages and then negotiate for benefits in exchange for release. War negotiations - you dominate a space and then negotiate for benefits in exchange for ending violence. Unless you’re the USA, where you dominate a region after the majority of forces are already defeated and then when someone tries to negotiate their surrender you nuke 200k civilians.

freagle , (edited )

Smooth brain take. You can’t negotiate unless there are stakes on both sides. Why are you people so daft?

freagle ,

The USA nukes two civilians cities in Japan DURING negotiations for surrender.

freagle ,

Putin has been calling for negotiations since he took power 20 years ago. He’s been appeasing the West and their insistence on marching the world’s first transnational nuclear military to Russia’s borders while asking for negotiations the entire time. In 2014 he ordered the invasion of Crimea in response to USA-backed militias violently taking over Ukraine by storming the capital and forcing the president to flee under threat of death and he was still talking about international agreements and negotiations. Negotiations have always been on the table.

freagle ,

The intent to annex Ukraine as a forward operating base for NATO dates back to the fucking 90s under Clinton. Do you need to see a todo list before you are satisfied? Thank god you’re not responsible for national security of a nation of millions.

freagle ,

Appeasement does not work. It has never worked. It didnt work in Sudetenland

And it didn’t work for Russia when they appeased the USA as they marched NATO all across Eastern Europe and installed nuclear capabilities aimed at Russia. Russia has appeased the USA for too long. They decided to act in Ukraine finally because Ukraine is THE strategic red line. Both Napoleon and The Third Reich invaded Russia through Ukraine because it is strategically the best path. The USA took up nearly every other borderland with Russia except Ukraine, saving it for last, and Russia appeased and appeased. It stopped at Ukraine.

freagle ,

No one ever invaded Russia through Estonia. The last 2 massive invasions that killed millions of Russians were through the border with Ukraine - Napoleon and The Third Reich. You can’t just pretend that every inch of border is equivalent. If you’re going to pretend you know history, at least don’t expose your clear confirmation bias.

freagle ,

What’s wild is that Western PR was actually saying that Russia was going to invade and Ukraine kept saying that they weren’t.

freagle ,

Wow. It’s happening.

freagle ,

So we don’t have wolves that are different from those we had before. We have the same wolves we had before and also we don’t have other wolves we also had before.

freagle ,

Bullshit, that was a great response

freagle ,

Stop being contrarian and write a better response then

freagle , (edited )

Tell me you live in a fantasy land without telling me that you live in a fantasy land

freagle ,

To maintain their empire

freagle ,

They’re looking for a way out to maintain the system. Right now, tech is not strong enough to allow the bourgeoisie to defeat the proletariat. They need to be able to neutralize massive numbers of people to prevent a revolution from ending class society. Autonomous weapons systems are the obvious move. Not sure how neuralink fits in, but these fuckers are just looking for leverage

freagle ,

It is true that a cornerstone of US policy is to foment reaction and anticommunism everywhere, but a cornerstone of any communist revolutionary state must be to be able to deal with it. However, I disagree that the color revolutions created revisionism. They did not bring Kruschev to power, they did not create Kruschev and his posse, nor their political positions.

So while reactionary elements in the Eastern Bloc were supported by the West, in the central committee during the days of Lenin and Stalin I don’t think you’ll find much evidence of it. The failure of the USSR was in the central committee and the ascendance of the counter revolutionaries who were motivated and powerful in their own right. The vast empire supporting them seemed to work at a distance, primarily creating external pressures, not internal ones. The empire made the USSR suffer economically, caused brain drain, caused the focus to be on proxy wars instead of domestic development. It’s not like the situation in Iran in '53. The counter-revolutionaries in the USSR weren’t backed directly by the CIA, they weren’t brainwashed, they weren’t directed.

If the USA has gotten soft, then it’s not the formidable power it once was.

My words were unclear. The USA has not gotten soft. It’s just that the whole idea that it was a formidable power in WW2 is sort of just not true. The USSR defeated 80% of the Nazi forces, the rest of the Allies combined fought 20%, the USA only a portion of that. The rest of the US’s “formidable power” was spent killing peasants, and they still lost to guerilla warfare. The Nazi army was the most advanced and powerful army the world had ever seen, not the USA army. The USA continues to operate the strongest spy network in the history of the world, it’s still as strong or stronger than it was in those days. It’s just that the material reality is that this strength is not enough and perhaps was never enough. The Western Europeans were already struggling with colonialism by the 1800s and had begun developing neocolonial superstructures long before the USA unseated them. Once the USA unseated them, the USA inherited a world where the development of advanced guerilla warfare was showing North Atlantic military strategy to be fundamentally incapable of sustainable occupation.

And it certainly has gotten soft. As I’ve said before, the current leadership consists of Cold War mummies and their sons who grew up in the End of History. I believe that the growth of BRICS and the push towards dedollarization, the ICJ ruling against Israel, countries pulling out of ECOWAS and AFRICOM, the deal China made with Saudi Arabia to normalize relations with Iran, these are all signs of the empire’s decline.

There’s a huge difference between the empire getting soft and the periphery getting strong. Everything you’re saying is evidence of the periphery getting stronger. You could propose the hypothesis that this is all the fault of the USA getting soft. I find that hypothesis underwhelming. It takes away agency from the periphery. The hypothesis I think has more evidence behind it is that the strength of the USA is now irrelevant in the face of the contradictions of empire. Neocolonialism and neoliberalism were attempts at solutions to those contradictions, but they don’t seem to have worked out for the empire. I think the periphery has gotten better at analyzing the material conditions and are exploiting those conditions to finally turn the tide against empire. I would not characterize that as the USA going soft.

Trump actually just pulled all US troops out and surrendered Afghanistan back to the Taliban

This didn’t happen: militarytimes.com/…/trump-ordered-rapid-withdrawa…

Instead, here’s what we see: factcheck.org/…/timeline-of-u-s-withdrawal-from-a… “The fact is, President Joe Biden and his predecessor, Donald Trump, were both eager to withdraw U.S. troops from Afghanistan and end what Biden referred to in his Aug. 16 speech as “America’s longest war.””

Your belief in the conflict between the parties can only be formed by filtering out evidence like this. Which, not to blame you, is actually what most people do.

Trump pulled out of the TPP

The TPP was never approved by Congress. Trump formally pulled it from the table. I don’t have a full analysis on the whys and wherefores of the maneuvering here. Congress is mostly millionaires. They come together all the time for the interests of the rich. The fact that they didn’t ratify the TPP tells me more about the flaws in the TPP than it does about the conflict between parties.

this most recent obstruction of Ukraine funding

Obstruction of Ukraine funding is perfectly timed to fit the timeline of other proxy wars. The Ukrainian’s don’t have enough soldiers, the Russians have destroyed everything the West has given to Ukraine. It no longer serves the interest of the USA to keep the proxy war going, so it’s Congress’s job to stop it. If Biden and his cabinet stopped it, they would publicly have to take up a position the Ds are not willing to take publicly because it will cost them votes. So now its Congress’s fault. The reality, however, is that this is continuous with the history of US proxy wars and quite frankly it’s the only way the Ds could stop funding Ukraine if that’s what they wanted to do. It seems that it’s exactly what they want to do.

limits on the movement of capital between the UK and the rest of the EU

The UK doesn’t want to be harmed, so they protected themselves. They aren’t opposing the USA by doing it, not in any meaningful way, they’re just following their profit motive and risk profiles. There’s no chance the UK attempts to assert dominance of the empire nor that it attempts to undermine the empire in favor of the Axis of Resistance, and there’s no chance it’s going to ride it out alone without the support of the empire. What you see as a schism I see as merely bureaucracy.

It shows contradictions within the logic of empire, not division within the empire. The partisanship is the current strategy of the owning class to manage those contradictions to avoid revolutionary conditions.

Maybe you’re right, but they didn’t need to do that before.

They did, but differently. There was a time when one party was all about the working class and the other was not. There was a time when one party was all about industrialization and the other was not. The history is rife with sloganeering, minor rebellions, etc. I think you’re correct that there’s something distinct about its character today. I think your diagnosis is off. I think that the culture war is all that’s left to them, and I think the nature of the culture war is that it is self-reinforcing, creating a runaway schism. But that schism is rhetorical and electoral for leadership, and personal, emotional, and moral for the populace. If the USA had a way out of the contradictions of empire, political energy would go towards that path, but I think we’re seeing that the empire is trapped and all of that political energy has to go somewhere that is infinitely expansive - culture war.

trying to make it illegal for Trump to run for office and Trump promising to jail his political opponents, but that could all be theater like you said.

I think this whole thing is being carefully managed. The timing of it is ridiculously obvious. It always needs to reach critical points at specific electoral windows that are too short for anything to actually happen but long enough for it to mobilize voters. It’s a total choice whether Trump ends up in jail or not, and that choice is going to be made on the basis of the consequences for the maintenance of empire.

These are outgrowths of partisanship that the empire manipulated people into, but now the blowback is setting in and this partisanship is starting to make empire management more difficult.

I just don’t think TPP and Brexit make it more difficult to manage empire. Empire is more difficult to manage because BRICS, the BRI, Chinese debt forgiveness, and the productive capabilities of the periphery are all taking up the space the empire needs to inhabit.

How about the so-called “labor shortage”, which is in direct contradiction with anti-immigrant/anti-refugee partisanship?

This is part of the set of contradictions that go along with the labor aristocracy in empire. From a purely economic situation, they would just flood the nation with migrants and tank wages, but there would be revolt. The migrants would eventually revolt as well, developing solidarity with the working class, so we need jingoism against the migrants. Now we both need cheap labor and also can’t have cheap labor. But the evidence of what I’m saying is here: politico.com/…/biden-urges-bipartisan-border-deal… Both parties want the same thing.

The rest of your contradictions are things I agree with. I just don’t think it’s the ruling class in contradiction with itself. Capitalists are all in on the US Dollar. Europe is primarily consumer market at this point. There will be rifts in the empire as European politicians attempt to stay in power by courting BRICS for energy and goods, but capital is going to stay with the US. This is because the USA is strong, not weak, but also because that strength cannot resolve these contradictions.

Texas blocking federal border patrol agents

That’s one to watch for sure. Balkanization of the USA points to some interesting conclusions. But this is long enough. Thanks for the chat.

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