Imagine that, some people are actually willing to sacrifice for change, unlike your useless ass who only seems interested in criticising those actually acting.
I'm not sure if you're bootlicking for billionaires intentionally or not, but attacking those attacking them with your useless armchair "meaningful solutuion" only serves them...
they used biodegradable paint, because they anticipated comments on the internet like the one you have made, complete with an ad hominem attack. the boat didnt need to be repainted.
where would you like them to “plant trees” in the meaningful way you would prefer these “idiots” to do? In the acres of land they happen to own that they can reforest with native species, yes? Perhaps you should contact them to remind them about the land they own that they’ve forgotten about.
what they’re doing is getting headlines and drawing attention to how “billionaires should not exist”, which they’ve done. People are seeing this, people are thinking about it, people are talking about it, people are taking time to hot-take simple solutions to the climate emergency like “them idiot protesters should go plant some meaningful trees”
I'm a progressive. I usually vote Democrat, because the Republicans are horrible. Pelosi represents everything I despise about the Democratic party establishment: serving the corporate billionaires, and blocking anything that helps working people. Sure there are many Democrats who I support, but Pelosi is NOT one of them!
Same WTF done with internet today children shouldn’t be in prison period and should have been immediately not give them until the 15th so they can continue to be cruel to them or time to appeal his decision.
You sure af don’t throw them into adult prison with zero access to schooling, no counseling, and punishments like being locked in solitary for days on end. Not unless you WANT to ensure they stay criminals.
So again, what do you do with them when they have committed further violent attacks against other teens that are trying to get better?
I’m not defending the conditions, but saying stupid shit like “wHy ArE kIdS iN pRiSoN aNyWaY” is dumb. Because they committed violent crimes. That’s why.
You do not put children in adult prison. It doesn’t have the facilities for counseling or education to help them.
You’re acting like they aren’t still minors and we should just give up on them because they’re violent instead of trying to rehabilitate them.
And also, we have no idea if these teenagers were put into jail for violent crimes. There’s nothing saying that in the article. You’ve just decided it out of nowhere and set up a straw man.
No I read other articles about it. Including one from last year when they were first moved out of juvvie.
Gov. John Bel Edwards, a Democrat, announced the decision to move the teens to the Louisiana State Penitentiary at Angola on July 19 after a series of chaotic fights, injuries and breakouts from the Bridge City Center for Youth near New Orleans, including an alleged carjacking by an escaped teen during which a man was shot. Residents in the surrounding community say they’re living in fear and have called for the facility to be shut down.
These are extremely violent teens committing serious violent crimes. After already being in juvvie.
So again, what do you do with extremely violent criminals that break out of juvenile facilities and commit attempted murder and carjacking while they’re on the escape?
You move the violent ones to a facility that can handle violent criminals and keep the ones that want to rehabilitate in a normal juvenile facility.
Why do you keep responding to "So what DO we do?" by just repeating what we shouldn't do?
Sure you can make the assumption that what they did shouldn't have put them in prison, but the legal system did come to that assumption. And you have to either resolve the reason or resolve the solution, you can't just ignore both.
All of them WERE in juvenile detention already. They were moved out after committing further violent acts against other juveniles.
So again, what do you do with violent teenagers that have already had a chance in a normal juvenile detention center and committed further violent crimes while there?
Can you provide a source on that? Also, you can provide a social worker or professional counselor at the very least. Which this prison promised to do and failed to deliver.
Following a slew of alarming headlines about violence, mismanagement and frequent escapes from Louisiana’s juvenile lockups, the state’s governor offered a new solution last week: temporarily moving teens to the notorious Angola prison for adults.
…
Gov. John Bel Edwards, a Democrat, announced the decision to move the teens to the Louisiana State Penitentiary at Angola on July 19 after a series of chaotic fights, injuries and breakouts from the Bridge City Center for Youth near New Orleans, including an alleged carjacking by an escaped teen during which a man was shot. Residents in the surrounding community say they’re living in fear and have called for the facility to be shut down.
At a news conference, Edwards stressed that the Angola move is temporary, aimed at reducing the population at the troubled Bridge City until more secure youth facilities can be built or renovated. The state has too many teens in its care to consider closing Bridge City entirely, he said.
It was roughly 25 kids in juvenile detention already that were too violent for the facility they were in, including breaking out and shooting someone.
Yeah Louisiana is a shithole in a lot of regards. Their prisons are god awful third world hell holes.
I’m absolutely not defending how prisoners, teens or adults, are treated there. It’s abhorrent and the Feds should step in and put some heads on pikes over it.
I’m just saying the article is using “children” pretty loosely here to put an image in your head. These aren’t innocent scared little kids. These are teenagers that have committed very violent crimes including attempted murder.
I agree with you overall, but they are not "in adult prison" - they're in a separate section, fenced off from the rest of the prison. LA juvenile facilities have been in disrepair for years, and the kids often riot and wreck shit (I would too if I were in their situation, so I'm not judging), but that means the normal facilities often aren't suitable either. They're basically renting space from Angola.
We just had some major prison reforms, but we still need a lot of changes to the juvenile system.
That’s quite a wild difference from claiming killing tuna saves the environment.
This is saying they only use farmed tuna from sustainable sources, instead of just fishing them from the wild and reducing native populations, as well as not using drugs, GMOs, or synthetic dyes with those farmed fish.
yes the whole nation is in jeopardy because some warmongers arent getting their promotions... if this is really the case, then the military is being mismanaged way worse than anyone knows.
we could cut those positions outright, and 10,000 others, and still be the biggest assholes on the planet.
I mean, that’s true, but the actual issue is that in the system as it currently exists, the entire reason Tuberville is doing this is to create empty vacancies, in hopes of stonewalling until the Presidential election. The entire plan is literally another attempt at a coup, just looking for ways to have a Republican administration put in a bunch of Yes Men in key positions, if they’re lucky enough to keep the House and win the Presidency. Having cronies in control of the military is no joke.
While we would still indeed be the biggest assholes out there, with a military that would still outmatch much of the world, the difference if that if this is continued to be allowed, there is real risk of the “biggest asshole” military on the planet being controlled by an actual dictatorship, not the dog and pony show we call a “democracy.” A fascist dictatorship that wants to wipe women and minority rights off the map and take us back 100 years or more.
I’m no fan of the milquetoast wimpy Democrats who watch the Republicans break rules all the time and are unwilling to play hardball themselves, but whinging while ignoring the literal rising threat of fascism that’s out there making plans to take power isn’t gonna help.
So, to quote a great man, “You’re not wrong, Walter, you’re just an asshole.”
Did I argue that they aren’t complicit or did I point out that what’s happening is literally part of a plan for an intended coup by the way more fascist of the two shitty parties?
We can suck major balls and you can still live in fucking reality where if the Republicans succeed at this, they will be using the military to root out and murder people like you and me, just because they can.
Democrats just want to be rich fuckwits above it all, but Republicans legit want to fucking hurt people, and ignoring that means you’d rather play pretend that we could just dismantle the military overnight. We can’t dismantle the military industrial complex we don’t have the political power. So in the meantime, let’s live in fucking reality and understand our own limitations shall we, hmm? Because acting like something we literally don’t have the power to do is something we should focus on while the fascists are at the gate is fucking nanners, to put it lightly.
We can be upset about more than one thing at once. Our military spending is out of control, and one person in congress should not be able to grind government functions to a hault.
OP is right, this is just a veiled attempt to maintain vacancies in the hopes of getting a republican president.
They learned from their mistakes last time, and they’re going to try again later.
Honestly, I think you give Tuberville way too much credit in terms of political machinations. I think he’s just very, very stupid. Every sign I’ve seen points to that.
I don’t think anyone is suggesting that Tommy Tuberville is a mstermind who conceived of, and is executing, a grand scheme. Just that someone told him to do something and he’s doing it.
Literally their playbook for decades. The government sucks in their hands because they make it suck, not because it’s inherently ineffective. But suckers are gonna suck.
Remember when they held up the judicial nominations under Obama, only to force through a massive number of federal judges (and three Supreme Court picks) once they had control again? You can see how they're doing the exact same thing with the military right now.
Now imagine if, on January 6th, the military was being run by MAGAts.
yes the whole nation is in jeopardy because some warmongers arent getting their promotions
The whole nation is in jeopardy because these leadership positions are being held open until Trump is reelected in a rework of the Merrick Garland SC nomination. Which should be terrifying. Jan 6 failed in part because some of the military top brass (Miley) put oath before Trump.
Read up on Project 2025 if you haven’t. These “unconnected events” are anything but. It’s a strategy.
yes the whole nation is in jeopardy because some warmongers arent getting their promotions... if this is really the case, then the military is being mismanaged way worse than anyone knows.
When you refuse to fill management positions, yes, it will become even more mismanaged. Moreover, this is still messing with people's pay and families as well. You can't really cut management positions in the military and expect it to function. Our readiness will absolutely be hindered.
You can hate the army, but they're also one of the biggest suppliers of aid to other countries. Their logistics and planning help save more lives than you ever will, plus they save more lives than they actually ever take in combat.
You're no better than a Republican who just wants to shut down and obstruct without offering any actual assistance or plans to move forward. You're a child not getting their way. Are you related to the Senator as you throw a similar hissy fit?
The theory that as disparate political ideologies move further from the center that they get more alike past a certain point. The spectrum isn’t a line, it’s a horseshoe.
I’ll make the argument that tankies aren’t really leftists tho. They’re some weird amalgam of authoritarian communists. They have more in common with fascists, but they just took a different trip to get there. It’s shitty political convergence
“Nearly 400 officers have joined the round-the-clock search operation for Cavalcante, who was captured in surveillance footage fleeing Chester County Prison by “crab walking” between two walls in an exercise yard, placing his hands on one wall and his feet on another and shimmying out of view. Cavalcante then ran across a roof, scaled another fence and got through razor wire, the prison’s acting warden said.“
That might just be the most expensive wank in recorded history. Man just torpedoed a 95 million dollar contract because he had to get off while on the phone with a prominent sexual assault awareness and prevention advocate.
This is the fruits of the GOP strategy that’s been going on for decades to strengthen their support through Christian believers. The Pope is just recognizing the impact of that from the religious side, whereas Barry Goldwater warned of it’s impact from the political side.
Mark my word, if and when these preachers get control of the [Republican] party, and they’re sure trying to do so, it’s going to be a terrible damn problem. Frankly, these people frighten me. Politics and governing demand compromise. But these Christians believe they are acting in the name of God, so they can’t and won’t compromise. I know, I’ve tried to deal with them.
It certainly is a terrible damn problem, and we’re knee deep in the shit right now.
Some of the replies here are absolutely vile: if you’re going to endorse locking people in cages for years if not decades and pretend that’s a justified response to anything short of their being an immediate physical danger to the people around them, then the least you can do is accommodate their most basic needs and ethical positions.
Prisons are pitched to us as places of rehabilitation - somewhere to pay penance and right wrongs before returning to the community, better for having served the time. I think it’s a deeply disingenuous characterisation which serves mainly to let people avoid facing up to the reality which is prison’s purposeless and ultimately harmful cruelty, but it is the dominant characterisation nonetheless.
But, if we blindly accept the rehabilitation narrative, then how exactly do we expect to rehabilitate people by fracturing them psychologically? By forcing them to violate ethical commitments which are sacrosanct to them, by alienating them from their communities and forcing them to abide by a clockwork dictatorial regime without any semblance of comfort or dignity, by leaving them to rot miserably for years?
No, and no wonder prisons are factories for broken people and recidivism if this is how people think about them. Get a hold of yourselves.
Also, before anybody retreats to the flimsy position of “but prisoners shouldn’t eat better than schoolchildren” or “but what about the poor” - yes, those people are also underserved, and we have resources available to improve conditions for all of them too. All that’s lacking is will.
Last but not least, if you concede that you care about neither the incarcerated nor the society they come from and will return to in time - then there’s also the question of why animals should suffer? If people aren’t even worthy of being afforded their basic preferences, then why should the default be the option which necessitates the lifelong suffering of sentient beings on an industrial scale?
Glad to know veganism is more important than justice.
He doesn’t have the right to be a vegan in prison. He’s in PRISON. Being justly punished. When you’re in prison, you don’t get to live the way you want barring basic human rights, and being vegan isn’t a human right, it’s a lifestyle choice.
Get over that fact and take your cultists out of the thread
he already has PBJs and PBJs are given specifically as a vegan option.
he doesn’t have the right to be vegan when he’s locked up
you don’t have the right to exploit crime threads to push your shitty political agenda.
This thread is not about you, not about vegans, and you coming in here brigading and unethically deciding the fact that a dude who stole billions is claiming to be vegan (whether that claim is true or false) is more important than justice and literally everyone else is unacceptable, get the fuck out of the thread
You. Unless you think we haven’t noticed you’re hiding behind a debate about the importance of punishment, the viability and legitimacy of the prison system and abuses of the U.S. prison system in a situation that has nothing to do with them because you’re trying to promote veganism.
It’s weird though. It’s literally just the guy you were talking to, and another who’s account is only a couple hours old and solely has comments on this post.
It’s weird that every single comment he made would have exactly 3 upvotes only an hour after posting on a 2 day old thread, deep within a comment chain of nearly 20 back and forths.
But maybe not, honestly it’s possible you’re right. It was just pretty suspicious.
I don’t especially care whether there’s a formally enshrined right for incarcerated people to be vegan - I’m saying that if we continue to insist upon locking people in cages with an ostensible objective of rehabilitating them and not simply performing retributive cruelty for its own sake, then we must treat the incarcerated people with diligence and respect as baseline. You can’t expect for well-adjusted people to emerge from a system of institutionalised dehumanisation, cruelty, and uncaring indifference.
I don’t think it’s unreasonable to respect an incarcerated person’s ethical commitment to not exploiting animals, and to be diligent in providing food of a reasonable nutritional standard which doesn’t violate those commitments to consume. Peanut butter sandwiches do not fulfil that criteria by themselves.
I’m not sure what you mean by “my cultists” - I didn’t bring anybody here, and I found this thread independently through my own feed.
In order to preemptively address some of your assertions in reply to another person in this comment thread:
This thread is not about you, not about vegans
It’s not about vegans, no.
It’s about respect for a person’s ethical commitments in a scenario where you’ve deprived them of the ability to satisfy those commitments themselves. My argument would not have to substantively change in order to comment on a person whose religious dietary restrictions aren’t being respected by the available options, to give an alternative example.
It’s true that the final paragraph of my original response speaks specifically to animal liberation, but that’s because I’m passionate about that issue independently of this one. That said, I think my original reply would remain perfectly sound with that paragraph removed if you’d prefer to take it that way.
the fact that a dude who stole billions
I don’t think the crime or characteristics of the incarcerated are especially relevant here. My argument would remain unaltered if the incarcerated person was poor, from a marginalised background, and in prison for much less exceptional reasons.
is more important than justice and literally everyone else
I don’t think that whatever justice there is to be found in the prison system is nullified by respecting incarcerated people’s ethical commitments, and I think that applies to all incarcerated people.
Unless you think we haven’t noticed you’re hiding behind a debate about the importance of punishment, the viability and legitimacy of the prison system and abuses of the U.S. prison system in a situation that has nothing to do with them because you’re trying to promote veganism.
I’m a prison abolitionist first and foremost, and I thought that’d be clear from the overall thrust of my original post - but apparently not. Respect for the incarcerated, their humanity, and their ethical commitments is very much the compromise position.
Well, good news: prison absolutely is for punishing people, not rehabilitation. And it never should be. Prison should never go away, specifically to spite disgusting monsters like you who want to do away with justice, ensuring that no one who does evil things will ever see meaningful life-rendering consequences for their actions.
You’re the kind of person who ruins the lives of abuse victims. Who tells rape victims that they need to put aside their emotions for your idea of a greater good while nothing is ever expected of their rapists or of you. People like you destroy millions of lives peddling this shit – there’s even a CSA survivor in the comments calling out another one of your ilk.
I’m a prison abolitionist first and foremost, and I thought that’d be clear from the overall thrust of my original post - but apparently not. Respect for the incarcerated, their humanity, and their ethical commitments is very much the compromise position.
No, what you are is an apologist. The idea of doing away with punishment, even prison, is nothing more than cheap apologia, anti-survivor, anti-justice, completely immoral and anti-human. Though given veganism is being used as the main driver for you to peddle your evil political agenda in this thread, it wouldn’t surprise me one bit if you truly did not give a fuck about any of that.
I nor anyone else with decency, goodness and common sense are going to give you or your evil ideas any quarter nor should they. The very idea of doing away with punishment or even prison given the horrific reasoning you hold for it is morally repugnant and can be dismissed on its face.
You are disgusting. Get away from me. I hope you never get what you want.
I don’t care about sharp words from a brutish authoritarian.
You’re free to continue endorsing an institution and approach which generates further undesirable behaviour as recidivism whilst preventing little wherever it’s implemented. You can continue to pretend that criminality is a phenomenon completely local to the actor and not a reflection of broader social and structural issues which we need to address. You can proceed with turning out more victims by proxy of the traumatised ex-incarcerated continuing to deal harm if it’ll satisfy the sadistic streak inside of you demanding that infractions incur the infliction of suffering and trauma in turn.
Regions which engage with mass incarceration and operate more sadistic prison regimes overlap with those regions with the highest rates of repeat offending. That’s not a coincidence, but a product of thinking like yours.
Prisons which exist with actual commitments to rehabilitation, and which respect the dignity of the incarcerated, while imperfect, turn out far fewer repeat offenders than those who don’t.
If you care about victims of abuse, as I do, then you’ll turn instead to approaches which result in fewer of them to be counted: alternatives to incarceration, and the pursuit of relative normalcy within the institution for the incarcerated where it still exists.
I hope for a future without coercion, abuse, violence, or pain. I would hope that we all do.
I don’t care about sharp words from a brutish authoritarian.
But you do care about writing a half-page’s worth of the most obscene, arrogant, self-satisfied, apologist garbage you can muster because ultimately, this is about the lack of respect you have for other people, especially abuse victims who you step all over to get what you want. Like here:
If you care about victims of abuse, as I do, then you’ll turn instead to approaches which result in fewer of them to be counted: alternatives to incarceration, and the pursuit of relative normalcy within the institution for the incarcerated where it still exists.
Who, in the world, would reasonably listen to someone like you? Someone who thinks like that? You know there are actual CSA survivors in this thread, right? Possibly even rape survivors? And you’re here talking that kind of shit thinking you know them better than the rest of humanity and have the right to speak for them?
Did you know I am an abuse survivor? That most of my friends are? Did you ever even think to emphasize with me, or ask me who I am or why I feel the way I do?
No. You absolutely did not. It didn’t even cross your mind to, because you’re a disgusting abuse apologist who doesn’t give a shit about anyone other than yourself. You likely only support getting rid of punishment specifically because you know it will hurt everyone else.
Don’t listen to him, pretty sure he’s a troll. Also looks like he has alts, as every one of his comments immediately gets upvoted two or three times, while comments like yours get downvoted. It’s pathetic.
Prisons are pitched to us as places of rehabilitation - somewhere to pay penance and right wrongs before returning to the community, better for having served the time
In America? many states don't even pretend with that pitch. They want to be "hard on crime" and "give justice to victims". And voters vote for that.
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