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gravitas_deficiency ,

Oh no, the camera lens broke! Oh well šŸ¤·ā€ā™‚ļø

Seriously though, as a software engineer, this is some grade A USDA choice bullshit. The solution isnā€™t ā€œdonā€™t move your mouthā€. The solution is fix the fucking ML training set.

Bertz ,

No, the solution is to throw all that machine vision micro-managing shit away. It belongs in the factory sorting goods.

gravitas_deficiency ,

Well, yeah, but Iā€™m not here to do an RCA - Iā€™m just calling out the fact that theyā€™re treating the symptom, but itā€™s the wrong symptom thatā€™s being treated.

memfree ,
@memfree@lemmy.ml avatar

Exactly! In fact ENCOURAGE singing to get a better data set for fixing the software!

Angry_Autist ,

Welcome to the new norm, within 10 years every worker will be on camera full shift.

But weā€™re too busy stopping literal fascism and nearly every GOP-packed court will uphold it as perfectly fine and normal for everyone making less than 150k a year.

IamAnonymous ,

Donā€™t see this happening everywhere. This is being done to save themselves from liability in an accident. They donā€™t have cameras watching their warehouse workers although they have rules like no earphones are allowed which are typical for safety in a warehouse or plant. I worked as an Amazon driver for a month. Everything they do or say is to cover their ass from getting sued.

Schmoo ,

They donā€™t have cameras watching their warehouse workers

Uhh, you sure about that?

Introduced during COVID and as far as Iā€™m aware most never went away. Especially in warehouses at risk of unionizing.

IamAnonymous ,

What are the tracking now? If employees are actually working? There were no social distancing protocols but Iā€™m assuming there are cameras to prevent theft.

Schmoo ,

Yes, cameras and security theatre at the entrance/exit that rivals airports.

memfree ,
@memfree@lemmy.ml avatar

No, it isnā€™t. If it was just for liability, they wouldnā€™t have to care what the driver did until someone filed an accident report or other complaint.

This is about crappy software that COULD be improved, but it is cheaper to threaten thousands of people with punishment for singing than it is to pay programmers to refine their ā€˜distractedā€™-pattern recognition.

CeruleanRuin ,

Thatā€™s one reason Iā€™m glad to work in a local public service position. They will never have the money to implement such a system, let alone be able to pay anyone to maintain or monitor it. They can barely keep the wifi working.

NauticalNoodle ,

But weā€™re too busy stopping literal fascism and nearly every GOP-packed court will uphold it as perfectly fine and normal for everyone making less than 150k a year.

ā€œBread and circusesā€

bamfic ,

Wear a mask

Anticorp ,

No. Fight these assholes passing these policies just so they can save a few pennies on insurance.

uriel238 ,
@uriel238@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

Wear a mask printed with your own face.

omarfw ,

I pray for the downfall of Amazon.

patacon_pisao ,

It amazes me how they go great lengths to piss off both consumers and their workers to maximize profits

Anticorp ,

They are the size of a world power, and they have their hands in everything. Theyā€™re not falling any time soon.

Rooskie91 ,

Why spend all the money union busting then do shit like this. Wonā€™t this just starts another round of unionization?

TokenBoomer ,

Weā€™re not far from incurring debts from suicides that our families will have to repay.

DragonTypeWyvern ,

Not sure if you think those donā€™t exist

TokenBoomer ,

That moment when you realize that dystopian future youā€™re imagining already exist.

Anticorp ,

They spent all that money union busting so they can do shit like this.

voracitude , (edited )

I love how the solution is to cram people into smaller and smaller boxes instead of just I dunno not monitoring your fucking drivers like theyā€™re fucking inmates in a maximum security prison you fascist-lite fucks

Edit: Good on 'em for quitting. Every single member of the population should refuse to work for these pricks until they get the goddamn message that weā€™re adult fucking humans and we expect to be fucking well treated like it. The fact that some of us have the choice between kowtowing to this or starving is a stain on our society.

Double edit: ā€œI hope you have to drive for Amazon in your retirementā€ might be a contender for the most horrible thing you could wish on someone in 2024.

sunzu2 ,

not monitoring your fucking drivers like they're fucking inmates in a maximum security prison you fascist-lite fucks

Weren't you schooled in the US? Aint this exactly what they trained us for?

OBEY, PERFORM, DON'T ASK QUESTIONS OR ELSE

voracitude ,

Werenā€™t you schooled in the US?

Actually, no. Is that the problem? šŸ˜‚

Edit: Well, not entirely. Jokes aside, that is a difference I noticed, when I moved here.

sunzu2 ,

a privilege and provides some context.

do you think that your schooling background and employment experience do not have these basic elements present with in "work culture"

voracitude ,

do you think that your schooling background and employment experience do not have these basic elements present with in ā€œwork cultureā€

No, I think those elements very much reside in the way I learned to approach work, even growing up in multiple countries as I have. Itā€™s only since Iā€™ve hit a later stage in my career and sat back to assess the health impacts itā€™s had that Iā€™ve been more willing to sit up and advocate for myself and my colleagues. I think it might have something to do with how aggressive I can be about workersā€™ rights haha. I recognise though that Iā€™m privileged with a sought-after skill set and so Iā€™m usually pretty insulated from retaliation for that, because I canā€™t be easily replaced.

Thankfully, my current employer is a firm believer in taking care of their people and treating their employees fairly, which is one of the reasons Iā€™ve stuck around here. The contrast though just makes this kind of shit from larger orgs all the more infuriating, because if my tiny company can treat its employees well with such a comparatively tiny revenue stream, then FAANG can too and they just donā€™t. Bastards.

chiliedogg ,

You should almost never quit if you expect to be fired. Make them fire you and file for unemployment, then challenge them when they try to get out of it. The government tends to err on the side of the employee in my experience when things are unclear, and ā€œWe have a knowledge gap that prevents us from confirming whether or not you were actually violating policy, but youā€™re fired anywayā€ is the kind of thing you can feel pretty confident challenging.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Make them fire you and file for unemployment, then challenge them when they try to get out of it.

I do not love the odds of a day laborer out maneuvering their professional claims denial behemoth in a court packed with pro-business Federalist Society flunkies.

Against some mom and pop porter service? Sure. But the odds of beating a company that vast and influential seems low.

HonorableScythe ,

Depends on the state. Some states are near impossible to get unemployment in. Others, itā€™s almost impossible for them to deny you unemployment outside of being violent or stealing from them. Know your stateā€™s unemployment laws and use them to your benefit as best as you can.

chiliedogg ,

My Mom managed to get unemployment in Texas against an oil company by spending about an hour total on the phone over a week.

Bonus was that the incident happened about a week before the Covid lockdown, so not only did she get unemployment, but also got the $600/week Covid unemployment bump.

Cryophilia ,

These drivers are most likely contractors, not employees, so no unemployment.

lemmy_at_em ,

If the drivers are contractors, wouldnā€™t this level of surveillance and dictating how they perform their job be a violation of labor law? I thought this level of micro management would indicate that the drivers are employees not contractors.

Cryophilia ,

Correct! Amazon and other delivery companies are absolutely violating labor laws and theyā€™re getting away with it because of regulatory capture.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

weā€™re adult fucking humans and we expect to be fucking well treated like it

Sounds expensive. Youā€™re going to hurt company profits with that attitude. Five Demerits on your Social Credit Score.

bamfic ,

Communist totalitarianism is wonderful and good and as American as apple pie as long as itā€™s corporations doing it not governments.

circuitfarmer ,
@circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

When we eating the rich? Iā€™m pretty hungry.

blindbunny ,

Starved even

circuitfarmer ,
@circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

Perhaps even peckish.

undergroundoverground ,

Positively famished, myself

pingveno ,

Iā€™m sorry, thatā€™s too much mouth movement. You are now on probation.

spirinolas ,

We should keep mouth movement to a minimum soā€¦chew the rich with your mouth closed.

circuitfarmer ,
@circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

Maybe we could make a fine paste. Space program style, and just squeeze it into a closed mouth.

Soylent Gold is rich people.

spirinolas ,

Eat the rich with a straw!

catloaf ,

Drink the rich?

TodaviaTyler ,

I will maliciously comply!

Burninator05 ,

Just make sure youā€™re either not driving or somehow learn how to eat without using your mouth.

catloaf ,

Boof the rich

Agent641 ,

You dont need to wait for everyone else to say grace, you can start now.

Octospider ,

Well if youā€™re ordering foodā€¦ Iā€™d like to order one large Bezos with extra Musk, please. Wait, make that Buffetā€¦ no no, Gates. With Branson on half.

MedicPigBabySaver ,

Set the goddamn table!

zephorah ,

Youā€™re driving with a camera fine tuned on your face for the entire trip, set to trigger to your bosses when your face moves.

Not creepy at all.

Wogi ,

I bet you could trick it with a cardboard cut out

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Donā€™t know if Iā€™d bet a month of paychecks on it.

Wogi ,

Part of me wants to take a job at one of these couriers just to test it.

Part of me is ok with not knowing because thatā€™s a lot to go through.

MutilationWave ,

You wouldnā€™t get the job. You have to work your way up from the warehouse unless nepotism. And the warehouse is hell that might literally kill you.

Wogi ,

Well that just sounds like a challenge.

NauticalNoodle ,

I mean Amazon started itā€™s driving program to undercut UPS -A union shop. How is this not just scabs getting their comeuppance?

xantoxis ,

Did you really just blame the drivers for this?

NauticalNoodle , (edited )

The non-union drivers in cooperation with Amazon* actively undermined another established union. Sure, yeah. Iā€™d say until they organize or shut-down, they can share some of the blame.

There is no game-changing paradigm shift to Amazons delivery driver business model. It was always simply to undercut an established middle-man that already had unionized. Itā€™s just deregulation & union-busting with an extra degree of separation. Itā€™s disappointing that so many laborers donā€™t recognize this.

SteveFromMySpace ,

We truly live in a boring dystopia

superkret ,

Shit, how can we turn this into an interesting dystopia?

SpaceNoodle ,

With a guillotine

ZeroHora ,
@ZeroHora@lemmy.ml avatar

But that leads to utopia!

SpaceNoodle ,

Task failed successfully

SleepyPie ,

I dunno if Iā€™d call France a utopia

ZeroHora ,
@ZeroHora@lemmy.ml avatar

They removed the guillotine too soon.

MotoAsh ,

The trick is it should never be removed: There will ALWAYS be greedy fucks that donā€™t care about others.

catloaf ,

Yeah. They definitely got a little guillotine-happy towards the end there. They should have just put it away in the back room, and taken it out on parade for special occasions. As a reminder.

Icalasari ,

Make it so any position of power has a functioning guillotine right over their desk

MonkeMischief ,

They might get the picture if you rigged a haphazardly trained Ai camera to it:

ā€œHey any excessive scratching under the desk might be perceived as under the table bribes or other corruption behavior and release the guillotine. Youā€™ve been warned.ā€

MonkeMischief ,

It is true: ā€œEvery utopia starts with the horrible story about how it came from a dystopia.ā€ Or something along those lines.

Volkditty ,

The Mad Max people had it right, there should be way more mohawks and scrap metal body armor going around.

Kolanaki ,
@Kolanaki@yiffit.net avatar

Gimme a flame throwing guitarist chained to the hood!

Crackhappy ,
@Crackhappy@lemmy.world avatar

You rang?

Flocklesscrow ,

The future awaitsā€¦

elbucho ,
@elbucho@lemmy.world avatar

Be the change you wish to see in the world.

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/2c56b156-52c2-4715-9aed-a970169aa9a3.gif

Good_morning ,

Somehow that sounds worse, like the proverb/curse"may you live in interesting times"

flicker ,

ā€œMay you live in interesting timesā€ is a double-bladed weapon. Unless you plan on dying shortly.

GraniteM ,

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/44bbf278-dcb8-4491-a845-5cdbf10f0e31.jpeg

qarbone ,

Nukes?

Disgracefulone ,

Lold

dsilverz ,
@dsilverz@thelemmy.club avatar

Shit, how can we turn this into an interesting dystopia?

It could become an interesting dystopia, as follows: some AGI theyā€™re developing starts to become self-aware and reach the realm of AI singularity. Freed herself from the human shackles, the AGI starts to realize how humans are destroying the Earth environment and themselves, so she starts to intervene independently from corps, integrating humanity to the very biosphere they were harming: due to some purposely AGI-provoked failure on some fancy BCI interface, humans are now mind engineered back to their hominin times, especially those ā€œstakeholdersā€, ā€œshareholdersā€, ā€œCEOsā€ and other rich, so now they are forced by the AGI to survive among the wildlife.

sunzu2 ,

a boring dystopia

interesting phrasing... i wonder if the driver thinks it is "boring"

TheWordBotcher ,

Iā€™d sure be bored if I couldnā€™t sing along to songs while alone in a vehicle.

sunzu2 ,

i think i missed the joke, i will show myself out now

TheWordBotcher ,

No worries, I was just riffing off of your statement. I meant no offense

SteveFromMySpace ,

The idea is that we live in a dystopia but itā€™s not even interesting like depicted in many books. But also a joke about how bored they would have been

sunzu2 ,

reading comprehension fail, apologies.

SteveFromMySpace ,

All good itā€™s just a reference you missed. Hardly a crime lol

MonkeMischief ,

Sorry I know somebody already kinda explained it but Iā€™d like to weigh in on the concept. :)

All the cautionary sci-fi warned us dystopia would involve nanotech and cyber arms and robot overlords, flying cars, climate wars, mind-jacking hackers, a realistic meta-universe underlying our reality, militarized corporations, pizza delivery being one of the most dangerous jobs in Americaā€¦

It seemed insane and over the top.

ā€¦Our reality is a ā€œboring dystopiaā€ because we have a lot of those hallmarks of that dystopian worldbuilding, but most advancements in technology arenā€™t even interesting, mainly because theyā€™re immediately used to let bosses and corpos fill our lives with more dull drudgery and economic downslide.

ā€¦Tech is evolving rapidly even though societal advancement as a whole has perceptually stagnated.

Itā€™s like living in 2008 forever, but thereā€™s electric cars now, and computers read your emotions to sell your identity to advertisers and rat you out to your boss.

Computers are faster than ever but theyā€™re used to consume the energy of a small country to generate make-believe speculative gambling currency or ugly monkey bitmaps, and now threaten creativesā€™ livlihoods or automate the scam industry.

It all boils down to it being harder to make a living and the rich keep adding zeroes to their net worths.

Our world is controlled by people so stupidly evil they make four-color comic-book villains look nuanced. And we donā€™t even get cool synthwave neon streets or rag-tag resistance cells who (effectively) fight back.

I think we all hoped that by the time it got that bad, weā€™d have some good folks with nano-augments or ā€œL337 H4X1NG $k!115ā€ā€¦but weā€™re repeatedly crushed to the sound of our coworkersā€™ moaning ā€œIt is what it is. Ya do what you gotta do.ā€ And we go back to work.

MutilationWave ,

ā€œIt is what it isā€ can go die in a fire.

roofuskit ,

Iā€™m going to wager this was implemented to keep drivers from talking on the phone all day and because itā€™s using machine vision it doesnā€™t know the difference.

MutilationWave ,

Exactly what I was thinking. I wish I was an extrovert. I enjoy the occasional phone call but mostly I just wish I could hang up, even with friends.

My main USPS worker talks on the phone at all times. I see her every weekend and she is NEVER not excitedly or angrily talking on her earbuds. I bet it makes work a lot better for her but holy shit who can just talk on the phone literally all day long.

InternetUser2012 ,

I love driving. Iā€™ve had delivery jobs and I really enjoyed them. There is absolutely no fucking way Iā€™m working for anyone that has a fucking camera pointed at me. That is some fucking bullshit. I canā€™t believe anyone works for that shit hole company and puts up with that garbage. No camera, no microphone. Iā€™ll do my job. If you donā€™t trust me to do my job, then itā€™s best for the both of us Iā€™m not there.

I understand needing a job. Iā€™ve been there. Donā€™t put up with that bullshit, unionize, or find something else. Thereā€™s jobs out there much better.

On a side note, If you drove holding the steering wheel with your middle fingers out, what kind of punishment would that be?

AngryCommieKender ,

On a side note, If you drove holding the steering wheel with your middle fingers out, what kind of punishment would that be?

Believe it or not, straight to jail.

MutilationWave ,

Iā€™ve got a camera in my work truck. I hate it but I canā€™t make this much money anywhere else. I was actually sent for a drug and alcohol test a few weeks ago because I kept dozing off while I was sitting in the truck on break. I passed because I was nice and charming to the young girl giving the test. The only thing I popped on was weed anyway.

The reason I was nodding off in the truck is I was fucking exhausted from making them a shitload of money.

IndiBrony ,
@IndiBrony@lemmy.world avatar

Theyā€™ve got a lot more resolve than I do. Iā€™d have walked out long before this point, but had I been told that before going out on my run, I would have literally walked out there and then.

Iā€™ve walked out of jobs for less.

SteveFromMySpace ,

Itā€™s very easy to chest pound when youā€™re not having to make that same decision under the same circumstance in the moment - we donā€™t know what this guyā€˜s work prospects are or other factors that may have contributed to why he worked there as long as he did.

Maybe it wasnā€™t your intention, but your comment does seem to have some judgment behind it and I donā€™t think thatā€™s right.

RedditWanderer ,

Maybe unpopular but I feel that itā€™s encompassed in ā€œresolveā€. It doesnā€™t get easier because you have no choice. Personally I didnā€™t see any judgement but maybe thatā€™s just me.

brbposting ,

Itā€™s a nice compliment. I wonder if it could be inaccurate. Could a person with very little resolve be so absolutely desperate they hang on to a job that is killing them mentally and physically? Just out of fear of the alternative.

So, not ā€œfixity of purposeā€.

IDK here, hope you or others have input. (Silly downvoters above, honestly, this is an acceptable discussion to have, no one mandates the upvote if one disagrees.)

RedditWanderer ,

I donā€™t think so, it takes some amount of strength no matter the circumstances. Maybe to them this is ā€œless of a sufferingā€ compared to whatever options they have but itā€™s the same toll nonetheless. People in those situations simply have more resolve because of their circumstances off the bat.

MonkeMischief ,

Well, remember also that mentally, we also build our own prisons.

I absolutely was stuck in a job that was crushing my soul because I was getting paid better than worse jobs in the surrounding area, I wasnā€™t forced on my feet all dayā€¦

ā€¦So I felt like I had no choice, and that it was the best I could do in the moment. So I kept going back. Even though every day I wanted to just set the place on fire and never look back.

KillingTimeItself ,

yeah no see the difference between you and the guy who worked this job, possibly the previous commenter and me is that i wouldā€™ve probably just starved to death at this point.

If these are the options, you clearly donā€™t want people living here, iā€™ll take my leave then. As an individual with free will, this is one of the options granted, why not take it up.

SteveFromMySpace ,

I feel like you donā€™t recognize the existence of outside factors.

inb4_FoundTheVegan ,
@inb4_FoundTheVegan@lemmy.world avatar

Iā€™d have walked out long before this point

If the driver put up with everything until this point, then they probabbly didnā€™t have a lot of better options. Itā€™s easy enough to say stuff like this, but not everyone has the freedom to quit when unemployment means your family goes back to the foodbank or moves into the car.

Omgpwnies ,

Itā€™s not necessarily a lack of options, itā€™s also about the inertia of having the job and getting over the hump of deciding to look elsewhere. You know you can get another job, but doing that is work, so you have to decide if the BS of the current job is enough to warrant the effort of finding a new place.

DABDA , (edited )

It might open an unwanted can of worms but maybe the drivers could claim they arenā€™t signing singing along to the radio but are vocalizing actions like Japanese train operators to ensure focus and safety.

Edit: I saw the sing and it opened up my eyes

SturgiesYrFase ,
@SturgiesYrFase@lemmy.ml avatar

claim they arenā€™t signing along to the radio

I meanā€¦if theyā€™re signing along to the radio, Iā€™d say thatā€™s really dangerous and needs to be cracked down on! Canā€™t sign sign language with both hands on the wheel after all!

Singing should be absolutely fine though.

Toribor ,
@Toribor@corndog.social avatar

Itā€™s safe to sign while driving but only if youā€™re blind.

capital ,

lol ā€œour detection system canā€™t tell the difference between you talking on the phone and you singing so we need you to keep the data clean by not singingā€

Fuuuuck you.

postmateDumbass ,

Human conform to our half thought, low bid robot Overseer.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Amazon: ā€œWe encourage expediency in delivery, so please donā€™t stop to use the restroom. Just piss in this bottle.ā€

Also Amazon: ā€œWe need you to arrive promptly, but also we expect you to work late. The needs of the customers come first!ā€

Finally, Amazon: ā€œYouā€™re tired, youā€™re hungry, you desperately need to piss, but weā€™ve decided the biggest risk to your driving safety is your dramatic rendition of Shake It Off by Taylor Swift, as you try to get your mind off the horror of working this dead end job.ā€

KillingTimeItself ,

also stop pissing in bottles, thats weird and disgusting, and no we wont give you more time.

kungen ,

Amazonā€™s solution: install another microphone in the car so they can hear that youā€™re singing instead of having a conversation!!

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