There have been multiple accounts created with the sole purpose of posting advertisement posts or replies containing unsolicited advertising.

Accounts which solely post advertisements, or persistently post them may be terminated.

arc ,

Carmakers did this to copy Tesla, not realising that Tesla did it to save themselves a few bucks and to hell with the person who suffer a degraded or unsafe driving experience as a result. Witness how Tesla even removed indicator stalks, making it all but impossible for people to safely and legally navigate a roundabout. Who cares if someone crashes, because it’s all about the bottom line.

Gestrid ,

not realising that Tesla did it to save themselves a few bucks

I guarantee you they realized that and likely did it for the same reason.

TexMexBazooka ,

I don’t want a touchscreen in my fucking car. That is all.

TheRealKuni ,

I don’t mind a touchscreen. Apple CarPlay/Android Auto are really nice.

I just also want physical controls for everything the car needs to do to be a car, like climate control or wipers or shifting. And also physical controls for play/pause, skip, volume, and tuning.

Touchscreens can do a lot to enhance the car experience, but they cannot replace physical buttons.

Electromechanical_Supergiant ,

The car experience

The car experience is driving.

We don’t need 6 different fuel efficiency visualizations and we sure as fuck don’t need games or videos in the car.

TheRealKuni ,

Sure. I don’t want games or videos (though I can see how that would be useful while waiting for an EV to charge).

I just want Apple CarPlay/Android Auto. Or, failing that, whatever controls are necessary to facilitate an infotainment system.

Electromechanical_Supergiant ,

How much entertainment do you need while driving? Can’t you just plug your phone in for some music?

Do you really need a maps app built into your car when you already have one on your phone?

I just can’t see a reasonable use for an infotainment system that isn’t already taken care of perfectly by the device I already have.

TheRealKuni ,

In my older car, I have a mount for my phone because it does not have GPS. But it does work just fine for Bluetooth.

CarPlay is a lot easier to use. As was Android Auto when I had an Android phone.

These also give me greater flexibility with regard to mapping. I can, for example, simply tell my phone to navigate to my wife’s location. (Obviously not a dealbreaker to not have, but convenient!)

It can also be really nice to have a side-by-side view of the media player and the maps.

I dunno, it’s not like I wouldn’t buy a car that doesn’t have CarPlay, but that car would lose some points in my mind. It’s the kind of thing I didn’t think I’d appreciate as much until I had it.

Aceticon ,

If it’s the kind of thing that it’s not reasonable to expect that people will stop by the side of the road to do, it should be buttons. The rest can be touch.

So for example setting a destination on your navigation interface is fine to do via touch screen, but starting/stopping swipers or changing audio volume is not.

TheRealKuni ,

Very well put.

deafboy ,
@deafboy@lemmy.world avatar

I’d go as far as mounting a full size qwerty keyboard on the steering wheel. Although we’d somehow have to deal with the shrapnel grenade situation as soon as the airbag hits it.

MonkeMischief ,

But if I’m gonna go out, having WASD forever embedded in my forehead is kinda metal.

bufalo1973 ,
@bufalo1973@lemmy.ml avatar

I’d rather have a “non-touch” screen with buttons in a car. Just to show info. And be it right in front of me.

CrowAirbrush ,

Can we complain more about subscription paywalled car functions then?

HouseWolf ,

You want buttons back because they’re easier to use

I want them back because I think car interiors look bland without them

We are not the same…alright I also want them back for the first reason aswell.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Safer to use.

A_Porcupine ,

Thank god. This is literally the worst thing about my car (apart from the lane assist trying to kill me).

snaggen , (edited )
@snaggen@programming.dev avatar

I found that a homicidal lane assist, have a really good effect on my alertness. Before lane assist I could relax and almost doze of, but with lane assist I don’t dare to relax for a second since I know it will try to murder me the first chance it gets. So, I guess that is why people say lane assist prevents accidents.

skeezix ,

So they’re targeting gay people now?

nsfwthrowaway411 ,

I have a feeling the people down voting you didn’t see the typo

skeezix ,

He fixed the typo. It’s no longer homocidal.

snaggen ,
@snaggen@programming.dev avatar

Corrected my typo, so contextually challenged persons can avoid being confused. You are welcome.

skeezix ,

Your spelling is homogeneous now.

Polyester6435 ,

Lane assist on the golf tried to murderise me recently even though I was driving on a road without lane markings

Polyester6435 ,

Lane assist on the golf tried to murderise me recently even though I was driving on a road without lane markings but I keep it on because it stops me from killing myself on this one bridge I have to drive over

Theharpyeagle ,

Wait, you don’t mean dozing off while driving, right?

havocpants ,

My car lets you turn off lane assist, it’s the collision avoidance that I can’t turn off that is trying to kill me. Randomly I’ll be driving along when an alarm sounds and it tries to swerve off the road. It’s fucking infuriating and dangerous and despite many of us complaining to the manufacturer you can’t turn it off.

Everythingispenguins ,

Is it on an independent fuse? If so just pull the fuse

MonkeMischief ,

Man do they still do that with these “smart features” or is it all just linked to an inexplicable welded shut black box now? Lol

Everythingispenguins ,

Honestly I have no idea. Often they run different features through different control modules, but every car is different.

NoSpiritAnimal ,
@NoSpiritAnimal@lemmy.world avatar

Subaru?

jumpinjesus ,

The capacitive touch buttons under the screen on my ID4 don’t light up, so they’re literally invisible at night and completely useless.

slightperil ,

Do you have more unlit buttons than the volume and climate strip that I have in the Multivan? I believe we share that same strip and it’s ironic that the power button on there is actually lit! However as it only does two things and there’s feedback on the screen when you touch it, I haven’t had any of the issues people have complained about. Plus those functions can be accessed elsewhere.

jumpinjesus ,

For the driver, you can access it elsewhere. But to deal with the climate, you then have to go into the touchscreen menu and mess around rather than just turning a dial. The volume is less of an issue as the driver, the volume is on the steering wheel. But the passenger can’t turn down the volume, etc. I love the id4, planning on driving it into the ground, but buttons for functions like that would be better.

locuester ,

You sure you don’t have the fader wheel turned all the way down? It’s usually to the left of the steering wheel.

A_Porcupine ,

There isn’t a fader wheel on the ID.3 at least, so I’d assume the same in the ID.4

danielfgom ,
@danielfgom@lemmy.world avatar

Sanity prevails at last!

Agent_Engelbert ,

Imagine paying the same price for a car that lacks the technology of:

  • Smart screen
    • With heat resistant materials that are designed to resist high temperatures and still function properly (i.e in summer times)
    • With GPS features, and media access
  • But the screen still sucks because you can literally buy a magnet and stick your phone there, and still be able to do literally everything a smart screen car do.

I mean id still buy it because I prefer cars that are not so impractical, but it’s a shame that it still costs practically the same.

Conceptually, a smart screen sounds like a good idea, but the implementation is bad.

mrmanager ,
@mrmanager@lemmy.today avatar

Judging from reviews, people are avoiding VW now because of really shitty infotainment systems…

Two2Tango ,

For me it was this and their build quality, I got the impression they aren’t cars you keep for 10+ years

barsoap ,

Have you tried observing the service intervals.

Two2Tango ,

I drive a Honda it just keeps going

barsoap ,

Yes. Different engineering approach. Performance, efficiency, no mandatory service intervals, choose two.

barsoap ,

It’s a thing Chinese manufacturers are focussing on to distract from the rest of their engineering.

Mr_Blott ,

I’m reading this as “VW is putting buttons back in cars because they reckon the EU is going to slap them for making dangerous cars”

Pirasp ,

That would be funny, but it’s more likely because they are about to go under if they don’t change something up. Doing one of the most requested this seems like a good start in that direction.

barsoap ,

Where with “going under” you presumably mean “doesn’t overtake Toyota and stays the 2nd biggest car company world-wide”. That’s by number of cars, by revenue VW is in first place.

I’d say it’s more a case of “yeah we should’ve guessed that how Tesla does things is just hype”.

nothatnow ,
@nothatnow@sopuli.xyz avatar

Finally people are starting to see that touch screens or any other touch surfaces don’t belong into cars.

TheRealKuni ,

As I’ve said elsewhere, touchscreens are fine in cars for functionality that isn’t something cars already had.

I don’t need a dedicated button for the Now Playing screen on my podcast app. Or for Points of Interest in my Maps app. But I would still like to use those things in my car the way I have become accustomed to.

But I do want physical buttons for everything I’ve always had physical buttons for.

My current car (a 2022 Ford Escape PHEV) has actual buttons and dials for climate control, media controls, etc. Everything you want to be able to do without looking. But it also has a nice touchscreen to support Apple Car Play/Android Auto.

This is the proper balance, I think. Let the car continue to function as a car without the touchscreen, but the touchscreen should be available for the luxury elements a car can provide.

snaggen ,
@snaggen@programming.dev avatar

What?!? Pictures Under Glass turns out not to be the most desired solution for controling your car? Who could have guessed? /s

phx ,

They’re fine for certain things on an evolving menu etc, but not anything where a tactile sense might be needed to avoid distraction. A lack of volume knob is the thing that pisses me off the most in many vehicles, including my own.

Also, power should be a physical cutoff and NOT a soft button for head units. The one of my car is a software toggle and when the system started glitching, froze and also put out high volume noise with no way to kill it except to shut off the vehicle when I could safely do so

barsoap ,

Yep a good rule of thumb is probably “If you aren’t comfortable with having it disabled when the car is moving, don’t make it a picture under glass”. Managing playlists is a thing you can expect people to do when stationary, touchscreen is fine, skipping a song is done while driving, make it a button.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

My '16 Prius has a pretty good balance between touchscreen and buttons. The only thing I don’t care for is having to use the touchscreen to change radio presets, but I usually stay on the same station anyway.

marretics ,

This was a wonderful read, thanks

TheEighthDoctor , (edited )

Unpopular opinion: Unresponsive buttons are just as bad as unresponsive touchscreens. And touchscreens are not bad if you don’t have 5 keys presses to get what you want, if you can customise your layout and if the system is not underpowered as they always seem to be.

bort ,

haptics of a button means that you can keep your focus on the street while pressing a button.

ExLisper ,

Don’t know what buttons or touch screens you have in your care but in my car it’s way easier to hit the button than the exact location on the touch screen. You can ‘feel’ your way to a button on a dashboard, you can’t do it on a touch screen.

lntl ,

i like buttons

MargotRobbie ,
@MargotRobbie@lemmy.world avatar

Replacing the buttons with a tablet has always been a cost saving measure on Tesla’s part that was marketed as “futuristic”, physical switches and dials made of plastic and metal as well as the underlying components will never be as cheap or as easy to wire as a simple touchscreen control. Other car companies followed suit, because Tesla made a method of reducing their own manufacturing costs hip, so many of them jumped on it.

But, Tesla tablets were designed with the belief that this cost saving is possible because of the delusion that full autonomous self driving is possible with existing hardware through software updates. When self driving didn’t happen after a decade of trying, people realized how inconvenient and dangerous it is that the only way to adjust the AC, stereo volume, and sideview mirrors while driving is through a tablet with no tactile feedback. So now, we are finally seeing that trend reversing.

NotMyOldRedditName ,

I don’t think autonomous driving had anything to do with the initial choice. It might be a reason now, but I don’t think it was the initial driving factor.

You left off it being marketed as clean and minimalistic. I think that’s different enough from futuristic. Some people love that aspect, some outright hate it. (Edit and I mean this in a looks fashion, not a functionality one)

tias ,

Especially when the buttons move around in the GUI after an update so you accidentally press the wrong ones, or end up having to search the menus while driving.

Perhaps this could change when we have mainstream tactile displays, but until then buttons will always be better.

MargotRobbie ,
@MargotRobbie@lemmy.world avatar

I think using a car tablet is equally as dangerous as texting and driving. Voice control would actually be better for adjustments while driving.

tias ,

Indeed and it seems attainable now, if it weren’t for the expensive hardware and massive energy required for general pre-trained transformers. Don’t want my car to call home just to run a neural network on Azure, it needs to run locally.

SnipingNinja ,

There’s Gemini nano which will run on phones locally, so I think we can have that soon enough

magic_lobster_party ,

Realtime non-cloud voice control is still unreliable. Gonna be a while before that can replace physical buttons.

lightnsfw ,

I don’t want to have to talk to my car. Just have buttons and knobs. This shit was figured out 30 years ago.

mriguy ,

This shit was figured out 30 years ago

More like 100 years ago.

dual_sport_dork ,
@dual_sport_dork@lemmy.world avatar

Horseshit. My Pentium 133 could do it in 1997.

The send-to-the-cloud thing just exists because tech companies have a pathological fetish for recording, analyzing, and storing every single little thing you say and do and then trying to sell it to advertisers. Or train AI’s with it these days, or whatever the fuck else. The only marginal benefit you might get is that they can update their algorithms server side and not have to update your car or other device. But the technology has been mature for literal decades, so I don’t think that’s terribly important.

That said, I still don’t want my car to have voice control. It’s just as stupid as a concept as making everything touchscreen.

magic_lobster_party ,

Speech to text is one thing. Actually understanding all the intricate details and variations of language is incredibly difficult. It’s good enough for some stuff, but I’ve yet to see a system a system that’s reliable enough for day to day use, especially in a car.

Scenarios like this happens way too often:

“Set alarm for fifteen minutes”

“Ok, setting alarm fifty minutes from now”

“No! FIFTEEN minutes”

“I’m sorry, I don’t understand what you mean”

“Remove old alarm and set it to fifteen minutes instead”

“Playing song on Spotify…”

fosforus ,

I had huge reservations towards Tesla’s control system, but in reality, I got used to it in a week. And I’m loving how clean and sleek the dashboard is otherwise. What I don’t understand is the car makers who include a huge tablet AND a dozen gadgets around the dashboard. That’s worst of both worlds.

computerscientistI ,

Also, Tesla’s button replacements actually do work more or less reliably. The other manufacturers decided to save money by adding a potato instead of a potent CPU that powers the screen in the middle of the console.

MonkeMischief ,

“Finally a use for all these leftover 1st gen Kindle Fire CPUs!”

psud ,

In practice though Tesla has buttons for the controls you need while driving.

Cruise control/lane keeping/cancel is a lever

Indicators, flash high beams is a lever

Park is a button

Windscreen wiper single wipe is a button, same button is window wash

Set speed is a scroll wheel, volume is a scroll wheel (and a touch control on the passenger side)

Navigation is on screen keyboard, but you should stop to change navigation, or have a passenger do it

Climate control heats or cools towards your target temperature, heated seats and steering wheel are automatic or touch screen, but you know you need them before you get in the car

What more would you want physical controls for?

  • All
  • Subscribed
  • Moderated
  • Favorites
  • •
  • [email protected]
  • random
  • lifeLocal
  • goranko
  • All magazines
    •