There have been multiple accounts created with the sole purpose of posting advertisement posts or replies containing unsolicited advertising.

Accounts which solely post advertisements, or persistently post them may be terminated.

Alabama wants to be the 1st state to execute a prisoner by making him breathe only nitrogen

Alabama is seeking to become the first state to execute a prisoner by making him breathe pure nitrogen.

The Alabama attorney general’s office on Friday asked the state Supreme Court to set an execution date for death row inmate Kenneth Eugene Smith, 58. The court filing indicated Alabama plans to put him to death by nitrogen hypoxia, an execution method that is authorized in three states but has never been used.

Nitrogen hypoxia is caused by forcing the inmate to breathe only nitrogen, depriving them of oxygen and causing them to die. Nitrogen makes up 78% of the air inhaled by humans and is harmless when inhaled with oxygen. While proponents of the new method have theorized it would be painless, opponents have likened it to human experimentation.

Chickenstalker ,

If you really want to execute someone and NOT botch it, nothing beats the guillotine.

jcit878 ,

when it fails though, it’s…messy

space ,

Is that what happened to Nearly Headless Nick from Harry Potter?

dabaldeagul ,
@dabaldeagul@feddit.nl avatar

I believe that was using an axe

30mag ,

It’s also messy when it doesn’t fail.

bob_wiley ,
@bob_wiley@lemmy.world avatar

deleted_by_author

    •
    FlyingSquid ,
    @FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

    Have you been to America lately?

    bob_wiley ,
    @bob_wiley@lemmy.world avatar

    deleted_by_author

    •
    FlyingSquid ,
    @FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

    Born and raised in Indiana. Live in Terre Haute, where the federal prison where they execute inmates is located.

    JdW ,

    Well, in Alabama and in in some states (cough, Texas) they probably are I’m afraid.

    Fades ,

    It’s Alabama…

    Monkeyhog ,

    They are, that’s just the truth.

    _number8_ ,

    the state shouldn’t have authority to do this but thank god they’re at least trying to be humane now [an excuse to push for the death penalty more?]

    i mean why is it even a question, i’d happily take this or a simple bullet over the horrible nerve acid shit they use now

    deadbeef79000 ,

    That’s their problem: The nerve acid shit makers had a change of heart and stopped making it.

    It’s a bit of theatre IMHO most executions are extra judicial thank to Dredd cops.

    c0mput0r ,

    This is how I would want to go. Look up BBC Horizon 2008 How to Kill a Human Being. Explains everything you need to know. Seems like states don't want to do it because people wouldn't suffer during execution. Maybe things have changed since then.

    Brickhead92 ,

    Is it really an execution if there is no suffering? /s

    30mag ,

    Seems like states don’t want to do it because people wouldn’t suffer during execution.

    Is lethal injection painful?

    threegnomes ,

    yes, they paralyze you then inject you with poison

    30mag ,

    Being poisoned isn’t necessarily painful. What poison do they inject?

    threegnomes ,

    Here’s an article about it: npr.org/…/gasping-for-air-autopsies-reveal-troubl…

    30mag ,

    It was a severe form of a condition called pulmonary edema, which can induce the feeling of suffocation or drowning.

    I don’t understand how we have problems with people dying in the streets from opioid overdoses or mixing benzos and alcohol, but the government can’t find a way to kill people without drowning them in their own blood.

    DocMcStuffin ,
    @DocMcStuffin@lemmy.world avatar

    Because the cruelty is the point. Nitrogen asphyxiation has been known for a long time. The Sarco suicide pod uses it because it’s a peaceful death. The whole reason it hasn’t been adopted is because they want the condemned to suffer.

    30mag ,

    Well, I can’t imagine why we got rid execution with electricity if they are supposed to suffer.

    sverit ,

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bag

    REdOG ,
    @REdOG@lemmy.world avatar

    Seems like states don’t want to do it because people wouldn’t suffer during execution

    To me it seems like they’re trying to make the process more acceptable to the public so they can delight in more of them.

    Sterile_Technique , (edited )
    @Sterile_Technique@lemmy.world avatar

    Surgical tech here… why not just use Propofol? It’s the shit we use to put people to sleep for surgery.

    It kicks in FAST - when the anesthesiologist pushes that stuff, it can literally take like 5-10 seconds for the patients to go unconscious.

    So… for the death penalty, hit em with the normal dosage to put them to sleep, then once they’re confirmed unconscious, push the rest of the bottle… or a liter of gasoline… or chuck em out the window; it doesn’t matter, as they’ll be 100% unaware of the actual method of death.

    Edit - turns out there’s a lot of good reasons we don’t just use Propofol - see comments below. Thanks for the insight, all!

    vithigar ,

    Because the idea of it being a punishment, rather than remediation or simply mitigation, looms over all North American discussions about sentencing.

    If they aren’t miserable then it’s not a punishment.

    livus ,
    @livus@kbin.social avatar

    In the case of Propofol they did want to use it but were basically banned by the drug company.

    BrianTheFirst ,

    But.. the whole reason we are having this discussion is because people are trying to make the process less miserable in their final moments.

    Colorcodedresistor ,

    deleted_by_author

    •
    HelixDab2 ,

    Manson and his cronies did not exactly die in obscurity. They had, and still have, groupies.

    StorminNorman ,

    They already render the prisoner unconcious when they administer the lethal injection. It’s not 100% effective though, thus the search for a method that doesn’t have the potential to horrify onlookers.

    livus , (edited )
    @livus@kbin.social avatar

    The real answer is that the makers of Propofol specifically don't want you to use it to kill people.

    Furthermore, if the US does use Propofol to execute anyone it will likely find itself suffering a shortage of Propofol to use as an anaesthetic in future.

    @vithigar

    lgmjon64 ,

    They used to use thiopental, which is similar to propofol, with similar onset, both as an anesthesic and for lethal injection. Manufacturers stopped producing it because its use was controversial. Now it’s not even available for anesthesia. It would suck if the same thing happened to propofol.

    FuglyDuck ,
    @FuglyDuck@lemmy.world avatar

    Because the people selling it don’t want to deal with the association with lethal injections

    dutchkimble ,

    Just imagining the reverse, if they used propofol commonly for executions and then you go for a surgery and the doctor informs you that you’ll be getting the same stuff they use for executions, but don’t worry it’s a milder dose

    lgmjon64 ,

    I mean, they DO use midazolam and the same paralytics for lethal injection that are also commonly used for anesthesia, just in a lower dose.

    JdW ,

    anesthesiologist

    There you have it, qualified medical professionals refuse (and are not allowed to anyway because of the oath) to participate in executions. So the people administring whatever concoction is made are not medically trained nor usually even particularily knowledgable on the subject. And yes, this has caused a series of botched executions, to the extent that the most bloodthirsty states are looking at smimpler ways to execute. Hence this aricle.

    Moobythegoldensock ,

    Because using your drug to kill people isn’t the best way to convince the public is perfectly safe. There would be a hundred TikToks talking about how anesthesiologists want to murder you with propofol and then claim you died accidentally on the operating table. Who are you going to believe, actual “doctors” or highly qualified TikTok influencers?

    Yeah, no drug company wants to deal with that. That’s why governments have had difficulty sourcing these drugs and instead have been resorting to black market dealers.

    captainlezbian ,

    It’s one of the more humane methods of assisted suicide. But also it’s the death penalty so not a good thing

    kitonthenet , (edited )

    Ok, so gas chambers again

    Edit: my issue is not with the inhumanity, there is no way the state can humanely kill people. I’m wary that republican governments desire the kind of infrastructure that can quickly and cheaply kill many people at a time, boxcars full, in fact

    snooggums ,
    @snooggums@kbin.social avatar

    No, this is far more humane. The state shouldn't kill anyone since the rate of false convictions is significant, but doing the wrong thing in a more humane manner is better than making an innocent person suffer even more.

    kitonthenet ,

    So it’s a chamber you fill with a gas that kills people, but it’s not a gas chamber

    snooggums ,
    @snooggums@kbin.social avatar

    A gas chamber, as the term has been used so far, is for a chamber where gasses that are not normally part of the regular atmosphere are used to kill someone in violently painful ways with a massive amount of suffering.

    The atmosphere is almost 80% nitrogen, and this approach makes it 100%. It doesn't have the parts we need, but is not introducing something new.

    It is not a gas that kills people, it is the removal of the gasses we need to live without the suffering caused by an increase of co2.

    kitonthenet ,

    I wonder if you were in there, would you appreciate the distinction?

    snooggums ,
    @snooggums@kbin.social avatar

    YES.

    The normal gas chamber causes obvious pain and torment as people vomit and writhe in agony. 100% nitrogen puts you to sleep. If I had an incurable disease with a lot of suffering, or sentenced to death from a false conviction, I would absolutely choose 100% nitrogen over any other method of offing myself.

    kitonthenet ,

    Well, I hope Alabama getting industrial scale killing capabilities is worth dying on this hill

    bdesk ,

    "Industrial scale" is something you made up in this conversation. That was not done in good faith. Have a good day.

    snooggums ,
    @snooggums@kbin.social avatar

    What the fuck are you even talking about? Do you think they are going to implement industrial levels of death penalties just because they found a less horrific way to kill people?

    angrystego ,

    Many ways of killing people can be done on big scale. Do you have some specific information about Alabama planning to make it large scale or are you worried because it includes gas?

    DLSchichtl ,

    All chambers that are not a vacuum are gas chambers

    Silverseren ,

    Always the conservatives trying to innovate on how to kill people.

    Pretzilla ,

    Except the unborn

    And the undead

    30mag ,

    The undead?

    Pretzilla ,

    Yes, The partially reanimated corpse of Ronnie Reagan brought that into question

    30mag ,

    Ew

    mojofrododojo ,

    because the medical companies they got their lethal injections from decided they’d rather not be associated with governmental killing.

    then the foreign countries they bought from decided the same. so now they have to get creative.

    Personally, I’d like to see a 500t press option: literally just drop a 500t weight on me from a 30’ height. By the time my brains register any sensation they’ll be strawberry jelly squishing out the sides of the press plate.

    Franzia ,

    This isn’t a new innovation and is actually aware of the science. I think, however, conservative elected officials will insist on continuing Capital Punishment and the world is forced to work with or in many cases against them.

    flossdaily ,

    That’s a pretty good way to go, apparently.

    But there have been an absolutely breathtaking number of death row cases that have been overturned due to new evidence that had exonerated the condemned.

    It seems pretty clear that the state is doing a very crappy job of determining guilt, and therefore shouldn’t be handing down such a permanent sentence.

    thegreatgarbo ,

    Yep, NO. I’ve tried it. You can’t get a breath and you feel like you’re suffocating.

    DLSchichtl ,

    Then you haven’t tried it. Your body is still able to dump co2, so the asphyxiation effect doesn’t kick in.

    livus ,
    @livus@kbin.social avatar

    deleted_by_author

    •
    DLSchichtl ,

    My wife is a detective and deals with a lot of suicides. Use of nitrogen or helium are the new go to for folks that wanna go peacefully. That’s why the party balloon helium tanks have 10% o2 in them now. They were a popular, cheap method sadly. The human body doesn’t give two shits whether it’s breathing a 80% nitrogen/20% oxygen, or 100% nitrogen. All it needs is something that can displace the co2 in your blood. Nitrogen works just as well as o2 for this. It’s when the body can’t exhaust co2 that it goes into asphyxiation. If you were having problems breathing, you were breathing the wrong stuff. It’s biology, yo.

    livus ,
    @livus@kbin.social avatar

    Good to know.

    I had just assumed the party helium situation was caused by the shortage.

    ZodiacSF1969 ,

    Helium (as a suicide method) has been around a while. My best friend used it to kill himself 13 years ago. Maybe it’s making a comeback.

    whispering_depths ,

    well, the science behind feeling out of breath is CO2 being pumped into lungs from blood, lol

    livus ,
    @livus@kbin.social avatar

    I was beginning to wonder if breathing pure nitrogen was some kind of party trick or rite of passage for science geeks.

    Notorious_handholder ,

    Years ago when I was in a bad place in life I attempted suicide using a tank of nitrogen and an oven bag. Thankfully I was stupid as hell and didn’t tie the bag properly or something. So when I passed out the bag managed to come off somehow. Still not entirely sure how it happened but either way I’m thankful it did and I managed to survive for better days.

    Anyways, Im telling you this to let you know I can very much confirm that breathing nitrogen is painless and was no different than regular breathing.

    Your body only starts the alarm bells when it can’t exchange out the co2 in your lungs. It can’t really tell the difference between pure nitrogen and some other gases coming in vs the optimal mixture we need to breath. So the alarms never really go off. There’s more to the science behind it, but it’s kind of a glaring flaw evolution left in our bodys survival system that can be taken advantage of including for use in anesthetic.

    BrianTheFirst ,

    So did it feel like you just went to sleep and then woke up?

    Glad you did such a terrible job of it!

    Notorious_handholder , (edited )

    Yeah sort of. At first I started feeling very drunk, but not like normal drunk. I can’t really think of good analogy other than it was like half way in between drunk and a small amount of anesthetic maybe?

    It was this slow dip into unconscious, it wasn’t like sleeping where I’m vaguely aware of the passage of time. But it wasn’t the instant knock out of anesthetic or normal unconscious either. It was like lowering myself into a pool if that make sense. Wasn’t a bad feeling, just kind of different. Had an awful migraine that lasted a couple of days afterwards though.

    Thanks I’m extremely happy everday with my failure! Lol

    Aylex ,

    I’m glad you’re still with us, friend.

    Lowered_lifted ,
    @Lowered_lifted@lemmy.world avatar

    Task failed successfully

    jumperalex ,

    I’ve been in a high altitude simulation chamber to experience hypoxia after rapid decompression. 💯 didn’t give a fuck, was a bit giddy, and if left there long enough with dwindling oxygen would have for sure died. No problem taking a breath.

    So in effect, yes tried it.

    SheeEttin ,

    Four of spades?

    jumperalex ,

    haha I can’t remember if we were doing cards like that or not. I remember having to answer questions writing them down on a form. Between the handwriting and the answers themselves it was hilarious; and of course educational. It was for certification to do high altitude jumps. you can bet your ass I made sure I was on oxygen per regs every time. No forgetting to pull the cord for me thank you very much.

    CarterH739 ,

    I have, sort of. I’ve worked HazMat most of my life. One of the jobs I had years ago involved neutralizing a large pit of acid. It was just a huge pit in the ground with a roof over it. From the outside, it just looked like someone had pulled the roof off of a house and set on the ground. There were only two openings, one at either end, so it was completely enclosed. The method here was to send the two youngest (and therefore invincible) guys into the pit with acid suits and full faced respirators, with buckets of soda ash, we walk around in it and stirred it up while we sprinkled the ash around. Safety standards back then were not what they are today. Anyway, the people in charge realized that there would be a reaction with gases betting released, hence the respirators, but no one considered the possibility that the gases might be heavier than oxygen. Which they were. We didn’t know what kind of acid it was but this was an old fertilizer plant, so probably nitric. Which means the gas was most likely nitrogen. Whatever the case, we got into trouble when we realized that we were both getting rather lightheaded. We tried to leave, but the only way out was up a ladder and by the time we got to it the other guy, we’ll call him Rick, could only get about half way up before he just couldn’t move anymore, which left me leaning on the ladder at the bottom, completely unable to help, as I was in the same state. Luckily, our foreman was a lunatic and he jumped in and pulled us out. You are absolutely not supposed to do that because you are just as likely to end up in the same trouble as the guys you’re trying to save.

    The experience with the gas was not unpleasant. I should have been terrified, but was mostly just mildly concerned. The only real effects I remember feeling are the lightheadedness and being really sleepy.

    sndmn ,

    Sure, Jan.

    angrystego ,

    Can you please share more of your experience? What was the occasion and the set-up? What was it like?

    FlowVoid ,

    Nitrogen hypoxia is a risk wherever liquid nitrogen is used. If too much boils too fast, it will displace the oxygen in the room. People in the room won’t even realize what happened until they pass out and die shortly thereafter.

    There are reports of people rushing in to rescue those who passed out, and suddenly passing out themselves and needing to be rescued as well. That’s how insidious it is. And that’s why MRI scanners (which use liquid nitrogen) have oxygen sensors in the room. You can’t trust your own body to tell you that all the oxygen is gone.

    mememuseum ,

    MRI machines are cooled by liquid helium. Nitrogen is not cold enough. I’d imagine as a noble gas it has a similar effect though.

    becausechemistry ,

    They are cooled by liquid helium, but also have a liquid nitrogen outer dewar as well with a vacuum insulator in between. The N2 takes the brunt of the ambient heat so you don’t have to top off the (much more expensive) helium as often.

    ktr41n ,

    Definitely doesn’t seem terribly traumatic - youtu.be/176eog7mZjc?si=B4TPpWw7CJb-IGXl

    (CW - shows pig putting its head into a box filled with inert gas to eat food. The pig falls over, regains consciousness, then immediately places its head back into the box to continue eating)

    feedum_sneedson ,

    That’s not the case with nitrogen asphyxiation.

    oatscoop , (edited )

    I’m willing to bet what you inhaled was carbon dioxide – that gives an instant feeling of suffocation. Which ironically makes it one of the safer asphyxiant gasses, as it’s heavier than air and you can detect it’s presence instantly. Inert (“noble”) gasses like helium, argon, and nitrogen don’t have that effect.

    CO2 is also cheap, readily available, non-toxic, and doesn’t cause physical damage. This makes CO2 asphyxiation somewhat popular for “stunning” or killing in places like slaughterhouses, labs working with smaller animals, or “feeder” animals for reptiles.

    HonoraryMancunian ,

    breathtaking

    Heh

    madcaesar ,

    I used to fully pro death penalty, especially for some of the sick fucks…

    But then I learned about all the false convictions, some COERCED by the fucking police, and since then I’m 100% against the death penalty.

    The satisfaction I get from a heinous killer getting killed, does not outweigh the horror I feel for even one innocent life being taken by the state.

    insomniac ,
    @insomniac@sh.itjust.works avatar

    It’s also cheaper to keep people in jail forever than put them to death because of all the appeals. And despite being more careful, we still get it wrong.

    Agent_of_Kayos ,

    Also, in my mind, death is a release. Keep those fuckers stuck in their filty meat suits while they rot in prison for the rest of their lives with no hope for escape. The especially heinous ones will get extra comeuppance from the other inmates

    nomadjoanne ,

    Right. Even a life sentence can very much be reversed if exculpatory evidence appears.

    SheeEttin ,

    It can be overturned, but it can’t be reversed. You can’t give someone those years back.

    TenderfootGungi ,

    This is what changed my mind on the death penalty. I have no problem putting a murderer or pedo to death, but we keep freeing people when new evidence is found that proves their innocents. Until we can get it right 100% of the time, we should just lock them up until death.

    HelixDab2 ,

    I would argue that we need the death penalty as a way to protect society from the absolutely most dangerous criminals but it’s very frequently misapplied. I would say, for instance, that people that are serial killers, or serial rapists (or serial child molesters), people for whom there is no significant doubt that they’re guilty, and people that will reoffend if they ever manage to get out of prison, should be executed. A simple murder for hire, or a robbery? No. Ed Kemper? Absolutely.

    I think that even life sentences with no parole are overused; most people can be rehabilitated and returned to society safely, if we were willing to dramatically overhaul our criminal justice system to not be based on punishment and retribution. (But if we did that, then how would we get free prison labor…? /s)

    tryptaminev ,

    …m.wikipedia.org/…/Capital_punishment_by_country

    All of western Europe has abolished the death oenalty completely. Many of these are countries with very low rates of serious crime.

    Meanwhile countries with the death penalty, but usually also very long prison sentences and high rates of incarcerations like the US are pretty bad with crime.

    It is impossible to justifiy the death penalty empirically. The statistics actually indicate that the death penalty is linked to more crime.

    Also the problem is, that clear cut beyond a doubt is what every judge who sentences someone to death, will claim about the case. Yet there is hundreds of cases in the US alone, where people were later exonerated. Some only after they have been murdered by the state already. There is nothing to gain, but a lot to loose with an execution. It cannot be overruled anymore.

    HelixDab2 ,

    The statistics actually indicate that the death penalty is linked to more crime.

    Correlation =/= causation. C’mon, you know better than this. It’s more probable that they have lower crime to begin with. Serial killers are not uniquely American by any stretch of the imagination, but they are quite uncommon relative to the population in other developed countries.

    Read what I wrote again. I’m advocating for the death penalty in very, very limited cases, where there is no significant doubt at all, where there is no reasonable or even unreasonable belief that an offender can be rehabilitated, and the offender is extremely likely to harm more people if they ever have the opportunity.

    tryptaminev ,

    Thats why i said indicate not “proof”. But again you say no significant doubt at all. But that is always the case of the people making the decision. For them there is no doubt, yet there is regularly wrong decisions.

    HelixDab2 ,

    Would you then claim that there was any significant doubt as to the guilt of John Gacy, Theodore Bundy, Edmund Kemper, Gary Ridgeway, John Geoghan, et al.? Would you agree that they would have all posed a significant risk of future harms had they managed to escape?

    No proof is 100% absolute; there is always the possibility of some error. Video evidence? Could be tampered with. Eyewitnesses? Memory is fallible. DNA? Must be from someone with near identical DNA. Confession? Those are very frequently coerced (and, seriously, confessions are a pretty terrible way of determining guilt, esp. when there’s no forensic or corroborating evidence). 29 bodies or people you were last seen with found in the crawlspace of your home with your DNA and fingerprints on them? Pure coincidence, it’s too good to be true, must be planted.

    Given that it’s impossible to know a thing with absolute certainty, how good does the evidence have to be before you would admit that there was not a significant chance of a false positive?

    Franzia ,

    It’s wild you disagree with life sentences and desire rehab, but also advocate for the death penalty.

    HelixDab2 ,

    I advocate for it in the case of people that can not reasonably be rehabilitated and pose an unreasonable risk to the existence of other people.

    I don’t know why that’s difficult to wrap your head around.

    You aren’t going to rehabilitate a serial killer, or a serial rapist.

    Franzia ,

    Can’t know if you don’t try. Some artists have come out and said they had these urges and art is the thing anchoring them enough to keep them from doing heinous things.

    HelixDab2 ,

    keep them from doing

    …And there’s your key. Moreover, they think that art keeps them from doing it; they have no way of experimentally knowing whether or not they’d do those things in the absence of art. It seems more likely that art is their excuse and that, in the absence of art, they would find anothe,r different reason to avoid committing atrocities.

    There’s a distinction between wanting to do a thing, and actually doing the thing.

    Agent_of_Kayos ,

    Prisons (at least in the US) have never been about prisoners and their reform. It’s about how much money they can bring in from the state and practically free labor. Like most things in the US it is driving by profit margins.

    …yay capitalism

    HelixDab2 ,

    Eh, no. We had prisons before we used prisons as a stand-in for chattel slavery. OTOH, we used to kill a lot more people for much less severe offenses, so people didn’t usually end up in jails for very long. And there was a period of time where we believed in reform, but that was well over 100 years ago now.

    assassin_aragorn ,

    Yeah this is one reason why I generally don’t support the death penalty. There’s no way to undo it. At least if evidence exonerates someone 50 years later, they’re still alive.

    sverit ,

    Not to give anyone ideas but: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suicide_bag

    gravitas_deficiency ,

    Alabama:

    we’re innovating! :D

    Everyone else:

    bro what the fuck

    torknorggren ,

    “Wat? It’s just unusual it’s not cruel y’all!”–Alabama, probably.

    TimeMuncher2 ,

    I really don't think it would be painless. Probably feel like you are being suffocated and breathe in more air only for it to be without any oxygen and feel even worse. The last moments would be pure mental torture.

    BrianTheFirst ,

    As stated elsewhere, the discomfort that you feel what you're being suffocated is not from lack of oxygen. It is from build up of carbon dioxide. When you are breathing nitrogen, you can still exhale that carbon dioxide. You don't get that panicked feeling of needing a breath.

    TimeMuncher2 ,

    TIL. Thanks for the explanation. Guess i was wrong then.

    neuropean ,

    It’s refreshing to hear somebody admit they can be wrong and learn from it. This platform is pretty cool.

    CaptObvious ,

    You weren’t wrong. There’s an explanation by @protist further down the thread. They make a convincing argument that nitrogen asphyxiation likely leads to generalized pain and terror before seizures and death.

    Djeikup ,

    I think you might be panicking because you know you will die regardless. But then again that’s how all death penalties work.

    Sharpiemarker ,

    Is it a moral alternative to provide the inmate with a choice of execution method?

    intensely_human ,

    6 million ways to die. Choose one.

    Sharpiemarker ,

    I mean that’s fair, but I meant more like “hey you can test this new method of execution, or you can have the lethal injection.”

    Mowcherie ,

    I get that it is ‘humane,’ but I get scared when I see humans developing and organizing highly efficient ways to exterminate humans, such as gas chambers.

    CaptObvious ,

    Suffocation cannot possibly be considered “humane.”

    The US frankly terrifies me these days.

    BrianTheFirst ,

    Nitrogen asphyxiation does not equal suffocation. It displaces the oxygen in your lungs. Discomfort from suffocation is from build up of carbon dioxide, not lack of oxygen. For the brief period of time that you are still conscious, you can still exhale that carbon dioxide.

    CaptObvious ,

    That seems unlikely. As @protist explains further down the thread, it would likely lead to generalized pain and terror before seizures and death.

    BrianTheFirst ,

    @protist is talking about nitrogen narcosis, which is a completely different thing.

    CaptObvious ,

    No, they’re not. Read the post.

    BrianTheFirst ,

    Yes, I did. Read my post.

    They said:

    Nitrogen narcosis happens to deep sea divers breathing compressed air, this would be straight up hypoxia, aka oxygen deprivation. Here’s what it does to your brain:

    Nitrogen narcosis happens because when you are under pressure, like when underwater, gases are more easily dissolved. The nitrogen that is in your body dissolves into your tissues and basically anesthetizes you to death.

    Nitrogen asphyxiation, like what we're talking about here, is when the nitrogen that you breathe displaces the oxygen in your lungs. This causes the oxygen levels in your blood to drop, which is what kills you.

    CaptObvious ,

    You said:

    @protist is talking about nitrogen narcosis

    @protist@mander.xyz said:

    …this would be straight up hypoxia, aka oxygen deprivation

    I have a scuba certification. I know what nitrogen narcosis is. @protist is clearly not talking about nitrogen narcosis. They’re describing what would actually happen in the case of being forced to breathe pure nitrogen, which is straight up suffocation.

    suffocation
    noun
    death caused by not having enough oxygen, or the act of killing someone by not allowing them to have enough oxygen
    –Cambridge Dictionary

    BrianTheFirst ,

    Captain, in my comment that you just replied to, I quoted them literally saying that they are talking about nitrogen narcosis.

    CaptObvious ,

    I give up. They very clearly said exactly the opposite, but if that’s where your reading level is, then you do you.

    CTdummy ,

    In protist comment the “this…” after nitrogen narcosis is meant to indicate a change of topic to the OP. As in “X is boring this is pod racing. “ it’s ambiguous and a semi colon could have probably avoided this confusion. Or even just “what op is describing is”. Not that I think his comment is necessarily correct.

    bemenaker ,

    You are correct that I forgot that you have to be under pressure for narcosis. I have read about death from nitrogen asphyxiation and thought it induced it also. I am slonscuba certified and while I haven’t been narcd, my dad has. You still get light headed and dizzy during asphyxiation from nitrogen due to lack of oxygen, which is part of being narcd but being narcd is worse because of absorbtion into the brain. Since.you are still breathing out CO2 you don’t feel the panicking you’re suffocating feeling, but it still takes 4 minutes to kill you. Though you will unconscious after a minute most likely.

    So yes, you are correct I forgot that it takes pressure to truly get narcd but asphyxiation does still bring on similar feelings itself.

    neuropean ,

    Yes he is. Nitrogen narcosis is from breathing compressed air with a high nitrogen blend. That’s why you need trimix with helium beyond a couple hundred feet. Otherwise you end up like my buddy trying to give fish your regulator.

    CaptObvious ,

    Read. the. damn. post!

    Notorious_handholder ,

    That guy is misinformed. He is talking about hypoxia which is what people commonly think of when dying from lack of oxygen, think of drowning. Hypoxia triggers the alarms in your body that cause the fear and pain you associate with suffocating due to the build up of co2 in the body.

    With inert gases like nitrogen however it is different. Check out this wiki article, in the process drop down tab is provides a pretty good explanation on the matter

    en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inert_gas_asphyxiation

    bemenaker , (edited )

    Not misinformed, I forgot it takes.pressure.to.get narcd, but asphyxiation does cause some of the same feelings. Narcd is nitrogen asphyxiation, but it has other effects, and the feeling is more intense before reaching total asphyxiation, and therefore it is easier to recover from. It takes the pressure for the nitrogen to bind to the oxygen receptors.

    Notorious_handholder ,

    I can confirm from personal experience that breathing pure nitrogen is painless and not at all like suffocating. If you want, you can check my profile to find the comment or look for it further up in a reply to a different thread in this post

    somethingsnappy ,

    Wait, you’re dead? I’m glad to hear it was painless.

    Notorious_handholder ,

    Sadly yes, but I lived!

    Had a hell of a headache/migraine the next few days afterwards though

    somethingsnappy ,

    So it was totally painless and then you had terrible migrains from something else?

    Notorious_handholder ,

    The process itself of breathing in the pure nitrogen and going unconscious was completely painless.

    When I woke up later on I had a terrible migraine that lasted a few days because not breathing in enough Oxygen will cause headaches and migraines. Had I not woken up though then there would not have been any pain from that side effect because I’d instead be dead

    somethingsnappy ,

    I know how it works, I know how anesthesia works. I know how a close range shotgun to the head works. It’s painless. We should never be doing it. For me, I’ll choose THC. Then, ketamine, then some NO2, then switch it to N. Then gulliotine.

    CaptObvious ,

    I’m glad you’re here to share this insight. Hope things are better now.

    30mag ,

    I don’t think this is intended to improve efficiency.

    Franzia ,

    WIRED: Pig Slaughterbouse CO2 Gas Chambers

    ApathyTree ,

    Ok, but bear with me here, because for real, this is how I want to go, and how I plan to put down my fowl when they get too old to live comfortably, because there’s no stress involved to taint the meat, and I can feel comfortable with myself for giving them a good life with free roam, and a good end.

    It’s incredibly humane. You feel nothing and don’t know you are suffocating. If you’ve ever breathed helium, you know what nitrogen feels like - literally nothing. This happened to multiple individuals in space because nitrogen is not flammable, and is why they now use 6% co2 in non-oxygenated spaces.

    The body does not care if it has oxygen, that’s hard to test for biologically because oxygen is highly reactive, what it does test for is buildup of co2. As long as you can breathe out the co2, your body knows nothing.

    So if they are going to kill other humans, this is the way to go. I don’t agree with doing that non-voluntarily, but if it’s going to happen this is at least humane.

    livus , (edited )
    @livus@kbin.social avatar

    deleted_by_author

    •
    ApathyTree ,

    No, that’s not even remotely the same thing as inert gas asphyxiation.

    When you get no oxygen at all, you pass out very quickly, you don’t suffer like you do with low levels of oxygen over extended periods.

    Don’t fear monger please.

    MBM ,

    Something I’ve been thinking about: for the victim, does it actually matter if it’s nitrogen or a well-aimed bullet/axe/guillotine? For the onlookers, sure the nitrogen looks a lot cleaner, but instant death is painless too.

    ApathyTree ,

    I’d argue, yes it matters.

    Bullet might not be as well aimed as expected, considering some of the firing squad have blanks, and most of them probably don’t really want to be there.

    Beheadings are reported to result in animated heads… and I would assume something like a waterfall of pain as the nerves from the body are severed but the brain, where consciousness lives, goes on for a bit yet. It might be quick, but it doesn’t seem pleasant.

    Electric chairs, just look them up, same with lethal injection problems… any “justice death” is basically torture.

    At least they can’t fuck up neutral gas asphyxiation. It’s either deadly or you sleep through it and wake up with a nasty headache.

    alvvayson ,

    If ever I would need to be killed, this would be my preferred method of leaving the earth.

    Happy to see them try it, even though I am against executing people.

    With hypoxia, you get euphoria prior to death. No suffering, no pain, just a little high to send you off this earth.

    RazorsLedge ,

    Leave the earth? “This” earth? What do you mean?

    OutlierBlue ,

    He means die. People use lots of euphemisms when talking about death. This is one of them.

    Redhotkurt ,
    @Redhotkurt@kbin.social avatar

    It's a common English phrase that refers to dying. The use of "earth" uncapitalized refers to the ground or land, not the planet Earth. You might be more familiar with the variant "leave this earthly plane," which, by the way, has nothing to do with airplanes.

    WarmSoda ,

    When people leave this earth they are welcomed onto the yearly space rocket that asends into the heavens. After seven days and seven nights of travel they land on Pluto, where the big farm in the sky is. That’s where your pets and grandparents are. Pluto is called Earth3 by the people on it.

    RazorsLedge ,

    That makes sense, thank you

    livus ,
    @livus@kbin.social avatar

    That sounds way too close to Hale-Bopp /Heaven's Gate.

    WarmSoda ,

    It’s nothing like that.
    I charge a lot more money.

    livus ,
    @livus@kbin.social avatar

    Sign me up!

    Off topic but I just checked and their website is still there. Feels macabre.

    mojofrododojo ,

    sounds like someone never learned about Xenu and the other earths.

    Tsk tsk tsk. What are they teaching in school these days…

    ZodiacSF1969 ,

    Ah, a fellow OT III.

    Wanderer ,

    Should do it to animals too.

    alvvayson ,

    Indeed. I have read that the reason we don’t is because it takes too long.

    That’s why they use CO2 asphyxiation, but in my opinion, that’s torture.

    HelixDab2 ,

    CO2 asphyxiation is extremely unpleasant. That is absolutely torture, and it is not in any way shape or form an ethical way to euthanize anything.

  • All
  • Subscribed
  • Moderated
  • Favorites
  • •
  • [email protected]
  • random
  • lifeLocal
  • goranko
  • All magazines
    •