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So, on pronouns.

I have a few questions on how to best behave to be as welcoming and inclusive as possible without sounding bad. I hope you guys don’t hate me.

I’m just a straight male. Are my pronouns he/him? Is that how I should tell people? Do you actually tell them as you meet them ? Do I have to wait for a certain social cue ?

How about online. Should I tell people or have it on my personal profile somewhere?

And about respecting other people’s pronouns. How do i figure them out ? Is it a big faux pas if I don’t before I know them ? Is it a faux pas if I refer to someone I just met and I assumed to be male as he/him?

I’ve never seen anyone referring to anyone irl by non conventional pronouns. Is it an actual thing or is it currently being pushed to make the world a more inclusive place?

I’d love some help with all of this.

MystikIncarnate ,

I too, am a straight male. It’s actually pretty easy.

It might be a bit of a faux pas when addressing someone as he/him when they prefer something else. Simply, if the mistake is made, they’ll correct your assumption (I’m sure they get it all the time, it’s not that big of a deal), and tell you their pronouns. Then it’s your task, socially, to respect their wish to be referred to by their pronouns. It might seem awkward to refer to someone directly as “they” or “them”, but it is grammatically correct, it just sounds awkward to our brains because it’s so rarely used as a singular direct pronoun… direct in the way that you’re talking to, or in the presence of that person… but it’s perfectly fine and preferred by your friend/colleague/acquaintance or whatever.

For yourself, if you’re commonly and most comfortably referred to as he/him, then you have two options: 1. ignore it, and people will assume, or 2. put “he/him” in things like your bio/email signature/about me pages and leave it at that. It doesn’t require qualification or context, like “my pronouns are” or something like that, just “he/him” alone in your bio is enough to let people know what you are comfortable with.

Personally, I don’t do anything, I let people assume, because I’m unbothered if someone refers to me as he/him/she/her/they/them. All pronouns for me are fine. I’m most commonly referred to as he/him because it’s the historically “correct” pronouns, but pronouns are more or less irrelevant to me.

And yes, people do, in fact, prefer they/them. I’ve met a few, and it feels awkward at first to say “they”/“them”, but you get used to it.

Tomboys_are_Cute ,

I am a straight male

Being straight doesn’t impact what your pronouns are! Your gender, whether you are cis, non-binary, trans, or any other gender identity is what determines these pronouns.

are my pronouns he/him?

Probably but thats up to you. Usually pronouns are given in that order as a matter of standardisation for understanding where they go in a sentence. Ie “He is going to the store” or “it all comes down his choice.” Obviously this leaves out some other gendered standard pronouns like formal Sirs and Ma’ams but for most conversation knowing she/her or they/them gets you most of the way there. For standard ones it might be intuitive but for people with neo-pronouns it helps a lot.

do you tell people when you meet them?

Sometimes. I try to do it more these days as a matter of course but usually I will give them when I’m in an environment where some people do and don’t where no one does. They are in my email signatures and real social media bios though.

Online rules

At least on your profile somewhere. I like Hexbear’s “no exceptions they will be in your name” policy, its better for uptake and helps people feel included.

figuring out others

If it isn’t clear you could always ask. If you aren’t a dick about it then it’s usually fine. If you get corrected though the most respectful thing you could do is just say sorry and use the right ones from that point on.

non conventional pronouns

Yes people do use them, if you are in places that queer people go to or feel comfortable you are more likely to meet someone with them. I would argue its more polite to refer to them as neo pronouns but I also have boring ones so its not really my place to say. If you look around hexbear there are a couple of frequent posters with neo pronouns and I’ve known a few people irl to use neo pronouns as well.

Ilflish , (edited )

Pronouns are just your preference for what you should be referred to. If you don’t provide them people will assume. The logic is that if only people who want to use specific pronouns suggest them, you are essentially outing yourself so even if you associate with your birth pronouns, it’s polite to present them so it’s less awkward for others.

The actual use is more awkward. The expected use is that you use it when the person in question is discussed but a pronoun isn’t really used unless that person is not around so again it seems to just be a polite way to present yourself.

For added context a good use case of announcing pronouns would be a research paper where someone would be described to another person Edit: Ive been made aware about another obvious use case. Talking to people online where you might not have a way to identify any other way

Ocelot ,

I think at some point language as a whole will shift. Most languages have had a concept of masculine/feminine and differentiating between genders for most if not all of their history. This seems pretty weird as a concept in modern times since it serves no real benefit. If we were to develop a language from scratch today I don’t think it would have such features.

Its going to take a pretty long time (hundreds of years) but language is constantly evolving. I think it will get there. In the meantime things are going to remain at least a little confusing.

I have a few transgender friends and its still a bit if a mental hurdle to see them as who they want to be identified as sometimes. I sometimes slip up and will call them by their old name or use the wrong pronoun. It’s never intentional of course, but sometimes my mental auto-correct isn’t working at full capacity. If I meet the person post-transition then its never really a problem as I always see them as that gender.

Jumi ,

From what I’ve seen so far pronouns are never in question irl although the circles I’m in there are not into that topic and online everyone who sees it as important has their own somewhere in their status or bio or whatever.

Nath ,
@Nath@aussie.zone avatar

Watch Princess Bride. Perfect that “as you wish”. With genuine sincerity.

Perfect. You’ve had a fun movie experience (Inconceivable!) and you now know the perfect way to respond to someone who has asked you or corrected you regarding pronouns.

riley0 ,
@riley0@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Don’t ask for other people to identify you, please.

verdigris ,

Pronouns are largely used to refer to people in the third person. As such I will never declare my pronouns because they aren’t for me to use, they’re for other people to use to refer to me. As such they should use whatever pronouns deliver maximal clarity for the listener.

I will respect others’ pronoun preferences because I’m not an asshole, but when people start trying to tell me that I’m being bigoted by not stating my own pronouns, they can fuck off.

FaeDrifter ,

Just for another use case, pronouns can help clarify if you prefer to be called sir or ma’am.

I wouldn’t call you a bigot for not having preferred pronouns though, that seems really silly.

Wahots ,
@Wahots@pawb.social avatar

Yes, your pronouns are he/him :)

Generally, people are pretty chill about it. If you are unsure how to refer to someone, you can always just call them by their first name or something else (the barista at the front counter, the person in the yellow sweater, etc!)

I wouldn’t overthink it, most people are totally cool if you get it wrong, especially if you show a willingness to get it right from then on. Queer people just wanna be treated like everyone else :)

-queer guy living in the gay district

BigNote ,

you can always just call them by their first name or something else

Well I didn’t know you were called Dennis.

07Chess ,

Most people aren’t going to ask about your pronouns if you present in a traditionally gendered way. If someone tells you their pronouns I think it’s polite to tell them yours too even if you think it’s obvious. It sounds like the way you’ve described yourself that your pronouns are he/him. If you find yourself around a group of queer/trans folks it would probably be contextually appropriate for you to introduce yourself as “My name is and I use he/him.” If you want to go above and beyond and do that all the time nobody will fault you that would benefit or appreciate that information. Some people may be confused or make an assumption but if you want to be an ally that can include taking the brunt of some of those conversations and teaching people why you’re doing it. Makes it more normalized.

You are pretty much always welcome to ask someone’s pronouns if you are unsure. Most trans/non binary folks will appreciate you asking because unfortunately there are a lot of cis hetero men that wouldn’t extend that courtesy or demonstrate that they’re accepting and open like that. As long as you’re respectful just ask “Hey, name, what are your pronouns? Mine are he/him.” and that will be more than sufficient. If you mess up after that do not apologize. Instead, thank them, restate your sentence using the correct pronouns, and move on. Don’t make it a huge ordeal and fall over yourself apologizing. Saying you’re sorry in that situation puts the misgendered person in the position of having to say “it’s okay” when it’s not. Thanking them demonstrates you’re aware that you made a mistake and shows that you are appreciative and trying to learn and do better.

For example: You: “He loves to skateboard.” Other person “they” You: “Right! Thank you. They love to skateboard.” then continue the rest of what you were saying.

Online can be tricky. You only really need to gender someone if they gender themselves. Everyone to me online is they until I see evidence otherwise. It makes your life easier to just be as neutral as possible.

There are definitely people out there that use unconventional pronouns. I’ve only met a few that use something other than they/them but they’re out there. It’s not just a fad or for inclusivity for the sake of it, it’s just rare. In fact there are probably people you’ve met that use they/them but they may not have been comfortable telling you that. It’s understandable, but I think it says a lot about your character that you’re curious and want to do the right thing. Thanks for asking!

JackbyDev ,

Getting someone’s pronouns wrong once really isn’t too big of a deal. What’s more important is how you react to being corrected and using what they ask you to going forward.

I still don’t know a good way to ask people their pronouns. Or rather I haven’t had to do it often so I don’t have much practice still so I still feel weird. Sometimes I get nervous that asking someone their pronouns might even make them feel like they don’t pass as the gender they want to present as. I’ve talked about this with people and the advice I’ve been given is that the best way to do it is to introduce yourself with your own pronouns. I still haven’t really had much opportunity to do it so not sure how to make it flow conversationally but the idea is that you’re giving everyone the opportunity to do the same plus it lets them know that you won’t react poorly to hearing someone tell you their pronouns.

I’ve really only met one person who prefers they/them and a couple of she/they folks. The trans people I have met all pass well enough in my brain that I don’t have to consciously try to use the correct pronoun. It just takes some effort to get used to.

Back in, say, 2016 or so there was a meme about “did you just assume my gender?” It was always a caricature and it seems like most people either want you to assume it or are okay if you get it wrong so long as you correct yourself once they correct you.

robot_dog_with_gun ,

I still don’t know a good way to ask people their pronouns.

in-person you can do this by offering yours when introduced. this protects binary trans people trying to use cultural indicators of gender from some abuse and normalizes the practice for non-conforming people, nicely resolving the competing accessibility needs of people trying to use existing gender norms and people outside them.

online you can ask your admin to do what hexbear does with display names and ban anyone being shitty about it.

systemglitch ,

It’s insane, literally, to care about this. Making language more complex than its simplicity of expression needs to be is insane.

Stop buying into this you loons.

Agent641 ,

Its quite important that you remember what the late Michael Jacksons pronouns were. They were He/He

Skkorm ,

You kind of don’t have to think about it this much. Someone who cares will tell you their preferred pronouns, in which case you’d say he/him then move on with your day

SnipingNinja ,

in which case you’d say he/him

If that’s their preferred pronoun

brygphilomena , (edited )

Yes, basically yours are he/him since you don’t identify as a different gender.

You only tell people if asked. No one will ask, because there isn’t any ambiguity about your gender identity. If you’d like, I’ve seen many straight cisgendered men put he/him in their profiles as support for the community.

Use your best judgement, most people will go by the gender you assume. If someone corrects you, apologize and use the correct pronouns from then on.

I have one friend that transitioned. She’s just a she now. Simple as that.

I have another friend that changed their name. The group I was with was confused on their pronouns, so I just asked them and they told me. Asking what they are shows that you respect them and their decisions.

If you respect people and use the pronouns they request, you shouldn’t go wrong.

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