Downvote me all you want, but what the fuck does anyone expect from a beaten and caged dog other than for it to lash out? If I was raised in Palistine I would probably feel the same way they do, completely lost and broken and that this is their only hope left to make a stance.
Yeah, more death and misery for civilians. That will totally show the people why not to support the only ones fighting for them, even if it's a fucking terrorist group like Hamas. Just like Dehousing worked against Germany in WW2, shooting Ukrainian schools and kindergardens works in Ukraine today, and more than a dozen similiar examples in between those two totally worked...
You’d imagine that support for revolutionaries seeking self-determination would be stronger in the West given the origins of the modern American and French state.
The USA didn’t ignore it, poorly thought out government regulations that didn’t allow US intelligence agencies to share information between each other caused it.
No, bush 2 ignored it. There were reports something was going to happen. The sharing of information was justification for the patriot act.
He then fabricated weapons of mass destruction to fan the flames for iraq. The other countries intelligence agency said it was bullshit, but we were told ours were more smarter.
Freedom fries were our measured response to the French being correct in their intelligence assessments.
It would make sense for Netenyahu to want something big and despicable enough to wage total war against Palestine. Israel has been slow rolling invasion and genocide for decades. It's definitely a conspiracy theory since there's no real proof yet but I element be surprised.
Not saying we should trust Netanyahu’s denial of this happening, but at the same time its not really reasonable to just trust an anonymous source in an ongoing conflict where public and international opinion matters a lot.
If there is more to this story then we probably will see more people confirming this in the near future.
Egypt telling them this isn’t some whisper by an anonymous source.
Maybe my wording is not that clear, but I am just responding to this part of the article where the source for the story is clearly mentioned as an anonymous source.:
“We have warned them an explosion of the situation is coming, and very soon, and it would be big. But they underestimated such warnings,” the official, who spoke on condition of anonymity because he wasn’t authorized to discuss the content of sensitive intelligence discussions with the media, told The Associated Press.
Anonymously talking with the media doesn't mean they were anonymously talking with Israel
Maintaining public anonymity does not mean the press didn't know who they were, and could verify that they knew what they were talking about.
I do agree that it's useful to maintain a certain level of skepticism... but that doesn't mean complete distrust of anything you're told. It's not unreasonable that Egypt had intel that an attack like this was coming, or at the very least that extremist elements were reaching a breaking point and something extreme was going to happen soon.
I'm of the mindset Zelinskyy absolutely knew, but purposefully kept denying it was close on the horizon to calm his people and also not be accused of saber rattling. It was a de-escalation and obfuscation tactic in my opinion and I think it sort of worked to the ends he intended in subtle ways. Ain't no way you see that many troops massed at your border and think "Putin? That guy's chill. He just doing some exercises. He wouldn't be planning to invade me on the heels of an Olympic closing... Again."
There is a full on “fear of chaos” happening. Nothing can be happening without some intention. People can’t fail, procedures can’t fail an information can’t be lost or misinterpreted. There must always be an all-knowing, bad actor failing on purpose.
So far the most benefiting entities politically are: Russia and China (US attention might be divided and be forced to divert funds to Israel), Netanyahu (Isreelis were very divided in his support, this raises up nationalism and helps him to do more).
The Saudis potentially as well. They dont like Israel, but due to all the Iranian funding they really dont like Hamas. Getting them to kill each other and drain their coffers gives them some breathing room. Plus turmoil in the middle east = increased oil prices = more money for the Saudi Regime.
I was saying this earlier. The Saudis always manage to come out of any worldwide conflicts with more money and power than they started with. It’s impressive, honestly.
Impressive may be the wrong word, but it is something, regardless of the source of the power. The levels they are able to go to without repercussion or ways they can take advantage of everything because of oil is something.
Considering the weak and precarious position of Benjamin Netanyahu. And the genocidal extremists that he represents. And his despotic ambitions. I know which one I’m betting on.
Well the Hamas attack was basically Netanjahu’s Reichstag fire. There were huge protests against his judicial, unconstitutional power grab, and now there arent. Now, his power is unchallenged and he even has additional wartime powers.
So, no warning, indiscriminate attacks that will,purposely harm civilians? This is awful. Hamas have already said they will execute hostages if there are unwarned attacks, so we can expect this to escalate on both sides.
This military mobilisation is not. This is a direct result of Palestine beating, raping, and murdering hundreds of innocent people, and kidnapping hundreds more.
Jordan has opened its borders to Iraqi, Palestinians, Syrians, etc. They have a general policy of taking in refugees. I don’t think Jordan does a good job treating those refugees well, but it’s almost a diplomatic certainty that Jordan would let them in.
But to answer your questions: Israel itself has announced it.
Cutting off Food and Energy from the entirety of Gaza doesn’t seem very targeted to me, does it?
If anything, you are biased. You are hellbent on making the Israelis look like the good guys here, unwilling to admit that sometimes there is no good guy and both sides are absolute shit
If you move the goal posts, you’re not neutral. People are taking Hamas’ side IN THIS INCIDENT, but Israel wouldn’t have done anything what they’re doing since two days if Hamas hadn’t attacked the day before.
If people deny that fact and start to point to past events or the overall situation, they aren’t serious people and can simply be ignored.
maybe hamas shouldn’t have killed hundreds of civilians purely to provoke a response? maybe the Palestinians should leave now? maybe they shouldn’t vote a dead cult like Hamas in as their government?
the open border to Egypt. What would you do with your family if you were in that situation? Be honest, get out of your armchair, dust off the cheeto crumbs from your fingers and think about it like a normal person.
You’d go. You’d put your family above ideology. If you dont, I really find it hard to sympathise, especially if you were celebrating in the streets in the last few days about a bunch of dead teenagers
I never said there was context that justifies Hamas targeting civilians, but let me make this really simple for you: The way Israel treats Palestinians in Gaza makes violent uprising inevitable.
And no, I cannot blame the Palestinian civilians there for supporting Hamas. They've been living under generations of oppression. They vote for Hamas because as horrible an organisation as it is, they know Hamas has been fighting tooth and nail for their liberation from Israeli oppression. They have actually traded blows with Israel and continue to do so. When you're under that level of oppression, that's all that is needed to justify that level of support.
what, send soldiers in with the specific aim to kill random palestinians going about their day? Im not going to bother arguing because frankly you have to be a complete brick to make that sort of a case
One small border crossing (that is not exactly the most open) for over 2 million people into a country that is ideal hostile to Palestinians? Great option. /s
And how exactly is that not ethnic cleansing?
And no, there were not over 2 million Palestinians celebrating in the streets after the terrorist attacks. Get your head out of your ass.
In my eyes, yes. I was absolutely a ‘both sides are as bad as each other’ person 3 days ago. Now Its obvious one side is objectively worse and crossed a line that cant be walked back without serious blood and retribution
EDIT: so basically you are saying, you are fine with Israel killing millions upon millions of Palestinian people but when it Hamas is doing the exact same thing that’s wrong.
EDIT 2: how can you be “be for both sides”? One side is committing genocide and the other is fighting for their right to live. Hamas was literally created around 1987s to fight back for Palestinians lives.
When peaceful revolution is impossible, violence revolution is inevitable.
You’ve had plenty of good counter arguments to your opinions in this thread. Instead of engaging you’ve decided to act like a petulant asshole. You’re a small part of the problem.
Every. Single. Source. Online and in REAL LIFE (the thing you have no idea about) echos my sentiment. This site is literally the only place overwhelmingly overrun by little murder loving neckbeard terrorists who painting their keyboards with jizz over the attacks. I have not seen a rational counter argument by you violence lovers yet. Hell, Ive had one heavily upvoted reply tell me Palestine is SURROUNDED by Isreal, a quick google maps view instantly proves how downright stupid this claim is.
Arsehol? yep. You can have your extremist silly opinions and im gonna call your shit out, if that makes me an arshole, ill wear it with pride. Ive never seen so many people excited to see a massacre, but this is also a site that worships bricks like Putin, Xi and Lenin so I guess Hamas is right up your neckbeard communist alley
Sounds like you should probably delete your account and go hang out where the super-smart, non-neckbeards are because most people here seem to think you’re an asshole troll who acts out whenever you get called on your bullshit.
Actually I just tend to read a lot about these news since I’m Palestinian and honestly your username has become far too familiar, associated strongly with downvotes. That doesn’t prove any of us two are right or wrong btw, just saying that you comment a lot and I tend to see you often on the same posts. Also I think I’m OP here so in a way you are stalking me?
So anyway, why so you avoid answering when people ask you to explain what you mean? It pays to be clear in online discussions.
So first, your gonna get a semi-apology, I was out of line on the stalking comment.
Second, I am actually (despite what you think) very sorry for the poor bastards living in Gaza right now. I have said as much many times but because I dont add ‘kill all the jews’, this is where the downvotes come, because that seems to be the only appropriate opinion to have around here these days. If I cared about votes, i’d just shutup and laugh and the bloodthirsty lunatics, but I like to comment, and dont care about fake points.
Third, tankie, is a derrogatory term for someone who is a bit of an armchair leninist, plenty around here. I tend to use it in situations where it isnt specifically relevant where the confusion may arise. From memory you also asked about ‘Cooker’ yesterday. In australia, we refer to antivax, conspiracy nuts as ‘cookers’ (meaning their brain is cooked). Think of them like MAGA people in america if that helps.
I hope this clears it up. Im actually gonna duck out for a bit as the comments are getting a bit heated, and beleive it or not, I want peace in the middle east and peace on lemmy! Neither side will comprise in the ME, but I will on lemmy right now, because theres too much hate in the world. Have a good night/day
I have said as much many times but because I dont add ‘kill all the jews’, this is where the downvotes come,
Hmmmm, not sure how our instances differ, but honestly I don’t see why anyone would upvote something like ‘kill all the jews’. I haven’t seen this on lemmy at all. Seems to me like it’s quite the opposite actually. I think a lot of the pushback you are getting is not because of that.
Third, tankie, is a derrogatory term for someone who is a bit of an armchair leninist, plenty around here.
Thanks. This is not what I think about when I hear ‘tankie’. Your definition differs from that of many on the internet
From memory you also asked about ‘Cooker’ yesterday. In australia, we refer to antivax, conspiracy nuts as ‘cookers’ (meaning their brain is cooked). Think of them like MAGA people in america if that helps. Thanks for explaining. I went to the urban dictionary when you said this word twice, and the definitions were too many to be able to pinpoint which one you meant. Please keep in mind that not everyone understands Australian-specific words. That’s why I asked.
Have a good night/day Hope you get some rest, the news can be overwhelming at times.
you support terrorism and the slaughtering of innocents. You would be right at home with the protestors in sydney today chanting ‘gas the jews’ (yes, they literally were saying that)
So if Israel can bomb Gaza for the actions of Hamas, by that logic (which I strongly disagree with), Hamas can also go around bombing Israel because they kill civilians on the fly.
Yes, Hamas should absolutely not have killed a single Israeli civilian or any civilian period. But none of your maybes justify more killing of civilians in Gaza.
Even if people in Gaza, who are constantly all their lives between a rock and a hard place with no clean water and no future prospects, voted for Hamas, still it does not justify Israel killing civilians.
I never said it ‘justifies’ it. Unless the civilians clear out, it is unfortunately inevitable. The difference is israelies arent going to be using their forces specifically to target civilians, unlike the other lot of animals
You said maybe Palestinians should leave. How would the civilians clear out when Israel has completely put it under siege and will likely shoot anyone leaving?
Also, would that not be a forced exodus of an ethnic group?
It's not ethical. It's war. War isn't like in the movies.
Hitler could have spent the war in an appartment in the middle of Berlin, safe in the knowledge no one would ever dare bomb him. Stalin could have nuked NATO, safe in the knowledge NATO wouldn't ever retaliate. If we allowed monsters who hide between civilians get away with it, they would inherit the earth. ISIS could tie a few civilians to the top of their tank, and murder us all. The Lord's Resistance Army could have freely marched into town to procure a few more child sex slaves, because they were protected by the children they had previously abducted.
There are no good guys or bad guys in this conflict. Both sides have stolen land. A third of Israel's population are 'arab' jews. They've lived in the region for millenia, and have just as much right to a country as the Palestinians. Let's not pretend they'd be safe in a Palestinian state or welcomed if they fled to neighbouring countries, given how popular Mein Kampf still is in the region. You'd be exchanging defacto Apartheid for genocide.
And let's not pretend that the Israelis have always undermined the peace process. For example, it's no coincidence that Israeli politics shifted to the right after 2000, when Arafat walked away from further negotiations at Camp David, something even the Saudi ambassador described as criminal, and despite the Israeli PM offering far reaching and deeply unpopular concessions. Of course, Israel also helped Hamas' rise to power, so once again no good guys or bad guys.
It's a mess and now it's a messy war.
All we can do is urge both sides to limit civilian casulties, not target them deliberately, but they are inevitable.
so hamas is a terroist dictatorship. who broke into their neighboors place, slaughtered hundreds of innocents for no reason at all, kidnapped dozens more and threaten to kill them, and these are the guys you think are awesome
I’ve seen this rhetoric before here and I don’t understand the goal. Berating everyone who isn’t sucking Bibi’s dick and calling them terrorist lovers isn’t going to create any good will towards Israel, quite the opposite.
im sorry, ive been called a ‘zionist’ (whatever the fuck that even means), a bootlicker, pro-apartheid for simply giving a fuck about people being murdered yesterday. so forgive me if im gonna call out your bullshit
Perhaps get off the internet and stop involving yourself so much in something that likely doesn’t affect you. You went into the fire and then complained about it.
no, the furious downvotes and rambly angry replies mean a whole bunch of you little murder lovin basement dwellers are actually getting annoyed by my comments, which I can only call a win
Sadly, yes. Israel is probably getting ready for an ethnic cleansing of the Gaza strip. As per the hostages, it seems like Israel has deemed them as dead already.
In certain circumstances, [roof knocking] will be used, the source says, but today Israel is already evacuating masses of the Gaza populace from central terrorist areas and attacking there.
There are also reports of people being ordered to leave their homes and head to the cbd, which is then bombed. It’s a warzone, though, so I’m sure we won’t get fully accurate information.
A position in the war cabinet has been left open for Opposition Leader Yair Lapid, who has refused to join the government if the far-right Religious Zionism and Otzma Yehudit parties remain in it.
timesofisrael.com
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