The federation tends to let member planets be independent, the federation doesn’t come in and be like “we own your planet and we provide for you in return we take everything”, so it’s definitely leaning socialist.
The main difference is who owns the means of production. In communism, the government does. In socialism, the people do.
Both aim to provide for the population at large and not just benefit to a few rich elites that own everything, but socialism is a bit more robust against tyrannical governments.
Sort of… Under Socialism workers control the means of production. That’s it, it can take a lot of forms. Communism, however, is a stateless, classless, moneyless society. There’s no need for a state to own everything anymore, or a need for a state at all, because there’s no class antagonisms any longer, and no need to secure the means of production on behalf of the workers. Communism is more of an aspirational mode of being in that sense, but there are socialist states that worked or are working towards those ends. The “tyranny” you’re referring to is more part of the transitional era where you need to have a strong state that can suppress and liquidate the bourgeoisie in order to keep control of the means of production.
I don’t think we know enough about the economics of the federation to say either way, but it certainly doesn’t appear that there are distinct classes of haves and have nots, making it basically a communist society.
The main difference is who owns the means of production. In communism, the government does. In socialism, the people do.
What would we call a hybrid system in which the government is made up of the people and owns the means of production? Direct Democratic Communism?
Edit to add:
A federation (also called a federal state) is an entity characterized by a union of partially self-governing provinces, states, or other regions under a federal government (federalism). In a federation, the self-governing status of the component states, as well as the division of power between them and the central government, is constitutionally entrenched and may not be altered by a unilateral decision, neither by the component states nor the federal political body without constitutional amendment.
From a Marxist perspective, all class-based societies are governed by dictatorships:
A dictatorship is the political dominance of one group of people over others. In a class society, a dictatorship usually favors the interest of certain classes over the others.
Right now, we live in the Dictatorship of the Bourgeoisie
The bourgeoisie is the ruling class in capitalist society; it owns the means of production and has a decisive influence on production. It lives off of surplus value which it obtains by exploiting the labour power of the proletariat.
This particular string of replies was you doing a stupendously poor job of explaining anything or accomplishing anything but looking like a snob. It would be better to say nothing than to be an asshole to someone who has done nothing worse than be a slightly frustrating liberal in their own thread on a non-communist instance.
Given this thread is about whether or not the Federation is a communist or socialist society, Marxist definitions are the most useful, eh? Furthermore, I’d argue that the term Dictatorship of the Bourgeoisie very accurately describes American (I’m an American) society, and does so regardless of one’s personal beliefs.
Well there are non Marxist socialist/communist models and systems but I take your point. I was just answering you because you responded to why I’m not a communist, that’s all
Again, perfectly fair. Before I was a communist, I rejected Marxist concepts as well. I’ve spent over two decades reading and listening to arguments for and against all sort of political, social and economic ideas. I’ve identified with centrism, liberalism, libertarianism, social democracy and other ideologies. Today, I consider myself to be a Marxist/socialist/communist not because it’s just the latest thing I’ve hit upon, but because it’s what’s made the most sense to me. When I use Marxist words and ideas, I don’t do so because I’m a Marxist; I’m a Marxist because those words and ideas have helped me to make the most sense of the world. And I’m certainly not demanding, or even asking, you do become a Marxist, I’m just asking you to consider what makes the most sense.
We can’t get to the Star Trek future unless we can limit the “rights” of capitalists in some way. In fact, we won’t have any future on this planet at all, since they seem hell bent on destroying all biodiversity in the name of profits. If stopping them is called dictatorship, then sign me the fuck up.
It’s amazing how people just make things up. I genuinely have no idea where you got these definitions unless it was some hole on Reddit or similar.
What manages the means of production if not a government? Saying “the people” is as hollow as the US talking about “Freedom” and “Democracy”. “The people” cannot merely project their will into the aether and have it realized, they need some method of organization. They need to be able to administrate complex systems rather than just hang out in “primitive communism but with high technology somehow”. Whatever that system is and whatever you call it, that’s a government. In a system of democratic government that administers things, the difference between “the people” owning things and the government – here an organ that exists only so the people can manage the means of production – owning them is immaterial.
It’s amazing how people just make things up. I genuinely have no idea where you got these definitions unless it was some hole on Reddit or similar.
I’m not claiming anything I said is facts, just the way I understand it to be/how it had been explained to me quite a while ago. I could absolutely be wrong, if that’s the case I’ll gladly retract my comment based on new (to me) information. I’m far from qualified to give an authoritative answer on this topic.
The way I understand it is “the government decides to build a factory because the country needs a factory” vs “the people of a region get together and build a factory because they want one”. Well, in either case nobody really owns the factory (compared to capitalism), but rather who’s in charge of it, who decides who works on what and how it comes to be.
Unfortunately the only examples of communism we’ve seen are authoritarian regimes like the Soviet Union, and currently North Korea and China (sort of). I don’t think we have a true socialist community that’s not some form of capitalist hybrid, let alone post-scarcity communism or socialism without massive corruption tainting it.
I’m not claiming anything I said is facts, just the way I understand it to be/how it had been explained to me quite a while ago. I could absolutely be wrong, if that’s the case I’ll gladly retract my comment based on new (to me) information. I’m far from qualified to give an authoritative answer on this topic.
I apologize for being coarse, it’s a bad habit of mine.
The way I understand it is “the government decides to build a factory because the country needs a factory” vs “the people of a region get together and build a factory because they want one”. Well, in either case nobody really owns the factory (compared to capitalism), but rather who’s in charge of it, who decides who works on what and how it comes to be.
If the government is democratic, there’s very little substantive difference here as-described, because “the government decides X” is an entity with the popular mandate doing it, and if that decision loses it the popular mandate, the people can oppose it. Likewise, if “the people” of a locality decided to build a factory in this hypothetical and a minority opposed it, if the minority cannot sway the majority, they are simply ignored.
The problem comes in when you realize that the goods produced by factories mostly aren’t for the use of the local community, they are for a much more expansive group of people. There need to be systems to coordinate production at the full scale of society so that people have some idea of who needs what. It’s compounded by the fact that the machines in the factory will themselves probably need to be imported from elsewhere.
Unfortunately the only examples of communism we’ve seen are authoritarian regimes like the Soviet Union, and currently North Korea and China (sort of). I don’t think we have a true socialist community that’s not some form of capitalist hybrid, let alone post-scarcity communism or socialism without massive corruption tainting it.
Depending on your definitions, you left out Cuba, Vietnam, and Laos. In any case, I don’t think most people are able to maintain the “real communism has never been tried” stance. Eventually, you either come down on the side that “No, they were real communism and communism is therefore evil” or “I was lied to about at least some of these countries and should give them credit”. For an anglophone, societal gravity is very much on the side of the first option, but it’s possible to reach the second conclusion if you have a strong enough motivation to dig through information. Cuba is probably the route of least resistance.
People in the past had to put up with a lot of shit we don’t have to today. Doesn’t mean we shouldn’t take advantage on modern luxuries. Your hemorrhoids will thank you.
Update: After extensive input from public wastewater bodies and industry experts including Kimberly-Clark Australia (the maker of Kleenex® Flushable Wipes), Standards Australia published a new, AU & NZ-specific, Flushable Products Standard (AS/NZS 5328:2022). The Standard details clear testing criteria that need to be met for manufacturers to use a “flushable” label in accordance with the Standard.
We welcome the introduction of the new Standard and are proud to announce that Kleenex Flushable Wipes meet and exceed the requirements of the Australia/New Zealand Flushable Products Standard (AS/NZS 5328:2022)
flushable in the us means it can go down the toilet. However, Wastewater treatment plants have to remove these from the wastewater, as they do not break down the same as poop, or in same case they don’t break down at all.
hopefully the Aussie government has define flushable differently than the us.
It’s very expensive problem. At least in the USA. My spouse works in waste water treatment and hates “flushable” wipes with a fiery passion.
Update: After extensive input from public wastewater bodies and industry experts including Kimberly-Clark Australia (the maker of Kleenex® Flushable Wipes), Standards Australia published a new, AU & NZ-specific, Flushable Products Standard (AS/NZS 5328:2022). The Standard details clear testing criteria that need to be met for manufacturers to use a “flushable” label in accordance with the Standard.
We welcome the introduction of the new Standard and are proud to announce that Kleenex Flushable Wipes meet and exceed the requirements of the Australia/New Zealand Flushable Products Standard (AS/NZS 5328:2022)
Being in an apartment, good chance it gets to the building-wide plumbing before clogging, and so wouldn’t be traced back to you. Of course, that would still leave you (and the rest of the building) without plumbing for a while whenever it actually does clog
Yeah killing a fish for the first time was a little off putting but like that didn’t stop me from eating the little guys. I imagine it’s the same for other animals
theres always people who will eat it, if people quit meat, all it does is make it cheaper for the cultures that eat off cuts like intestines/chitlins, stomach, organ meat, feet and such.
head is a very low bar, as pork head itself used for head cheese in various cultures. In Filipino culture for example, its the traditional meat choice for Sisig, which is very popular.
Every time we go to France, my wife will beg me to go to every supermarket so we can find this kind of meat, if it wasn’t for me, she would buy the entire stock, especially brain.
Presentation has very little to do with consumer habits, it’s mostly a matter of education.
Installing a set of patio doors a decade and a half ago I saw a LARGE indoor grow tent in the client’s garage. This was before my state had medical so I didn’t bother to ask.
High pressure sodium ballasts and a very redundant air filtration system told me everything I wanted to know.
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