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Should I permanently leave Israel?

I’m not sure if this is the right community for this question, but it says “no stupid question” so here goes. I’m an Israeli who now lives in the US, but I am considering permanently residing in the US or elsewhere (perhaps somewhere in Europe or Canada) because I’ve become kinda disillusioned with Israel for a variety of reasons (the war in Gaza being one of them, the erosion of democracy by Likud being another, and etc) but is that cowardly to leave? Should I go back and try to change society or should I just leave for good? Thanks for your time.

oakey66 ,

As a Russian Jew who fled the Russia in the 1980s, my family moved for our safety and opportunity. Countries don’t deserve reverence just for being countries. We can be proud of our heritage without having to show allegiance to a nation state. Especially, when it is using our ethnicity/religion to brutally wipe out and massacre a civilian population.

Just do what is best for you and your family.

magnetosphere ,
@magnetosphere@fedia.io avatar

Regardless of your decision, I think you deserve credit just for seriously considering the issues involved.

FaizalR ,
@FaizalR@kbin.social avatar

Second this.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Thank you :)

Kaboom ,

Well, if Israel loses the support of other countries, there might not be an Israel. Id also hide the fact youre a Jew, anti-semitism is on the rise, not just anti-zionism.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Yeah I know anti semitism is on the rise, which does make me weary, but there’s also lots of institutional support against racism and anti semitism

recursive_recursion , (edited )
@recursive_recursion@programming.dev avatar

to ask questions even while anxious is something to be commended on especially since you aren’t sure about what the right choices could be

I think it’s actually brave to ask for help especially in difficult situations such as the one you’re in

“The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.” - Marcus Aurelius

Should I go back and try to change society or should I just leave for good?

This brings back memories from a well known anime called Code Geass where 2 of the characters have a debate on whether change can either be born from within the system or if it must be made externally

  • Lelouch vs Suzaku

Personally I’d say it’s external but I don’t know if this is closest to the truth of the perfect solution

From recent historical records like Hong Kong and Ukraine🌻 vs Russia

  • brain drain is a real thing and it seems that to continue living under oppression and subjugation is probably the worst if not wrong decision as you’d be unintentionally sacrificing yourself for a corrupt authority

change is probably a mix of both internal and external

  • but to continue living in an state of eroding democracy might be more detrimental than benefical to most
  • as I’m writing this, I find it funny that this could be said the same for the fediverse here
ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Thanks for this response. Israel also is facing AFAIK a slower brain drain because Israelis with education and money tend to move.

RagingHungryPanda ,

How would you plan to change society? That sounds like a big ask of someone.

I totally say someone should leave if they want, I’m currently leaving the US and traveling and am looking for a place to settle that isn’t America.

But remember something: America is funding Israel and helping with Gaza, so I don’t know about choosing America to get away from that. It is a step removed at least?

It’s not cowardly to leave. Also, you can always change your mind or move on if that choice doesn’t work out. I’d leave. But I’m already doing that.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

The US is helping Israel’s war in Gaza yes, but so are most European countries to be fair. I guess I meant more that the war is far away and won’t affect me and my kid personally over here.

DerisionConsulting ,

If your wish to change things is the only thing that makes you want to go back, be honest with yourself, do you actually have the ability to change anything?

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Probably not

snooggums ,
@snooggums@midwest.social avatar

Do you want to try to change anything if you did have the ability?

If not, and you don’t plan on living there. then it just comes down to whether citizenship has some kind of positive for you like being able to freely travel or something like that.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Well I’m fairly politically active, so kinda

blargerer ,

You need to do whats best for yourself, but it sounds like Israel would be a better place with your voice in it.

NeatNit ,

It’s not super relevant but Israel doesn’t allow offshore voting, the only way to vote if you live abroad is to physically travel to Israel on voting day. (This doesn’t apply to those on official government business, like ambassadors or navy soldiers or whatnot)

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

How do you mean?

stanleytweedle ,

Should I go back and try to change society or should I just leave for good?

“God, grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference”

I can’t tell you what to do but I can tell you that getting out of a bad situation you had no hand in creating doesn’t make you a coward, it just means you’re rational.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Thanks :)

Jackthelad ,

Yeah, this isn’t something that any of us can decide for you. And any views will be clouded by how people think on the Israel-Hamas conflict.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Ironically I’m firmly in the middle on the conflict compared to a lot of what I’ve seen from the online left, but compared to most israeli policymakers, I am far left. It’s weird.

Jackthelad ,

To be fair, the current Israeli government has far-right members in it, so a centrist would look far-left in comparison!

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Yeah I’m just center-left, but that’s “far left” or even “extreme” left in the Israeli politics now…

TheBananaKing ,

Leave. If nothing else, you’ll get to call yourself Wasraeli.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Lol

BassTurd ,

No. Nobody owes their country of origin, shit. They don’t care about you at all. They don’t care about their own people. If you can flip a switch and make it better, do it, but don’t sacrifice your life, literally or figuratively, for a cause you can’t change.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Prob correct

pineapplelover ,

If you could make change, you could probably make change in other countries as well.

ashkenaziisraeli OP ,

Less so since I’m not a citizen of those countries.

Microplasticbrain ,

My family left Iran before I was born and I’m grateful they did. What could we have done to change the country from within? Unfortunately nothing.

Chef_Boyardee ,

I want to tell you to not listen to these comments, but all of them tell you to decide for yourself. Well, you asked the question, so I will answer.

Yes, and move to Palestine.

TrickDacy ,

So weird

Melkath ,

It's your choice.

The whole "be the active person who stops the riches from ruining earth" trope is a lie.

The current US is just as bad as Israel if not worse.

All the losers who either flunked high school or flunked, but had daddy to pay their way have brought fascism back en masses.

If you have the luxury to move to Sweden, or the Bahammas, as far as I'm concerned, do it.

You'll be in a better place when Israel nukes Iran, WWIII pops off, and the US cripples the internet/critical infrastructure around the world.

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