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Plans for Saudi Arabia’s linear city cut from 170km to 2.4km

Saudi Arabia’s wildly ambitious plan to build 500m tall, mirrored, 170km long parallel skyscrapers, forming a 1.5M population desert city has been curtailed to 2.4km long.

The news was broken by the financial news publication Bloomberg, which said that Saudi Arabia’s government had “scaled back its medium-term ambitions” for Neom, of which The Line is the most significant sub-project.

The Saudi government had hoped to have 1.5M residents living in The Line by 2030, but this has been scaled back to fewer than 300,000, according to the report. It is unclear how it intends to house a higher concentration of people considering the proposed length (and therefore area) has been massively slashed.

answersplease77 ,

1 mile is not a city. it’s smaller than the park next to my house

3volver ,

Huge waste of time and money. That effort could be focused on many better and more reasonable projects. This is what happens when fucking idiots get a ton of money inherited from their parents. We should never have relied on Saudi oil, it’s been a drain on humanity.

SrTobi ,

The LineDash

DozensOfDonner ,

But do they have enough millionaires to house in there?

guacupado ,

I think at that point it’s a town.

lemmytellyousomething ,

Lol

Cyberflunk ,

Did they plan for sewage this time? Or will there be another poop train?

anas ,

I see this a lot and I’m not sure whether to attribute it to ignorance or racism, but Saudi Arabia isn’t the UAE.

Cyberflunk ,

Huh. Both in my case. Education will helpe in both issues. Thanks.

Madison420 ,

Its more likely that they’re directly next to each other but the uae gets more coverage but is much much smaller.

afraid_of_zombies ,

Lucky for them. The UAE is utterly incompetent at sewage and garbage. Pretty sure it’s because everyone running the stuff over there is either a relative of someone important or someone imported who wants to be seen as impressive.

  1. Drown you in paperwork
  2. Demand the most expensive version of everything since the most expensive one is better in their mind.
  3. More paperwork
  4. Demand you follow some weird standards that seem to be a mixture of old UK and lord only knows what
  5. Finally they agree to the project and they demand a discount
  6. More paperwork
  7. Demand to see entire system in operation remotely.
  8. Tell you they aren’t ready and are willing to pay for storage
  9. Wait five years and finally turn it on.
afraid_of_zombies ,

You might be surprised how many places have a system like that in the developed world.

magic_lobster_party ,

Do we have a list of stupid city ideas? I think El Salvador’s Bitcoin City and Egypt’s new capital should belong there.

BarrelAgedBoredom ,

If you’re interested in the inner workings of shitty civic planning check out James C. Scott’s Seeing Like a State. He’s an anthropologist who took a particular interest in why top-down societies always seem to miss the mark in infrastructure, ecology, agriculture, and social services (among others). A significant portion of the book is spent critically analyzing Le Corbusier’s work and his ideological contemporaries. With Brasilia as a case study for the failures of “high modernist” ideology and design philosophy. It’s a great read and I think a lot of these new urban planning projects that are obviously insane and impractical owe a lot to these batshit crazy people from the past that founded this particular flavor of foolish

ElderWendigo ,

There’s Brasilia & Fordlandia (also in Brazil).

golli ,

It is unclear how it intends to house a higher concentration of people considering the proposed length (and therefore area) has been massively slashed.

I got a brilliant idea: extend it slightly to the sides, maybe in a round shape. This allows for a more efficient way to house a high concentration of people.

Diplomjodler3 ,

This is truly the most moronic project ever, but at least I had a good laugh about it today.

Peppycito ,

It’s even dumber than dumping sand into the ocean in the shape of a palm tree and calling it a suburb.

disguy_ovahea ,

I guess they read about China’s recent success with a fusion reactor.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

How recent are you talking and by what measure of success? Because I’m not finding anything when I search and, as far as I know, the world is still a long way away from fusion as a practical energy source.

Lath ,

Try South Korea instead. I think they're the ones who achieved a 48s run recently.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

I wouldn’t call that a practical energy source either.

disguy_ovahea ,

China sustained 158 million degrees Fahrenheit (70 million degrees Celsius) for 1,056 seconds.

Lath ,
  1. That explains it. I don't have that long of an attention span.
disguy_ovahea ,

livescience.com/chinas-1-trillion-artificial-sun-…

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

So by “recent,” you meant 2022 and by “success,” you mean running 17 minutes.

How long do you think you can power a city with those 17 minutes of fusion?

Because my guess is around 17 minutes.

disguy_ovahea ,

It’s a substantial leap in proof of concept. The previous record was 17s. They’re opening up all research that led to the success, with many scientists claiming potential for controlled applications within 20 years.

Even improved harnessing and storage of 158M°F could allow the reactor to work in modulation. It’s a big deal in the science community.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

“Many scientists” like the ones who have been claiming that my entire life since the 1980s?

Can you show me any of their peer-reviewed journal articles that say so?

And considering your definitions of “recent” and “success” turned out to be a little on the untrue side, I’m not inclined to believe your “big deal” claim either.

disguy_ovahea , (edited )

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC9256834/

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

You do know the difference between a peer-reviewed journal article and a regurgitated press release on a site called ‘Nuclear Newsire,’ right?

disguy_ovahea ,

Corrected. Here’s another.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Both of your links are just reviews of nuclear fusion progress. The first one, China specifically, the second one, multiple projects. Neither of them make any sort of claim that I can see about practical nuclear fusion being 20 years away.

You seem to have a major honesty problem.

disguy_ovahea ,

There’s no need for personal attacks. If you read them, both articles have updated sustained fusion reaction times based on China’s successful experiment. The only nation currently investing heavily into further research is China, but they have released all research for the scientific community. If I were to speculate, it would be because this technology would save a communist nation billions, while costing a capitalist nation just the same.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

It is not a personal attack. Virtually everything you have said has been dishonest.

You said it was recent. It was 2 years ago.

You said it was a success. It was 17 minutes.

You said scientists claim that practical fusion is 20 years away. Your evidence did not make that claim.

You can speculate all you like, but your actual claims have been false. Repeatedly.

disguy_ovahea ,

The Chinese government announced the fusion consortium on Jan. 9, 2024 according to the first article I posted.

17 minutes of 158M°F heat is a success. The previous record was 17s, and required maintenance and repair after fusion. With improved capture and storage, this version can work in modulation.

From the article:

The Chinese government has set the goal of building the first industrial prototype fusion reactor, which it has dubbed an “artificial sun,” by 2035. Officials hope to begin large-scale commercial production of fusion energy by 2050.

So yeah, it’s an exciting prospect in the development of stable nuclear fusion.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Cool. I set goals all the time too. That doesn’t make them achievable.

disguy_ovahea ,

Sure, not with that attitude. You seem pretty determined to discredit the success here. How heavily are you invested in fossil fuels?

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

I didn’t realize the only two options available were fusion power, which is not yet practical, or fossil fuels.

I was sure there were lots of other ways to generate electricity.

I guess not.

disguy_ovahea ,

I thought you wanted clarity, but clearly you want a debate. Find someone else to argue with.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

I thought you wanted to clarify, but instead you accused me of being invested in fossil fuels.

And to clarify that, I’m not invested in anything. Unlike you, apparently, I can’t afford to invest in things.

glimse ,

Man, I don’t think fusion is coming any time soon either but I just read this entire exchange and you have been undeniably insufferable the whole time. There are a thousand ways to discuss this disagreement and you chose the combative one.

I’ve argued with people like you before. You accuse and accuse and accuse them when the other person realizes it’s not worth their time and throws a parting jab, you play victim. It’s embarrassing and everyone sees right through it.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Well I’m sorry you feel that you see through my pointing out that they kept saying things that weren’t true in response to me, but I’m going to point it out and not just accept it as if it actually is true.

I also don’t see why I should accept the accusation that I invest in fossil fuels. Would you accept that if it was leveled at you as if it were the truth (and I hope it isn’t)?

skillissuer ,
@skillissuer@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

fusion won’t generate anything but hype. if you want reliable power source, just build normal uranium fueled nuclear powerplants like a responsible government, not overhyped garbage like hedge fund manager that just got his shipment of good idea powder

TransplantedSconie ,

desert sun’s rays nuke the lake in front of glass wall/city

“Where lake go?”

Diplomjodler3 ,

It would just fry anyone who stands there for more than five minutes.

skillissuer ,
@skillissuer@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

probably beats living in saudi arabia

TransplantedSconie ,

I don’t know it’s probably great for Bonesaw McKillajournalist.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

That’s not a big problem since this is in a desert. Getting any water there in the first place is the problem. And, based on the mockups I saw, there’s supposed to be a lot of greenery.

skillissuer ,
@skillissuer@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

water policies of saudi arabia are straight up insane. riyadh takes half of water from seashore desalination plants (that burn massive amounts of oil, so big that it cuts into their oil revenue very significantly). for the other half, they have somehow found non-renewable water, literal fossil water, and it’ll run out in decade (might have misremembered). at the same time there are no water meters in the city at all

tal ,
@tal@lemmy.today avatar

at the same time there are no water meters in the city at all

Apparently Ireland hasn’t billed for water either, and the prospect of the introduction of billing had activists objecting on grounds like “you can’t charge for water, water is life-critical and a human right”. I remember reading comments on /r/Europe from Irish readers who were really upset at the prospect of needing to pay for water.

googles

It looks like as implemented, billing is only for households that use substantially more than the average and start going out late this year:

moneyguideireland.com/water-charges-2017-new-rule…

The latest information from Irish Water is that the earliest that excess charges will apply is Q3 2023 at the earliest.

So the earliest any household will get a bill from Irish Water is October 2024.

skillissuer ,
@skillissuer@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

ireland has less issues with potable water supply i suspect

also unrelated but why are you googling loudly

TheOctonaut ,

You’ve missed the point that the government had relatively recently introduced a ‘temporary’ Universal Service Charge during the recession and had not (and have not to this day) removed it. I was in favour of metering water but the argument wasn’t as simplistic as you’re making it.

Ireland being a low density country with an inundation of fresh water rain and springs is certainly worth mentioning when comparing with Saudi Arabia though…

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

The stupidest idea for a city that I’ve ever heard has gotten marginally less stupid.

At least now you can get from one side to the other quickly in an emergency.

Not that they’ll even build these 2.4 km.

aniki ,

Ask anyone who’s ever built a house and they can tell you what a stupid fucking idea it would be to have a foundation that large.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Even if they somehow had some magical way to solve the foundation issue, with the original plan… could you imagine having to go from one part of the city to another for pretty much any reason? In a linear city? You better hope that other part is really close. Especially if it’s a personal medical issue or a dying loved one.

themoonisacheese ,
@themoonisacheese@sh.itjust.works avatar

Also: this city has only one road. How is traffic going to be? Better hope you somehow get a flat near your work, and that everyone else does too, and that nobody ever moves or cha’mnges job for any reason. This is such a horsehit project I’m surprised the guy who proposed it didn’t get thrown out of the window like in the meme.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Never mind commuter traffic, imagine how long it would take necessary commodities to the right places in a timely manner!

aniki ,

I never looked into it more than a tertiary “Holy shit that looks dumb,” and yet somehow it’s even dumber than I thought!

HappycamperNZ ,

I mean, how is it any different to any other multi km wide city?

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

For one thing, you can avoid congestion.

HappycamperNZ ,

Sorry, I mean those saying I hope you don’t need to get to the other side, or what if you move.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Like I said- if you need to get to the other side of a normal city, you can avoid congestion by taking a different route.

In a linear city, there is only one route. If there is a traffic jam or a train derailment in a linear city, there are no alternative routes. Not even for an ambulance.

HappycamperNZ ,

I would assume you have two routes, one either side, both directions for this exact reason.

If anything it will be more reliable and cost effective as every mass transit can be used by anyone.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

It’s very easy for one truck crash to block off both directions of a road. Even a very wide road. I know because I’ve experienced it.

I’m really not sure why you don’t understand why having multiple alternate routes from A to B would be a big advantage.

HappycamperNZ ,

Im saying two separate highways, one on either side rather than two directions next to each other.

I live in a city full of peninsulas and harbours - well aware how much it sucks having one way in and out of places. The difference is that they were never planned and designed for current volumes, vehicles and logistics - this can be.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

So two truck accidents could clog up the entire city. Again, seems like having alternate routes would be an advantage.

HappycamperNZ ,

And three separate incidents that also breach both lanes, cant be cleared quickly and happen at the same time can block three.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Can they be cleared quickly? Because I’ve sure been in traffic due to wrecks that block off both sides of a divided highway for hours. Except they could divert traffic to the nearest exit.

Lath ,

I thought the proposed plans had multiple level high speed rails inside?

jmcs ,

Their plan was to have most people commute by train and have a veritable army of self-driving trains. That’s easily the most well thought part of the harebrained idea.

Zron ,

Not just train

Hyperloop

You know the thing that totally exists and wasn’t a scam to stop California from installing high speed rail that would cut into a certain company’s EV sales.

gimpchrist ,
@gimpchrist@lemmy.world avatar

This is a good place to have elon’s little super tube!!

DrunkenPirate ,

I think it came up like this: Saudi king at his last visit at Chinese Wall. „Uw, one can see it from the space? That’s awesome.“ At home: „Servants, build something as big as the Chinese Wall that is visible from the space, so everyone sees how great I am.“

skillissuer ,
@skillissuer@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

That would be crown prince Mohammad bin Salman, because king Salman has retired in all but name

WhatAmLemmy ,

Is that bone saw cunt, or some other auth piece of shit cunt?

IWantToFuckSpez ,

Yes it’s Mr Bone Saw

Habahnow ,

That is Mr. Bone Saw(MBS)

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

I live in the city (Terre Haute, Indiana) where Mr. Kashoggi, the man who was murdered by MBS, went to school (Indiana State University) and there was very little outcry, which saddened me greatly.

Confused_Emus ,

Well yeah, he wasn’t white.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Honestly, that is not a big Terre Haute problem today compared to a lot of Indiana. While it is still by far majority white, there is a sizable black population compared to a lot of other Indiana towns this size and there’s no “black part of town,” it’s thoroughly integrated. As far as Kashoggi is concerned, there also is a large enough local Muslim population to support a mosque. ISU is also a progressive school despite being in Indiana they are very big on multiculturalism. I don’t know what the Muslim population of the school is, but enough that you would notice and the school does have public celebrations of holidays like Eid, so it was actually surprising.

Now, I admit that was not always the case. In fact, a little over a century ago, Terre Haute was the site of an absolutely horrific lynching of a black man. And, of course, since this is Indiana, there is not a total lack of racism. But compared to other parts of the state I’ve been to, it’s doing relatively well on that front.

Confused_Emus ,

I was thinking more of the systemic racism that’s supposedly not a thing in America depending on how far in the sand one’s head is buried. Definitely happy to know sentiments are improving locally, though.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

Oh there’s definitely that everywhere, for sure. I just was surprised it wasn’t a big deal at least at ISU, but it wasn’t. I know because I not only worked there at the time, but in the marketing department taking photos and videos of ISU events of pretty much any sort and no one in my department was sent to document anything.

WhatAmLemmy ,

Oh thank god it’s an ally of the free world and not some bad guy.

Diplomjodler3 ,

It was the crown prince, not the king, but I’m pretty sure that’s more or less how it went.

dwindling7373 ,

I’m pretty sure the whole “can be seen from space” is wrong.

RGB3x3 ,

Ever used Google Maps? Everything can be seen from space.

june ,

Some things are too small to be seen from anywhere.

Like ur dick

lol gottem

Canadian_Cabinet ,

You can’t see it with the naked eye, but only with magnification

dwindling7373 ,

That’s just existing with extra steps.

ChaoticNeutralCzech ,

As if he cares

Gradually_Adjusting ,
@Gradually_Adjusting@lemmy.world avatar

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