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thatsTheCatch ,

Needless and needle-less đŸ„

thatsTheCatch ,

Fucking sucks for immunocompromised people as well I’m sure

dantheclamman OP ,
@dantheclamman@lemmy.world avatar

My mom has lymphoma. She gets extremely sick from even minor colds. I am very worried about losing her to an infection, and the thought that it could be a vaccine-preventable infection fills me with rage

gregorum , (edited )

I’m well past feeling bad for stupid people who die needless and preventable deaths, and I’m well past feeling anything but hostility towards those who, through stubborn and willful ignorance, would threaten my life and the lives of those I care for, not to mention everyone else around them— especially the elderly and infirmed.

it’s as simple as that, and any equivocation on these points is just them trying to pass responsibility for their own social and moral failures onto others. and for that, fuck them.

edit: subject-verb agreement

Granite ,

I wish it were that simple. But those people are going to take up hospital beds, nurses, doctors, etc away from people who got vaccinated (or couldn’t due to medical conditions). They’ll drive up medical prices even more. They’ll spread their diseases to those with compromised immune systems.

I don’t feel sorry for them, but they’ll harm and kill others on their way out.

gregorum ,

perhaps you missed the part where I nether pity them, accept their excuses or equivocations, or accept, in any way, any reason for their refusal of their civic, social, or moral responsibilities? because when you say:

I wish it were that simple

please explain wtf you mean that I didn’t address pretty explicitly in my first comment

afraid_of_zombies ,

If it makes you feel better medical prices were going to go up anyhow.

takeda ,

As for driving insurance prices. I remember there was a law that was introduced in NY that allowed insurance to do that. Everyone was saying it was symbolic, because they already could set different prices for unvaccinated.

Couldn’t they just do that?

Veneroso ,

It’s really too bad that Covid wasn’t deadlier. Can we get Covid Classic back?

Super Covid?

Airborne Ebola?

fadingembers ,
@fadingembers@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

The worst part is they aren’t hurting themselves, since they were vaccinated as children, but their kids will suffer instead

dantheclamman OP ,
@dantheclamman@lemmy.world avatar

If only they were islands to themselves and didn’t take innocent people down with them in pursuit of their Darwin Awards

gregorum ,

that’s one of the things about conservative philosophy, especially today, is the subscription to the concept of solipsism, at least to the part f that philosophy which states that nothing outside of the self exists, not really, except as a projection of the self. meaning, in actuality, everything one sees and experiences is, in actuality, simply part of one’s imagination— a “projection” on one’s ego whose existence is purely to fulfill a need of the self and is represented/projected as such.

it’s a particularly sociopathic and self-serving view of the world, which illustrates very quickly the types of people it attracts as an ideology and those to whom it’s an easy and quick defense.

afraid_of_zombies ,

If you are a liberal and a vegetarian then you do not eat meat. If you are a conservative and a vegetarian you are the only one allowed to eat meat.

linearchaos ,
@linearchaos@lemmy.world avatar

Looks at notes: We’ll need to get that up to hundreds of thousands before anyone even starts to think about doing something about it.

NotMyOldRedditName ,

Don’t worry though, the faster you approach a million, the more likely they’ll just start to shrug it off and say it’s the new normal.

tsonfeir ,
@tsonfeir@lemm.ee avatar

I’ve come to accept that I’ll have to work until I’m dead. So one thing that doesn’t make me upset is less people. Specifically less people to take my job—younger people.

So, anti-vaxers, if you really wanna pwn me, you’ll make sure your kids live long enough to take my job.

some_guy ,

I feel bad for kids and for people who are vulnerable. The adults who are bringing down our society through idiotic decisions can’t die fast enough, imo.

Candelestine ,

We can’t drown out botnets without botnets of our own. Information war is war, but lacks attrition, so the opponents never actually get defeated.

So, we can either accept this status quo, or we can escalate. But I don’t think we can just try harder, we’re givin her all she’s got, Jim. It’s not like medical professionals are known for having tons of free time and extra morale to burn away on twitter.

So, we need technical assistance, of some sort.

Granite ,

Problem is, who will fund the good botnet?

Candelestine ,

A grant from the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation. Who else?

thisisawayoflife ,

The CEO of the Internet!

acockworkorange ,

MDs are our there signing exceptions. It’s a matter to legislate about.

lolcatnip ,

In some states they’ll be legislating against vaccines.

acockworkorange ,

At the federal level then. Let the vaccine riots commence!

markr ,

Holy shit I thought this was only about Covid. These absolute idiots are breaking herd immunity for the entire field of virus based diseases.

0110010001100010 ,
@0110010001100010@lemmy.world avatar

Polio has (re-)entered the chat.

dantheclamman OP ,
@dantheclamman@lemmy.world avatar

The anti-vaccine movement has been fighting their pro-disease fight for decades now

Lepsea ,

They should meet my friend named rabies

PinkPanther ,

It would technically solve their problems. I’m all for it.

Wahots ,
@Wahots@pawb.social avatar

Rabies is the real litmus test to see if people really have the balls to be anti-vaxxers or not, lol.

That, or smallpox.

highenergyphysics ,

As long as it disproportionately affects red states, I’m all for it. Let’s go. Cull these fucking mouth breathers.

Blahaj_Blast ,
@Blahaj_Blast@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

Problem is, a good chunk of these mouth breathers were vaccinated as kids, and their innocent, unknowing children get to reap the costs.

JustZ ,
@JustZ@lemmy.world avatar

Survival of the adequate. Their parents are inadequate.

Bytemeister ,

Classic Republican mentality. Pull up the ladder you just ascended.

afraid_of_zombies ,

I get the anger but keep in mind they do have children.

captain_aggravated ,
@captain_aggravated@sh.itjust.works avatar

There were children in Hiroshima. What’s your point?

afraid_of_zombies ,

Well thanks I was having a good day but now I get to think about that.

6_juniper_6 ,

Remember how many German anti-vaxxer emmigrated to Columbia (or Paraguay?) where they had to send their children to school and what happened first day they vaccinated them without asking the parents 😄😄😄😄

SeducingCamel ,

And there’s still a large amount of not-republicans in those states

BraveSirZaphod ,
@BraveSirZaphod@kbin.social avatar

Ignoring how fucked up it is to take pleasure in people's deaths, let me remind you that there are some people, even in blue states, that cannot receive various vaccinations due to health risks and thus are entirely reliant on herd immunity.

Also, disproportionately doesn't mean "solely".

Karyoplasma ,

hope you enjoy smallpox and diphteria

afraid_of_zombies ,

Only 19% of people have gotten the latest lastest Covid vaccine.

The first one was giant walk in clinics where you just told them your name and address. Completely free. The largest vaccine drive in US history.

The second round was at pharmacies and some popup spots. Free but they bill via insurance.

The third was at pharmacies only and free only if you didn’t have insurance.

I know I am speculating here but is it possible, just remotely possible that trying to reduce costs in the short run by managed inconvenience and using crony capitalism is a factor in the decline of vaccination? And furthermore costs us as a society more with more deaths, more disability, more sick time taken, less time for students in school, less overally human happiness than just doing the way that proved it worked amazingly well 2 years ago. Could it be that by making things harder for people they are less likely to do it? Do humans really respond to incentives and short term cost savings do not always translate to greater long term prosperity?

Oh man this is like way too wild. No way I am right about any of this.

jettrscga ,

You might be right about the Covid vaccine, but this article is mostly referring to young children and vaccines such as measles. I don’t think it would be about distribution changes in that case.

More parents are requesting exemptions, with the implication being that more people have become polarized against all vaccines.

sigmund ,

I got my vaccine while in the weird period after getting a new job where you don’t have your health insurance info yet.

I paid $200 for it.

I’d do it again - got covid a few weeks ago and it was pretty light, likely a result of the vaccine - but damn, that’s a hard ask for a huge portion of the population.

markr ,

Covid vaccines remain free to anyone with insurance, including Medicare. They are immediately available at just about any pharmacy. Access is not the problem.

WookieMonster ,
@WookieMonster@midwest.social avatar

My sister’s insurance didn’t cover it. Which is wild, and I thought should be, but she fought it hard and that was the final answer. She had to go to a free vaccine event to get it because she couldn’t afford the several hundred dollars they wanted without insurance.

markr ,

yeah, despite this being legally required. This is the absolute shit of privatized health insurance in the US. These companies know they can just obfuscate, deny, and delay with impunity, and they do so.

afraid_of_zombies ,

If it is not a problem how come last month they would not go forward without my insurance information and made a big stink about having problems confirming everything?

markr ,

because back in september the government transitioned from direct funding to an insurance mandate based system. So yes you have to provide your insurance information.

afraid_of_zombies ,

Why?

markr ,

Because your insurance is now paying. Previously it was directly funded by the government.

afraid_of_zombies ,

Why is there a 2nd middleman? The retailer is already a middleman buying in bulk and selling to consumers. If the vaccine costs x amount why not just pay the pharmacy the x instead of the government paying y + x to an insurance company? The insurance company isn’t adding any value to the process. They aren’t coordinating the logistics, they aren’t pushing their users to come in, they aren’t providing anything.

markr ,

Huh? The person with health insurance has already paid the insurance company. That person owes zero dollars to anyone for the vaccine. The government also is not involved in the transaction. The payment is from the insurance company to the pharmacy.

Insurance does add value. It buffers people from variations in health costs. In the case here of one $200 vaccine dose, sure many people could pay directly. Also many people can’t. In either case that $200 is a barrier to getting vaccinated. It is in society’s interest, our interest, to have high vaccination rates so we try to remove the barriers to getting vaccinated.

I think for profit health insurance is a shitty system but as long as we have this shitty system I want the government to regulate the crap out of those insurers. Like requiring no cost vaccines.

numberfour002 ,

The third was at pharmacies only and free only if you didn’t have insurance.

For people in the USA: The covid vaccine is free for people with insurance.

Additionally, at least some doctor’s offices have it (mine does, but I don’t want to assume they all do), and there are vaccine clinics where they do flu/covid/etc that show up periodically if that’s more your style.

I’m not specifically calling out the user I quoted, just making a general statement because I’ve seen that exact sentiment (“the covid vaccine is no longer free”) like 4 or 5 times on lemmy in just the past day. It’s disinformation/misinformation and it leads to situations where misinformed people decide not to get vaccinated, in part, because they think it’s going to cost them money.

afraid_of_zombies ,

Do why did they ask me for insurance information when I got there last month?

numberfour002 ,

If the provider you were seeking the vaccine from didn’t already have up-to-date, accurate, and valid insurance information for you, then that would be one reason for asking. Realistically, a random internet stranger isn’t going to know the answer to your specific situation. However, if you want to know more about your specific circumstances, you may consider contacting them again and asking for clarification.

afraid_of_zombies ,

I don’t know how to ask Walgreens this.

stringere ,

Because while you may not be billed for it, insurance will still pay for it.

EssentialCoffee ,

The rollout for the 2023 vaccine was awful. I wouldn’t be surprised that some folks gave up because you just couldn’t get an appointment and then it was out of mind.

The third was at pharmacies only and free only if you didn’t have insurance.

I have insurance and didn’t pay for any of them.

Rogers ,

While I’m all for vaccination including covid vaccines, we would not have the distrust towards the mega pharmaceutical companies if they were not so untrustworthy. They sold their trust for profits a long time ago.

blazeknave ,

We didn’t trust their business practices, or that they were treating not curing people (which comes from r&d startups anyway). Pfizer overcharges diabetics and shit, we never thought they put 5g chips in your DNA or whatever tf these nut jobs think. This is not an extension of corporate mistrust, it’s anti science luddites keeping the population uneducated and sickly.

kent_eh , (edited )

I might be more cynical if they weren’t being monitored by literally every government health agency on the planet.

Bytemeister ,

Do you trust automakers? What about Apple or Google? How do you feel about GMOs in food? I bet you still eat, have a smartphone and drive. I get that it is hard to trust megacorps and industries thst have the populace captive, yet fear of a vaccine is what illicits special irrational behavior in people.

Rogers ,

In the US I don’t trust the phone and big tech companies to not sell my data, i dont trust the automobile industry to not lobby aganst good public transportation, and i don’t trust mega pharma to not SKU the test results when they could can away with it. I dont trust any of the above to not Astroturf, buy off ftc officials or anything if they are in a position to get away with it. Perhaps im just bitter because i was prescribed an absurd amount of opioids as a 16 year old. They were pushed so hard they told us it was safe they blantently lie

Veneroso ,

Well, given that the vast majority of these folks are aligned to a particular political party
 And it’s an election year during covid/flu/rsv season


Carry on!

kent_eh ,

It’s a bit uncomfortable to be cheering for eugenics, even if it is self-administered


lukzak ,

I don’t think this counts as eugenics, as nobody is forcing them to kill themselves. This looks more like natural selection to me. I’m all for it.

hfiwg ,

I hope you would agree, it is wrong to see people as totally atomized, neatly seperated, each in their own little castle with their own small set of things. We are all part of a World just as that World is part of all of us. Sometimes we make it a little better and sometimes we make it a little worse, but surely it is not as simple as to say anyone is the sole cause of their suffering nor, that they are the only recipient. For example: would it not be terrible for those, that love them to lose such a very dear peace of their world, and as an extension of themselves, even if it is in part responsible for their own demise?

You also mentioned natural selection, but it is clear, that not all thing one could label natural are good, just or desirable. ‘Can we perhaps even build a new nature?’, ‘In a world where we can sustain everyone, should we not just do it without any kind of selection?’ - those are just two questions, that come to my mind, but I don’t feel like thinking about them, still wanted to write them down.

AquaTofana ,

Fortunately this isn’t government mandated “cleansing”, these people are being told to get vaccinated/wear masks/use hand sanitizer. They’re being given every opportunity and encouragement to protect themselves.

Definitely Darwinism doing what Darwinism does.

I just feel bad for the immunocompromised people who will unfortunately inevitably get caught up in the assholes who refuse to take necessary precautions.

AbsoluteChicagoDog ,

This is as much eugenics as when that cult all killed themselves. Exact same situation.

Asafum ,

I just saw somewhere that (of course it’s Florida) politicians in Florida are calling to stop distribution of vaccines there because of “potential to cause cancer.”

Hmmm
 Now you care about carcinogens? You know what helps prevent carcinogens from entering the ecosystem? Corporate regulations. Oops I said the bad R word
 They don’t actually give a shit about what causes cancer, it’s just another political stunt


Veneroso ,

We really need to come back to reality as a country. Unfortunately it will take another thirty years.

Asafum ,

Unfortunately it will take us actually taking action against propagandists, but since they’re “the press” they get a free pass to do whatever they want.

It’s a horrible scenario to be in, because you definitely don’t want to open that can of worms with the current political system. Who gets to decide what is propaganda and what isn’t? I could easily see a Trump administration labeling all media that isn’t right wing media as “propaganda unfit for consumption.”

So we rely on the intelligence of the common individual to see through the bullshit
 As we all know common sense isn’t common :(

Kusimulkku ,

Hah. Needless.

muntedcrocodile ,
@muntedcrocodile@lemmy.world avatar

Do we have that many darwin awards to give out?

Melody ,

We do have an infinite amount of them yes. Sadly they will all be printed on fancy paper at best this year because of the volume of them.

muntedcrocodile ,
@muntedcrocodile@lemmy.world avatar

With the way its looking we might only be able to affort toilet paper

FlashMobOfOne ,
@FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world avatar

Ever since April 2020, whenever I hear something about vaccines, I just assume the worst.

I never got rid of my mask or hand sanitizer. Keep some in your car too. We’re all responsible for our own germs because culturally and legally, your right to life is considered less important than the right to stupidity.

Snapz ,

These people have gone too long without people they love dying in front of them from things like prolonged diarrhea lung, mucus intoxication and blood tears. Also the holocaust survivors and WW2 soldiers have mostly passed away.

We have a collective goldfish memory and right wing governments constantly sabotaging public education. We also lack empathy on the whole. Civilization doesn’t feel like it can sustain much longer.

ipkpjersi ,

We saw it during COVID too though, so many people refusing vaccinations because they are complete morons who don’t believe in science, as their family members die around them one by one, many of them still deciding that they won’t let “the man” win and inject them with “that poison”.

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