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Pokethat ,

I honestly don’t know how I feel. Most content feels like ‘consume our product/content and give us monthly fee’ instead of nice shows and movies. Everything seems to have a point where it pulls me out and I find myself questioning if I’m crazy or if everything feels like shit.

There are some amazing gems, but for years it feels like Hollywood has cared less and less about making cool and engaging media and are instead of focusing on manipulating people.

I’m sure the problem is coming from the top, but writers and actors have been pretty shit too

dudebro ,

Everything is shit. Quality is down and prices are up.

People gladly have been lowering their standards for years so those profiting off of them can make even more money.

Most actors are awful these days. Like, look at Chris Pratt lmao. That guy is terrible but very popular among children and manchildren.

We don’t have this generations’ Tom Hanks yet.

The only way to watch live action stuff that isn’t kiddie-bullshit is to watch things in other languages. They still have integrity and aren’t just loading their actors up on cocaine to cover up bad acting.

Snekeyes ,

Um. So watch other languages. They have integrity and.no coke. Cause coke actors… they are low paid and have to stay up and beat their bodies down to get paid.

Got it. This is fascinating fabrications Your imaginations almost rivals your thoughts.

dudebro ,

Ok. Believe what you want and watch what you want.

Dogs_cant_look_up ,

This is probably the worst take I’ve ever heard. It’s actually amazing how much i disagree with almost everything you’ve written here.

And, Tom Hanks is still acting, Tom Hanks is literally this generations Tom Hanks.

There’s so much excellent acting and directing in the world at the moment i just can’t fathom how you have come to your conclusions.

dudebro ,

I’m sorry, we’re just going to have to agree to disagree.

Hope you like the new marvel movie coming out.

FatCrab ,

Yes, only marvel movies come out now. Everything else is actually banned at the moment. Christ, your takes are fucking awful.

bassomitron ,

Chris Pratt is definitely not a great actor, he’s mediocre at best. However, he’s in tons of blockbuster movies so that’s why he’s popular, not necessarily because people think he’s talented.

The other stuff you said is just nonsense. There are tons of great, well written, acted, and directed movies. You just have to look outside the mainstream/blockbuster releases. If you only focus on the big releases from major studios like Disney, then yeah you’ll think that it’s nothing but shallow garbage. But there’s way more content nowadays, so it’s harder to sift thru the massive diluge of content out there.

dudebro ,

There are not ‘tons.’ There is very few quality content out there these days.

I’m not saying it doesn’t exist, but it’s becoming harder and harder to find in a sea of shit perpetuated by people with low standards.

tormeh ,

www.metacritic.com/browse/movies/…/filtered

funkless ,

Banshees of Inisherin? The Whale? Everything Everywhere All At Once? Succession? The Bear?

There’s loads of great acting out there. Maybe the issue is you’re buying tickets to Chris Pratt instead of other things?

dudebro ,

I’m not saying they don’t exist.

But every big-name, big budget release these days is almost guaranteed to be trash.

That wasn’t always the case. It’s only that way now because people’s standards are so low.

pineapplefriedrice ,

The big name movies now are so cringeworthy and require zero thought on the part of the viewer. I’d be almost embarrassed to go watch them. The worst part is that I used to watch them because there was just nothing else to see, until one day I was so bored that I walked out of the theatre. To my surprise, I was even approached and given a refund by the manager without asking… maybe they watched it too and understood the pain.

vimdiesel ,

You are equating “big name” with quality. That has almost never been true since movie blockbusters became a thing. Go ask any movie history buff/expert. You are very wrong if you think blockbusters were some kind of artsy tear jerkering, mind bending, raved over by critics products. They’ve almost always been formulaic.

TheActualDevil ,

But the first blockbuster movie is an arthouse masterpiece that really makes you look deep within yourself and wonder how big a shark could actually be.

Jaws. It was Jaws.

pineapplefriedrice ,

But are those the things that get marketing? I’m with you on loving that content, but none of the main theatres in my area (a city of 7 million) even show them. A couple will put them into the standard screen theatres at oddball times to fulfill their contracts, but the good content is in the local dollar theatres where, of course, the movie gets less traffic.

I think what they’re saying is that the movies that you’re “supposed” to watch are things like those god awful Harry Potter prequels (literally any fanfic amateur could have written them better), the ten thousandth Marvel movie (seriously, just stop), or those Adam-Sandler style low effort white trash movies that run solely on the recognition of the probably male and supposedly “so talented” lead actor.

pineapplefriedrice ,

But are those the things that get marketing? I’m with you on loving that content, but none of the main theatres in my area (a city of 7 million) even show them. A couple will put them into the standard screen theatres at oddball times to fulfill their contracts, but the good content is in the local dollar theatres where, of course, the movie gets less traffic.

I think what they’re saying is that the movies that you’re “supposed” to watch are things like those god awful Harry Potter prequels (literally any fanfic amateur could have written them better), the ten thousandth Marvel movie (seriously, just stop), or those Adam-Sandler style low effort white trash movies that run solely on the recognition of the probably male and supposedly “so talented” lead actor.

vimdiesel ,

As a gen X I can tell you that quality is not down and that you have tunnel vision. Go watch some 80s/90s shows lmao. Most are garbage, with only a few gems. It has definitely gotten better as competition increased.

evatronic ,

There’s a bit of a point there, though. As summarized by Futurama,

Fry: Married? Jenny can’t get married.

Leela: Why not? It’s clever, it’s unexpected.

Fry: But that’s not why people watch TV. Clever things make people feel stupid, and unexpected things make them feel scared.

Hollywood caters to what people want. What people want is often not “good”.

kale ,

We remember the good movies and forget the schlock. We remember 1976 as “Taxi Driver” and not “The Gumball Rally”.

PsiOc ,

I’m interested to see how Hollywood evolves post strike. Hoping that this will allow Writers and Actors more agency when making their products rather than having to conform to whatever shitty money grubbing practices that the Execs usually force on them

cantstopthesignal ,

Having 20 writers so you don’t have to pay them as much really dilutes any narrative structure.

doublenut ,

Oh boy at this point most of them are just fighting for their jobs, not even worried about actually making the work they want to be. If thats the kind of change you want to see in Hollywood, its gotta come from the consumer.

5in1k ,

Hopefully the number of bombs this year is the message the consumer needed to send.

gnarly ,
@gnarly@lemmy.world avatar

Gonna offer my two cents as someone who entered the industry during the last writer’s strike. You’ll see some interesting creative divergence as said creatives crave expression and reach out to new venues like YouTube for the first time. It was one of many changes to the industry at that (and now this) time. I use generative tech because it’s part of this exploration of the taboo. Back then, YouTube was the taboo because it was effectively working for free and with no insurance or protection by comparison to a stable studio gig. Take away the studio gig, anything and everything could be opportunity for change and especially so the longer this goes on tbf.

Mikina ,

This is one of the reasons why I strongly believe that if you want to do any kind of art and are passionate for it, you should never make your income depend on it. It’s why even though I’ve studied Masters in game development and was always passionate about games, I work as a Red Teamer in cybersecurity instead, and then work on my games as a hobby.

And especially if we’re talking about games, where you can just get a regular IT job as a programmer that pays more than you will ever make (assuming you don’t get to work on a AAA project, but the you basically have zero agency about the game and are still just a code monkey), the best course of action (which I regret not doing, but my classmate did and is a lot better for it) is to just take advantage of the fact that IT pays comfortably, but instead of just making more money just work parttime for a “regular” pay, and use the free time for your projects.

But every time an art becomes business, it will inevitably suffer for it. There are rare cases of small indie studios getting lucky to be able to uphold their vision and still earn enough to afford paying their employees comfortably, but sooner or later you get into a point where you just have to start considering stuff around marketing that’s totally unrelated to the art in itself, but usually forces you to compromise your vision

I’m actually pretty glad that generative AIs will probably really soon replace most of the artists required for mass production of such big budget commercial titles - because then the only option of someone who wants to do that kind of art will be a smaller indie studio or a hobby project, which may not be as successful and will probably end up as a niche, but it will also mean that a lot less artists end up with their passion sucked out and destroyed by execs forcing them to do shitty generic money grubbing stuff - because that will be done by AIs, and keep on being as generic as it is now.

Jordan_the_hutt ,

I think that’s in part due to nepotism. It seems like everyone who’s successfully in entertainment is the child or grandchild of someone else who was successful in entertainment. The same is true for the music industry and its starting to become true in the AAA gaming industry.

When people start to get those jobs because of their family connections rather than their ability everything goes downhill. The most obvious example outside of entertainment is politics.

vimdiesel ,

You’re worried about the 1%, this is about the 99% behind the scenes, doing supporting roles, building sets, etc . Don’t let movie execs take your eyes off the prize, that’s what they want.

solstice ,

I’ve barely even noticed this writers strike because I haven’t watched any Hollywood movies or watched any new TV shows and it literally years. Everything I’ve watched recently has been complete garbage. So I find myself watching older shows again and again, more YouTube content, educational and history stuff like that…heck, I’ve been following some modern film critics like Red Letter Media and just watch their commentary vs the real thing, and it’s usually much more entertaining.

I think Hollywood is going to use this opportunity to replace the writers with AI. If it works great, if it doesn’t work, nobody will notice or care.

QuarterSwede ,
@QuarterSwede@lemmy.world avatar

I subscribed to Britbox and find the writing and acting of much higher quality. Plus, the stories are generally more interesting with more feeling. I mainly watch that, watchTCM, and certain YouTube channels.

LetMeEatCake ,

Other than the nightly shows, you won’t be seeing the impacts of these strikes for months. Films and shows take a lot of time to go from inception to finished product. For movies I wouldn’t be surprised if the impact doesn’t happen until next year.

evatronic ,

To wit – we’re just now, seeing the tail-end of a lot of the COVID-19 shutdowns percolate up through the delayed releases and shortened seasons for a bunch of shows, and most of those shutdowns were gosh, almost 2 years ago now.

vimdiesel ,

Actors and writers use what they’re fed, this is 99% on movie execs.

bobman ,

If you want a gem, I recommend checking out Undone. It’s by the same guy who made Bojack Horseman.

You can stream it for free here: fmovies.to/tv/undone-70zyj/1-1

Just make sure you have a good adblocker, like uBlock Origin.

ThinlySlicedGlizzy ,

I don’t care how fast AI can pump out “high quality content” because I refuse to consume any of it. I really hope the strikes are successful.

tdawg ,

honestly we need legislation that protects artists who use their art as a means to live

dudebro ,

No we don’t. They can do something else.

It’s called the free market, baby.

Blue collar workers have been finding new ways to make money ever since the industrial revolution. Don’t be a Luddite.

If these people still want to make art, nobody is stopping them. They just have to get a real job too, like everyone else.

It’s okay. I think they can survive and still lead a higher quality of life than the vast majority of people on the planet.

wuddupdude ,

The free market kind of sucks at making art and I think it’s okay and good for the government to subsidize it.

ninekeysdown ,
@ninekeysdown@lemmy.world avatar

That is one way to view it. However due to everyone, in including blue collar workers, having their lively hoods threatened by AI we need to ask the question if were okay, as a society, for there to be more jobs eliminated than created. Are we okay with the current ways and (some would say the illusion of) the free market controlling everything? Are we okay with letting people suffer needlessly? Would you be okay with looking into the eyes of someone you know and saying “too bad that’s the free market baby!” Because it’s starting with the arts but it’s not stopping there. It’s only a matter of time before it will not need many warm bodies to do things. The knowledge works are next on the list and it won’t be long after that where manual labors will be impacted. This is all WAY before we even hit AGI.

I’m not saying that AI taking jobs is a bad thing. I think it is an amazing thing but we need to start embracing it as an opportunity for things to be more Star Trek and less dystopian hellscape. That means changing this mindset that a lot of us have and start asking ourselves how do we want the world to look in 100 or even 500 years from now.

HTH

the_post_of_tom_joad ,

They just have to get a real job too, like everyone else.

Would you mind expanding on what a “real” vs “fake” job is? I disagree with the premise entirely but i am not taking you with a loaded question, i am honestly curious about what that means to you (and by extension what other people who use that term might mean)

dudebro ,

Jobs that are necessary for the survival of our species.

Jobs that people don’t do for fun. They do it because it needs to get done.

People will still act even if they don’t get paid for it. Will they, deliver food just for the fun of it? No, I didn’t think so.

leftabitcharlie ,

There’s no such thing as a job necessary for the survival of the human race. The only thing jobs protect is the economic system, which doesn’t care about the human race.

cantstopthesignal , (edited )

So like, North Korea. Just a bunch of farmers and the military. I’d rather live in a world with joy and innovation.

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

Lol EVERYTHING we do is necessary for our survival, because of the fact that it’s humans doing it.

dudebro ,

Ok.

bobman ,

I wonder what this comment said.

tdawg ,

You sound like a copypasta genertor

RidcullyTheBrown ,

If it is high quality, why do you care how it was produced?

But it’s not the high quality content that’s threatened by AI, it’s the mediocre gargabe. It’s the endless stream of poor quality TV shows and movies which are produced not as art, but as a means of steady predictibile income for the companies involved. That’s the industry aspect of the business. This side of the business consumes most of the talent in the industry. They all know it’s not good and they all hope they will get the funding to actually work on the things they know will be high quality. I think AI will allow them to do that.

Further more, this strike is not just about AI. I think this aspect is the one media outlets care most about and gets reported on more. The entertainment industry has suffered a major shift with streaming platforms and the movement of money from production studios to streaming platforms has left the employees behind. They’re getting less money from streaming platforms but still do the same work. That’s what the strike is about. The industry didn’t care for them when it changed.

R51 ,

To answer your question about quality: it matters because it’s not real. The act of producing something of quality is what makes us better people. It ties into motivation to be better. Computers automating repetition doesn’t hinder that (as much, it does affect learning curves). The notion that computers be used for an output that would normally require creativity is just throwing away the essense of creation, the end product is not the only thing that benefits us. There’s no objective to why it was created, an AI writing something that evokes emotion is a party trick. All it really does is promote consumption and demoralize innovation, and ironically it hides behind innovation as the end-goal of the project. It’s just dead. One of the most beautiful things within creating something of value is the very process of creating it, having the passion and desire to do so, and the will to bring it into existence. AI is a cursed attempt at trying to replicate this process, and by lifting that kind of burden from a human inhuman.

dimlo ,

i refuse to believe AI can replace totally of the human part in the industry. Yeah some of the weak actors will be pushed out as they are not doing the job good enough, but it’s inevitable that one day technology is advanced that AI can actually replace human workforce. Like car manufacturing industry that have massive machines to assemble car parts, but also there are things only human can do. We don’t need crappy scriptwriters writing rubbish soap opera that my 10 year old daughter can write because they are no more generic than a AI churn out script. It’s like hiring a typewriter operator in 2023. Or rubbish actors that are like reading their script out with minimal effort and skills. It does not make sense.

dustyData ,

typewriter operator in 2023

There’s this people called stenographers who are paid quite well, they can write hundreds of words per minute and essentially transcribe a conversation in real time. They are hired by courts to create records of the sessions, by journalists, parliaments and to transcribe subtitles for audiovisual media. They use this cool typewriter like machine called a stenotype that was invented in 1880. The thing is, they tried to replace them with speech recognition computers. They discovered they needed a human to sanitize input for the computer, essentially a person who can speak really fast and really mechanically, repeating what others said in the room, or what was said in the movie or whatever, into an oxygen-mask-like sound proof microphone. So, they still had to pay someone to be there. Many places decided they could just pay the stenographer and receive higher quality products despite the slightly higher costs. Then YouTube tried to use machine learning to auto-create closed captions. Before that they used a community contribution approach that depended on volunteers to take some time to transcribe the subs. That change to automation was such a fiasco that some big YouTube channels now advertise that they pay an actual company with humans to do the closed captions for their videos in the name of proper quality accessibility. Because automated closed caption tends to do interesting stuff and it’s even worse when they try to throw auto-translation into the mix.

The point is, people tend to not understand technology and how it relates to humans, specially techbros and techies who have the most skewed biases towards tech and little sociological understanding. Nothing can be accurately predicted in that realm, and most relations that result from the appearance of new technology are usually paradoxical to common sense.

PipedLinkBot ,

Here is an alternative Piped link(s): piped.video/watch?v=1C7leljxnG4

Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.

I’m open-source, check me out at GitHub.

MelonTheMan ,
@MelonTheMan@lemmy.world avatar

I agree with you when it comes to AI in its current form - I wouldn’t even call it a party trick, just dumb luck. Machine learning through repetition will use existing ideas and tropes.

However you can provide the model with unique ideas, new tropes, characters, environments, and settings. The model in its current form could generate something nearly usable (script wise) and still be a valid piece of art with some cleaning up. Just because you save time doesn’t make an idea less “good”

In the future we could have near sentient AI that generates actual pieces of art far faster and better than a person can.

dudebro ,

Lol, ok.

I can’t wait for you to like something then change your mind when you find out it’s made by AI.

Lol.

RidcullyTheBrown ,

There’s no objective to why it was created, an AI writing something that evokes emotion is a party trick.

Then it’s not valuable. The question still stands: if something is truly valuable, does it matter how it was created? You are not answering this question, you are simply pointing out why AI in your opinion cannot produce art. My question is a bit “tongue in cheek”, of course. It cannot be truly answered without a specific example of creation. I’m asking it to prove a point: we’re dismissing something we don’t understand.

All it really does is promote consumption and demoralize innovation

I’d argue that this is what Hollywood already does. And as you rightly argued through your comment, it brings little artistic or creative value.

kmkz_ninja ,

To me, it’s the same feeling as the teachers that wouldn’t accept papers written on a computer (after an age where we know how to write) because “it’s less honest”.

I’m not good at drawing. I would love to try to make a game. Anti-AI luddites are happy that I will never produce something because I am incabable of doing something that an AI could easily accomplish.

dudebro ,

Yeah. It’ll be nice if all the drivel in Hollywood were automated.

If you think you’re so good at what you do, then you can be what the AI learns from to improve.

Everyone else? Well, tough tamales. This is what progress looks like and blue collar workers have been feeling it ever since the industrial revolution.

ramble81 ,

You’re just not going to give up this crusade are you? Going to start comparing salaries of line workers to starving kids in Africa again?

dudebro ,

What crusade?

These people don’t need more money, plain and simple.

TheActualDevil ,

You realize that most actors and writers are barely or not at all paid enough to live. This idea of the rich and famous actor is an edge case that you’re letting become your whole idea of them because they’re exactly that. Famous. But even you have to realize that there are countless others that will be and currently are being affected by the things their striking against. For too many years already writers have been shafted by production companies by hiring them as short term contractors to avoid paying them a fair wage or give them an option for royalties. And when literally everyone in the industry is doing that, then they have no choice if they want to get paid at all.

And being mad because some high profile rich fuckers are participating is insane. Their participation shows just how important it is. They’ll be fine. They have millions and they’re still out there on the picket line anyway because the things the industry does and wants to make worse is bad for humans. That’s what collective action is about and it’s beautiful.

dudebro ,

I realize they are living a higher quality of life while working less than the vast majority of people ever to walk the Earth.

Do you realize it’s about wanting more, not needing more? It’s not like these people are living off of peanut-butter sandwiches, lol.

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

That’s not what progress looks like, but you do you, fam. We’ll be over here on our new federated sites watching stuff made by actual human beings while Hollywood starves to death as everyone else stops watching that garbage.

Or we will campaign the federal government to ban the tech outright and your lazy shill ass will have to actually do something useful to make a living.

dudebro ,

Sure.

kmkz_ninja ,

We’ll be over here on our new federated sites watching stuff made by actual human beings

slowly puts away stable diffusion community subscriptions

I, too, got mad at the creation of the personal computer and lobbied congress to ban them because they aren’t as real as my subjective interpretation of reality, work, and honesty.

Knusper ,

If it is high quality, why do you care how it was produced?

To me, this is comparable to fiction vs. non-fiction.

Personally, I do already find fiction less engaging, because there’s nothing romantic about these stories. With which I’m not referring to a love story, I mean that there’s no sense of wonder of what lead to these events. It happened that way, because a writer wrote it that way.

And yet, the one thing still tying fiction to reality is the writer. You can still wonder what life experiences they’ve made to tell this story and how they’re telling it.
Our current narrow AIs don’t make life experiences, so you lose even that strand of meaning.

loom_in_essence ,

I’m looking for an interaction with the artists. I do not care what an AI produces… and I don’t care what a marketing team or boardroom of producers produces. I’m looking for an artist’s vision.

hark ,
@hark@lemmy.world avatar

Then hollywood is the wrong place to look. AI can make it even worse, but hollywood has been mostly devoid of expressing artistic vision long before AI came around.

Rodeo ,

I’m looking for an interaction with the artists.

How exactly are you interacting with them while sitting on your couch looking at a screen?

This is an appeal to purity argument. You’ve invented some higher standard (that doesn’t really even make sense) with the purpose of excluding the thing you don’t like.

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

Do you understand how art works at all?

kmkz_ninja ,

That it’s an entirely subjective experience and to presume that someone’s enjoyment of it means that a human had to be involved in It’s creation is such a ridiculous response.

Have you ever seen the paintings that one chimpanzee made? They’re actually pretty nice in composition. Am I allowed to like the way they look even if no human made them?

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

So long as it’s not a glorified machine learning program designed to commit mass fraud and copyright infringement, then yes. Until then, go cry harder.

kmkz_ninja ,

I’m going to think back to people like you in 15 years and smile at how naive you were.

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

No you won’t, you’ll still be sitting in front of your computer having gotten nowhere in life because you expected AI to solve all your problems for you and you couldn’t see it’s just another corporate grift. Like any sucker.

kmkz_ninja ,

“The internet is a grift”

aztec_dubstep ,

not wanting to see things you don’t like. In art.

loom_in_essence ,

The audience responds en masse by tuning in, paying up, being changed, perpetuating the ideas back into the culture through the filter of their own personality, chatting about the thing, praising or criticizing the artist.

This is an appeal to purity argument. You’ve invented some higher standard

Nope. It has absolutely nothing to do with “purity.” It has to do with humans doing the ancient human thing of making art. Dancing, singing, telling stories. You’re bringing in the abstraction of purity.

Hollywood (in its crudest aspect) is already an AI algorithm for churning out trash. That’s why I tune out already. Because it is not humans telling each other stories. It is pure corporate manipulation. More AI in the hands of producer-goons just means more corporate manipulation and less humans telling each other stories.

AI in the hands of an artist is a tool for exploring and creating. AI in the hands of corporate goons is the total opposite.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

I saw a great strike sign- “I refuse to memorize lines written by a machine.”

kmkz_ninja ,

But why? I feel like people are twisting their arguments against AI. Or they are being twisted against.

Why does an actor care where there lines come from? We live in a world where The Room was written and released, but AI content is going to be the end of media? People aren’t that special. Our thoights aren’t that special. We don’t have souls. We’re just thinking machines, and nothing we create is more unique than something that we created creates.

nickwitha_k ,

But why? …

Because this is about enshitification of life for studio exec profits. It’s not really about where a machine can or should be a part of creative works, but HOW they are being used.

Nearly very industry in which LLMs are being used in the latest hype wave, it’s not being used to improve anything but concentration of wealth in the hands of a dwindling number of individuals by worsening product quality and real ability of any of humanity, outside of those of hereditary wealth, to be get by.

dudebro ,

It’ll be funny when we start watching stuff and can’t tell what is AI and what isn’t.

I fully expect people like you to like something and then hate it after you find out it was made by AI.

Lol.

Meowoem ,

It’s funny to me because all these people are saying exactly what everyone used to say about mobile phones, about the internet, about computers… I know so many people who railed against the internet saying they’d never use it and that computers only make things more difficult - now they’re all yelling on Facebook about how the evil corporations they work for aren’t letting them work from home lol

AI will keep getting better and the way people use it will continue to evolve, there will be truly great things made by obsessive outsiders which speak to people in ways nothing has… Just like with every minor technical or social Innovation in art. Many of the giants of the old era will vanish and many new greats will grow and start to stagnate into conformity…

I’m excited for the future and all the interesting things it brings, we can’t just stop creativity and progress because some affluent performers want guarantees of stability which just don’t exist in reality

gnarly , (edited )
@gnarly@lemmy.world avatar

I do too hope the strikes are successful. That said, you’ve likely already been consuming generative technology for some time now. Disney alone has nearly a decade of research into it already. Advanced VFX applications use all sorts of generative tech too. When I was working in LA we referenced public data all the time. I know it’s gotten a huge spotlight on it given private AI capitalizing/evangelizing it all but the very real threat of digital scabs taking people’s jobs needs the biggest spotlight right now. I do think the tables will turn if nothing good can come out of Hollywood and those artists begin weaponizing that same tech against the execs. I see what studios are doing as no different than impersonation & identity theft by using this tech to limit working hours to skirt union protections.

TheCraiggers , (edited )
@TheCraiggers@lemmy.world avatar

because I refuse to consume any of it

I guarantee you already have and didn’t notice.

There’s a philosophical argument to be made for sure, and I’d probably even agree with you. But the reality is that the technology is here, and it’ll be used in pursuit of the almighty buck.

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

That’s what makes it especially insidious. We want entertainment made by people, for people, not by AIs for corporations and their pockets.

Aux ,

I would prefer AI content.

kmkz_ninja ,

I’m fine with AI content. It’s going to make making media so much easier for people who aren’t inherently artistic but have a vision they want to show.

loom_in_essence , (edited )

There are already teams of humans ready to do all that stuff. AI adds nothing there. The non-artistic person with a vision can already collaborate with skilled artists.

But more importantly, we are not worried about artists using AI as a tool. We are worried about corporate goons using AI to fire all creative staff and generate manipulative trash.

kmkz_ninja ,

Okay so instead of me just working on a fun product for free in my own time, I have to pay someone a fair wage as if this is a commercial product I’m producing?

There’s several people in this thread arguing we should outright ban the use, instead of coming up with ways to protect artists without artificially limiting AI.

loom_in_essence ,

I have to pay someone a fair wage as if this is a commercial product I’m producing?

There’s several people in this thread arguing we should outright ban the use,

I didn’t see anyone ITT making that argument, and anyway this whole debate is specifically and explicitly about hollywood goons using AI to churn out trash without paying the talent. It’s not about some broke artist using AI to bring his vision to life. As I already said. It’s beyond straw man to treat that as the position that’s being criticized

kale ,

The first company that debuts an entirely AI film will be a game changer, since it’s training set will be all the greats/popular films from Godfather, Taxi Driver, Jurassic Park, Star Wars, Inglorious Bastards, and Parasite.

Then everyone will want to get in on the game and we’ll see a huge number of AI films. To be noticable and unique, a certain amount of hallucinating will be allowed. After a couple more years, you’ll see model collapse as the film AIs are now using other AI output as their training input.

AI systems need a steady “diet” of human created material to continue to create material that is relevant and interesting to humans.

Robert Evans has a great episode on “behind the bastards” about AI and children’s books. The majority of Kindle published children’s books and coloring books are AI generated. There are Kindle books on how to make hundreds of AI children’s books a month using AI tools, including how to write the prompt for the AI input.

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

Stop being lazy and learn how to make your own shit. You aren’t entitled to other people’s skills.

kmkz_ninja ,

He says on a computer instead of hiring a postal worker to deliver his message.

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

In my own words instead of having ChatGPT do your thinking for you, the way you do

rikudou ,

Yeah, we need human writers! I don’t think AI can turn great books into shitty movies as well as actual writers. AI scripts sound like a real gain, IMO.

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

Questions for everybody else:

  1. Who actually thinks like this?
  2. Why are big Lemmy instances allowing obvious shills to concern troll and forum slide on their servers?
rikudou ,

Well, for one, I think like this. And given the upvote, at least one other person does as well. And six others disagree. Which is fine with me, by the way, people can disagree and be civilized about it.

As for “obvious shills and trolls” - just because I like the technology and dislike current writers, I’m a troll? With thinking like this you should perhaps go live in a totalitarian state, cause that’s how they roll - “you’re either with us or you’re bad”.

Can you pretty please let me have my opinion?

pinkdrunkenelephants ,

Well, for one, I think like this.

Then I have no reason to take you seriously. Goodbye.

rikudou ,

Stop acting like a spoiled kid, please.

loom_in_essence ,

Why do you expect AI to write better scripts than “current writers”? Do you believe than humans are incapable of good writing, and we need AI to finally make the first good art to ever exist?

rikudou ,

Not first good art, no, there are many great movies. It’s usually when people who are famous enough to do whatever are the directors (Tarantino, Nolan). But the usual crap? All the unimaginative movies and TV shows? Botching good books by not understanding the source material at all? That’s most of the writers and that’s who I think should be replaced by AI. We were doing a presentation on capabilities of AI recently and one sentence my colleague came up with sums it up: AI is not some super smart thing, it’s like millions of average people who can think really fast.

loom_in_essence ,

Again, why would you expect AI to write better stories than humans?

If hollywood churns out trash it’s because producers want trash. The AI will just help them churn out trash cheaper.

So how will AI fix this?

JeffCraig ,

There are many issues besides AI stuff that are causing this strike.

Yes, with the quick emergence of AI in all industries, we do need strong workers rights agreements and laws to address it, but AI isn’t really the primary issue.

People pick positions in these arguments that are too stringent and not realistic. There will be places where AI is useful in this industry. The union just needs to make sure AI isn’t abused in order to completely replace certain types of laborers.

rikudou ,

Well, then they’ll make movies without union.

vimdiesel ,

I hope there is some kind of “label” that comes out of this like the Surgeon General’s cigarette warning. “This movie is 87% AI generated” so I won’t have to bother thinking about whether to skip it. Fuck lazy & greedy movie makers. They’d giveup their immortal soul for $3.50

bobman ,

I understand your desire to support the SAG-AFTRA strikes, but I think you’re wrong to say that you’ll refuse to consume any AI-generated content.

First of all, it’s not clear that AI-generated content will be of lower quality than human-generated content. In fact, there are already AI-generated images and videos that are indistinguishable from human-made ones. As AI technology continues to develop, it’s likely that AI-generated content will become even more sophisticated.

Second, even if AI-generated content is of lower quality, it’s still possible that it will be enjoyable to some people. There are many people who enjoy watching low-budget movies or reading self-published books. Just because something is not created by a professional does not mean that it cannot be entertaining.

Finally, boycotting AI-generated content will not actually help the SAG-AFTRA strikes. The strikes are about ensuring that actors and writers are fairly compensated for their work. Boycotting AI-generated content will not affect the studios’ bottom line, so it will not put any pressure on them to reach a fair agreement with the unions.

I think a better way to support the SAG-AFTRA strikes is to donate to the unions or to spread awareness about the issue. You can also write to your elected officials and urge them to support legislation that protects the rights of actors and writers.

I hope you’ll reconsider your position on AI-generated content. It’s possible that this technology could have a positive impact on the entertainment industry, and it’s important to keep an open mind about its potential.

Tygr ,

I’ve been “striking” for a long time now, against junk TV in general. There’s an occasional awesome show that delivers but 95% of it is low-effort junk TV like dating, survival, cooking and other shows like it.

I haven’t had live TV in years and it’s quite shocking to see what the average user deals with. Junk TV + ads that play 30% of the time is absolutely insane.

JJROKCZ ,

Hey now! Some of us like the cooking shows lol

Tygr ,

Yeah. I’ll watch an occasional Gordon Ramsay here and there. I’m more referring to the baking shows, kids cooking shows and similar. But you know what I mean, replace all variants of cooking with the many variants of home improvement, how many do we need?

JJROKCZ ,

Yea there are simply too many, they’ve flooded the airways with a lot of garbage instead of a small amount of quality that reruns

HeartyBeast ,
@HeartyBeast@kbin.social avatar

low-effort junk TV like dating, survival, cooking and other shows like it.

... in other words, exactly the shows that don't use actors or writers

speck ,

Huh. When you put it that way...

tryptaminev ,

Dont they also have writers on these? With most of it being scripted and dramatized, sbd. gotta make all this stuff up. Also the whole set-up the catch etc. I thought these were done by writers too.

reev ,

I don’t know how other companies work, but I work at a company that produces a lot of reality TV shows. They definitely have writers that will lead the direction that the shows take (for example challenge ideas for a dating show or maybe bow they deliver hints to a blind customer cooking show) and they’ll have some leading questions in interviews (or even asking to phrase things for more drama if the contestants want to and they usually say yes) but you’d be surprised at how unscripted the ones we produce are.

bobman ,

I actually think the movies they star in and write are shit too.

Just looking at the list of movies held up by the strike makes me weep with joy.

Glad greedy shitbags who make nothing but garbage are fighting each other.

blivet ,
@blivet@kbin.social avatar

I haven’t had live TV in years and it’s quite shocking to see what the average user deals with. Junk TV + ads that play 30% of the time is absolutely insane.

Yeah, I’ve had the same experience. We don’t have live TV, and when we occasionally hang out with friends or family who do I’m always flabbergasted at the frequency and length of ad breaks nowadays, and similarly amazed that despite a nearly endless list of channels there never seems to be anything I actively want to watch.

leapingleopard ,

I can’t believe the people that allow commercials to blare in their living rooms without diving for the remote control like the house is on fire. Is it just me? and they just continue normal conversation like it’s somehow possible to hear them.

keeb420 ,

sometimes its nice to have background noise.

most of the time though im with you though.

lumcos ,

diving for the remote control like the house is on fire

lol this is me, it’s not just you 😂

Our house is generally on the quieter side. Partly because some of us are on the spectrum, and partly because we like to actually hear each other when we converse. Haven’t paid for TV in years, don’t miss it.

AbidanYre ,

Bruce was talking about it 30 years ago when we had 57 channels and nothin’ on. It’s only gotten worse since then.

UlfKirsten ,

Bruce?

Streetdog ,
@Streetdog@lemmy.world avatar

Bruce Wayne

timetraveller ,

I had one of them first TiVos, then upgraded to them expanded versions modes online for 1TB of shows. The 30-second skip button pressed six(6) times would effectively (skip) the ads. Never looked back. When I see or hear a commercial at someone’s house it rocks me like I’m in a different dimension and time.

FlashMobOfOne ,
@FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world avatar

Personally I rarely watch TV in real time, so the only time of year I ever really see commercials is during the NFL season.

keeb420 ,

nfl redzone is the only way i can watch most of the sunday games anymore. going back to the regular broadcast just feels so slow and outdated.

FlashMobOfOne ,
@FlashMobOfOne@lemmy.world avatar

You do you, my friend. I love the regular broadcasts.

grue ,

My parents still have cable TV (I just got them a Roku not long ago, so fingers crossed…), and at this point I can’t stand to watch it for more than about one and a half commercial breaks. It’s hard to believe anybody willingly subjects themselves to that trash when ad-free alternatives are available.

afraid_of_zombies ,

You forgot animated sitcom that either lasts 6 episodes or 16 seasons

mmagod ,

lol only 30%?

jokes but i agree… i remember going to visit some relatives and sat and watched tv with them… i too was so shocked at how they’d sit idly thru commercials jarring into their show, slapping them in the face…

i can’t stand it. just about anything i watch, when i watch, is commercial free

MyNameIsIgglePiggle ,

I think they get that from most half hour shows are 22 minutes and hour shows only 42 minutes.

But if course networks have been known to cut them back even further to squeeze some more ads in

cantstopthesignal ,

Even the most high effort shows have so much useless digression and pointless characters that are developed and killed off in a single episode.

Millie ,

What’s it going to take to actually do something about these ultra-rich leeches literally destroying our planet and everything good on it to inflate a number in a bank somewhere? How do we actually build up the initiative to stop it?

All our other problems seem largely centered around our inability to appropriately respond to extreme greed. Not only in actually actively stopping it, but in even identifying it or being able to properly censure it in the first place. The moment you start talking about the rich being the cause of our problems, there’s a section of society that starts tuning you out. I definitely feel like as things get worse people are starting to catch on, but even once we’re there, where do we go?

If we actually get to the point of agreeing that excessive wealth is inherently misanthropic and should be a crime in and of itself, how do we make it a crime while so much power sits in the hands of those who’d be on the losing end of that decision?

I hope the WGA and SAG can spark a change in people’s consciousness around labor. I’d honestly love to see a lot more interviews and independent podcasts coming from the picket lines. If there’s anyone who can convince Americans to fight for the value of their labor, it’s the people write and play the parts in the stories they love.

ConTheLibrarian ,

We need enough people to agree on both a vehicle and a direction.

  • There are a lot of people dissatisfied with the current government(s) but don’t agree how to create change; be it through the current system, major modifications to the current system, or even more severe changes.
  • There are a lot of people who don’t want wide spread poverty/suffering, but don’t agree on how that problem should be dealt with; be it through universal income, massive public projects, or wealth taxation and better competition regulations.

IMO we need a new digital/decentralized/open-source/transparent ‘social media platform’ that can replace the current easily manipulated electoral systems.

We need ideas & policies to be independently actionable from the partisan politics that afaic specifically exist to mitigate change and maintain the influence of money in policy.

Mayoman68 ,

Not sure if this is directly applicable but there’s the concept of dual power, where you can organize a bottom up power structure that takes some power from the regular government without needing to either submit to it or outright overthrow it. With that said it has only ever been successful in cases where the government is incredibly unstable to begin with.

Danterious ,

I agree that that we do need something like a collective action platform so people can coordinate much better than they currently do. Also something that you didn’t directly mention but I think you imply is that there doesn’t need to be complete agreement before action is taken because there are alot of valid disagreements on how to move forward but there are also alot of agreements as well that are ignored in public conversation because we take those points as a default.

I’ve been working on something similar to this on my own time (which you can see in my post history) but honestly we won’t move forward if we don’t actively start working together properly.

SwallowsDick ,

The fact that most people will reflexively reject and wilt at the idea of a wealth cap, or at least enforceablely taxing every dollar made above a certain amount at 99%, is a testament to the many decades of often-subtle propaganda that makes people think that modern western capitalism is the only way. As well as the continuing de-funding of public education and making colleges less accessible.

Buddahriffic ,

And another part of the problem (and IMO one of the biggest ones) is that the propaganda is only their first line of defense. If the rich and ultra powerful feel actually threatened, they don’t have to rely on soft power. See Epstein’s fate as well as the Panama papers reporter.

assassin_aragorn ,

I want to add on some quick math. Some people will look at this and scoff, saying that actors are millionaires and are more similar to these billionaire leeches than to us. A billion isn’t a number you can easily wrap your head around – I have trouble putting it into the correct perspective and scale, and I’m an engineer. It’s really difficult. So to try and show exactly how much money we’re talking here, I’m going to use time:

  • 35k seconds, 9.7 hours
  • 70k seconds, 19.4 hours
  • 100k seconds, 1.16 days
  • 250k seconds, 2.9 days
  • 1m seconds, 11.6 days
  • 10m seconds, 115.7 days
  • 100m seconds, 3.2 years
  • 1b seconds, 31.7 years

I haven’t even lived for 1 billion seconds yet, and I’m 28! Even an actor who’s racked up $100m over a successful career is closer to $0 than they are to $1b. Now arguably I’d say $100m is at the point where it needs to be treated similarly to $1b, but even so. The average working adult is closer to an actor in terms of wealth than these disgusting hoarders.

In reality, every dollar isn’t equal, and what this analysis doesn’t take into account is the amount leftover after all necessities are paid for, which is the reason why someone making $35k is not living like a millionaire. The point here is, a billion is incredibly big. It’s unfathomable. Unless the person protesting is a billionaire, they’re on your side against the leeches and absurdly wealthy.

(I suspect this is why actors tend liberal and billionaires tend conservative.)

jkure2 ,

What’s it going to take to do something about these ultra rich assholes

Let’s be honest the only answer is [redacted], they effectively own the government in the US and it’s not much better in Europe

TrenchcoatFullofBats ,

But what are we going to DO about the 5–12 feet tall, blood-drinking, shape-shifting reptilian humanoids from the Alpha Draconis?

sediton ,

Not all revolutions require blood, but I feel like capitalism is going to fight real hard to stay around. Even though that’s exactly what needs to go

paddirn ,

Robin Hood Rebellion. Start taking from the rich and giving to the poor.

SCB ,

The moment you start talking about the rich being the cause of our problems, there’s a section of society that starts tuning you out.

That’s because this is an insane claim.

If we actually get to the point of agreeing that excessive wealth is inherently misanthropic and should be a crime in and of itself

This is a massive “If.” I could probably never be convinced that one person’s wealth is inherently detrimental to someone else’s well-being.

These are very extreme views. I support the Hollywood strike, my buddy is a union leader (as were both my parents), and I’m a reliably Democrat voter, and I couldn’t disagree more with what you’ve said above.

33KK ,

The thing is, you can’t get that rich by playing fair, it’s only possible at the expense of others. And I can assure you, most rich people are activelty making our lives worse.

SCB ,

Again that’s a huge claim with nothing to back it up.

33KK ,

Nothing? 💀 Show me a single billionaire that got rich by playing fair

SCB ,

Define “playing fair”

33KK ,

Anticonsumer, anticompetitive practices, corruption and lobbying in their own interest, propaganda, tax evasion…

SCB ,

I lobbied in my own interest not 15 minutes ago, as part of Citizens Climate Lobby. Just got off a zoom meeting with my rep. Lobbying is not inherently bad.

Can you prove tax evasion? That’s a serious crime.

Also, shameless plug - consider joining your local chapter of CCL! Took me 5 minutes to sign up and all meetings have been via zoom.

citizensclimatelobby.org

33KK ,

Yes, I didn’t mean that lobbying in general is bad, I mean lobbying against the interest of the public. It’s commonly done by basically any big corporation + propaganda to gaslight people into believing that its in their benefit ( an example i have on hand: web.archive.org/web/…/get-the-facts/ )

By tax evasion I mean in general doing anything to not have to pay tax, lobbying against rich people tax, keeping your assets as loans, etc.

I’ll look into the shameless plug

Rodeo ,

That’s because this is an insane claim.

Consider that they have the power to massively improve everyone’s lives but are choosing not to.

Perhaps they didn’t personally cause and create some of those problems, but they are still the only ones with the power to make the necessary changes, so the continuation of those problems is indeed their doing.

SCB ,

In what way does the logistics revolution spurred by Amazon’s growth not massively benefit every person who buys anything in the US? You’re seriously suggesting with a straight face, that Microsoft hasn’t saved literally hundreds of millions of lives just in database tech alone?

You’re talking out of your ass here man. Hell, you’re putting billionaires on par with running a government which is simply absurd.

It’s not on rich people to save the fucking world, though Bill Gates has personally done more for the world than most governments ever have. It’s on voters to pass policies that provide them better lives. That’s the point of democracy

Rodeo ,

Are you serious lmao

You think billionaires have no influence on government? Please

SCB ,

I think you don’t understand how government functions in any real way at all

knivesandchives ,

That’s a really good question. Part of the problem, of course, is that the game is rigged: consider how difficult it is to buy food that doesn’t feed the Nestle war chest.

As a society, I think there are moves in the right direction - I just stumbled across something called Community Wealth Building, which is very cool, for example.

But as a private individual? That’s harder. I’d love it if there were an Amazon equivalent out there that sourced exclusively from worker owned co-ops, or at least unionized businesses, but as it is, I’m coming up dry…

mindbender444 ,

Now I can finally catch up with my backlog!

Lenins2ndCat OP ,
@Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world avatar

How’s that boot taste?

atp2112 ,

As far as I’m aware, neither of the striking unions have called for a consumer boycott.

Lenins2ndCat OP ,
@Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world avatar

It’s just kind of disgusting to be saying this shit jovially when people’s lives and families are at stake and actors are publicly threatening to burn down CEO’s homes. It reeks of sociopathic shit having absolutely no empathy or support for what people are going through.

CeruleanRuin ,

He clarified his words after some people naturally started to take it a little too literally, but I don’t think he needed to.

Whoever that “anonymous exec” was who said they wouldn’t even start to negotiate until strikers started losing their homes deserves to be pilloried.

CeruleanRuin ,

He clarified his words after some people naturally started to take it a little too literally, but I don’t think he needed to.

Whoever that “anonymous exec” was who said they wouldn’t even start to negotiate until strikers started losing their homes deserves to be pilloried.

Lenins2ndCat OP ,
@Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world avatar

Pretty sure this walk back is simply because of the legal implications. It’s pretty obvious what he meant.

Pillory is too nice for them.

CeruleanRuin ,

Idunno, the pillory could get pretty brutal if the crowd was sufficiently riled up. It wasn’t uncommon for people to bring stones or bricks.

orphiebaby ,
@orphiebaby@lemmy.world avatar

I don’t know why you got downvoted. Because you watch TV? So what? Either way, I liked your comment!

kratoz29 ,

I hope all the industry did that kind of hiatus then (?

vimdiesel ,

This is the best possible outcome. No one wants that AI generated shit while actors and behind the scenes people make starvation wages.

dudebro ,

deleted_by_moderator

    •
    GentlemanLoser ,

    You have a serious agenda huh champ

    dudebro ,

    Err… no. I just don’t agree with what the crowd is saying in this regard.

    Don’t they have an agenda?

    Syrc ,

    So if we’re going to have AI replacing Actors, Animators, VAs, Writers and everything there’s going to be a lot less people to pay and ticket prices will go down by 90% right?

    The whole population will benefit from AI and not just people who already make way too much money like it happened with pretty much every other technological innovation right?

    dustyData ,

    Just like WallStreet, the ultimate goal is to also replace audiences entirely with AI sentient viewers. That way they can create millions of viewers who will be pre-primed to want to watch the same pieces of media several hundred times. They can even view the movie at 500% speed so they can do so in a shorter timespan than meat viewers. OpenAI will be the first company to offer culturally insensitive and politically neutral 100% synthetic audiences to feed your Hollywood releases. For just cents per 1 million viewers/hour you too can release a blockbuster. This includes Twitch and YouTube audiences!

    RidcullyTheBrown ,

    The whole population will benefit from AI and not just people who already make way too much money like it happened with pretty much every other technological innovation right?

    Humanity benefited from the invention of the printing press. Humanity benefited from the industrial revolution. Humanity benefited from the invention of computers. Humanity will benefit from AI too, greatly so. This is not what is up for debate. Some people made fortunes from it, but does that matter when you compare it to how much good it brought about?

    Syrc ,

    Did it really benefit that much from it though? We can now be infinitely more productive while working, but are still required to work the same work week and have the same purchasing power, if not less in some countries. And the products made with that work cost pretty much the same, even though it costs much less to produce them.

    Very rarely a technological innovation actually ended up improving common people’s quality of life, and the ones that did were due to being improving of the end product in nature.

    AI doesn’t improve the end product (rather, currently it worsens it), it just improves the efficiency. And like with the Industrial Revolution, people will get paid the same, will have to work the same amount of time, and their end products will cost the same. CEOs will benefit from it and no one else, if history says anything.

    RidcullyTheBrown ,

    You probably don’t know history.

    Syrc ,

    Just from a quick Google search. Skip to the end if you want raw hour comparison.

    I’ll gladly accept a huge AI implementation if it means cutting even 20% of current working hours while keeping the same salary, but I’m really skeptical on that.

    RidcullyTheBrown ,

    That’s not what I’m debating. What about healthcare? What about acces to education? What about infant death rates? What about travel? What about not having to worry about starvation? Clean water directly into your home? Hot water too? Electricity? Have these not improved the quality of life greatly? You must not know history if you think your average peasant was living a better life preindustrialisation.

    I’m not sure what work you’re doing at the moment but you seem pretty burned out by it. Maybe it’s time for a change

    Syrc ,

    That’s not what I’m debating either. All of those are due to technological advancements that improved the end product. AI doesn’t improve the end product, just the process.

    When the end product improves, the one who benefits from it is the customer, and the manufacturer if they manage to sell it at a higher price than before.

    But when the process improves and the end product is the same, it just takes less money/time to make it. So the only way common people would benefit from it is if manufacturers decided out of goodwill to either raise salaries, reduce working hours, or decrease the price of the end product. And that barely ever happened in history.

    RidcullyTheBrown ,

    But when the process improves and the end product is the same, it just takes less money/time to make it. So the only way common people would benefit from it is if manufacturers decided out of goodwill

    The industrial revolution improved the process. Before that, for example, knives were traditionally made by a skilled blacksmith and were very expensive. After, they were made cheaply and much better and made their way in every home. Just like pots and pans. And clothing and carpets and chairs and literally all the goods which required a skilled crafstmith and were expensive and scarce became massed produced and became cheap.

    Same with computers: things that were hard to make because they required skilled workforce became easy to do and cheap with automation.

    It will be the same with AI: another round of things that are expensive because they require skilled labour will become cheap and available to everyone. This time it will be even more complex things than before, things that require a bit of ingenuity like medical diagnosis, maybe driving, maybe teaching, maybe writing (but more probably editing rather than writing). Think cheap basic healthcare for everyone. Think free, good, reliable public transport for everyone. Think reliable press. I don’t know what form it will take and where we’ll find applications for it.

    It’s not clear what capabilities this technology has at the moment and what is its future. However, it promises a wonderful thing: the ability to scale up for free things that couldn’t be scaled because they could only be done by people and people are in short supply.

    As for the work hours comparison between now and the medieval times, that comparison is not correct. It compares working hours, but doesn’t add in the effort required for just living. When work is done, you have to make food from scratch always because you can’t store it for too long, gather firewood, clean the firepit, bring water from somewhere, make tools, make clothing, wash and clean the house, constantly repair a host of poorly built things that require attention, a million things to do always. We really can use our down time for leisure nowadays.

    Syrc ,

    I don’t know, I don’t think any of those things could be reliably entrusted to an AI.

    Medical diagnosis is very serious stuff and should not be taken lightly, same for driving.

    Press will also suffer the biases of whoever built the model so it’s not really going to be different from today. Editing maybe, but I don’t think either is going to lower the price of publications by that much.

    Teaching as it is done today could very easily be replaced, but that’s because it’s a flawed system at its core and should be reworked from the ground.

    I’m very skeptical about it but maybe you’ll end up being right, who knows. It’s all moving so fast and predictions are hard to make.

    icepuncher69 ,

    Dont listem to them, they are trolling

    vimdiesel ,

    Bro you are waaaaayyyyy overly optimistic on who AI is gonna benefit :) . It won’t be the 99% in the end.

    Syrc ,

    That was sarcasm, I thought the “Right? Right?” was enough to give it away lol

    kmkz_ninja ,

    So your argument isn’t against AI, it’s against studios. Or your argument is against us, and our complacency when it comes to corporate or profit overreach.

    I don’t see how you could take that as an argument against AI in general. Stanley Yelnatz wasn’t wrong for looking for the shorter shovel.

    Syrc ,

    Sure, just like my gripe is mainly with school shooters rather than with guns, and with crazy billionaires rather than with social media.

    But since you can’t realistically regulate the users to a healthy level, you have to regulate the tool. Because, just like those other two things, the benefit it brings to regular people is minuscule compared to the harm it can do.

    reksas ,

    Fuck hollywood.

    This would be good opportunity for people to start new film studios and such, founded on more equal profit sharing. Let greedy pieces of shit shrivel and die without labor to exploit. There is no negotiating with those kinds of people as they will just try to find ways to force and manipulate people to do what they want.

    Aux ,

    It’s ironic that Hollywood was created by filmmakers and actors who got tired of being exploited by investors and cinemas alike.

    c0mbatbag3l ,
    @c0mbatbag3l@lemmy.world avatar

    It’s the circle of liiiiiife capitalism.

    Aux ,

    How’s that capitalism?

    potoo22 ,

    People dislike a greedy business.
    Start a humble competing business.
    Greedy business falls in line or fails.
    Competing business now free to push profits, becoming greedy business.
    People dislike a greedy business.

    Aux ,

    Wut? Are you 13 years old or something?

    randon31415 ,

    People dislike a greedy business. Start a humble competing business. Greedy business lowers prices to crush competition, or buys it outright. People continue to dislike a greedy business.

    Idea1407a ,

    “Money makes the world go around…”

    “Greed is good”

    Making money is fine, but at what cost?

    Hypersapien ,

    Actually, they moved to Hollywood so they wouldn’t be under Edison’s camera patents.

    SpaceCowboy ,
    @SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca avatar

    They should call it “United Artists”!

    And… Jeff Bezos already owns it.

    TwoGems , (edited )
    @TwoGems@lemmy.world avatar

    Ribbit

    Amazed ,

    Charlie Chaplin did a similar thing - United Artists. Then it got sold to MGM. and so on

    TrenchcoatFullofBats ,

    It’s also worth noting that many of the “indie” production companies are backed by billionaire money. For example, Annapurna (movies: Her, Zero Dark Thirty, American Hustle, games: Journey, Stray, Kentucky Route Zero, Outer Wilds) was founded by Megan Ellison, the daughter of Larry Ellison of Oracle software, worth about $150 billion.

    Indian Paintbrush, the production company that has financed all of Wes Anderson’s movies since 2007, is run by Steven Rales, CEO of Danaher, worth $7.3 billion.

    It’s not just production or indie firms either - CAA (Creative Artists Agency) talent agency that represents people like Tom Hanks, Steven Spielberg, The Weeknd, Bob Dylan, Aubrey Plaza, Bradley Cooper, Cardi B, Chris (Evans, Hemsworth and Pine), Salma Hayek and thousands of writers, producers and directors, is currently in final talks to be purchased by Francois-Henri Pinaul, who owns Gucci, Balenciaga, Girard-Perregaux and Christie’s auction house, is married to Salma Hayek, and is worth about $33 billion.

    zombuey ,

    Fake news, these are all crisis actors. They didn’t even try I’ve seen many of these people in movies!

    TrenchcoatFullofBats ,

    According to his lawyers, Alex Jones is a crisis actor

    MargotRobbie ,
    @MargotRobbie@lemmy.world avatar

    These crisis actors can literally be anyone, it could be you, it could even be gasp me!

    complacent_jerboa ,

    incredibly based. fuck the execs. fucking parasites

    GammaScorpii ,

    Hollywood is dead anyway. They just make superhero movies for china now

    MixedRaceHumanAI ,

    好萊塢沒有死。

    Upwuarkdownquark ,

    deleted_by_author

    •
    CodeMonkeyDance ,

    jejeje

    EmperorHenry ,
    @EmperorHenry@lemmy.world avatar

    They’ve been making alternate versions of every movie for china since 2008. Especially disney. Disney is such a cuck to china that they declared all the winnie the pooh characters as public domain to appease Ping.

    TrenchcoatFullofBats ,

    I wonder what the Chinese version of Cocaine Bear is like

    Nothus ,
    @Nothus@infosec.pub avatar

    Good. I hope they never come back. Theater is better when it’s local and in person, and everything coming out of the machine for the last twenty years has been total garbage.

    nobody ,

    You haven’t enjoyed a single movie from the past twenty years?

    Sharkwellington ,

    Let me put it this way. Have you ever heard of Nolan, Tarantino, Coen? Morons!

    Smacks ,
    @Smacks@lemmy.world avatar

    Whole lot of the bigger establishments have been going through the ringer lately

    Jojo-Mcfrost572 ,
    @Jojo-Mcfrost572@kbin.social avatar

    Good. More please. Hold these cucks accountable.

    Destroying the planet for infinite wealth.

    dojan ,
    @dojan@lemmy.world avatar

    Yeah! I’m sick of it. Not only do they want infinite money but also infinite growth.

    Literally like a cancer. Feasting on society until nothing is left.

    jimmyjoners ,

    This. I want more strikes. I’m tired of everything going to shit and the masses sit back and do nothing. I’ve gone to a few protests recently, and honestly it’s cheap therapy for me. Feels nice to actually DO something.

    kklusz ,

    And what have you actually accomplished with marching and shouting? I went to quite a few BLM protests back in 2020, got tear gassed and shit along with my friends, and yet still haven’t seen anything meaningful change.

    CeruleanRuin ,

    Change is slowwwww, my brother. It’s rare that an actual upheaval happens and things shift noticably overnight.

    It is and always has been a long, long struggle, and there is no final victory, only temporary triumphs that must be vigorously defended, because the enemy will never stop trying to take back every inch.

    lohrun ,
    @lohrun@fediverse.boo avatar

    Change doesn’t have to be slow and we don’t need to make more excuses for the people able to make the change. Protests outside of the US have shown how to accelerate change in the direction they want. At this point though, it appears that a lot of people have given up hope that anything will change

    CeruleanRuin ,

    And can you blame them? The opposition infrastructure is so incredibly overbuilt that it’s like trying to chip away at a wall when they keep taking away your tools.

    CyPhD ,

    I think it’s even more goddamn nefarious than just destroying the planet for wealth - if some of the shit I’ve been reading is right, then AI has changed the game and this strike is our fucking chance to get ahead of the shit that these studios want to pull. In what world is it okay to pay an actor a single day’s worth of work and retain their likeness in pepertuiry using AI generation.

    I’ll admit that I’m not very knowledge on the whole workings of the AI part of it, but I do feel like every actor should have full control over their likeness and how it should be recorded and how it is applied to AI.

    MBM ,

    From what I heard it’s not even new technology but from ~2016, they’re just trying to push it through again but now under the guise of AI

    vimdiesel ,

    The 1% would murder us all and replace us with AI if given the chance, never forget that. They’d be too stupid to realize that the AI bots would take them out next.

    vimdiesel ,

    You wanna get really mad? A new practice they were trying to pull off was bring in some young good looking actors; do 3d body scans, record a bunch of voice data, and then have them allow the studios a perpetual license to use their likeness for a few thousand bucks. How evil is that?

    dudebro ,

    Sounds cost-efficient.

    If the end product is the same, who cares if it’s made more cheaply using robots instead of humans?

    This frees those humans up to do something else useful for society.

    lohrun ,
    @lohrun@fediverse.boo avatar

    It’s only a matter of time for desperate people to sell their likeness to a company doing that. If there was a company out there saying they’d pay you $3k to do a full body 3d scan, record 1 hour of voice lines, and own the rights to your image…do you know how many people would do that? (Probably a significant amount)

    Evil and awful yes, but people are desperate for cash in this economy and most people wouldn’t truly understand what they are giving up to the company

    TendieMaster69 ,

    Let’s hope some never become desperate, because they see through the lies and wouldn’t be doing anything for money. They’d have fun watching things break.

    vlad76 ,
    @vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

    At this point they should just pay OpenAI to AI generate their “actors”

    doggle ,

    Good to see some solidarity. I wish it happened more. I’d have thought that the spread internet, allowing easy and covert communication, would have caused a proliferation in the number and efficacy of labor unions, but alas.

    StalinIsMaiWaifu ,
    @StalinIsMaiWaifu@lemmygrad.ml avatar

    we’ve had generations of Americans come and go without the need* of unions, I think the positive communication aspects are outweighed by the negative culture ones

    *unions are good for everyone, by need I mean the effects of neoliberalism hadn’t kneecapped the (white) working class until 2008

    Tar_alcaran ,

    we’ve had generations of Americans come and go without the need* of unions,

    Thanks to the work of the unions formed by the generations before them.

    SwallowsDick ,

    The Internet has done a ton of that, around the world. But the news focuses on negative stories because, psychologically, humans are much more compelled by negative stories

    BrazenSigilos , (edited )

    Oh no! Anyway…

    Edit: In case the subtlety slipped by some folks, I was pointing out how very unimportant the film industry is as a whole. I stand by the folks striking for better conditions and pay, but without Hollywood the world will continue on. Humanity doesn’t need a new Marvel movie to survive the next year. Food, water, construction, transportation, these things are critical infrastructure. But I do not care if Hollywood stops making cookie cutter movies for a while, let the studios feel the crunch. Who can honestly say they are totally caught up on all the shows they want to watch, anyway? Go watch something you didn’t have time for before, because the newest season of “Someone else’s life” just aired. Go make a new friend, read a new book, or explore a new place. Don’t want to or can’t for some reason? Ok, go watch anything else, there is more media then you consume in a lifetime available for you to peruse on the internet.

    Lenins2ndCat OP ,
    @Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world avatar

    How’s that boot taste?

    dudebro ,

    The actors are also stepping on others.

    They care more about living well I’m Hollywood than children in Burundi getting food and water.

    All this money is so they can live as lavish a life as possible and show off to their friends. They want this money for acting instead of doing something else useful for society.

    They get mad when I point out they don’t work that hard and have a lot of excess wealth.

    zouden ,

    They get mad when I point out they don’t work that hard and have a lot of excess wealth.

    I think this is an imaginary conversation you have while in the shower

    dudebro ,

    No, it’s what I witness whenever I call it out.

    kmkz_ninja ,

    What do you do for a living? I’m certain I can come up with some reductive asshole argument about how you’re hurting some.

    Lenins2ndCat OP ,
    @Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world avatar

    The workers have no control over anything in Burundi. What a bizarre thing to attack them with.

    BrazenSigilos , (edited )

    What boot? The boot of the industrial propaganda machine that I’m refusing to be concerned about when it just might have to slow down on producing another cinematic universe for merchandising? Screw the studios, let them deflate a little while the people who do the work strike for better conditions and wages. I’m sure the next Thor movie can wait a couple more years before becoming a lunchbox.

    Lenins2ndCat OP ,
    @Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world avatar

    The workers get to choose what gets produced do they?

    You are complaining about exactly the same people that the workers are striking against.

    BrazenSigilos ,

    You are complaining about exactly the same people that the workers are striking against.

    Yes, because as a worker of any kind, I stand in solidarity with the people who are looking for fair compensation for their time and work.

    The workers get to choose what gets produced do they?

    Yes. If I work at a chemical plant, then find out the plant has been poisoning the town I live in, my most effective way to stop that happening is to refuse to make more poison and convince as many of my neighbors and colleagues who work with me to do the same. The boss won’t come down from his office and make it himself, will he? As the person making it, I’m morally responsible for it’s existence.

    Lenins2ndCat OP ,
    @Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world avatar

    Right. The impression given by your original post (pre edit) was that of not caring about the workers, I’ve just seen that edit and see the misunderstanding here now.

    BrazenSigilos ,

    Yeah, my mistake. I realized that afterwards, hence the edit. That’s what I get for trying to use a meme response, I need to be clearer in my reactions.

    Lenins2ndCat OP ,
    @Lenins2ndCat@lemmy.world avatar

    o7

    TokenBoomer ,

    To add; this is, in my opinion a bigger deal than UPS. There are other freight companies. It’s bigger than the railroads. We have other shipping. We only have one Hollywood. Entertainment sucked the last time they striked. It started all the reality shows.

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