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Feathercrown ,

This is every school surveillance software

hddsx ,

Oh man. That’s work that office IT. At my office, the just log everything but unless you do something wrong, no one checks it.

Every student should be issued a webcam shade

SGG ,

If a school provides a device to a student to take home there’s two possible outcomes.

  1. They provide a managed device, and with any management tool, there’s a way to invade privacy, intended or not.
  2. They provide an unmanaged device and get sued by parents for letting their"innocent snowflake" access unwanted content.

In both instances there’s something to legitimately complain about, but I still say the first option is the better one. The problem comes with oversight and auditing on the use of those management tools.

Not to mention that even with the second option of unmanaged devices, invasion of privacy can still occur if students are stupid enough to use the school provided accounts (Google, 365,etc)

youngalfred ,

There’s other ways - write it into the conditions of loan that it’s not the school’s responsibility to monitor student use when at home.

There are solutions that allow monitoring only on campus - both the monitoring person and the student need to be on-site for the software to contact a licensing server. No server contact=no monitoring.
And never bring ‘AI’ into it.

Badeendje ,
@Badeendje@lemmy.world avatar

What are we monitoring? How kids get dressed, if they pick their nose while using the computer?

Blocking sites does not require on device “monitoring”. Locking down a machine does not require monitoring. So why this invasive level of monitoring.

Deceptichum ,
@Deceptichum@quokk.au avatar

It’s about monitoring what the children are using on the device not turning on the camera and spying on them naked.

youngalfred ,

OK so that’s nuts they installed a private ‘AI’ monitoring software that they have no oversight or control over. From the article, they can’t even see what it flags as inappropriate - it just flags and deletes.
A school admin should never hand over that much control!

sunzu2 ,

School contracting is corruption central.

dohpaz42 ,
@dohpaz42@lemmy.world avatar

The rights of children, especially privacy, has never been a priority for anybody except the children themselves.

Arkouda ,

…on students’ school-issued machines and accounts.

These are school issued machines, and like all machines issued by a 3rd party for use under their supervision, they come with monitoring software.

This isn’t some dystopian issue, and frankly, students should not be using school issued machines for private chats or photo storage, and should absolutely have their search history monitored while using said devices.

Sundial ,

These aren’t necessarily the computers you and I grew up on where they had a dedicated computer lab room for use during class time. These are devices they take everywhere with them, even home. Now imagine some creepy school IT administrator decided to peek on the Webcams of kids while they’re on their room?

catloaf ,

No need to imagine, it’s linked in the article: cbsnews.com/…/610k-settlement-in-school-webcam-sp…

Brkdncr ,

Camera/mic access seems like overreach. PII should be obfuscated and only accessible with an audited workflow that includes an access review.

Modern off the shelf MDM is capable of this.

Arkouda ,

I understand the difference between a laptop and PC thanks.

Now imagine if, and hear me out, one didn’t bring school hardware home so some “creepy IT administrator” doesn’t have access.

“Save the kids” arguments always fall flat on the face when the solution is as simple as leaving school devices at school.

shalafi ,

They have to take it home for homework.

SadSadSatellite ,

Yeah it’s a good thing homework doesn’t exist.

Darkassassin07 ,
@Darkassassin07@lemmy.ca avatar

Yeah, when i was in school; there were no devices issued to students. We had ‘computer labs’. Ie; a room full of computers for student use. There was always one computer for the teachers to use that had a remote-desktop interface monitoring every screen in the room live. They could always see what you were doing, lockout your keyboard/mouse, blank your display.

This really doesn’t seem any different.

I could understand outrage if students were require to install this on their own hardware; but school issued devices are under the schools monitoring and control. Always have been.

EleventhHour ,
@EleventhHour@lemmy.world avatar

These are different because kids take these computers home, and it’s some random working for a 3rd party monitoring what’s going on.

Creepy.

Darkassassin07 ,
@Darkassassin07@lemmy.ca avatar

kids take these computers home

I feel like that is the bigger problem. These aren’t private/personal devices; students shouldn’t be treating them as personal devices. Especially knowing it’s a monitored device.

Properly educating students on the use of these devices is the solution. Not telling schools to turn a blind eye to the use of their own equipment.

TimeSquirrel ,
@TimeSquirrel@kbin.melroy.org avatar

I mean yeah, I don't watch porn on an office computer at work after all. They should have their own devices for all that stuff. School devices = school-related activity only, no more.

youngalfred ,

Like doing homework in your room? Where now the monitor can turn on your webcam without you knowing and watch you in your personal space?

Darkassassin07 ,
@Darkassassin07@lemmy.ca avatar

And again; I think that’s a bit of a separate issue. These devices shouldn’t be equipped with cameras, let alone have the camera monitored/accessible.

The actual activity happening on the device; running applications, what’s on screen/in storage, even it’s location (with informed notice of said tracking) sure. but there’s no need to monitor/access the camera regardless of how or where the device is used.

A simple piece of tape fixes this problem. (plus education to teach students why, ofc)

sunzu2 ,

Even if kid limits it to that, this arrangement is still no appropriate.

CosmicTurtle0 ,

These are fucking kids. They are still learning what devices do and what their appropriate use is. If they are like me, they have probably already found ways to watch porn, monitor their crush’s computer, read their email, and get into their webcam.

It’s not lack of education.

It’s lack of impulse control.

Darkassassin07 ,
@Darkassassin07@lemmy.ca avatar

If they are like me, they have probably already found ways to watch porn, monitor their crush’s computer, read their email, and get into their webcam.

I got into quite a bit of similar mischief as a (pre)teen; but I didn’t do any of it on equipment that I knew was monitored (at least, monitored and signed out to me…)

catloaf ,

Then you were the exception.

Arkouda ,

I agree that this is no different, and has the same solution: Don’t use the schools computers for things that aren’t for school and you won’t have no problems.

catloaf ,

The article has a pretty convincing argument against it. You should read the whole thing.

Arkouda ,

I read the article and it is not in any way convincing.

Sorry to burst your bubble.

sunzu2 ,

Justify it however you want it but this is a huge over reach esp since we got some shiti 3p vendor involved to middle man this.

I totally trust them not to sell that data after it is "properly anonymized" or "leaked" 🤡

Arkouda ,

Can you explain to me how a 3rd party putting monitoring software on their own hardware is an over reach?

sunzu2 ,

School is the counterparty and a state actor with everything that entails sign a poorly negotiated, likely corruption ridden contract with some trust me bro we don't sell data, vendor, ie third party.

Now your child is subject to a contract arrangement that you are not privy too that enables some "dudes" to track your child's usage of equipment.

If you don't see this as an overeach, society has really degraded esp in context of the child abuse issues we are coming grips with.

Arkouda ,

School is the counterparty and a state actor with everything that entails sign a poorly negotiated, likely corruption ridden contract with some trust me bro we don’t sell data, vendor, ie third party.

What could be gained by monitoring someones school activity that is not already bought and sold by social media companies that the majority use excessively and daily?

Now your child is subject to a contract arrangement that you are not privy too that enables some “dudes” to track your child’s usage of equipment.

Don’t use third party hardware if you are worried about being monitored.

If you don’t see this as an overeach, society has really degraded esp in context of the child abuse issues we are coming grips with.

If you could make a real argument that isn’t a personal attack or logical fallacy that would be great.

sunzu2 ,

Bootlicker vibes are strong here.

I am happy you are willing to sell out your child like that 🤡

Chozo ,

This isn't isolated to school-issued equipment. While this article is mostly talking about high school students, this same situation plagues upper education, as well. My roommate was recently taking some college courses from home, and the proctoring software they require installs rootkit-level spyware on his computer and tried monitoring our entire network activity.

Arkouda ,

That is 100% a different issue.

Chozo ,

Not really, though. In both scenarios, somebody attending a public school is required to have invasive spyware running on their devices.

Arkouda ,

The difference between schools installing the programs on their own hardware and installing them on personal devices is stark and I cannot take any argument seriously that ignores this.

Chozo ,

You're missing the point. Either way, the use of this invasive software is required in order to attend public school.

I cannot take any argument seriously that ignores this.

Arkouda ,

Either way, the use of this invasive software is required in order to attend public school.

Oh? Who is forcing the use of school issued equipment?

Last time I checked one did not need a school issued device to attend a public school. In fact I would go out on a limb and say the majority are too underfunded to give every student a device in the first place.

Chozo ,

Oh? Who is forcing the use of school issued equipment?

The schools. Many assignments are given 100% digitally now, with no option for a pencil-and-paper version outside of special needs situations, which not every student qualifies for.

Last time I checked

"was clearly a long time ago" is how that sentence should've ended.

sunzu2 ,

You are booming too hard here lol

Jfc

Badeendje ,
@Badeendje@lemmy.world avatar

Why? Can you elaborate on why this is not an issue and kids should be monitored by a 3rd party?

Arkouda ,

I already made that clear in my original comment.

sunzu2 ,

You have some wacked out priorities lol

Badeendje ,
@Badeendje@lemmy.world avatar

No you did not. You just stated that this was the case. I’m asking why that is/should be acceptable.

Why is it normal to put monitoring software on?
Why does a 3rd party need to monitor it?
What are they monitoring that would be considered acceptable?

I honestly ask, because I can’t think of any reason.

Or is this similar to “mass shootings are a fact of life”?

fubo ,

If your kids’ school laptops are surveilled, they’re surveilled by someone. Let’s call that someone Joe. Joe is a person who took a low-paying job that lets him surveil your kids. Joe likes his job, because he gets to surveil your kids. He gets to turn on the camera and look in your kids’ room. He gets to read the chat messages your kids send to their classmates.

Your kids would be better off without Joe in their lives. Joe is not a source of security. Joe is not protecting your kids; Joe is a threat to them.

sunzu2 ,

We know that positions with power and access to children will attract pedophiles this is a well known, thoroughly confirmed fact.

And yet we got apologist justifying another government over reach.

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