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Riot Games Now Requires Kernel-Level Anti-Cheat Software for League of Legends, Following Valorant's Implementation

Vanguard, the controversial anti-cheat software initially attached to Valorant, is now also coming to League of Legends.

Summary:

The article discusses Riot Games’ requirement for players to install their Vanguard anti-cheat software, which runs at the kernel level, in order to play their games such as League of Legends and Valorant. The software aims to combat cheating by scanning for known vulnerabilities and blocking them, as well as monitoring for suspicious activity while the game is being played. However, the use of kernel-level software raises concerns about privacy and security, as it grants the company complete access to users’ devices.

The article highlights that Riot Games is owned by Tencent, a Chinese tech giant that has been involved in censorship and surveillance activities in China. This raises concerns that Vanguard could potentially be used for similar purposes, such as monitoring players’ activity and restricting free speech in-game.

Ultimately, the decision to install Vanguard rests with players, but the article urges caution and encourages players to consider the potential risks and implications before doing so.

Darkassassin07 ,
@Darkassassin07@lemmy.ca avatar

Nope. Take your rootkit and go fuck yourself with it.

There’s absolutely 0 reason a game should ever have kernel access. Ie unrestricted access to every piece of data on the system.

HelloHotel ,
@HelloHotel@lemmy.world avatar

Funnally enoigh, the reason for and against game companies exploiting a critical vulnrability to access to ring -1 is way stronger. If you installed an anticheet to ring -1, No MoRe PiRiCy, nobody needs to know its there, nobody can remove it, its not like your system is unusable now, and best yet, its a verry big target for other shady types to join the ring -1 party. /s

blueengie ,
@blueengie@c0tt0n.world avatar

@ForgottenFlux @technology HAX!

GiM ,

I don’t understand the Vanguard hate. Its one of the best anti cheats and unlike EAC it doesn’t take screenshots of your desktop.

Just use a separate OS install for games.

polle ,

“just” :D More like hitting the uninstall button hard.

Eezyville ,
@Eezyville@sh.itjust.works avatar

We could go through the hassle of partitioning our drives, installing another OS (and possibly paying for it), maintaining that OS, and rebooting to play this one game. Or we could just not install this game and say fuck that hassle.

ByteJunk ,
@ByteJunk@lemmy.world avatar

By the replies, I almost assumed this was 4-chan. It’s either some bold bravado, or generic out of touch shaming people foe allowing kernel level access.

There are interesting conversations to be had around this topic. For example, Riot in the article rises the following points, can we address those?

Cheat software developers are already releasing cheats that operate at this level. If Riot wants to combat them, it has to do so at the kernel level.

Lots of other companies are already using similar software to prevent cheating.

“This isn’t giving us any surveillance capability we didn’t already have.” Claiming that if they wanted to steal data, their example being a secret recipe, then they could already do so in user mode.

sudoku ,

Cheat software developers are already releasing cheats that operate at this level. If Riot wants to combat them, it has to do so at the kernel level.

and what is their endgame? “Developers are releasing cheats that emualate a mouse. Therefore Riot needs to use a camera to record your hand”?

Lots of other companies are already using similar software to prevent cheating.

If everybody is jumping off a roof, so should Riot?

“This isn’t giving us any surveillance capability we didn’t already have.” Claiming that if they wanted to steal data, their example being a secret recipe, then they could already do so in user mode.

Isn’t the whole point of anti-cheat to survey the computer? If you aren’t getting anything new, then why even use a kernel-level anticheat?

ByteJunk ,
@ByteJunk@lemmy.world avatar

and what is their endgame? “Developers are releasing cheats that emualate a mouse. Therefore Riot needs to use a camera to record your hand”?

You mean a device that physically operates the mouse? I don’t know, I don’t work for riot, but this is done in online chess - to participate in some tournaments with money prizes you need 2 webcams.

If everybody is jumping off a roof, so should Riot?

No, the question is if this discussion also cover all other anticheats that use kernel mode, or is here anything that is League-specific?

Isn’t the whole point of anti-cheat to survey the computer? If you aren’t getting anything new, then why even use a kernel-level anticheat?

This is just splitting hairs on semantics, isn’t it? From the moment the app is running in user space, it could collect a huge amount of user info, but it can’t look for kernel-level cheat software.

Note that I don’t play league, I could care less about the game or the developer, I’m just interested in the privacy vs cheating aspect of the conversation.

Loewi ,

Isn’t the whole point of anti-cheat to survey the computer? If you aren’t getting anything new, then why even use a kernel-level anticheat?

Because the one thing they want to find, cheat software, can hide if it’s running in kernel mode and the anti cheat isn’t.

ultra ,

You could also run software in the kernel that hides vety sensitove data

Serinus ,

Don’t put games on a classified system.

wildginger ,

Dont make games a risk to whatever data I personally treat as equivalently classified. I cant own multiple computers to keep my private info on one and game on the other, unless youre offering to buy me some new tech

Serinus ,

They already are a risk. You think Minecraft is incapable of uploading your My Documents directory? I can write that code in less than 20 lines and add it to any existing, working game.

Lethal Company is more of a risk than Riot and Vanguard, at least for now. If Riot LA does lose control of the source code, I expect US authorities will be notified.

Serinus ,

I cant own multiple computers to keep my private info on one and game on the other

If you wanna be truly safe in Windows, this is what you have to do. In Linux, it’s almost possible (but difficult) to manage all your permissions well enough, but if state actors are finding four zero-days at a time in iOS and Android I don’t doubt that they can get into your Linux system if you’re running untrusted executables.

It’s an interesting thought because everyone’s concerns here are valid, but they didn’t start with Vanguard or Riot. They started well before. If you have League of Legends or any Steam game installed, you’re already compromised, and Vanguard doesn’t really move the needle there.

People here are raising alarms about a bald tire while they’re already driving on 3 other bald tires. The problem isn’t at all solved if you “fix” the one.

Nobsi ,
@Nobsi@feddit.de avatar

“Developers are releasing cheats that emualate a mouse. Therefore Riot needs to use a camera to record your hand”?

The most basic form of anticheat already spots this.
You are so far in the past it’s clear why you don’t understand it.

cley_faye ,

they could already do so in user mode

So, you read “we already have these surveillance capability” and you’re fine with it? Interesting.

The whole point of “user mode” is that it is possible to separate things. Even on Windows, assuming proper handling of your storage and settings, one account can be barred from accessing another account data it should not have access to. Granted, most people won’t care, but you can do it, and run separate windows accounts for games and personal stuff for example. You can even do it without constantly switching between them.

Not only kernel mode “anticheat” will allow snooping on the current account, but on others too, that’s the key difference here. As a user/customer, it removes the possibility of having private stuff on your computer at all.

That’s kind of a big deal.

ByteJunk ,
@ByteJunk@lemmy.world avatar

You could drop the flamebait, but all good.

Not only kernel mode “anticheat” will allow snooping on the current account, but on others too, that’s the key difference here.

Can’t this already be achieved by elevation? Why would a kernel driver be necessary?

Guest_User ,

Someone woke up on the wrong side of the bed it seems 🙄

ByteJunk ,
@ByteJunk@lemmy.world avatar

I could point out the ad hominem, but even worse, emojis?! You have zero credibility, scram.

wildginger ,

You could drop the flame bait

nekusoul ,
@nekusoul@lemmy.nekusoul.de avatar

As someone who has previously argued that user/kernel-level distinction is pretty pointless (along the lines of this XKCD), the multi-user aspect is something I haven’t considered before and actually quite important.

darganon ,

Anti cheat is whatever, it’s adding a gigantic target for malware. Privacy is great, but it’s literally just adding an attack vector.

rabiddolphin ,
@rabiddolphin@lemmy.world avatar

They want you to be digital slaves

Rakonat ,

I was gonna care until I read league of legends. Clearly people already hate themselves and despise sensible choices and alternatives. Otherwise they wouldn’t play lol.

erwan ,

Everything bad about LoL is it being a MOBA. I think you can’t prevent toxicity in a MOBA.

In a team with randoms, if you start losing you’re stuck in an unfun game where you get crushed by the ennemi for half an hour.

What’s not to love?

Rakonat ,

MOBA is possible to be good and have come back games but LoL is entenched in shitty game design choices from 15 years ago and largely survives because its free to play and anyone interested in MOBAs has heard of it and played it. I’d argue games like smite or monday night combat do the MOBA genre better and advance from crippling rts controls on an action oriented game, but those never caught on cause the moba crowd hates change and innovation.

tagliatelle ,

You must not have paid attention to the smite “pro” scene if you believe that game is in a good spot.

kameecoding ,

i mean, that’s not Moba specific, Counter Strike, you get 1 griefer and it becomes a slog fest.

it’s the people that suck, lots of raging and griefing at the slightest setback by people who have no life.

Quit that shit a long time ago, have not played multiplayer games in years.

wildginger ,

Arent CS games a faster turnaround tho?

kameecoding ,

I don’t think so, CS games can go to up to 90 minutes theoretically, unless the game is really one-sided then the game lasts somewhere between 40-60 minutes, which I would say is a reasonable estimate for Dota 2, never played LoL so not sure how it is there.

wildginger ,

Huh, I thought they had a max of 45. Maybe Im mixing that up with a different game

kameecoding ,

yeah probably, though CS is kinda ambiguous what the max is, but well that’s the max, unlikely to happen, this guy does a calculation of it:

www.youtube.com/watch?v=v8CmJ9namK0

Mikina , (edited )

tl;dr: Was never toxic or angry, and was consciously trying to not blame others but focus on my performance, but eventually gave up on DOTA, because it’s too complex to play seriously and captain a team. Switched to Starcraft2, and realized how mentally taxing and depressing it is when you don’t have a team to blame, and that you unconsciously blame teammates because it’s a powerful mental defense mechanism. I’ve never felt worse, stressed and anxious, than after a loosing spree in 1v1 Starcraft.

I’ve spent hundreds of hours playing DOTA in highschool, and eventually I’ve reached the conclusion that unless you play with (and ideally are a captain) in a premade team, there’s not really a point in playing - you will never get better alone, and you will unconsciously always blame other teammates, making it harder to learn your lessons and improve. (I’m deeply flegmatic and forgiving in regards to others, a archetypal support main, so i never was getting angry or toxic, thankfully. So I was usually more focused on my own performance and didn’t care that other fuck up - or so I thought)

I’ve also quickly realised that the knowledge required to be a captain is something that even after thousands of games, and hours of research, I’ll never be able to get. There’s so many variables you need to know just to pick a team comp and get through the ban and pick phase, and then you add itemization to the mix, knowing what your team should do based on the current minute, hero picks, and items chosen by your and enemy team… I really respect any pro player due to that, because its isane how many variables they have to work with.

And so I switched to Overwatch, because there, the meta is a little bit easier to follow and there’s not that many variables in play, to be able to lead your team.

I wasn’t able to get a stable team willing to take the game seriously, and eventually I’ve also noticed that I still tend to subconsciously focus on what my team did wrong, instead of my own gameplay.

So, I switched to StarCraft 2. And oh boy, those were the worst few months of my gaming life. The meta was eaiser to grasp, I knew what to do, the issue was building the muscle memory to execute it correctly. But there are plenty of resources, from training maps to The Staircase method, so I was making a pretty good progress.

However, the Ranked. Here, I’ve realized how much blaming others in team games is a necessary defense mechanism, because in this game, you have only yourself to blame for every loss. Hitting that play button in Ranked was terrifying, I was regularly depressed and felt terrible after every loss. It was so taxing to my mental well-being, because most of the games you play, just end with: “You suck. That was a beginners mistake. You’ll never be good at this game, and you have only yourself to blame. Just give up.”.

There’s no blaming teammates, theres no " I’ve made a few mistakes, but my team also…", which as it turns out, being able to do that is a tremendous help in regards to your mental health.

I still had fun, it was a great challenge and I enjoyed learning the game and slowly getting better, but the losses, and especially loss streaks, were so stessfull and taxing, to the point where I was literally anxious to the point of almost having panic attacks every time I wanted to hit that fucking Find Ranked Match button.

But the wins, oh boy I’ve never felt better in my life. But, you know - as an average player playing at your rank, you should hover around 50% win rate. And that’s a lot of losses.

I’d recommend this experience to everyone who keeps playing competitive games with random players. It was eye opening in regards to how you handle losses, and a great introspection into how I subconsciously handle losses in team games, even though I never got angry.)

ipkpjersi , (edited )

I’ve found on StarCraft 2 you can just blame the enemy. You can say “omg you cheesy 10 pool garbage” or “you just mass mutas all day congrats” or “making roaches is a good skill to have” or “congrats you made siege tanks” etc. I was very competitive at one point but now I just don’t really care much for it anymore. I’ll still play ARAMs with friends but maybe not after this kernel-level anticheat lol unless it works through Geforce cloud then I guess I could keep playing it.

Generally though, I’ve started out gaming with single-player games and I’ve mostly gone back to single-player games, other than playing RuneScape (OSRS and open-source RSPS) games etc ofc.

Mikina ,

Oh, definitely. Blaming the opponent is something that I’ve also started doing, but also quickly found out that it doesn’t really work as well as blaming teammates in regards to your mental state.

“My noob teammates kept feeding the enemy, so there’s not much I could’ve done even if I played better.” shifts your guilt almost entirely on them. “The noob enemy chose an ease cheese strat” always has the slight problem that you always have to add (consciously, or you just know it subconsciously) “that I didn’t recognize in time and I didn’t manage to counter”. And that feeling will nag you :D

r1veRRR ,

While it wasn’t 100% free from hate, Heroes of the Storm had significantly less of it. Similarly, GW2 has a far friendlier community than WoW, because game design does matter.

CosmicCleric ,
@CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

Similarly, GW2 has a far friendlier community than WoW, because game design does matter.

So much this.

Poem_for_your_sprog ,

GW1 was better

Commiunism , (edited )

I’ve been playing League casually from time to time on Linux, and it’s just a shame that they’re adding Vanguard to the game since that kills any compatibility it had under wine. Though, knowing League community, a lot of players on Linux are so addicted to the game, they’ll switch their operating systems for it or buy a second computer just to play.

teatowel , (edited )

The TPM 2.0 (and secure boot) requirement is only enforced if you’re running Windows 11.

Liz ,

As if I needed another reason not to ever use Windows 11.

Commiunism ,

Thanks for the correction, I’ve removed the section from my comment.

Dicska ,

Gaming (compatibility) is the only reason I’m not on Linux. I have tried it before and if all my games were possible to play on it I wouldn’t even look back.

Tlaloc_Temporal ,

It’s pretty close right now, especially since steamdeck and proton. Take a look at protonDB, see if there’s a critical mass of your main games to try again?

Dicska ,

Thanks, I’ll take a look but AFAIK Valorant still doesn’t work properly and smoothly on Linux.

ObsidianZed ,

I don’t fully know how these kernel level anti cheats work, but is it possible to setup a VM or some other container solely to run games like these?

Dark_Arc ,
@Dark_Arc@social.packetloss.gg avatar

In theory yes, in practice, it’s a great way to get banned if they want to crack down

PrefersAwkward ,
@PrefersAwkward@lemmy.world avatar

To add to this, if you VM, you have to find a way to hide the fact that your VM is a VM. Often, the GPU is the number one problem doing this, so a passthrough is enough.

halva ,
@halva@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

in theory yes, but vanguard is very good at differentiating between VMs and real hardware

bitwolf ,

That’s another problem. So few will vote with their wallets because they’re so addicted to the game they’ll just deal with it.

Chev ,

Edward Snowden showed that the US is spying on their citicens but nobody seems to care. But when China is doing it, everybody seems to lose their mind.

nucleative ,

If the group doing the spying is ideologically in the same “tribe”, people don’t seem concerned. It’s both a survival mechanism and our Achilles heel.

yamanii ,
@yamanii@lemmy.world avatar

For me it’s the opposite, they are so far away from me I couldn’t care less what Xiaomi does with my info.

alice_mac ,

This makes more logical sense however most people see foreign as worse than local but controlling.

FabledAepitaph ,

Agreed. China isn’t going to put together a bogus profile based on poorly researched correlations and throw me on a list with no ability to defend or appeal the decision. And if they do–who cares? I’m never going to China.

evranch ,

In the case of rootkits, your “info” could include anything. Keylogging your passwords and financial data, compromising your machine as part of a botnet…

The worst part is that it doesn’t even have to be the original installer. If this malware turns out to have an exploit, your computer could be botted and sold to the highest bidder.

The only person with kernel-level access to a computer should be the owner.

guacupado ,

Better the devil you know than the devil you don’t, and all that.

Liz ,

I mean, I care.

EmperorHenry ,
@EmperorHenry@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

If something won’t run with core isolation enabled, it’s probably malware

ByteJunk ,
@ByteJunk@lemmy.world avatar

The kernel-level cheats would fall into this category I guess, but cheaters will still be running them. Could anything without the same level access identify them?

EmperorHenry ,
@EmperorHenry@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

It doesn’t matter. Nothing should ever need to get that deep into your system…ever.

You need human moderators watching all the players to see if anyone’s cheating and then you manually ban the cheaters

_Mantissa ,

deleted_by_author

    •
    Danitos ,

    Dota 2 is similar to LoL, has a native Linux build and runs perfectly fine out of the box. Perhaps you can give it a shot.

    smileyhead ,

    You cannot make a paper that can have any text written onto, but not the one text you don’t like. The only way to do it is to spy on someone and check actively what is being written.

    You cannot make a computer that can run any program written into, but not the one program you don’t like. The only way to do it is to spy on someone eather physically or via lower level spyware.

    sugartits ,

    You cannot make a computer that can run any program written into, but not the one program you don’t like

    Yes you can. This has been done multiple times for decades now.

    smileyhead ,

    Nope, this is mathematically impossible. See what is Turing completeness, any complete programmable system, like any programming language can simulate any other language and system. You can run Windows on Minecraft redstone or spaceship program on a smartwarch as they are Turing complete systems. Only roadblock is time to port it and slow execution.

    The only way someone can get close is to nerf the whole system by allowing only a single program to run. This is how secure boot works, it looks at what you run and say “sorry Dave” if it’s not signed. But if this signed program is also complete, like operating systems are, you still can run things on top of it :#. It’s complicated, but TLDR there is no way to say “can run anything - 1”, only “can run X number of programs” and there’ll never be.

    sugartits ,

    Yes, I think I was misunderstanding the original point.

    ILikeBoobies ,

    The Chinese government wants to install a root kit on your PC

    If you meet someone playing these games then they are the dumbest people you have run into

    Draedron ,

    Or they dont give a fuck what the chinese government thinks about them

    ILikeBoobies , (edited )

    No, they might be ignorant of how bad this is though

    It is at a level where you would write to your representatives to ban it. I assume you are ignorant of rootkits since you mentioned “what they think about you“ rather than “owning your pc”

    catalog3115 ,

    Respectfully, I have to correct you. This argument is not correct way to think about privacy.

    For Example :- You don’t care what I think about you but if I ask where do you live, what is your bank ac, what messages and email you send and to whom, etc. You will not provide me those details even though you don’t care what I think about you. Similarly a player might not care what they think about them but the mere collection of user data is bad for the player.

    omnomed ,

    Very well put.

    Holzkohlen ,

    If you meet someone playing these games then they are the dumbest people you have run into

    Hello, nice to meet you. I am trying to get away from it, but it’s hard. Sunk cost fallacy and all that. BUT I am playing at lot less. Having to dual boot to play one damn game is gonna help too.

    ook_the_librarian ,
    @ook_the_librarian@lemmy.world avatar

    Dual boot would only protect you if have your other side encrypted or are monitoing it to make sure the other partition is never mounted.

    What you need to play games like this is a side-piece computer on its own LAN.

    erwan ,

    If you believe the game to be malware you should not play it. Even if it doesn’t have a kernel-level anticheat.

    A binary on Windows can do pretty much whatever it wants.

    ook_the_librarian ,
    @ook_the_librarian@lemmy.world avatar

    Agreed. But I was more highlighting what lengths you need to go to protect yourself from a rootkit. I thought the parent mentioned dual booting as a sandboxing measure. I could have been mistaken.

    Haha ,

    Says the guy with a username as primitive as boobies lmao

    yamanii ,
    @yamanii@lemmy.world avatar

    2024 still on the red scare, for an american company nonetheless, lmao.

    ILikeBoobies ,

    China isn’t leftist or communist

    Tencent isn’t an American company

    CosmicCleric ,
    @CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

    2024 still on the red scare, for an american company nonetheless, lmao.

    To be fair, there is a small but real chance that we may be going to war with them someday in the future, over Taiwan.

    Do you really want an adversary that can disable a large portion of your populations computers in one fell swoop?

    Chadus_Maximus ,

    o7 OpenSuse you will be missed. This has been a great blow to the Linux gaming community. Sad I cannot be a part of it after this change.

    prole ,

    Wait, are you saying you’re giving up Linux? Seems like you’re saying OpenSUSE will be missed. Really? For LoL???

    jivandabeast ,

    People who play League are a different breed bro

    Chadus_Maximus ,

    Yeah. This comment section just looks like a bunch of people who have played league once half a decade ago. Easy to quit something they weren’t doing in the first place.

    daq ,

    I actually wish valve did something this catastrophically stupid when I was wasting 5 hours a day on fucking Dota. Would’ve made it so easy to quit.

    MonkeMischief ,

    Just like that?

    Are you the one that calls the surrender vote at the 15:00 mark? :|

    C’mon, don’t let em have their way with you and the rest of the playerbase like that. This move is a gross breach of trust on their part.

    –Fellow OpenSUSE (Tumbleweed) community member

    Jarix ,

    On a side note im delighted that someone with the username rooty is talking about unrooted things.

    Am I a simple man who enjoys simple things.

    Im also okay with this

    nymwit ,

    Can you run games like this in a virtual machine? Would that eliminate kernel level general invasiveness concerns because it’s a…virtual kernel I guess? Does that virtualization require too much overhead to run demanding games?

    doctorcrimson ,

    Yes you can, but at the cost of performance and the risk of permanent ban. I believe there is a sizeable community of Valorant Players on Linux, which means all of them are using virtualization to bypass the anti-cheat.

    nbafantest ,

    The LoL is only for windows installs rn

    doctorcrimson ,

    I didn’t realize Riot even made any Linux distributions period.

    Mycroft ,

    They don’t, Linux players have to use wine. And it will be impossible afaik to play lol on Linux once vanguard is added.

    As someone else said, there is no plan to add vanguard on macs

    RmDebArc_5 ,
    @RmDebArc_5@lemmy.ml avatar

    They didn’t. Only mac and mobile

    MonkeMischief ,

    I mean…that stupid university “anti cheat” rootkit browser called “lockdown” can detect if it’s in a virtual environment and say “this won’t run. Plz put me on bare metal so I can read all your secrets.”

    I imagine this program wouldn’t find that hard to do either sadly.

    Danitos ,

    There’s ways in which a program can detect if it is running in a VM. If Riot made a kernel-level anti-cheat program, they’ll surelly also implement this.

    thoughts3rased ,

    They did implement this from my knowledge. I think SomeOrdinaryGamers made a video where he showcases hardening a VM to beat the detection.

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