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GBU_28 ,

Sounds great.

Allow Airbnb to return to it’s roots:

Small time short term rentals used when the owner is away. And for remote locations where no hotel exists.

femtech ,

Yeah, it was great to stay and a million dollar house on the top of a mountain next to a state park for a weekend. But I choose a hotel when I’m just going to a city for something.

phoneymouse ,

I’ve stayed at my share of Airbnbs booked by others, but never really enjoyed the feeling of sleeping in some strangers house. Also, disliked the impact of airbnbs on local housing markets. The idea of replacing long term housing with short term housing is completely stupid from a public policy perspective and a great way to ruin a city.

Additionally, I like being a customer, and anonymous. I don’t want to be rated by the host. I don’t want to be judged on whether I put my own towels in the washing machine before I checked out. If I’m paying, that shouldn’t be my damn job.

Also, airbnbs are random. Some are good, some are awful. Some hosts are fine, some are a bit too much. Hotels do vary, but on the whole, the experience is much more consistent.

feannag ,

For me, it’s almost always the cheapest/most convenient way to stay somewhere with a kitchen. And it may be an okay kitchen but almost always better than a hotel’s. That’s the part I find the hardest to replicate outside of Airbnb.

Thebeardedsinglemalt ,

Exactly, I lost all taste for Airbnb when we were staying for 2 nights, and every 4 hours the owner was balsting me with text messages telling me I needed to rate them 5 stars because if I didn’t they wouldn’t rate me 5 stars…but I had to take out my own trash, put all towels and linens in the washer, and make sure to tidy up before I left or else I’d incur their “clean up fee”. Fuck that shit, I’m not paying you a shitton of money to clean up after myself. Especially when half the bathrooms have black mold and rotten water damaged wood around the showers, and you have to be extra mindful because this was a time when hidden cameras were common.

Varyk , (edited )

it costs more and offers less than hotels, landlord motherfuckers are asking me to do their chores for them plus pay for electricity and tip them for cleaning their own house i am paying for, to share with four other people?

take out your own fucking trash.

and the service fee for paying airbnb directly is almost up to 15%.

no goddam way.

this message brought to you because of the assholes who sent me “so you know” messages about trash days and cleaning products.

9point6 ,

The main Airbnb value proposition was trading some of the conveniences you get at a hotel for a significantly cheaper room.

When they are roughly the same price as staying in a hotel, why would you choose it?

ravhall ,

The only time I’ve ever used an Airbnb was when I wanted a location that did not have a good hotel option. Which has been cabins in the woods, and beach front property. Outside of that, I would rather have the convenience of a hotel.

foggy ,

I just stayed at a 4 star resort in Quebec City. That value could not be delivered with Airbnb. Ain’t no way.

HarriPotero ,
@HarriPotero@lemmy.world avatar

I usually travel by car and with my dogs out of necessity.

Airbnb is the most cost-effective when you need a room that allows dogs.

Bustedknuckles ,

That describes my family. We’ve done Airbnb and VRBO, but now pretty much stick to hotels. You know what you’re getting, price is competitive, to bdint have to wash your own bedding, and a lot of hotel workers are unionized. That’s all in addition to the awareness that every Airbnb house could be a home for someone who needs it. I won’t be sad if the Airbnb model folds and helps the housing market regain a bit of sanity

sevan ,

I was only ever interested in these company’s services as a way to save money. They are no longer cheaper than a hotel, so I would rather stay at a hotel.

wintermute_oregon ,

I stopped using air bnb. I use to use them for more obscure places that didn’t have hotels. I don’t like they take homes out of the market. I get for vacation areas this is less of an issue but for places like ny city, San Francisco, etc it’s taking homes out of use.

I hate the cleaning fee. It’s become obscene.

Just everything about the model bothers me now.

avidamoeba ,
@avidamoeba@lemmy.ca avatar

Just everything about the model bothers me now.

As it should.

wintermute_oregon ,

The original model I liked. You have an adu? Rent it for spare cash. Rent a spare room. Etc. it didn’t impact supply and let a lot of people earn a little cash. It wasn’t a business. It was an accessory. Now it’s a business.

avidamoeba , (edited )
@avidamoeba@lemmy.ca avatar

The thing is, it was never the original model. It was what was marketed at us. The model was always dumping to monopolize the market. Perhaps the original software nerds didn’t have that in mind but the moment MBAs came along to “help them grow” the program was to win Monopoly in that market. And that was very early on since VCs were involved nearly from the get go in most of those cases. The original idea as you describe it ends at the singing of the VC contract.

PS: Software nerd myself that used to drink the Koolaid, now a very senior, jaded software nerd.

wintermute_oregon ,

It was the model for a very long time. It was all about renting excess capacity. It was a brilliant move. It wasn’t till much more recently people turned it into a business by buying properties just to air bnb.

avidamoeba , (edited )
@avidamoeba@lemmy.ca avatar

Not sure when do you refer as recently but where I am this has been a common practice since at least 2015.

Don’t get me wrong, if you wanted to make a spare rooms rental system, nonprofit or otherwise, you could. But if you wanted to do that you would put restrictions and hoops to jump in order to limit rental to spare rooms only and maybe you wouldn’t charge 17% in fees.

idiomaddict ,

2013 for me.

tyler ,

Perhaps the original software nerds didn’t have that in mind but the moment MBAs came along to “help them grow” the program was to win Monopoly in that mark

So…… it was the original model. And yeah airbnb literally grew because of renting out extra rooms, it didn’t grow from turning entire homes into rentals. It became that much much much later.

quicklime ,

I get for vacation areas this is less of an issue but for places like ny city, San Francisco, etc it’s taking homes out of use.

It’s every bit as big of an issue for vacation areas / areas where tourism is the primary driver of the economy.

Take Tahoe or Mammoth Lakes for example: until the early 2010s it was still possible to move there without knowing anyone or having any other inside track, get a job (not your favorite or first choice, usually, but something to work from while you get established) and find your crappy first apartment or half-a-cabin or rundown shack or basement or ADU to rent.

That scenario is almost completely gone now and has been for ten years, plus or minus – depending on where each person sees the line that divides difficult from impossible. People making far less than a living wage now commute to both of those areas from an hour or more away. The sense of how “connected” or privileged one has to be to make it or even just scrape by in areas such as these has relentlessly risen to a level that has had an enormous impact on mental and emotional health and life outcomes in these areas too.

All of these factors were already big in the negative column balancing the very real positives of living so close to nature and preferred sporting activities, before the rise of the short term rental blight. But nowadays those negatives are practically off the meter.

bobs_monkey ,

I get for vacation areas this is less of an issue

Nope, this is the issue for housing in small towns/touristy areas. Most of the housing stock in our town has been scooped up for Airbnb/VRBO/etc, and has 1) limited housing stock for locals, 2) has raised housing purchase prices to unaffordable levels because of “profit potential”, and 3) limited availability of long term rentals that has also shot rental rates through the roof. In small towns, housing is already limited by geography, and so it just exacerbates an existing problem and completely screws local who likely don’t make a lot to begin with, because generally tourism and tourism-adjacent industries makes up the bulk of the available jobs.

DaCrazyJamez ,

I stopped doing airbnbs a few years ago. Hidden fees, unreasonable rules and requirements. And now more expensive than most hotels. They just are worse now.

fishpen0 ,

Yeah it turns out that Airbnb hosts behave much more like hivemind landlords than business owners. They all wind eachother up to behave the same in their forums and chatrooms. The advice on how to operate comes from other greedy reactive people and not from like consultants and data mining and people with degrees in their own field like it does with hotels and large businesses.

Airbnb hosts are “school of hard knocks” TikTok and Instagram advice listening get rich quick schemers who put minimal investment into quality.

Both groups are enshittfying their industries. But the downward slope is much steeper in airbnbs than it is in hotels.

WatDabney ,

Airbnb is a fine example of a sort of variation on enshittification.

The way it works is a new company with a new and notably cost-effective way of doing things comes along and is unsurprisingly wildly successful. And then, inevitably, that leads to them hiring a whole raft of executive parasites who all have to be paid obscene salaries for doing nothing of any real value, which means the company needs to raise prices and cut back on services in order to generate more profit to pay those salaries. And meanwhile, the new executives, with nothing of any note that they actually need to or even can do, but with a need to create some illusion that they’re necessary, have pointless meetings in which they propose and wrangle about and eventually approve and implement new policies and new plans that are generally awful.

And pretty quickly and not coincidentally the new company ends up at least as bloated, mismanaged, overpriced and under-performing as the companies they so recently replaced.

See also: Uber, DoorDash and the entire streaming industry.

avidamoeba , (edited )
@avidamoeba@lemmy.ca avatar

While you got the effects correct, you got the process wrong and that’s important.

The way it works is a new company with a new and notably cost-effective way of doing things comes along and is unsurprisingly wildly successful.

The business model isn’t based on cost effectiveness. Most of these companies work at a loss for a long time, providing artificially low prices in order to gain market share and push existing players out. This is isn’t new. It’s called dumping. Irs just been a bit obscured by buzzwords like “new technology” and “disruption.”

And then, inevitably, that leads to them hiring a whole raft of executive parasites who all have to be paid obscene salaries for doing nothing of any real value, which means the company needs to raise prices and cut back on services in order to generate more profit to pay those salaries.

These executives aren’t hired to do nothing and collect high salaries. Their salaries aren’t what drives the price increases. The major shareholders who spent their money to sustain the company so far want to get return on that money. They install executives with this one goal - maximize profit - so they can get this return. This is what drives the hiring of sociopaths who drive prices up in order to increase profits at all costs. This is what drives hiring such people in all public corporations. You got the effects right but the reasons aren’t to do with shit execs and their salaries. It’s all to do with major shareholders search for growing profits. Everything else follows from there. This is important to understand in order to point the finger in the right direction. Misdirecting people’s substantiated anger with the system has been a perennial tool used to maintain profit maximization for as long as possible.

_different_username ,

I’d also like to point out that the underlying model may well be unsustainable in the way that it is offered at the start. Who benefits when a for-profit company operates at a loss? We, the customers, do. We get low prices and customer-friendly practices that are genuinely enjoyable. That business can’t operate in that way indefinitely, as the early investors are not funding it as an act of charity.

Eventually, the bill comes due. The shareholders have funded the company on the premise that, after losing lots of money on customer acquisition, it can restructure and monetize those customers and recoup their investment, hopefully with a lucrative return when they decide to capitalize their holdings and find a new company with which to repeat the process.

There is absolutely no reason not to enjoy the perks of the early stage of the customer acquisition process; the shareholders are subsidizing your product at no cost to you. But we shouldn’t be surprised when the shareholders stop subsidizing and start squeezing their formerly pampered customers in the hopes of getting their money back (and more, of course).

This doesn’t excuse unethical or abusive practices, but it does mean that, even without them, the experience of those early days probably wasn’t going to last forever.

snooggums ,
@snooggums@midwest.social avatar

There is absolutely no reason not to enjoy the perks of the early stage of the customer acquisition process; the shareholders are subsidizing your product at no cost to you.

At the individual level, sure. Even for things like streaming services it isn’t a net negative to take advantage of those ‘introductory’ prices.

But a lot of these businesses that operate at an obvious loss are undercutting currently existing business practices that are probably more cost efficient than these new businesses. Like restaurants that used to take care of their own delivery were undercut by malicious pricing from door dash and uber eats only to wind up in a situation where they would have to start from scratch again or pay the outrageous extortion fees to DD and UE.

I avoided both DD and UE because I knew it would not be sustainably long term. It was obvious they were maliciously undercutting competition. Same with uber and lyft and all the other ride share businesses, although at least they got some reform going on the taxi side.

avidamoeba ,
@avidamoeba@lemmy.ca avatar

There is absolutely no reason not to enjoy the perks of the early stage of the customer acquisition process;

I can think of one reason. Depriving the existing industry from revenue which ensures the new entrant can raise their prices higher than the preexisting status quo. This is the other part of the equation that makes dumping work. Of course we can’t expect most people to choose to pay more but if people were able to resist that, the strategy wouldn’t work.

Zerlyna ,
@Zerlyna@lemmy.world avatar

I had a bad experience on AirBnB. Had tickets to see a band downtown Asheville. Labor Day Weekend. Found an airbnb in walking distance at a reasonable rate. Booked in April. Day before the stay, got a notice the host cancelled. No explanation. By that point it was $400 a night before taxes and parking for a hotel room downtown. Wound up not going. Ruined my weekend. Never again.

Stupidmanager ,

And zero penalty for the host. They only need to claim property damage. I’ve been burned twice by this, and once drove up anyway and the host rented it out on a diff platform for 3x. I played stupid and the guy told me he rented it through vrbo, the day before. I showed him my reservation that now showed canceled as of the day before.

Zerlyna ,
@Zerlyna@lemmy.world avatar

I have a feeling that’s what happened with mine too. It never occurred to me to have plans ruined like that. I’m hotel now all the way.

Zikeji ,
@Zikeji@programming.dev avatar

Good.

cyborganism ,

Good.

chemical_cutthroat ,
@chemical_cutthroat@lemmy.world avatar

Double plus good.

Boxscape ,
@Boxscape@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

Double plus good.

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