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sanguine_artichoke ,
@sanguine_artichoke@midwest.social avatar

I find grass so useless. Every boomer parent I’ve known is just obsessed with it, too. They think that not having a green, green monoculture lawn means you’ve failed morally or something, and that it’s how they show the neighborhood how responsible they are. One GF’s dad came over to our random Winconsin lawn of grass and weeds and strawberries and was “I WOULD JUST PULL THIS ALL UP AND START OVER”. Uh… no?

Then I had an across the street neighbor (guy with a bumper sticker “I’ve never seen a FLAG burned at a GUN SHOW”) who would mow his lawn every single day with a riding mower. You couldn’t even tell what part he had done yet. I went out of town for two weeks and he rode over and mowed my lawn. I left my backyard just go and it was awesome… after a few years, birds started nesting in the middle of the prairie, and I had flowers growing I’d never seen anywhere else.

UlyssesT ,

I went out of town for two weeks and he rode over and mowed my lawn.

This happened to me too. grillman are so violently obsessed with inch-high fuzzy green rectangles of obedience that they’ll sometimes invade your property to make more of them, overriding any of their own pretenses about the sanctity of private property in the process.

sanguine_artichoke ,
@sanguine_artichoke@midwest.social avatar

I think he thought he was doing me a favor, but really was just jerking off his lawn obsession. Same guy told me one time “HEY i saw a bear in your driveway and I was gonna come run it off so it didn’t mess with your garbage but it left!” I was uh, okay… no, please don’t come confront a bear in my driveway. Dude drank light beer all day.

UlyssesT ,

In my case, it was deliberate aggression because I had told him, in person and to his face, that those were protected native plants and I had a legal right to have them on my property.

But grillman “did me a favor” with a disgusting little smirk when I confronted him about it later. He even implied that I got nothing to prove what he did because I don’t have the surveillance state shit that he has on his side of the fence.

doctordevice ,

Did you sue? I’d have been livid enough to try to sue. IANAL, but at a minimum I would hope that would be trespassing.

ryathal ,

By the letter of the law it probably is, but if they hadn’t expressly been told not to it won’t go anywhere.

Rodeo ,

Some places have bylaws on maximum lawn height and you can actually be fined for letting it go. That’s how insane people are about lawns.

someguy3 ,

I thought it was virtually all places. I’m surprised the other guy could even let the lawn go native.

doctordevice ,

Not everywhere is in an HOA. And many people allow native vegetation on purpose to give local wildlife something to eat (see OP).

Pika ,
@Pika@sh.itjust.works avatar

I mean that’s probally overkill, that person was either OCD or was thinking he was doing them a favor. That sounds like a great way to have a pissed off neighbor and a potentially hostile neighborhood

doctordevice ,

I’d feel a little different (still pissed) if it was a next door neighbor who extended their mow. But to cross the street and change someone’s property without permission is already hostile to me.

sanguine_artichoke ,
@sanguine_artichoke@midwest.social avatar

I doubt that I could have demonstrated real harm, or even proved that he did it. I got back into town a week later and my brother, who had been watching the house, said “huh, the guy across the street mowed the front yard”.

mrchuckles ,

do you have kids? they love playing outside. barefoot. and a nice lawn is a paradise for bare feet. not to mention the actual process of mowing (electric mower) is very peaceful and good for my mental health. super therapeutic.

Masimatutu OP ,

Sure, but we also want those kids to have food when they grow up, don’t we?

mrchuckles ,

hot take: you can have bee gardens AND a lawn

Masimatutu OP ,

Or you can have a clover lawn, which is nice for insects as well as kids.

Kids don’t dislike long, unkept grass either, as long as you keep the thistles out.

mrchuckles ,

seems pretty naive to think that it’s joe homeowner that’s the problem, and not insecticides and fertilizers from mega farm corporations like monsanto. let me know where to mail my apology letter lol

Blackmist ,

They all seem obsessed with plastic grass now which is even worse.

My garden is mostly weeds. Haven’t cut it in 15 years. I pretend to be a trendsetting wild gardener, but really I’m just a lazy bastard.

SomeAmateur , (edited )

It seems like people used to suburbs see that as the pinnacle of life but of course that’s not true.

In my experience rural areas get it because they are farmers and beekeepers with an understanding that working with nature is the way to go

saltesc ,

I get it as a dog owner with only a courtyard. But he goes on long hikes in the bush and big walks a few times a week. It’d be nice to give the little fella a patch to hang on while I’m at work. And I mean a patch—I hate mowing and any yard work motivation in me is for citrus, chilli, and grapes.

crispy_kilt ,

Dogs will happily lay in high grass.

learningduck ,

My dog loves tall grass so much. He likes stomping them.

Resonosity ,

There is the risk of tick transmission of Lyme disease in tall grass. I suppose you can pretreat to prevent contraction, but mowing grass means you don’t have those threats/hazards to worry about.

I still hate lawns and wish more would be native, but I wonder if there’s a way to grow a native lawn such that you invite the good wildlife and keep out the bad. Would need a biologist to chime in

LifeInOregon ,

One of the 10 plants in this article would work. And one of them is bound to be native to your area.

sanguine_artichoke ,
@sanguine_artichoke@midwest.social avatar

My yard was very low with ground cover. I actually did mow the front, I just didn’t care if it was grass or a bunch of random other plants. I had a dog when my gf lived with me, but at this point, didn’t. There were so many rabbits and deer I actually just grew my vegetable garden on the front porch in containers.

huf ,

i never understood why american front yards dont have fences. just a barren wasteland of green from the curb to the front windows. fence your garden in!

sanguine_artichoke ,
@sanguine_artichoke@midwest.social avatar

Many do, but it really depends on the area.

JohnDClay ,

How tall did the grass get? Did it pollinate, and if so, was it noticable for allergies? Were you still able to walk through it?

I’m wondering what sort of plant you could let grow where you could still walk through easily. Maybe clover?

sfgifz ,

Aren’t these allergies sometimes caused because you’re not exposed to the stuff? Like how it is for peanuts.

JohnDClay ,

I don’t know, but I wouldn’t want people who come over to cough uncontrollably even if I was used to it.

sanguine_artichoke ,
@sanguine_artichoke@midwest.social avatar

Low height ground cover type plants grew naturally there. Clover, alfalfa, strawberries, unknown other plants, with an occasional thistle. Larger plants (whatever they were) would grow on the periphery. When he mowed my lawn it was maybe about a foot high.

We were surrounded by acres of forest where plants grew wild, so if there was a problem with pollen, it wasn’t the .4 acres of my front lawn. Myt front lawn, I did mow occasionally. The back I let grow wild and yes, one could still walk through it.

One of the lame things about lawn is that people don’t let them go to seed. If grass goes to seed, it not only regenerates itself, but also provides food for birds and squirrels. I was on an acre and a half across the street from this guy, and bounded by 30 feet of trees on ones side and 200 feet of forest on the other.

Resonosity ,

That guy was an asshole for doing that to you. I wonder if that might be considered trespassing. Dunno if you can have any civil remedy served to you, or if it’s even worth it, but still sucks.

revlayle ,

I’m 52 and hate mowing yards. Most other people my age are also obsessed with their lawns or simply “enjoy getting out and working on the yard”

There few things worse than doing yard work. I think dying is one of them, maybe.

Anyways, yeah we have a yard. We try to keep various bushes and wildflowers as we can. We go as log as possible in early spring to not mow and get all the clover and stuff to bring the bees and like insects over.

As for mowing, I pay someone 50 dollars every 2 weeks to keep it not looking like crap.

My father-in-law, who lives with us, used to do most of the gardening and lawn stuff. He is too old now to do any of it. He’s always trying to get the rest of the people in the house to do stuff in the yard. I keep telling him "you know you are the only one who really gives a shit on how ‘nice’ the yard looks. My only goal is to keep the city and neighbors off our back, that’s it.’

EDIT: Also neighbors seem intent on having a single uniform grass breed and obsessed with having no weeds. Nah, I have all the grasses and weeds. I have a neighbor down the street who is always just HAND PULLING weeds out of her lawn. Like hours and hours of it. I mean… wat

sanguine_artichoke ,
@sanguine_artichoke@midwest.social avatar

It seems to be something that retired people love, to keep them active and give them something to do (a sense of purpose besides grandchildren?). I don’t mind yardwork myself, but I don’t feel like it’s virtuous or something. I also understand that a chemical-sodden monoculture isn’t really the best for humans and wildlife.

My mother used to try to get us… oh, she still does… to come “PULL WEEDS”. As kids it made sense, like okay, she wants us to get away from the video games and be outside and do whatever she’s saying, but at this point…

Modern_medicine_isnt ,

I will admit there is something very pleasing about looking at a well trimmed yard. That said, the percent of the earth’s land surface covered by manicured lawns is tiny. The ag industry would love for you to believe your lawn is the problem. It isn’t. The problem is the monoculture farm land. Acres of fields with only one type of crop. And probably other things like pollution and such. But industries love to play the “you are the problem” card to divert from themsleves.

HaiZhung ,

This is the correct answer, this shit is „your carbon footprint“ all over again

IDontHavePantsOn ,

“Walk to work, ignore corporate consumption, and use only the highest quality refined petroleum products, and go easy on the avocados.”

miss_brainfart ,
@miss_brainfart@lemmy.ml avatar

Yes, but also: Every little bit of help, well… helps.

Don’t let those industries playing the blame game discourage you from dedicating a part of your yard to a bunch of flowers, because then the problem would get ever so slightly worse.

TWeaK ,

Yeah but you could easily have a patch of lush green grass the size of this one in your lawn and also some nice flower beds, bushes, trees and whatever else. Most people want some of that, not just a plain garden with no features. The problem isn’t peoples’ yards, it’s pesticides.

Amends1782 ,

This + a massive over usage of pesticides

Kbin_space_program ,

Not just the bees, all bugs in North America have seen a 75% die off in the last 20 years.

Big shocker that songbirds, which eat those bugs, have also seen a massive die off.

Despite those deniers that still blame housecats, the true culprit is almost certainly pollution and pesticides.

cobra89 ,

Despite those deniers that still blame housecats

Both things can be true. They aren’t mutually exclusive.

Also we have less pollution and pesticide use than we did in the 60s and 70s. Why is it just becoming a problem now?

DrCatface ,
@DrCatface@lemmy.ml avatar

less pollution? that cannot possibly be true. according to dr google 1970s world population was 3.7b, now we’re more than double that

Redscare867 ,

I’m the US, the EPA was created in the 1970’s. We definitely have less pollution (of certain types) today than we did in the past. Some notable examples of how disgustingly polluted American skies and waterways were in the past:

The skies of Pittsburgh, PA

the Cuyahoga River fire

Coal Production has also been declining

And then of course less visible examples like the Montreal Protocol stopping corporations from depleting the ozone layer.

My point is in terms of greenhouse gas production we are much higher than in the 60’s and 70’s, but we have massively improved in a lot of areas. Of course there is still room to improve.

Turun ,

I bet that while we have less general pollution and less dumping trash in the environment kinda things, we have developed much more potent insecticides. And if those insecticides do not degrade within a few weeks they will accumulate in the earth and the water.

Edit: Wikipedia about one type of modern pesticides: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neonicotinoid

bentropy ,

Yeah, pretty sure your lawn has almost nothing to do with insects vanishing. It’s much more likely the insane amounts of highly potent pesticides we put directly into our food chain. Those pesticides obviously aren’t classified as pollution so we aren’t polluting, we’re killing the environment on purpose.

Btw. The development and use of neonicotines corelate quiet nicely with the drop in the insects population.

theneverfox ,

To put that in perspective, let’s say I drink water contaminated with chemicals for decades. Then, “suddenly”, me and half the people i know are sick with cancer and various side effects decades later…

That’s how environmental toxins work. They accumulate throughout the water cycle and through the food web, and if its less than acute (short term) in effect it statistically hurts a population, such as lowering reproduction or creating birth defects that lower the fitness. Then, once concentrations pass LD thresholds (lethal dose, meaning LD50 will kill half of the individuals of a species on average, LD10 would kill 1 in 10) you start getting mass die offs

Every water table, all of the soil, every living being is riddled with non-naturally occurring substances. Even though we released more damaging toxins in the 80s, the rate of pollution doesn’t matter - the concentration in various parts of the ecosystem is what matters, and that’s a slow process

LordKitsuna ,

I’d say and cars just think about how many bug splatters you see on an average decent trip on the highway now multiply that by the millions of cars on the road daily. It’s not the root cause but it certainly didn’t help

Kbin_space_program ,

Oh certainly can't help. But we know that the pesticides and herbicides have carryon effects to unintended species. Ones that the parent companies that invented them didn't report on because they don't kill those species. Ones that don't necessarily kill them, but lead to things like the white nose fungus running amock in bats, or lead to Colony Collapse Disorder or other infections in bee colonies.

kbotc ,

Why would white nose fungus and pesticides be linked in the slightest? The issue with that is tourists who don’t want to admit they’ve been driving from national park to national park visiting each cave along the way without sanitizing anything. Same reason Zebra Mussels are spreading so rapidly. Just like people blaming 5G for COVID: It’s easier to externalize blame rather that come to terms with the, frankly, minuscule amount of spores that are needed to destroy the entire roosting colony.

Gormadt ,
@Gormadt@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

My car used to look terrible after a drive to the local wilderness area, now I’ll be lucky to see one smack my window per trip.

TheSlad ,

Im gonna dig a pit in my backyard and make a pond. Its gonna be a lot of work but it will all be worth it when i sit out on my patio in the morning sipping coffee to the sound croaking frogs, buzzing bugs, and chirping birds.

Scubus ,

You will want to be careful doing that. It needs to be big enough to have differential temperature so the water moves, therefore aerating it. Without air in the water nothing but mosquitos can live or breed in it. Also, depending on the soil and whether you are above the water line, you may not be able to keep enough water in it between rainfalls.

I’m sure you can look up how to do one properly, I just want to to be aware it’s not as simple as dig a hole and fill it with water, because that will do more damage than good.

TheSlad ,

Of course I’ve been doing a lot of research dont worry. And also I’ll be using a pond liner

Gormadt ,
@Gormadt@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

House cats are making it worse too

Both things are true

MoodyRaincloud ,

Housecats were actually keeping the bird population healthy for decades by eliminating the weak. Of course now that habitat destruction and toxins made entire populations weak it is a problem.

But removing housecats to solve it is akin to drinking out of paper straws to solve plastic pollution. It helps, but it doesn’t do anything substantial.

kbotc ,

Why would you say that? Hawks and owls were the “natural” predator of North American song birds and I’ve seen plenty of raptors in my large US city. Not like bobcats are suffering population-wise in urban areas.

FireTower ,
@FireTower@lemmy.world avatar

Outside cat / feral cats have had massive negative impacts on bird and small mammal populations. Particularly in areas where they fill an ecological niche that the wildlife hasn’t adapted to due to none of the local fauna being in that niche. Hawaii and Australia in particular have this problem.

MoodyRaincloud ,

Those are indeed special situations where cats are basically an invasive species.

Here in Europe the correlation between cats and bird population is not so strong. While destruction of habitat and the crash in insect numbers are the big culprits.

crispy_kilt ,

Same in Europe

mrchuckles ,

“it’s your neighbors fault for having a lawn!”

meanwhile monsanto……

electric_nan ,

I stopped cutting my grass and now I have rats :(

CantaloupeAss ,

Simple, get an owl

electric_nan ,

We do have foxes, but they’ve been a disappointment thus far.

Surreal ,

Now we have an owl infestation

CantaloupeAss ,

Simple, get a condor

the_third ,

Rats do not live off grass. If you have them, there’s some sort of food source on your or your neighbors property.

Cornelius_Wangenheim ,

Or, like, insects.

mrchuckles ,

lmao my guy rats literally eat everything

the_third ,

Yeah, but they really can’t digest grass.

mrchuckles ,

they eat seeds, overgrown grass develops seeds. man this thread is ridiculously misinformed lol even on RATS

electric_nan ,

Tons of blackberries.

Guntrigger ,

They don’t live off grass but long grass is great cover for them to move freely. My lawn is pretty wild, but I have to mow directly around the house otherwise mice and all sort of insects start taking up reaidence in the house.

ClarissaDarling ,

I’m not sure where you live but if you can find some native seeds from your area, plant those! It’s the perfect time in many northern-hemisphere places for overwintering things like wildflower, clover seeds and more! Fancy lawn grasses are bogus and weak

jaybone ,

Is this the Windows 98 background?

TimeSquirrel ,
@TimeSquirrel@kbin.social avatar

Windows XP was the grassy hill. Windows 98 was just a random shot of some clouds.

jaybone ,

Lol it’s been so long I can’t remember.

What was the Windows 95 background?

Was it that flying pixelated window with the pixelated acid trails?

Coreidan ,

……Because of insecticides from agriculture.

It has literally nothing to do with people mowing their lawns.

If you got rid of all of the lawns you’d still see mass extinction of honey bees.

MayvisDelacour ,

Sure but why add to the problem? Why not carve out your own little slice and help the situation? Probably not going to hurt anything if you stop using pesticides and feed the bees where you can.

Coreidan ,

It’s not adding to the problem. As long as farmers are using fuck tons of pesticides and insecticides every day it doesn’t matter what you do to your lawn.

Either way insects are going to die.

You guys love slinging shit but you have no clue where to sling it.

Pipoca ,

No.

Honey bees are dying because of parasites and pests, pathogens, poor nutrition, and sublethal exposure to pesticides.

It’s not just one thing. Most of those things on their own won’t even kill them. For example, Varroa mites will kill an already weakened hive, but not a healthy one.

Lawns absolutely contribute to poor nutrition, due to habitat loss. Same with all the mowed grass we have everywhere in suburbia. Monocropped agriculture does as well, because bees do best with a variety of flowers.

I’ve let the back part of my property grow wild the past couple years, and it’s currently filled with a ton of goldenrod, chicory, and a bunch of other random flowers. You would not beleive the number of honeybees I’ve seen back there at once, or how loud the buzz was.

Similarly, there’s a reason I see a ton of fireflys in my yard, but I see almost none in my neighbors yards. It’s because they’re well- manicured green wastelands

Case ,

We keep the front mowed for the HOA.

The backyard can grow until we worry about snakes affecting our pups.

We have a front garden that gets no care outside HOA recommendations. It came with the house.

Can’t wait until I can OWN a house, but the market (with all the influences upon it) isn’t there.

I’m saving, and considering moving to another state, if that helps all the pedantic monsters our there.

BartsBigBugBag ,

Just quit watering the grass except for in small walkways and start a food forest.

TheAnonymouseJoker , (edited )
@TheAnonymouseJoker@lemmy.ml avatar

I had to kill 6 stingy bees today because they invaded my home. Nobody asked them to make a nest here.

Edit: killed another one

cyberpunk007 ,

I have an abundance of bees and other insects, and I mow my lawn. But I have gardens.

Buttons ,
@Buttons@programming.dev avatar

I want to make a short film / animation where aliens are approaching earth, the only thing we know about the aliens is that they plan to destroy all life and replace it with their own twisted creation. A few minutes of typical story follows, heroes assemble, go to fight, etc. The heroes lose and the ending scene shows that the aliens have succeeded and replaced all the diverse life on Earth with a perfectly manicured lawn that covers the entire planet. A biological wasteland.

UnverifiedAPK ,

m.imdb.com/title/tt8368406/

Son_of_dad ,

So is this like a whole movie with the premise of “the cage” from star trek?

CPMSP ,

Commence high pitched screeching

blanketswithsmallpox ,

Pretty sure one of the nearby planets to Earth in The Foundation series is like that.

An entire planet covered in sunflowers that shoot deadly ass rays against anything that comes close. Perfect homogeneity.

Guntrigger ,

Please, not the ass rays!

blanketswithsmallpox ,

I’m glad someone got it lol.

The pistols and stamens, the center part of the flower are where the reproductive organs are. So it’s the closest thing to an ass a plant has.

People need to be proud of their.puns again damnit!

Rozauhtuno ,
@Rozauhtuno@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

!nolawns

Tankton ,

lemm.ee/c/permaculture approves of this post.

CommunityLinkFixer Bot ,

Hi there! Looks like you linked to a Lemmy community using a URL instead of its name, which doesn’t work well for people on different instances. Try fixing it like this: !permaculture

Masimatutu OP ,

Good bot!

xfgdf ,

great bot

itsgroundhogdayagain ,

if I didn’t take care of my lawn, I’d have invasive Bermuda grass getting into everything and it would kill all the other plants. I’ve also looked into overseeding with mini clover but I’ve read that it doesn’t tolerate traffic well. open to any suggestions as I’m fighting a losing battle with fescue and the damn Bermuda.

Knoxvomica ,

Fescue is amazing grass. I suggest overseeing with an aggressive ryegrass if you really have issues, but just let the Bermuda grass be. Otherwise add in some microclover seed for good measure.

BB69 ,

But I thought grass is bad

IMALlama ,

Monoculture anything is bad. For example, many parks will have tons of trees but if you pay attention you’ll likely on see the same handful of species.

sammer510 , (edited )

A few options. Cover the entire lawn for an extended period of time with a bunch of tarps or cardboard so no sunlight reaches the grass. Kill the entire thing. Start over with native seeds. Or roto till the entire thing

For me personally Bermuda grass never stood a chance against all the clover, dandelions, cheeseweed, purslane, tall flatsedge, and broadleaf plantain that make up a lot of what used to be the lawn. Some of those are invasive technically but at least rabbits come to eat the dandelions and plantains

S_204 ,

This just isn’t accurate. Your lawn isn’t responsible for the death of bees. You also don’t need pesticides for a healthy nice looking lawn.

Jubei_K_08 ,

In those moments I’m as high as fuck and imagine I could own a home, I’d just desert-ify the yard. It’s going that way anyway, let’s beat the rush. Just sand and rocks and some desert plants. Like us, most yards will die in the water wars.

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