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Bluefold , (edited )

There’s a trait you can pick that exactly explains my problems.with the game. The trait is ‘Dream Home’. It is described as

‘You own a luxurious, customizable house on a peaceful planet! Unfortunately it comes with a 125,000 credit mortgage with GalBank that has to be paid weekly.’…

I thought this was a cool way of adding increased difficulty for myself. I tend not to play at the hardest setting because I don’t have much time to play. But having to plan ahead and work around this limitation sounded like it would add an interesting wrinkle to the strategy I’d have in the game.

However, when you start the game you discover that the loan has to be paid off in full… And you have unlimited time to pay it off. The only way to be foreclosed upon is if you actively go tell the bank to foreclose on you. It’s like they had the idea, but couldn’t be bothered to implement it.

What’s worse is 120k is nothing in the game. You can easily get there within a few hours of play. This is just one example, but it speaks to the game’s complete unwillingness to give the player anything negative or push them any way from their ‘freedom’. The sheer fact you are not locked out of any faction or faction mission is another example. There are 0 stakes in the game and you feel 0 connection to the people you meet or places you visit. Not helped by Sarah potentially being one of the most annoying judgemental characters in any Bethesda game I’ve ever encountered.

Update: I eventually visited this ‘Dream House’. It kinda sucked. The planet it is on is kinda ugly. There is more to this mechanic than I originally thought, however. When you visit you can pay 500 credits for 1 week of access as a ‘payment’ towards the principal. Still very deceptive of the original description.

abbotsbury ,
@abbotsbury@lemmy.world avatar

The only way to be foreclosed upon is if you actively go tell the bank to foreclose on you

Bethesda once again being so scared of the player making a choice, so they lock down anything that actually changes the game behind a giant 🚨 ARE YOU SURE??? 🚨

funktion ,

I mean there are a whole bunch of players that seem to have a problem with actually dealing with consequences. Just look at the bg3 players who are so pissed about “missing content” when they murderhobo their way through the game. Like no shit you killed the people who give you quests, of course you’re going to miss out on their stories.

UnverifiedAPK ,

The sheer fact you are not locked out of any faction or faction mission is another example.

Ah, so Skyrim in space

deft ,

vast as an ocean but as shallow as a puddle

Makeshift ,

I swear every space game is described like this

qarbone ,

I think it’s because so many space games try to dazzle with the unfettered dream of exploring the endless cosmos. But you obviously can’t fill an endless cosmos with interesting things to do. Hell, most of space is just dead rocks and hot gas.

KSPAtlas ,
@KSPAtlas@sopuli.xyz avatar

I feel like dyson sphere program is somewhere further, it being a sandbox factory game means you can do basically as much as you can reasonably handle on your computer, although story wise it’s not great since it’s not meant to be a story game

borth ,

So if you don’t pay, they still won’t foreclose on you? So what’s the point of paying lol

Katana314 ,

Someday I’m interested in making an open world game (short on features because I’ll never have giant budgets) that embraces the friction of inconvenience, but finds enjoyable ways for people to circumvent them.

Eg: You can’t easily locate yourself on the map, but you can use a radio to ping towers and triangulate, which gives a breezy interface - or just ask locals. You can’t fast travel, but train stations get you where you’re going - and you might get an interesting conversation or even a whole questline on board.

Zoomboingding ,
@Zoomboingding@lemmy.world avatar

There’s a little open world game called Miasmata with that triangulation system! It’s an open world survival horror. It’s pretty short though, and I bet you could get it for just a few bucks on sale. I really enjoyed my time in it, and the world is the perfect mix of dreary and serene.

hellerpop ,

I think Zelda does this pretty good already.

Happenchance ,

When ARMA Reforger released it was chaos, with 95% of the people hopelessly lost at all times. It’s because the game gave you a map, a compass, and nothing else for navigation. Best. Immersion. Ever.

Always on instant GPS with augmented reality waypoints between abstract objectives is what kills player immersion (and developer creativity). If I can just follow an arrow from point to point and complete a game: it wasn’t worth making the game.

Dubious_Fart ,

Yep. Theres no exploring, theres just “run to waypoint. grab thing waypoint is on, run to waypoint, hand over waypointed item, find next waypoint source, repeat”

Cause devs want to dumb games down so any mouth breathing reject can conquer it without any effort, to bring in that sweet sweet idiot money.

Honytawk ,

Not every game mechanic needs to be a struggle.

And not every person can dedicate hours of time each week to play. Doesn’t make them mouth breathers.

But I agree they should at least give you the option to turn it off or on.

At least it is a Bethesda game, so someone will mod it in.

Dubious_Fart ,

Its not a struggle to read the quest text and find a location on your own volition.

If thats a struggle, then you should be playing games that don’t require reading.

TowardsTheFuture ,

Man. Was really hoping to be wrong about it, but I mean, it is bethesda. Can’t expect a full up to date game without gamebreaking bugs or missing features when they could just rely on unpaid mod creators for that.

Ser_Salty ,

There are no (known) gamebreaking bugs

XanXic ,

Why didn’t you pick any of the more negative traits? Like your example is the most basic harmless one. There’s ones with way more downsides. Did you pick the ‘2 loving parents’ trait and are mad they don’t kill you on sight? lmao. Like I picked wanted where I always have a bounty and it’s cool. I’ve had a bounty hunter show up in the middle of a boss fight before. Both in space and on ground. Added a decent complication. A few of the others are pretty long term negatives like weakening aids and food.

I also don’t know if you explored much because the game has a pretty robust ailments system. Like if you pre-plan sure you can have all the expensive cures on hand, but you can get quite a few ailments at once from fucking around. I had a cough for like 4 hours because I couldn’t find an aid for it. I eventually had to go to a doctor to get rid of it.

Bluefold ,

I did pick other negative traits. My problem with this one is it straight up lies to you in the description. You think it is going to be negative but instead it is the most basic boring version of what that trait could be. I’ve explored many hostile environments where conditions are common and haven’t had a situation where I didn’t already have the sure on hand but I tend to loot a lot.

You can’t change your traits after starting. For my play style, this one should have been perfect. Instead it just sucked all fun out of the potential mechanic.

Dubious_Fart ,

its like the trait that gives you living parents.

makes a big deal out of having to send them money every week.

Its little more than a rounding error on your accounts, the amount you end up sending.

And they end up giving you several amazing things or free.

spoiler___ A big honkin awesome ship, Thats got amazing cargo capacity for as early as you get it: Just gotta visit them a few times to get it and a pretty fuckin awesome pistol that, when i got it, was outdamaging everything i had except shotguns by at least a factor of 2.

Seriously, money in this game is a joke. Getting to be a rich removed is easier than building water purifier settlements in Fallout 4.

UlyssesT ,

Surprise twist on an old comic chefs-kiss

yoink ,
@yoink@hexbear.net avatar

hmmm people seem to like this thing i don’t like

ah it’s because they’re actually lying for the purposes of fooling me, the objectively correct main character

Sniatch ,

I don’t understand why is it popular to shit on Bethesda games? Just don’t play it if you don’t like it. At least it has no microtransacrions or Battle Pass nonsense.

CountryBreakfast ,
@CountryBreakfast@lemmygrad.ml avatar

I dont think gamers know what they want.

WereCat ,

They know exactly what they don’t want at least

CountryBreakfast ,
@CountryBreakfast@lemmygrad.ml avatar

That isnt clear either. I wonder if some people are just routinely negative about major releases? I usually don’t have wide expectations and get into games for niche reasons, for settlement and ship building in this case. I’m not really invested in what the more negative gamers have to say because it doesn’t have much to do with why I want to play the game. Also I feel like too many are just outrage poisoned so their opinion is just guaranteed to be ridiculous.

sewerkat ,
@sewerkat@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

I imagine a lot of people bought it, enjoyed it for a few minutes too long to refund, and are now stuck with 60 bucks down the shitter

Makes you wonder why game demos aren’t a thing anymore

loutr ,
@loutr@sh.itjust.works avatar

70 bucks*

Sniatch ,

There are so many ways to inform yourself beforhand. You can also try it out on Gamepass. If you buy an 70 bucks game blindly its kinda your own fault.

sewerkat ,
@sewerkat@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

Ah yes, because it’s the customer’s fault that Bethesda released a barebones game again.

Listen. The game pass isn’t a replacement for demos. It still costs money, so for people who can only buy a limited number of games per year, that’s a no-go. It’s one of the more expensive subscription services as well. The point of demos is to be a free but limited experience of the game so people can decide whether the game is worth throwing money at without getting a subscription for hundreds of games they don’t care about or already own. Nothing against the game pass mind you, it’s great for lots of people, but it ain’t a demo.

Besides, this isn’t just about Starfield. There seem to be more games coming out unfinished than otherwise, and both that trend and the absence of demos seem to have come with SaaS games becoming the norm. Remember when no man’s sky came out? Or cyberpunk 2077? Or fallout 76? Beinging back demos won’t completely prevent cases like that, but it sure would help

Sniatch ,

You say more games are coming out unfinished and then you buy a 70 bucks game on release from Bethesda without informing yourself beforehand? Yes this is your own mistake.

Blackmist ,

There’s an old saying in Tennessee — I know it’s in Texas, probably in Tennessee — that says, fool me once, shame on — shame on you. Fool me — you can’t get fooled again.

Dubious_Fart ,

most people playing the game now probably got it free with their GPU/CPU purchase. You know.

Just so you know.

sewerkat ,
@sewerkat@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

I swear lemmy users are worse than redditors. Y’all are embarrassing the fucking fediverse you demented parrots. I’m honestly considering going back to the terrible reddit app, at least people there know how to read.

I pirate games. It’s the only way to inform yourself, but it’s widely illegal. Games reviewers are hesitant to publish critical reviews, because that means risking not getting review copies. Community reviews are constantly review bombed for any controversial game, to the point where you can’t look up whether bg3 is good without having to scroll through a deluge of rants about how they’re shoving gay propaganda down people’s throats or whatever.

Starfield got 88 on metacritic. It really does not deserve those numbers. But major bethesda releases are major news, so as a reviewer you do need to appease them. But as a customer, how are you supposed to inform yourself when Bethesda has every major outlet by the balls? I shouldn’t need to care, because as i said, i pirate before i buy, but many people just can’t safely do that. If game publishers would just release goddamn demos, they would provide an actual way for customers to inform themselves early on (when sales are the most important), and hell, maybe people would pirate less shit too. But that would mean having to release games that at least work, so of course the industry don’t want that. And corporate rimmers like you don’t help the situation

SwampYankee ,

Starfield doesn’t feel unfinished or barebones at all to me. There’s a ton of great quest content, the art is top notch, and I haven’t seen a single bug in 30 hours.

bonfire921 ,

Well steam is really pushing devs to use demos again, given it’s mostly indie at this moment but slowly more and more demos start showing up, which is nice. One can hope AAA will do this to but I highly doubt they will

MindSkipperBro12 ,

Bethesda games tend to have awful writing, released with an unacceptable amount of bugs, and not having micro transactions and a battle pass shouldn’t be praised, it must be the standard.

Oka ,

I expected it to be buggy. I have not yet encountered a bug in my first few hours.

That being said, there’s lots im not liking about it so far.

XanXic ,

I had Vasco become a part of the door to the cockpit. I couldn’t enter. I had to leave the ship and hit the specific ‘to cockpit’ button for a few hours because reloading didn’t save him from his torment. Only bug I’ve had but was weird lol.

ForbiddenRoot ,

Vasco quite frequently blocks the door everywhere for me, but at least I have been able to push my way through so far. He’s like my Golden Retriever in that respect so I am used to it from real life.

Blackmist ,

The big super-mutant companion from Fallout 3 did the same.

It’s nice to know Bethesda are keeping all the fan favourite bugs alive and well.

Dubious_Fart ,

Real sad that Vasco isnt a full companion. Had so much potential there, instead, all he is is a glorified tutorial escort for the start of the game, and graduates to annoying barricade for the rest of it.

Redredme ,

So it should be praised as it currently isn’t the standard in the gaming industry. But hey, let’s shit on it so we can totally tell the industry that this is the wrong path and micro transactions are the way to go!

Phegan ,

Right now it needs to be praised so it becomes the standard.

gizmonicus ,

The only way it becomes standard is when it isn’t profitable. We can scream all we want, but people still buy that crap.

Dubious_Fart ,

It is the standard, idiot fucking gamergoblins dumping their wallets out saying “GIVE ME ADVANTAGES” are the assholes thats are trying to change the standard.

c0mbatbag3l ,
@c0mbatbag3l@lemmy.world avatar

When will you learn the only thing that gets results is buying or not buying them? Fucks sake. It’s capitalism, if you buy shitty product more shitty product gets made.

iheartneopets , (edited )

I don’t understand why it’s so popular NOT to shit on them. Remember when Andromeda came out with many of the same issues, and people fucking REAMED it (rightly)? Now Bethesda is finally getting SOME criticism for their shitty business and game development practices and we have lots of people out here suckling at their teat defending them for some reason. “Leave them alone, it’s just a Bethesda game, why do people love to hate them, wahhhh.”

As if Bethesda isn’t one of the most beloved companies of all time, and most everyone started from a place of WANTING to love this game. But they’ve been making shitty decisions for years, hiding behind the nostalgia of their past titles, and they are overdue some criticism. It doesn’t mean everyone hates them.

flucksy_bango ,

Remember when Andromeda came out with many of the same issues, and people fucking REEMED it

No, enlighten me, because I fucking hated Andromeda.

iheartneopets ,

Typo on my part, but a definition of ‘ream’ is to reprimand or beat up, essentially

flucksy_bango ,

It actually means to make a hole bigger

iheartneopets ,

As a phrasal verb it also means to reprimand severely

flucksy_bango ,

I wonder why they’re synonymous.

szczuroarturo ,

I dont know why pepole shited so much on Andromeda.it was fairly ok title and i personaly was looking forward to next part( which sadly probably wont happen ). Certainly gameplay fitted andromeda more than inquisition. Alghtough from what i have seen i definietly wouldnt be so amazed as some journalist seem to be but Its a ok title. Not a BG3 for certain. Alghtough i admittedly never really liked bethesda style games.i even prefered dragon age 2 rather than skyrim. Bethesda games are too diluted for my tastes.

ErinCrush ,

Stop complaining. Play it if you want, don’t if you don’t want to. People just like to be popular and liked. Everyone bandwagoned on Baldurs Gate being good but I can’t think of a type of game I hate more than that. Now everyone is bandwagoning on this because A- they don’t have an Xbox or a PC, or B- they want to be cool and alternative.

I mean come on, last week everyone was saying “omg Baldurs Gate has no microtransactions! Roleplaying! GOTY!” And now with Xbox/Bethesda making a game just like that, you guys instantly roast it for being…a Bethesda game.

fosforus ,

Yeah, I’ve been wondering about BG3. It seems like the main game mechanics are horrible, but perhaps the story is good. So it sounds to me like a fantasy Disco Elysium.

ErinCrush ,

My GF played it a lot and I saw so many bugs, quests breaking, and crazy difficulty spikes. But when Bethesda has some bugs? Oh my gosh, people start rioting. People just love to hate when they get the chance.

MindSkipperBro12 ,

What did you GF play it on?

Meowoem ,

Yeah it’s weird, I’ve seen a few really annoying bugs in bg3 and a fair bit of plot confusion and quest muddling - if Todd had made it people would be screaming about that and ignoring all the great parts.

Half my inventory is full of random things I don’t know if I need, most from weird side quests that were never really explained or resolved in any meaningful way and I’ve forgotten about. The writing isn’t bad but it’s often confusing, I often find myself having to pick at random because I haven’t memorized enough weird names and background lore to know what I’m actually saying.

The leveling and combat system is top notch though so props to them for inventing that.

And I’m certainly not saying it’s not great, it’s a great game and a lot of fun but if it had been the target of a anti circlejerk rather than a pro one we’d be seeing a totally different side to it.

ErinCrush ,

Exactly. It always seemed to me like the game was held together by tape and toothpicks. If Bethesda, EA, Ubisoft or some other bigger company had made the game, people would give it a 6-7/10 and would complain up and down about the mechanics.

bandario , (edited )
@bandario@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

I cannot stand turn based combat and generally avoid RPG’s these days and even I think this is a ridiculous take.

I don’t own BG3 but I’ve played at a friend’s place and that game is about a thousand levels deeper than Starfield. If you like RPG’s and mucking around with dice whilst you play computer games, BG3 is a god damn masterpiece.

couragethebravedog ,

I hate those types of games and I’ve still managed to sink 50 hours in bg3 and I’m not even done with the first act yet. It’s the new standard for AAA gaming.

bandario ,
@bandario@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

The larger studios need to take notice. All of the positive press and heartfelt words about this game have been heard the world over.

You CAN deliver a complete product with no microtransactions and have people absolutely frothing over it and make a big pile of cash.

It’s REALLY not my cup of tea, but I can’t pretend for one second that the game isn’t the absolute tits. It’s fucking amazing, really. I just can’t do turn based. At that point I may as well get a DND group together.

Hadriscus ,

Oh, it’s turn-based?? I thought I would buy it but turn-based completely ruin the immersion for me. I never understood how you’re supposed to suspend your disbelief when everybody politely waits for the opponent to strike.

bandario ,
@bandario@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Worse than turn based my dude/ dudette. It’s roll for attack with in-built twin die. Ruined it for me too but I’m not going to stand in the way of the target audience enjoying a truly great game.

Hadriscus ,

Yea neither am I

NathanielThomas ,

Nobody bandwagoned on BG3, it’s a masterpiece

PreachHard ,

Exactly all the hype started after the game released and people banged on about how fucking amazing it is. Nearly 200hrs later and I concur.

PM_ME_FEET_PICS ,

It’s was a game that was in development for 4 years and they released it still in beta. Only 3 of the 7~ game destroying bugs have even been addressed yet. 4 of them existed and were reported on in the Early Access.

The writing is sub Bethesda, typical of LS.

Enemy base is very weak. Only like 10 different types of enemies in a world with hundreds.

pm_boobs_send_nudes ,

Alright, you had me convinced until the sentence “the writing is sub Bethesda”.

Yeah…no.

PM_ME_FEET_PICS ,

You honestly think BG3 has good writing? It may have had it back when Chris was writing. Not anymore.

bitsplease ,

Enemy base is very weak. Only like 10 different types of enemies in a world with hundreds

This alone tells me you barely played the game lol, there are well over 10 distinct enemy types in the first act alone. Hell, I think you might run into close to 10 enemies before you even get off the Nautilus

The writing is sub Bethesda, typical of LS

And this either tells me the same as the above, or that you just have awful taste. The writing is one of the strongest points about the game, and nearly every review of the game agrees, whereas shitty writing is practically a cornerstone of Bethesda at this point.

Totally with you about the bugs, and I also find it frustrating that a lot of bg3 fans are willing to just pretend those bugs don’t exist when disgusting it. Everything else you said is just idiotic though

PM_ME_FEET_PICS ,

The writing is very mid. It’s cute that you’re still in the honeymoon period with the game.

Predictable main story, shoehorned characters and short boring responses.

PM_ME_FEET_PICS ,

The wiki lists 23 distinct enemy types. Again, in a world with hundreds of classic monsters: where are they?

ErinCrush ,

It’s boring

GoodEye8 , (edited )

Well if you want to get nitpicky there’s no “roleplaying” in a Bethesda games because there are no bad outcomes. Minor spoilers about BG3.

For instance in BG3 I went into a camp swords blazing and murdered everything in sight. Turns out I killed a recruitable companion along the way that I never would’ve found out if I hadn’t read about it online. Technically speaking that’s an undesirable outcome because I’m going to miss out on some content but at that moment I didn’t give a fuck and similarly the game just went along with it. At no point did the game even hint that maybe I shouldn’t kill that character, if anything the game told me the objective is to kill that character. Had it been a Bethesda game I 100% would’ve been prevented from just murdering that companion and the game had given me a chance to recruit them.

Similarly I reloaded one hard fight 4 times to save a character who was relatively important to the story. That bitch just kept on running into AOE effects and getting herself killed. BG3 didn’t give a fuck if that character lived or died because the story would’ve continued without her. We all know how Bethesda handles characters that are important to the story, they literally cannot die.

And finally I’m currently at a point where the game gave me 2 choices, either I send one of my companions into eternal servitude or another character important to the story dies. Maybe there’s a third option that lets me save both but I might’ve missed it. If this was a Bethesda game there wouldn’t even be such a situation because it doesn’t matter what you choose, either option has a bad outcome.

And those are just examples from my current playthrough. From what I’ve seen others play you might not even get to those decisions, which means some decisions will lock out other decisions down the line and that’s once again something Bethesda does less and less with each game

Baldurs gate 3 gets praise because it’s a great game, Starfield gets shit because underneath it’s just Skyrim in space. Are we supposed to give praise for a game that follows a decade old design philosophy? If Doom 93 came out today should we lose our collective minds? No, because the industry has moved forward. Our expectations should be higher than Skyrim. There are good things about Starfield. The moment to moment combat seems excellent and Bethesda clearly has improved the visuals compared to FO4 and FO76. But the rest of the game seems it could’ve just as well been released back in 2011.

And before you think I’m some hyped up tweeb who is now disappointed that Starfield didn’t live up to the hype, I haven’t been hyped about a Bethesda game since Fallout 3. I’m well aware how easily Bethesda springs up hype and how the final product doesn’t really match the hype they promote. I had pretty basic expectations of what Starfield might be and I feel like Starfield was pretty much in the ballpark to the expectations I had: good shooting, lots and lots of loading screens and menus and very little of actual “space”. That’s to say I didn’t have high expectations in the first place.

szczuroarturo ,

That would explain why out of all of Skyrim i only remember the fact that you could kill the girl that invites you to dark brotherhood amd subsequently destroy it.

ErinCrush ,

All that gameplay you described? Is ancient. The industry has moved on as you say. You clicked through menus and virtually rolled dice to do that. That’s so old, it predates video games themselves.

At least Starfield is more modern than turn based gameplay.

bircelak ,

Was looking for a legit review and this seems to be it. Thank you :)

BG3 freedom gaming forever

mranachi ,

I think the microtransactions praise was more are, non predatory marketing / extracting every last cent praise. Didn’t Stanfield have a premium cost to pay a week earlier or something? Is that not a similar concept, albeit nowhere near as shit as microtransactions.

Are we not all tired of being wrung out for our cash? What’s so wrong with just charging what you need so that you can make a game.

Tofu_Lewis ,

Uhh just play Outer Worlds you nerds

NathanielThomas ,

Starfield doesn’t unlock in many countries until September 5.

Everyone fucking relax

Agent641 ,

If my therapist and my dealer both failed at getting me to do tgat, what chance you think you have?

Viking_Hippie ,

Tgat? Is that an acronym of "Toke, grin, assess, twerk "?

JamesStallion ,

Occams razor dictates yes.

Trihilis ,

The negative opinions basically boil down to the following:

  1. people who have played the game and genuinely don’t like it (like asmongold) and have good arguments why they don’t like it. I respect these people opinions. You can tell them apart because they actually name the things they don’t like in the game with constructive arguments.
  2. People who haven’t played the game and probably never will and just regurgitate what the hate train is saying. If you ask them why it usually boils down to “it looks boring”, okay cool have played it? No? Okay is there anything else you don’t like? Then the usual “bethesdaslop” and calling people idiots or shills start. I mean what are you even trying to accomplish? Are they just annoyed others are having fun while they’re angry? I don’t take these people seriously and you can usually easily pick them out of the comments.

The game will probably get review bombed on metacritic and the likes, I’m calling it now. Just the amount of stupid articles and YouTube make it a self fulfilling prophecy. I won’t give a shit, I’ll try it on gamepass when it comes out. If I like it I will keep playing it and if I don’t I will stop. It’s as simple as that.

I really don’t see why people feel the need to jump on some hate train just for the sake of disliking something. It’s just as annoying as people who want to be contrarian just to look interesting.

Meuzzin ,

People are just weird, and typically have zero foresight.

I think you’re pretty much spot-on.

I understand some of the negative reviews, but over-all, I’ve enjoyed it so far. More importantly, it has massive potential.

abraxas ,

Asmongold gets on my nerves despite the fact he usually has well-conceived opinions. Offhand, do you have a summary of what his complaints are?

Trihilis ,

I don’t really want to rewatch the 4 hour or so stream but off the top of my head’ -ship combat wasn’t fun (he didn’t get it and found it unreasonably hard) -he did not care for the RPG elements and doesn’t like games where you have to play for a lot of hours before it becomes fun -he found the combat clunky compared to other shooter games

He admitted he probably wasn’t the right audience for the game since he never really liked Bethesda games. He just wanted to try something different. Also story seems to be not that important to him generally. I personally love Bethesda games and can get completely absorbed in them. But I can also definitely understand it’s not for everyone.

abraxas ,

All that makes sense. I remember him defending P2W action games. And I did stumble onto a reaction video of him laughing at random things that CP2077 thought of but weren’t in Starfield. Fair enough.

Sinister Bot ,
@Sinister@hexbear.net avatar

Damn starfield is bad? With its premise being Another basic america glass towers neolib united federation in space, while also made by bethesda? Who could have known.

Hadriscus ,

Probably not very class conscious. But I have not played it

Tankiedesantski ,

Yes but this game is political because it lets you pick pronouns. Give me back my wholesome, unpolitical, giant stars and stripes robot spouting anticommunist catchphrases, Bethesda game!

ForbiddenRoot ,

I somehow entirely missed the hype around this game and came across it again only accidentally on early release day when looking at some other sale on Steam. Been playing it and it seems fine to me in a vague Skyrim-in-space sort of way, which is all what I was expecting from a Bethesda RPG.

The world seems alive enough and there are plenty of side-quests and amusing / interesting things to discover. Now suddenly I have been coming across a bunch of posts everywhere where the game is supposed to be terrible or something. Still seems fine to me, but maybe I have lower standards after decades of gaming. shrug.

Dubious_Fart ,

Its fallout 4 in space.

But with a worse interface and a lot more menus that are annoying to navigate.

besbin ,

that’s just console first UI design school Bethesda have subscribed to since Skyrim.

Dubious_Fart ,

I know, its heavily consolified, but its bad even for bethesda.

GenderIsOpSec ,
@GenderIsOpSec@hexbear.net avatar

Skyrim

arguably since Oblivion

jabrd ,

Honestly this plus “Skyrim-in-space” make me feel pretty confident that this game is going to have staying power just because we know how good the modding community is for bethesda games. Skyrim was panned up front as genre generic fantasy with a pinch of viking magic but has been played continuously for a decade plus because it made for such a good blank slate to add onto. Also I guarantee every current UI issue already has modders working on it. Starfield script extender just dropped and the game hasn’t even officially been released

Dubious_Fart ,

Which really sucks, if you think about it.

Cause you and I both know the only thing that makes Bethesda games big sellers is the fact that anyone that buys them goes “Oh boy, I cant wait for the modders to make it actually interesting/fun/etc”

JackbyDev ,

But at the same time these games are very moddable. Not every game has great mod apis and they suffer for it. It’s like would you rather buy a shitty product that breaks easily or a shitty product that breaks easily that you can also fix easily? Clearly the second. That’s what Bethesda’s games and reputation were (in my mind at least) pre Fallout 76. So no, I don’t think it’s shitty at all. The community of modders exist because Bethesda made the games moddable, not because the games suck. If the games sucked and weren’t moddable then people wouldn’t be buying them in the hopes they could mod it.

Dubious_Fart ,

I’d rather buy a product thats decent, and doesnt rely on waiting 6 months for the community to do all the dev legwork.

JackbyDev ,

Yeah, no shit, that’s not the point of the comparison though, goober.

Dubious_Fart ,

its literally what we’ve been talking about this entire time.

and please, if you’re gonna insult me, at least be more inventive at it than a grandmother from the 1950s

JackbyDev ,

I’m saying that if the games just totally sucked and couldn’t be modded they wouldn’t be popular. Being moddable is a good thing that developers should do. When you say you’d rather have a good game that’s also moddable when discussing the comparison of bad games that are moddable versus bad games that aren’t moddable it comes across silly. Like, yeah, obviously I was a good game that is moddable. I also want a million dollars. We’re not just having a discussion about random things we want. I’m pointing out that the fact that the games are moddable is a very good thing about the games and those modding communities wouldn’t exist if it was harder to make the mods.

Also, I’m not insulting you. That’s why I used a silly word to try and help it sound more light hearted.

Reddit_Is_Trash ,

Some mods have attempted to fix the menus.

I’d like to see some complete UI overhauls at some point, but right now I’m using a mod that increases the refresh rate to 120hz from 30 in the menu’s

Tankiedesantski ,

Yeah the interface is awful.

On the other hand, I came across pirates boarding a freighter yesterday. I shot down the pirate ship and boarded the freighter. The gravity generator was malfunctioning so it would sometimes have gravity and sometimes be zero g. There were navigation puzzles, some of which could only be done in normal grav and some in zero-g.

None of the random side content in FO4 is anywhere near that interesting.

Dubious_Fart ,

You’ll be bored by that new radiant by the 10th time you do it.

Tankiedesantski ,

It’d probably grate on me the second time I do it. Doesn’t mean that it’s not more interesting than the generic “this settlement needs you to shoot some dudes” FO4 encounter.

Dubious_Fart ,

Its more interesting because its the first time you’ve encountered it. after a year you’ll have the same criticisms about starfield radiant quests that you did about fallout 4 radiants.

sentient_loom ,
@sentient_loom@sh.itjust.works avatar

Fallout 4 is a much better FPS. But Starfield is a much, much better RPG.

Dubious_Fart ,

Eh… I’m not sure I agree with that statement, but to each their own

Renacles ,

Why are people pretending the game isn’t getting glowing reviews? Is the Bethesda hate circlejerk still going on?

mind ,

deleted_by_author

    •
    Renacles ,

    Yep, he just added a few panels because he didn’t want to look like an idiot.

    Kushia OP ,
    @Kushia@lemmy.ml avatar

    Oh no I’ve been found out 🥹

    AOCapitulator ,
    @AOCapitulator@hexbear.net avatar

    this game is a negative -5/7 in my heart

    circuitfarmer ,
    @circuitfarmer@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

    It didn’t come out on PS5.

    Tankiedesantski ,

    I like the game, but reviews are pretty unreliable these days. Cyberpunk 2077 also got a load of 8/9/10s on release and that game ran like shit and was full of bugs.

    JackbyDev ,

    Every game gets and 8, 9, or 10 lol.

    RobertOwnageJunior ,

    Is the performance difference big if you play from HDD or SSD?

    BetaDoggo_ ,

    There should be no performance difference. The only difference should be in loading screens and possibly pop-in from streamed assets.

    RobertOwnageJunior ,

    Is the game generally demanding, though? Don’t exactly have a top of the line setup.

    Zana ,

    I have a 2070 Super and am running it well.

    Baphomet_The_Blasphemer ,

    https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/6658f821-ad90-4b7a-8ac6-792128650052.jpeg

    b3nsn0w ,
    @b3nsn0w@pricefield.org avatar

    extremely, based on the testing by gamersnexus and hardware unboxed. even a 4090 can only get you 90-100 fps on ultra without upscaling (of which only fsr 2 is present, which is generally horrible in terms of image quality). performance drops off accordingly, if i’m not mistaken you have to drop to medium on a 3060 to get 60fps at a render resolution of 1080p.

    based on the numbers we’ve seen, i wouldn’t recommend high settings on anything but a 40-series, on which you probably want both dlss and framegen (for which you’ll have to install a mod, thankfully those are already out). the combination of those two gives you a clean doubling in performance, although latency doesn’t improve compared to native rendering. on older nvidia cards, you’re stuck with regular dlss, and scaling down render resolution unfortunately doesn’t have anywhere near as pronounced of an effect on nvidia as it should be based on current testing.

    amd cards have anomalously high performance in this game (which is kinda sus tbh), they generally perform on par with the nvidia gpu a tier above them (so an amd gpu that normally matches the 3060 would perform like the 3070 in starfield – or rather, given the lackluster visual quality, the 3070’s performance is currently pushed down to the 3060’s level, while amd is unaffected by this). there is also no raytracing in the game yet (even though we know they worked on it because they hired for that role, and because it’s 2023) so at the moment if you have an amd card you’ll have a great time in starfield, performance doesn’t suffer the same limitations, and the technologies you would miss out on aren’t implemented yet.

    on the intel side, however, the game doesn’t run at all. most of the time you won’t even get to the menu, and if you do, rendering is completely borked. it is unclear yet if the issue is with bethesda or intel, but given that it’s an amd-sponsored game, the charitable interpretation is that they didn’t test on intel hardware at all or give intel any time to fix stuff, and the less charitable interpretation is that they’re intentionally locking out intel cards.

    Dubious_Fart ,

    I’m on a 6700xt. I run the game at ultra and I’ve never had an unplayable dip at 1080p. worst i’ve had is like…40s in New Atlantis. Which is fine for ultra across the board for a non-combat area. N

    b3nsn0w ,
    @b3nsn0w@pricefield.org avatar

    yeah, that sounds like the amd performance thing. it doesn’t run anywhere as well on nvidia or intel, which, according to the steam hardware survey, is about 84% of gamers

    Dubious_Fart ,

    Oh well. Sucks for nvidia card owners to finally experience what AMD card owners have had to deal with forever.

    b3nsn0w ,
    @b3nsn0w@pricefield.org avatar

    really? so anti-competitive bullshit is okay now because it’s ✨the other side✨ doing it now. also let’s pay no mind to intel users who are completely locked out, there’s no reason amd would be highly incentivized to do that, right?

    i despised gameworks while nvidia did it, and i despise the same bullshit when amd does it. this is not how you fix shit.

    Dubious_Fart ,

    Don’t let the fact that I said nothing of the sort stop you from continuing your little rage fest.

    b3nsn0w ,
    @b3nsn0w@pricefield.org avatar

    i mean the “oh well” kind of implies it’s unimportant because it’s happening to nvidia users

    i see that you’re from .ml so it makes sense that the radeon rebellion has swayed you but amd is just another corporation that wants your money

    Dubious_Fart ,

    If you’re going to continue to pursue this, I suggest a creative writing class. At least make it more entertaining to read.

    NBJack ,

    This won’t hold true if your RAM gets to the limit, and you end up creeping into swap space. If you do, everything becomes a potentially streamed asset! While certainly not ideal, you’ll feel it harder on a HDD vs. SSD. Remember, you need at least 16GB of RAM for this monster, which these days is basically standard on most PCs (and about 70% of all Steam users as of August have no more than 16).

    YeetPics ,
    @YeetPics@mander.xyz avatar

    I saw a massive difference, had my original target drive set as an hdd, could barely open a menu without a hangup, dialog and character face movements suffered as well.

    I moved the entire file over to my ssd and it was a night and day difference. No lag issues anymore.

    Dubious_Fart ,

    I’ve seen posts elsewhere that say 5min+ loading screens on HDD that tried to install it to their HDDs. game does a LOT of asset streaming.

    Destraight ,

    I doubt that OP has played starfield

    ShimmeringKoi ,
    @ShimmeringKoi@hexbear.net avatar

    Lol even the title screen just looks like the Starbound logo

    FatTony ,

    This thread feels like everybody is pointing guns at each other.

    Spaceinv8er ,

    https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/9972d8c0-1e45-41a1-9da3-e7bf1ad5c991.webp

    eochaid ,
    @eochaid@lemmy.world avatar

    My wife, a couple friends, and I have all put a ton of hours into this game and absolutely love it. I put several hours into the shipbuilder alone. Every hand built sidequest I run into feels like a TNG episode. And I love the kinda Becky Chambers / Star Trek-style utopia with mystery and drama theme they’ve got.

    This is the most Bethesda game they’ve ever made, for better of worse. It doesn’t hand hold you. There are plenty of times where I’ve looked at my quest log, found nothing i could do except the main quest, and then decided just to jump to a random system - only to get pulled into some crazy new adventure for a couple hours. You’re supposed to be an explorer, if you put even the smallest effort into exploring, you will be rewarded.

    A lot of people complaining were never going to like this game or any Bethesda game and I don’t know what to do with those people. The amount of constant negativity on the internet makes me really appreciate stories like TNG and writers like Becky Chambers and Cory Doctorow, because they’re so positive and affirming and optimistic and when they criticise, they also offer solutions. And this game really scratches that itch for me.

    And after almost 40 years of life dealing with the constsnt cycle of negativity and hatred and anger and frustration and drama, on the internet, a global scale, and in my own life…I’m just tired. I can’t play games with “edgy dark stories” anymore. I can’t go back to New Vegas because its bummer after bummer. And i know a lot of people thrive on that “scortched earth” bullshit but I just can’t anymore.

    I just…wanna sit down and play a game. And maybe one where everything is okay for once. And this is that game for me.

    CapitanStrider ,

    Yeah that’s fair. Even if you see negative stuff about a game online, if you enjoy something then just enjoy it. Online toxicity and negativity are out of your control. Just get comfy and find peace in knowing that you’re having a good time.

    guriinii ,

    I don’t get the hate, fuck 'em. I’m absolutely loving the game, it’s exactly what I wanted and more. In fact, I get the same feeling I did playing Skyrim, you’re doing some side mission, then you see something absolutely stunning. Earlier I was on some grey barren moon looking for resources, I look to the right, see the red planet, it’s ice caps, and other two moons with the milky way behind them.

    I like the TNG comparison. The side missions are so much better than in other Bethesda games I’ve played. Even little interactions with the NPCs or little events and conversations that just happen as a part of the world and not some quest. Love it.

    thecodemonk ,

    Damn it. Now I might have to try to buy it. In was thinking game pass as I would probably just do the main story and be done… But if the side quests aren’t just some, go pick up this item and bring it back, id love that.

    guriinii ,

    I mean there is that too but it’s how the story is told. Maybe the voice acting and characters are better also.

    updawg ,

    Head to Paradiso for a StarTreky adventure.

    SwampYankee ,

    Man that last quest for Sarah was a such a TNG moment. Overall the writing in this game is a cut above most - that quest was sort of an obvious twist, but it was executed really well. I find myself wishing the animations could keep up with the writing and voice actors sometimes, but we can’t have it all.

    sentient_loom ,
    @sentient_loom@sh.itjust.works avatar

    Are you hoping for cut scenes with specially rendered segments? Because I hate that stuff and would rather see animations built within the game world, like we have in most of these Bethesda games.

    Cut scenes ruin games for me. It’s why I never finished a Mass Effect game.

    SwampYankee ,

    No, just more emotion in the animations. You know how real people will sort of look up & to the left or something, maybe put their finger or hand up if they’re trying to remember something? Or they’ll look around and move their head a little, scratch their chin, etc. if they’re thinking. Or they’ll scrunch their eyebrows up and look at the ground if they’re sad?

    That kind of thing.

    sentient_loom ,
    @sentient_loom@sh.itjust.works avatar

    Okay yeah, those would certainly be improvements. And… we have the technology.

    Honytawk ,

    The eyes are always looking at the player as well. Kind of makes them look psychopathic.

    c0mbatbag3l ,
    @c0mbatbag3l@lemmy.world avatar

    Strange, I hate the Bethesda POV and would rather have a cinematic view that helps sell the acting and narrative. Nothing kills my Interest quicker than a boring me looking at you view of things.

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