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PunchingWood , (edited )

The price increase is insane. That does not seem to scale in comparison with what you’ll get in return over a regular PS5, especially if you’re gonna be forced to buy the digital editions from the PS store, which are outside of the sales often the most expensively priced versions too, I’ve practically only bought second-hand discs for my PS5 because of that.

So either games will start running at higher framerates on real 4K, like 60FPS and up. Or developers will get lazy and stop bothering to optimise for the older generation of PS5, which will then be an excuse to upgrade to the more expensive edition to play at 4K and/or 60FPS.

I really hope the latter won’t be a thing for the sake of both players and game development, there’s been enough unoptimised shit lately and I hope we can move forward again.

RxBrad ,
@RxBrad@infosec.pub avatar

That optimization part is what worries me. I still remember games like Control & Cyberpunk being basically unplayable unless you had a PS4 Pro.

PunchingWood ,

Yeah I’m afraid that stuff like GTA6 might run like absolute dogshit on the old PS5, because they will see the opportunity to make use of the better hardware to sell the 4K and 60FPS. No doubt even Sony will try to push this, trying to sell more of these Pros.

I do hope we will move forward, but I think money and greed will play too much of a role in this. We don’t even really need a PS5 Pro right now, looking at the current line-up of games that run fine on the old PS5, even in 4K and 60FPS, as long as developers spend the time to optimise their games instead of throwing everything on to raytracing (which I find is still in a very experimental phase).

ATDA ,

I’m sure at some point devs will make good use of the extra power. And by that point this puppy will be half the cost MSRP to snatch up.

Swarfega ,

Not worth it. The PS5 games catalogue is piss poor compared to when the PS4 Pro released.

GoodEye8 ,

Kinda hard to make a solid catalogue when you follow the live service trend and your projects flop one after another.

PunchingWood ,

Frankly that’s just thinking with only PS5 exclusives in mind.

A lot of people, probably the vast majority, don’t get an Xbox or PlayStation for the exclusives. They just get one because they don’t own or want a gaming PC and look for the easier more accessible solution.

So to them the catalogue is just fine because they don’t get the console just for the exclusives.

poshcrow ,

gta 6 gets delayed… sony releases this early to sell more ps6’s ?

poshcrow ,

gta

ech ,

Is there an eli5 on how “ai upscaling” is less (or even equally) technologically demanding than just putting in better hardware?

Thorry84 ,

The game is rendered at a lower resolution, this saves a lot of resources. This isn’t a linear thing, lowering the resolution reduces the performance needed by a lot more than you would think. Not just in processing power but also bandwidth and memory requirements. Then dedicated AI cores or even special AI scaler chips get used to upscale the image back to the requested resolution. This is a fixed cost and can be done with little power since the components are designed to do this task.

My TV for example has an AI scaler chip which is pretty nice (especially after tuning) for showing old content on a large high res screen. For games applying AI up scaling to old textures also does wonders.

Now even though this gets the AI label slapped on, this is nothing like the LMMs such as chat GPT. These are expert systems trained and designed to do exactly one thing. This is the good kind of AI that’s actually useful instead of the BS AI like LLMs. Now these systems have their limitations, but for games the trade off between details and framerate can be worth it. Especially if our bad eyes and mediocre screens wouldn’t really show the difference anyways.

antithetical ,

So far I’ve traded in all my Playstations for the latest versions. But this price-hike and no disc-drive are a dealbreaker. Guess I’m going for a new gaming PC and a Steam Deck now. Too bad Sony, you messed up.

catalyst ,
@catalyst@lemmy.world avatar

At this price I’m so glad I decided to go for a slim instead of holding out for the pro. Absolutely no way.

themurphy ,

Not really on topic, but AI upscaling is no joke. It’s actually very useful and saves alot processing power. Same with the extra fps, making a 30fps into a 60fps with ease.

million ,
@million@lemmy.world avatar

Don’t they already use FSR on the 5?

Ashtear ,

FSR doesn’t use AI hardware. The original comment is overselling it a bit, but something AI-driven like DLSS does offer substantial (if slightly blurry) framerate gains.

Aielman15 , (edited )
@Aielman15@lemmy.world avatar

This generation is already pretty weak, and it was hard to justify the original PS5 which, after a whopping four years, still has too few exclusive titles to justify the increased price point. Now they are asking for $700 (and they increased the controller’s price, too), but there’s still too few next gen titles, and it doesn’t even come with basic features like a disc tray and a vertical mount. Not even a better form factor, it’s the same old ugly case, but somehow bigger.

The only premium thing about this thing is the price tag. $700 dollars but €800, because apparently they are dominating the European market so much that they don’t even have to try to sell it at an honest price point. With all those money you can just buy a PC. I honestly don’t think that many people who are interested in the console market (which, historically, has always been a “low budget” entry into modern gaming) would be willing to spend so much money on one.

I guess we circled back to the PS3 era, when Sony got drunk with overconfidence. Only, this time they’ll get away with it because their main competitor is somehow even more incompetent than them. I wonder if the handheld PC market will pose a threat to their dominance in the future - at the moment, it’s a very small niche.

v4ld1z ,
@v4ld1z@lemmy.zip avatar

It’s just so sad. I remember back when the PS4 Pro came out and you could trade in your old PS4 for a little on top to get a Pro at GameStop. It was a night and day difference going from a base PS4 to a Pro - and merely for the price of the console, 3 random games off a list of curated games, two controllers, iirc, and 100€. It was straight gas for me.

Paying 300€ on top - realistically even more because you’re not gonna sell a used PS5 for 500€ nowadays - plus the money for a disc drive and a vertical stand would set you back like 900-100€. Completely out of their minds

zib ,

The PS5 is already a very powerful piece of hardware that most devs aren’t making full use of. I honestly can’t see any justification in a hardware upgrade other than some Sony execs thinking it’ll be the end of the world if they don’t put out something new to make some profit line continue to go up.

IsThisAnAI ,

I love sunny and have 2 ps5s. This thing is DOA.

ZeroTwo ,

They need to pump out more games to justify this. I see no reason to upgrade as mine already sits and collects dust. The controller is super awesome tho, use it all the time for my PC.

60fpsrefugee ,

Sony thinks so too, which is why they increase the controller’s price, lol.

burgersc12 ,

You could buy a pretty nice PC for $700

NOT_RICK ,
@NOT_RICK@lemmy.world avatar

Which could play MS and Sony games. I don’t think consoles make much sense nowadays.

burgersc12 ,

And the best part is you don’t have to pay for online and you won’t need to rebuy your games each new console generation.

NOT_RICK ,
@NOT_RICK@lemmy.world avatar

First one I’ll grant you, but there was no rebuying from last gen to current gen for anything non-Nintendo.

burgersc12 , (edited )

If you pay for the discs, you can’t use the discs on future generations. Right? Ps4 can’t read ps3 or ps2 discs. Xbox one can read xbox and 360 discs, but they limit it to only specific games. So in general, you have to buy it once again on their online store, if its available at all.

60fpsrefugee ,

While pc can play old games, you can sometimes run into compatibility issues. Especially games in the ps1/2/3 era.

Og Xbox and xbox 360 games work without much issues on Xbox one and series XS. Ps4 and Xbox one games are 99% playable on Series XS and Ps5.

sigmaklimgrindset ,

Yeah, idk why Ps4 has no backwards compatibility. PS3 (fat) was backwards compatible with PS 1+2, and PS5 is backwards compatible for PS4. I didn’t buy a PS4 for that exact reason, and was lucky enough to get my hands on a PS5 during launch to play all the PS4 games I missed.

With all the niche Japanese games I like slowly coming to PC, I probably won’t buy a new console ever again. (As an aside, if anyone has a spare fat PS3 they’re willing to sell for parts…)

burgersc12 ,

It just feels so anti-consumer and everyones forgets about it and they just happily pay for content which can no longer be owned only rented.

sigmaklimgrindset , (edited )

I agree. One of the few reasons I still stuck to consoles is because I could buy the physical games and have it on my shelf forever. That’s going the way of the dinosaurs, and while I love that things are more accessible via Steam or whatever, I can’t let my friends borrow my games, or pass it along to someone else to enjoy if I didn’t like a game as much.

I also just love collecting and displaying game cases and steelbooks and stuff. That’s rarely a thing anymore, either.

wiccan2 ,

The lack of backwards comparability is because of the large difference in architecture.

The PS2 was a128 bit custom processor, the PS3 had PS2 hardware in the original fat versions to achieve backwards compatibility, it was dropped to reduce the price.

The PS3 was a 64 bit (I think) custom PowerPC processor.

With the PS4 Sony switched to x86_64 processors making the console essentially a PC with bespoke custom hardware. The PS5 is the same but better speced components as the tech moved on. That’s why the PS4 & 5 are compatible, they are essentially using the same architecture.

Microsoft is a similar story but they went all in on emulation of their old consoles which is why only certain games are allowed, they only allow the ones tested to work with the emulator.

sigmaklimgrindset ,

The PS3 was a 64 bit (I think) custom PowerPC processor.

Thanks for jogging my memory, I completely forgot how different the PS3 architecture is compared to the other PlayStations and also the 360. Same reason why emulation for it is so hard (and why MGS4 has no modern ports 🥲)

HeyJoe ,

It did when the ps5 first came out. $500 for it was a steal back then. I wanted to build a PC at the time but due to the crazy GPU prices and low stock for other parts I decided it was best to wait. Got a ps5 instead (was also hard to get as well) and thought it was absolutely worth the price for the experience it offered. Just built the pc I wanted last fall shortly after prices started dropping. First time ever I made a good choice.

Ashtear ,

Yeah, after that time I really didn’t think consoles would be as much as a midrange PC. And yet, here we are. Feels like Sony’s back to late PS2 era levels of hubris now.

Shard ,

Get yours! Now with 50% more AI™

Hurry while stocks last!

Glytch ,

That’s why you build your own. It’s actually really easy to do.

PunchingWood ,

Depending on how much you care about visuals, yeah.

A decent GPU will often be the price of an entire console. That said, even if you go with high-end hardware I found that eventually the cost will make up for itself for not having to pay for PSN to make use of and play on the internet. Or the fact that games are very often priced up to 50% more on the PS store than those on PC because there are no competing stores.

mintiefresh ,

I can’t see how this is worth it for anyone. Are there even games that are pushing the current PS5?

No disc drive either.

Z3k3 ,

No disc drive either.

I’m out

redy_velvet ,

There are games that perform poorly, but to my understanding that’s not the hardware’s fault

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