I am proud of Lemmy.ml for defederating. The second I find out if kbin social or lemmy world defederate or not I will just move to the other one since I use both. (Edit turns out Lemmy.ml is run by Tankies and also allows federation with lemmygrad.)
Tankies is a word that better suits them imo. I consider myself a socialist, but those guy are fucking defending the CCP (chinese comunist party) and are very trigger happy with the banning switch. So yeah, i dont think this is a win but more like bussines as usual.
That works for me as well… and most of lemmygrad.ml, but no one ever visits that place, people just talk smack about it based on a few users and posts 🤷.
Exactly. This is why federation is cool. The individual can choose where to go. Oh, kbin and lemmy.world, you didn’t defederate from the corporate shills? OK then, I shall defederate myself from you. Plenty of instances.
Lemm.ee is another big-ish general purpose instance that looks to be in favour of preemptively defederating after some polling and discussion there today, in case Kbin.social and lemmy.world continue to stay silent.
I will have to check that out. I tried lemmy.ml but found out it is run by tankies. So I deleted my account there. Lemmy.world are trying a wait and see approach which I think is a bit naive giving metas reputation. But at least they are against Tankies. As for kbin.social I have given the dev the benifit of a doubt since it is one person who works hard on kbin and most likely has not had time to comment on meta. I have faith that he will do the right thing and defederate from meta.
Deleting your account wouldn’t really change anything. There’s no reason to unless you have some very strong moral problem with being associated with them in any way.
By the way, you can definitely have a Lemmy account on a different instance, no need for kbin (unless you like it there, then that’s great). Their views shouldn’t have any effect on the other Lemmy instances.
I've always found tankies to be the most extreme example of being anti-socialism and anti-ML. Because do they really think Marx and Lenin would support these dictatorial (and still capitalist) human rights violating countries to be what their utopia is?
In a realistic comparison, Marx and Lenin would support European democracies before they supported trash like modern Russia and China (and don't even get me started on North Korea).
How dare you imply that socialism and communism are egalitarian and anti-authoritarian, and aren't just pejoratives for anything right-wing fascists don't like!
Not really. Lemmy.ml is the result of the creation of Lemmy. The restrictions of genzedong may have influenced the creation but you can’t equate that to being a direct product, and nowhere in the thread talks about that. A more apt title is “TIL the top admins of lemmy.ml who are also top devs of Lemmy are pro-CCP” (add “shill” to the end if you want). This may be a little willy-nilly but this is TIL where facts should be objective and links should be informative.
Thank you for calling attention to this! I’ve been trying to raise awareness about why people should avoid lemmy.ml like the plague. My first post on Lemmy was on this thread created by the same person that made the post you linked to. I had noticed the mod action they called out where someone was banned for posting an Axios article about the Chinese succession plan for the reason of “Orientalism”. I appreciate that Lemmy is defederated and at the end of the day your server admin matters first and foremost, but I do really hope the views of those top devs never lead to problems with the software itself. At least it’s all open source and they would be called out if they ever tried anything shady.
Sure it is a thing but JavaScript on that domain can access it either injected or provided by the site. This is quite risky. Cookies can be http only so that client code cant access it.
Because we were talking about how to save that information without using cookies. Setting a cookie would break the one thing that the conversation was about, wouldn’t it?
If we’re in a fun conversation about how to enter your home without using the door, would you be the one saying “I have an idea, I have an idea: use the door”?
It was clearly a reference to the so called ‘cookie laws’ requiring permission for tracking cookies. However, cookies that are not for tracking purposes do not require any form of consent.
Legally it’s the same thing. The ‘cookie laws’ don’t explicitly forbid cookies, any kind of tracking is prohibited. Also, just storing a cookie with the information that a banner was shown doesn’t require consent. The only thing that requires consent is tracking the user.
This is reddit killing third party apps, because even if you did subscribe you’re still not getting NSFW because reddit is taking that out of the API anyways
So who would pay literally more for less? Reddit can say all they want about supporting 3rd party but even the blind could see through them
I bet Infinity is doing this instead of hanging up their keyboards like the other apps specifically because they know it won’t work and want to be living proof of it.
The devs were hoping that they can keep their apps up and their livelihoods without too much additional work, that’s fair from them I suppose. But they should definitely be taking a hard look at porting their existing apps for the Fediverse, if they aren’t yet.
(Apparently) Unpopular Opinion: I think defederating Threads is the wrong move, because it just locks people into Threads. If people on Twitter had the ability to move to Mastodon AND still interact with all the people they did before, I think we would have seen even more people move. The only reason I still check twitter at all is because I have a few close friends who didn’t move. Meta is likely going to have big adoption of people who aren’t ready to go to Mastodon, but are interested in getting out of the dumpster-on-fire that twitter seems to continue to be. But blocking those people from being able to join the more popular Lemmy instances, given no actual policy violations, just will keep people in Meta that otherwise could leave. With the “however” being: It’s not quite clear to me that Threads users will be interacting with Lemmy as much Mastodon, if Threads were a Reddit replacement, it’s more directly connected.
The problem isn’t with the user base. It’s with Meta and their business practices. People very simply do not trust Meta or Facebook and with good reason.
That’s exactly it. Deleted my Instagram account when I learned they signed me up for a Threads account automatically. Haven’t used Insta in years, but Mark says I have to have a Threads account. So Fuck Zuck.
more ideally would be as many levels of granular control as possable for users and their clients.
The point is to blacklist as specific as needed, EX: dont block lemmy dot Marxist Lennonists just its extremist communities (ml admins have a communism chinaphile problem)
However Servers ghould get
whitelist/blacklist of users
blacklist/whitelist of communities (prevents blocking servers for just their groups)
I understand your viewpoint but you have to realize meta/Facebook has done this before. The best solution to protect Lemmy/mastodon in the long run is to cut the cancer out before it has a chance dm to spread.
When you cut off a cancer, it dies. When you defederate a social network orders of magnitude larger and more powerful than you… it doesn’t even notice and continues to thrive. It’s not the same thing at all.
Threads got 80 million users in 48h. Those people are not gonna use Mastodon anyway. They don’t care about their privacy, they don’t care that some proprietary algorithm is gonna decide what they will see, they don’t care that it’s Facebook. Those people have no standards. The only way we can help them is by educating them and if that doesn’t change their mind, then there is nothing we can do, because freedom and privacy is not something they value. People who value them are capable of making a small sacrifice of not using some website when an alternative exists.
Facebook either just wants to use the Fediverse for their own benefit or they want to destroy it before it becomes a bigger competitor. We shouldn’t risk all that we have built just because we live in an ignorant society that doesn’t understand technology.
Just because they won’t use Mastodon now, doesn’t mean they never will in the future. Especially when (not if) Mastodon sorts out some of their usability issues around signup and interacting with posts from other instances.
We need to build a strong society that isn’t dependent on big corporations for being able to do the most basic things like talking to each other. The usability issues seem like a tiny price to pay for that and for privacy and freedom of speech. Those people can join Mastodon any time if they wish. But if Facebook manages to destroy the Fediverse, there will be no freedom for anyone.
It’s not just about having the biggest reach, though.
I’ve noticed that some of the folks who are generally against defederating, whether it be between independent fediverse instances or from large companies, seem to have this impression that fediverse needs to take a huge chunk of some market share in order to compete. But the whole point of the Fediverse is that it doesn’t need to compete.
It’s not a company looking to increase their size, following a bottom line, and trying to increase profitability. It’s a network of people who communicate and share content. There’s no need to compete with anyone in order to accomplish that. We’re doing it right now regardless of whatever else exists out there.
We’ve gotten so used to this model where there are only a few really culturally relevant social media sites, but that’s literally because we’ve just bought into the business model of these companies as societies. Slashdot has been going strong since 1997. Is it the biggest forum or news site on the internet? No. It gets a tiny portion of the internet’s traffic. But that’s plenty to be what it is!
The fediverse is not facebook or twitter or reddit, and it shouldn’t be. We don’t want or need it to be.
I heard someone make the point recently that nobody walks into a nice, small restaurant and says they wish they were at McDonalds. Facebook is the McDonaldsification of the internet. Let’s be a bunch of small mom and pop restaurants instead.
Fully agree. It would be like saying people with @gmail addresses can’t email people on @someFederated.com email addresses. Also I think (and correct me if I’m wrong here) the idea of “defederating” gives power to some in a way we hated reddit admins having power. Suddenly it’s “totally the fediverse except when…”.
Imo fuck that. If I don’t like threads I won’t use threads the same way if I don’t like lemmy.someinstance I won’t interact with lemmy.someinstance. leave it open and let the users choose. But also let’s educate. Some will listen and some will roll their eyes. But it’s a choice.
Being the “Ban Happy” socal media is a bad thing and an even worse reputation.
I debate if its a good thing to let FB just have free content with asterisks as I have no idea whitch way the cup of users will spill
EDIT: FB is a parisite that has a small enugh heart to use agressive tactics like Embrace Extend Extinguish, be careful if we do let them in and always be ready to shut that door)
Another thing, lemmy.ml, reddit, twitter, (tiktok for good mesure) as well as Facebook and sons (and likely more) have sensorius admins, moderating above what most users want and warping conversations to pretend like “this is what people are saying online and nothing more nor less”. To be overly flippant: “lol problem child blocked other problem child”
perspective: if i can still reach everyone on the fediverse with threads… why should i switch to lemmy and co? there is no incentive for it. so 99% will not do it if they don’t have to or get a incentive from it.we don’t get something from it, but facebook does (userdata and money).
so its a one sided deal where only facebook wins and we lose in the end.
Since writing my comment above, I’ve come across Cory Doctrow’s “Let the Platforms Burn” article where he argues that interoperability and the ability for users to move to other platforms is the best way out of the Meta situation. …medium.com/let-the-platforms-burn-6fb3e6c0d980
i mean, could lemmy even work with threads? completely different layout and functionality. im having a hard time understanding the Fediverse past lemmy instances interacting haha.
Oh shit you’re right. I could have sworn I saw they used their own protocol “similar to activitypub” but looking at their site it sure as shit is activitypub. Thanks
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