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Freesoftwareenjoyer

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Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

You can always write code for Free Software projects in your free time and contribute to a good cause.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

No worries, he can optimize it later.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

// TODO: fix this code

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I will be crushed when this happens along with millions of others, like you, who thought this could never happen again.

Be careful of the slippery slope fallacy.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

That’s not certain and them getting absolute power also isn’t.

So to me it sounds a bit like the arguments that they like to use. Like:

if we accept immigrants, they will slowly replace us and destroy the country

Technically maybe that could happen, but there are many other things that could also happen and that you are failing to consider.

Freesoftwareenjoyer , (edited )

But did they ask him how to patch KDE2 under FreeBSD? knowyourmeme.com/…/how-does-one-patch-kde2-under-…

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Backend developer.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

This is all true, but it’s interesting how people often forget another simple option: the software is commercial - it is simply sold on some website/store. Just like you can buy the game Mindustry on Steam, but it is Libre Software and even though you can get the build for free on GitHub and its itch.io page, people still pay for the Steam version. I wonder why people forget about this option, since it’s probably the simplest one.

Of course, Steam is a proprietary, unethical platform, so I’m just using it as an example - I’m not saying we should sell there.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

It would be nice if I could quit making proprietary software for a living. Maybe some day I will try making some commercial libre software and will see how it goes.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Is it? On GOG you can download games without installing their proprietary client (there is also a libre alternative called Heroic Games Launcher, but that’s made by the community). Itch has a libre client and it’s also optional. Both those platforms don’t put DRM in games, unlike Steam.

Steam has forced updates. This means that game developers can push an update that for example deletes content from your game and as far as I know, you can’t really refuse it.

On a page of every game that is sold on Steam, you will see text that says “Buy”. But I’m pretty sure their ToS says that you are only renting games from them. So they are misleading their users.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Absolutely proprietary.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

This is not for everyone, but I like when they post their crypto wallet address, because then I can send them money anonymously (especially if it’s Monero), it can be a one time donation and I don’t have to create an account on some website.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Grayjay is proprietary. Its license doesn’t allow you for example to modify the source code, which is one of the 4 essential freedoms. Programs that don’t give you all of those freedoms are not Free Software.

gitlab.futo.org/videostreaming/grayjay/…/LICENSE

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I have started by at least supporting game developers on Steam.

Steam puts DRM in games and requires proprietary software (the Steam client), so you should consider not buying there at all. GOG’s client is also proprietary, but its optional and there is a free alternative called Heroic Games Launcher. Itch.io has a libre client (also optional). As far as I know games on those two platforms are DRM-free.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Grayjay is proprietary software. The license doesn’t allow you to for example edit its source code: gitlab.futo.org/videostreaming/grayjay/…/LICENSE

So it’s denying you at least one of the 4 essential freedoms.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Paying for open source software sounds good on paper, but if it is required, the software will never accumulate the users to make the development have any meaning.

Based on what you said, I’m not sure what you mean by “open source”, but Free Software gives you the right to distribute the program (www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.en.html#four-freed…). So anyone who owns a copy can legally share it with you. There are commercial Free Software projects. The game Mindustry is one example.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Free Software can be legally distributed (it’s one of the 4 essential freedoms that it gives you). It doesn’t matter if it’s commercial or not, someone can always give you a copy.

There is a game called Mindustry, which is a libre game that is sold one Steam and it seems to be doing fine. This is just one example of a commercial Free Software project.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

It’s not Free Software, because it doesn’t give you the 4 essential freedoms.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Valve didn’t invent Proton. As far as I understand, it’s just a fork of WINE. I think the only difference is that it contains fixes for Steam versions of games. For non Steam games everyone uses WINE. I’m sure Proton is convenient for Steam users, though.

Not actually owning games sucks, but find me a digital marketplace that doesn’t say that you’re only “renting” them or some other bullshit.

Since GOG and itch.io give you DRM-free offline installers of games, I believe that you do own the games that you buy there. I haven’t read their ToS, though. It is possible that they say the same thing.

Steam doesn’t call it renting, rather, I quote, “As a Subscriber you may obtain access to certain services, software and content available to Subscribers or purchase certain Hardware”, where the subscriber is the word to call any user that has a steam account, nothing less nothing more: “You become a subscriber of Steam (“Subscriber”) by completing the registration of a Steam user account.” store.steampowered.com/subscriber_agreement/#1

Thanks for finding the exact quote. They didn’t use that word, but to me it sounds like renting. You have access to software as long as you are a subscriber. But I probably wouldn’t mind this if their games didn’t have DRM. Then, if at some point you stopped being a subscriber, you would still be able to play your games (at least the ones you’ve downloaded). Another interesting thing is that they can ban you for selling your Steam account. But before Steam became popular, it was usually possible to sell used games.

Also, torrents do exist, and guess what, they’re DRM free, just as you like it, I assume. That’s actually exactly why they should exist, imo: to preserve things.

The point is that DRM is unethical. I refuse to pay for anything that contains DRM. Breaking it is illegal, requires special skills and sometimes it’s very difficult even for experts (Denuvo). If those games were Free Software, any programmer could remove DRM from them and distribute such modified copy. That’s exactly why we need to get rid of proprietary software - so that developers don’t have power over users. I also think that piracy should exist, but it doesn’t solve our issues with software freedom. Nobody should restrict what people can do with their software and their computers.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

People can get proprietary software for free too, if they don’t mind pirating it. It might be illegal and the risk of getting malware increases, but many people do it anyway. Sometimes it’s even better than the original, because the pirated version won’t have DRM.

So in practice nobody has to pay for any software, any movie, etc. People just choose to do it. In case of Free Software getting it for free is just easier and safer. In theory this might mean that there is less incentive to pay for it, but some projects that I’ve seen seem to be successful. Maybe people don’t know they can get it for free, or it’s too much effort, or they are simply fine with paying.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

That is interesting! I had no idea, since it’s packaged in Debian, so I was able to easily install it for free, without even knowing there is a paid version.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Yes. And as you can see it has 14k reviews on steam while factorio has 141k reviews.

Yes, but what is this supposed to prove? That proprietary software is more popular? Usually it is. There are many different reasons for that, but one of them is that there is simply more of it.

It’s also a game, so there is no productivity gain or loss associated with it. There is no on call IT support, but you also don’t need any and if something breaks, you lose nothing except the ability to play THIS game for a short while. It’s not a… webserver you run your online shop through where every hour of downtime costs you X hundreds of euros or dollars.

It’s similar to selling a desktop app or a mobile app. I can’t find the source code of AnkiMobile right now, but I’m pretty sure it’s Free Software. If you want an example of a commercial app that people might use to do work, there is Ardour.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Proton is the directX to Vulkan translator

But WINE does exactly that, it translates different Windows APIs. I’ve been using it to play games (including Steam games) way before Proton was released. It has existed for 30 years now. Proton came 25 years later and according to Wikipedia:

Proton is developed by Valve in cooperation with developers from CodeWeavers.[2] It is a collection of software and libraries combined with a patched version of Wine to improve performance and compatibility with Windows games. Proton is designed for integration into the Steam client as “Steam Play”.[3] It is officially distributed through the client, although third party forks can be manually installed.

You can see for yourself that it uses WINE and other software that WINE also uses, like DXVK: github.com/ValveSoftware/Proton

screenshot

Not to mention that Valve managed to solve the problems around anti-cheats and all of this works with minimal tweaking.

If this is truly their achievement, then it is impressive.

Nice of them, to make a revolution and then just let the people actually have it, don’t you think?

If there is a revolution, then it seems that it’s mostly an achievement of WINE, DXVK and other developers. It is great that Valve contributes to Free Software, though. But that doesn’t change they fact that they also make proprietary software, which is unethical and they are doing it to attract people to their proprietary platform. WINE is licensed under a Copyleft LGPL license, so it’s also possible that Valve had no other choice in this case. Since last I checked even SteamOS was proprietary, there are good reasons to doubt their intentions.

Also DRMs are already not the shittiest malware big companies trying to install on your machine, it would be anti-cheat. Why noone talks obout them? There are methods to detect cheaters without installing a rootkit spyware on all the end-users PCs.

I talk about it, but most people don’t care about stuff like that at all.

Lol. Sorry, but the games and DRM are not why. The most important reason to it is that we’re losing proprietary software’s technologies. Technologies that might help advace our modern day of living. Also because what they’re restricting is basically a knoledge, and knowledge shoud be free, not because your poor ass can’t own their games.

My argument was that people deserve to be able to control their computers and to do that, they need to be able to control the software. Your reason is very important too. You can watch Richard Stallman’s talk for more: youtu.be/Ag1AKIl_2GM

And Proton is the example that Valve contributes to FOSS community, unlike literally every other major game company, even CDPR.

That is true.

Thats not even all of it to why i stand on my point, Steam prices are also the most humane, especially if we mention all this bunch of sales steam is famous for. They were there from the beginning, even though they could’ve done something similar to PSN in terms of pricing policy, given that steam was and still kinda is de-facto monopoly, since other game stores on pc have only the fractions of steam’s profits at the most.

What you are saying is true, but before Steam became popular, it was possible to buy used games on physical media for cheap. Now even physical copies of PC games have Valve’s DRM, so I blame Valve for destroying the used games market on PC (on consoles it still exists).

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I don’t doubt that Steam is convenient. I was just saying that we should buy DRM-free games when possible and support alternatives that don’t force us to use proprietary software. More freedom is better and if we don’t try to change something, we will be stuck like this forever and it might even get worse.

I say this as someone who daily drives a PinePhone

Same as me then, nice!

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I don’t think it’s silly at all to demand that users should have rights and that they should be able to control their computers. Valve makes proprietary software, which takes away user’s freedom, so it is unethical. They could make money in an ethical way if they only wanted. SteamOS is proprietary software too.

I don’t know much about VR, but if Valve makes a headset that doesn’t require proprietary software, that will be great. It should then be used as an example that other companies could follow. But it can’t be used as an excuse for them abusing users in other ways.

Also someone need to be paid to develop open source software. This being the beginning of the topic and all. I’m happy for that to be Valve at the moment as they have shown the industry how to be better.

Certainly, but Valve’s business is mostly focused on proprietary software and DRM. When they do make Free Software, it seems to be for the purpose of attracting people to their proprietary platform.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

It’s not easy to have freedom when you are a gamer. Steam and Epic Games Store are both proprietary (but for Epic you can use Heroic Games Launcher) and so are most games. There aren’t that many libre games and maybe around 10 of them are good. I hope that will change in the future.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I bought The Orange Box, so I had the same problem. All physical copies of games are like this now and Valve is the reason. That killed the used games market on PC. You used to be able to sell your game after you got bored of it, but not anymore.

GOG’s client is proprietary just like Steam and Epic, which is bad, but the difference is that their client is optional. You can get offline installers of games directly from the website, because games there are DRM-free. So that makes GOG better than those platforms. There is also a Free Software alternative client developed by the community - Heroic Games Launcher. It works with Epic Games Store as well.

Another store is itch.io, which sells DRM-free games and their optional client is Free Software. But this store only has indie games.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Yeah, that was the case in one of the companies I worked for. They only tested on Chrome and Edge.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Web standards keep evolving, this is normal. Otherwise you would be still running Adobe Flash.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Nice!

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

XKCD 2228

xkcd.com/2228

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I wonder if we all worked together if we could sabotage it in some way. Just enough so that it’s no longer worth it for them.

I'm looking for a TOS-breaking telegram client that strips out all the premium shit

Hello fellow pirates! I’m tired of having all the telegram premium ads and antifeatures in the client and I’m looking for a client that removed them even if it’s against the TOS. Any tips? I’d rather use an actual open source fork than a cracked version of the original...

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

It’s super weird to me that pirates aren’t advocating for the Free Software movement. Being able to control their own devices should be like one of their main goals.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

We’ve had a way forward for 40 years and it’s called Free Software: youtu.be/Ag1AKIl_2GM

www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.en.html

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Free Software gives you the 4 essential freedoms. One of them is the freedom to distribute the program. So anyone could legally give you a copy for free. Sounds like what you want, no?

Even if the authors implement some kind of DRM, any programmer can modify the program to remove that feature and share the modified version with everyone. Technically that is also possible with non-free software, but it’s illegal, pretty difficult and requires special skills.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

The FSF’s stance is just based on our current capabilities. Most people still use proprietary operating systems. We are capable of developing free alternatives of non-free programs, even very complicated ones. But it’s not realistic to think that we can currently replace all firmware for any device if we don’t know how it works. The amount of products that have the RYF certificate is already very small. Even Librem 5 didn’t manage to get it. When it becomes easier, I’m sure they will change the requirements or add more levels.

I’m pretty sure Libreboot contains proprietary firmware now and GNU is planning to develop an actually libre fork. So it’s silly for the developer to criticize the FSF for not being radical enough. It makes me think that the person doesn’t really believe in what they are saying.

But then the author says they want us to have proprietary firmware packages in our systems. So they want our OSes to be less libre… They even compare not including proprietary firmware to burning books… I stopped reading after that.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

But nobody is saying that there shouldn’t be a way to update firmware. Firmware just shouldn’t a be part of the OS, unless it’s free. Adding proprietary components to our systems will only make it harder for us to keep our freedom.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

You don’t know what the proprietary update contains. It can be a security fix, but also a backdoor. People can decide on their own if they want to update, but I see no reason why I must be forced to have proprietary stuff in my system. I want a fully libre distro. I can’t switch to one, because I would have to give up on using AMD GPUs, because people like you say that this is fine.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I am forced to keep proprietary firmware in my OS to use the hardware and that’s what you are advocating for. You want everyone to be forced to do that. But I don’t want anything proprietary in my system. I see no reason why I should have a proprietary firmware package installed for my GPU to work. The firmware could be just on the device itself and if someone wants to change it, then they can install the package in their OS. But maybe there could also be some other way.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

The world won’t change itself. If people did nothing 40 years ago, there wouldn’t be a Free Software movement.

It sounds like you are not using a fully free distro anyway. Most of the popular distros contain proprietary firmware, so what’s the problem?

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I didn’t say that I’m never going to install any firmware updates. I just don’t want to put it in my system if it’s proprietary.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

I think it’s important to have boundaries. If we keep our operating systems fully free, it will be harder for anyone to pressure us to add proprietary components to them. But if our OSes already contain non-free components, it’s not that hard to add more. We not only want freedom, we also want to keep it.

It also needs to be clear for the people in our community that our main goal is freedom and getting rid of proprietary software. Convenience is less important.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

What’s the problem? You want people to not discuss things that are offensive? It’s a shame he used to believe that, but he changed his mind, admitted to being wrong and moved on.

What would you want to happen instead? That we cancel people, because they have an opinion we don’t like?

he was just trying to keep his job

What job? The position at his foundation that he does for free? If he only cared about keeping it, why did he quit 2 days later?

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Why don’t you include the more recent postings in which he states his opinion has changed?

Because he is biased.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

This is something he mentioned literally a few times between 2003 and 2013 (and he talks about a lot of stuff - check stallman.org) and he doesn’t even believe anymore. In 2019 he said that it was something he used to believe, but he realised he was wrong. You can read it on Wikipedia (unfortunately I can’t find the original source for the quote right now): en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Stallman#Controvers…

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Unfortunately it doesn’t seem like it. Between 2003 and 2013 he really used to believe that pedophilia doesn’t harm children. But he really only mentioned it a few times and hadn’t talked about it again until 2019 when it was brought up again. He said then that he had changed his mind since and that he was wrong (en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Stallman#Controvers…).

I don’t think we should cancel people for believing something stupid 10 years ago, but his haters love to use this. Just like they like to misquote him or spread fake rumors about him (stallmansupport.org). They are probably too angry to think clearly or verify information, but sometimes I wonder if for some of them it’s really only about his position on proprietary software (he wants to destroy it) and that’s why they wanted him removed from the FSF.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

So him changing his mind was fake, him leaving his own foundation was fake, is there anything that could prove you wrong then?

He was only sorry once he got a lot of flak for his pro child rape opinions.

No, he got in trouble, because he was misquoted by the media when he talked about Minsky. If he is such a liar, why didn’t he apologize for that, since that was actually what the drama was about? He could have said that he was wrong and that he no longer believed that. But for some weird reason he didn’t.

Put it this way - if Andrew Tate all of a sudden said that sexism is wrong and he’s sorry for his actions, only once YouTube started removing his videos, would you believe it to be genuine? Or just him trying to maintain his position?

So mentioning pedophilia 3 times over 10 years (2003-2013) makes it comparable to Andrew Tate?

It certainly seems like a convenient time to have a change of heart, no?

Let’s see. He mentions it for the last time in 2013. Then people dig up his old posts in 2019 and he responds. He had only 6 years to change his mind, very suspicious. Btw, do you know how people knew about those posts? They were on his public website. It was not a secret.

Sorry, I have no time for people who want to see children get raped.

You’re just salty, because we are going to destroy your precious little proprietary software and there is nothing you can do to stop it.

Freesoftwareenjoyer ,

Exactly. There have been things that I had believed for most of my life that were false. If we punish people for being wrong, then nobody will ever change their mind. The cost of doing so will be just too big.

Richard also doesn’t care if some subject seems disgusting or if his ideas seem radical to most people. He will talk about the ethics anyway, without any emotions attached. That’s what philosophers do.

They have to make it look like some conspiracy, a “cult”, etc., since they have nothing else that they could use. There are always people attracted by that sort of thinking and for them it will be enough. In 2019 we saw multiple Free Software projects joining a hate campaign against Stallman based on a blog post that misquoted him and another blog post with fake rumours. The second one was linked by the Software Freedom Conservancy (sfconservancy.org/…/rms-does-not-speak-for-us) and it contained stories like these:

I recall being told early in my freshman year “If RMS hits on you, just say ‘I’m a vi user’ even if it’s not true.”

I think all of those people are either blinded by hatred or have some other motive (in this case it’s hard for me to believe they are all this stupid and can’t recognise obvious trolling). Maybe some of them want proprietary software to exist and Richard’s ideas are too radical for them. But the only way they can fight him or the FSF is with lies.

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