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barsoap ,

sewage contamination in the water

Just like home!

blkpws ,

It’s Catalan signs, not Spanish.

ADTJ ,

The title says Spanish beaches, not Spanish language.

The signs are found on Spanish islands.

blkpws ,

Yes that’s why I want people to stop saying it is in Spanish, many comments here are talking like if the signs are in Spanish “the second or third language most talked” but it isn’t, there is no Spanish here… haha

tomba ,

ITT apparently everyone thinks Mallorca is in Mexico

charlytune ,
@charlytune@mander.xyz avatar

ITT people who didn’t click on the article and understand that this was produced as a humourous way of promoting the campaign against overtourism, which is a significant issue in the Balearics.

GBU_28 , (edited )

UHH THERES MEXICAN ON THE SIGN DUDE, DUH

/S

blkpws ,

I don’t see any Spanish on the sign, only English and Catalan words.

GBU_28 ,

Sarcasm missed.

Lack of critical reading strikes again. I’ll edit with the /s

blkpws ,

Well, you also assume people know what “/s” is… I never used Reddit, but I suppose this is something common on Reddit users? idk

GBU_28 ,

Well I was fucked from the starting line cause I assumed the full caps, blatantly idiotic statement would come across as sarcasm but hey here I am

stopthatgirl7 OP ,
@stopthatgirl7@kbin.social avatar

You’d be surprised. I thought someone was being sarcastic when they were talking about the “shamdemic,” only to find out no, they were completely serious. There are people on here who would say that in all seriousness.

GBU_28 ,

I’m gonna edit to make it even more idiotic

blkpws ,

I still don’t understand why you need to be sarcastic… what’s the point?

GBU_28 ,

Sarcasm is a natural part of human interaction.

It’s not the core part of conversation, or information transfer, but is natural to all cultures.

Cya

blkpws ,

But I mean, why doing that here? xD It is not even Spanish, Mallorca is full Catalan place.

PowerCrazy ,

Seems a bit racist and xenophobic to me, not to mention the undermining of the societal trust that is required for warning signs to work at all.

shadysus ,

Yea especially when tourists often don’t know about the local risks. Warning signs are mostly for people who aren’t from a particular area

Don’t want a ‘boy who cried wolf’ situation

jmcs ,

On the flip side tourists are making entire regions unlivable for the natives through exploitation of economical inequality.

PowerCrazy ,

100% But that could certainly be ameliorated through proper Spanish governmental policy no?

GBU_28 ,

The local government sought this out via policy, now they need to undo it.

If you tell people “this is a great place to party” they’re gonna, and they’re not gonna go home when you’re ready for bed.

explodicle ,

The latter really jumped out at me. I’ve definitely heard more than once “These careless tourists just ignored the signs!”

Madison_rogue ,
@Madison_rogue@kbin.social avatar

I think it funny that there’s an assumption in this thread that these posters are aimed at U.S. tourists when visitors from the U.K. outnumber the Americans by a factor of six to one.

P1r4nha ,

People in this threat also don’t seem to realize how the island of Mallorca is full of foreigners, even some just living there, but nobody speaking Spanish. In fact it’s probably easier to get around with German or English in the touristic parts of Mallorca.

This is not about some poor US tourist who wasn’t good enough in school back home to learn Spanish. It’s about huge crowds of rowdy UK and German tourists who go to “Malle” every year for partying and getting piss drunk without any consideration of the locals.

Skunk ,

Locals sometimes call it “the German island of Mallorca”

sab ,

Germans also refer to it as the 17th Bundesland. A Bundesland is to Germany what a State is to the US.

NuPNuA ,

To be fair, they spent years encouraging that kind of tourism and are no annoyed that they’ve got to popular. As the article points out it represents 75% of their economic activity so they’d be buggered if everyone just said, fine we’ll go somewhere else then.

derGottesknecht ,

Nah, not really. They want to change from party tourism, which is concentrated on one small area to a more distributed culture tourism. Those tourist spend twice as much and not only in the big clubs but on small shops all around the island. So they have a plan and it makes sense.

GBU_28 ,

Sounds like the role of the government to shape the tourist visa availability

derGottesknecht ,

Spain is in the EU, so no visa necessary for tourists.

GBU_28 ,

Sounds like the government needs to reconsider that

HobbitFoot ,

So Spain should leave the EU?

GBU_28 ,

Obviously not. Why would the only options be zero tourism controls or leave the EU?

So many people here can only consider black and white, it’s such limited thinking.

HobbitFoot ,

How do you “control” tourism?

GBU_28 ,

Visas, residency/rental restrictions, curfews, noise ordinances, non local surcharges, resident member beaches (membership fulfilled by residency), or a hundred other things

Edit: example: in palm springs, you cannot have any outdoor music or elevated noise as a non resident.

If you do, you can be evicted from your rental same day

HobbitFoot ,

Visas only work for UK tourists side they aren’t in the EU; Spain and Germany are both in the Schengen Zone so there isn’t even a border to check for passports. Also, because Spain is in the EU, it may not be legal for them to provide pricing that discriminates between locals and EU tourists.

You can try to restrict the rental supply or make the area not as fun for tourists, but you can’t just put up a border unless you want to leave the EU.

GBU_28 ,

Good thing I didn’t say “put up a border” then huh 🤔.

HobbitFoot ,

How do visas work without a border?

GBU_28 ,

Hotels and rentals require they are filled out, either there, or ahead of time.

HobbitFoot ,

Visas are the permission a government gives to non-citizens to enter their borders. This competency has been given to the EU to manage as part of the Schengen Area, which is a visa-free zone for all EU citizens.

How is a group of towns going to start restricting access to their communities without seeing up a border?

And why would a German doesn’t need a visa to visit Spain, why would a hotel ask for something they don’t have?

GBU_28 ,

When I, as an American, arrive at a hotel or rental in Mexico, I must present, or at that time process a visa entry form. That and my passport are logged by the provider.

One can assume they file that form with the government.

If I try to book further stays, beyond the allowable limit, the booking would be blocked, and I would be in trouble with the government / informed I need to leave promptly.

Think more flexibly dude, other places are already handling this.

Because you are so rigid in your thinking, let’s drop the word “visa” and construct a new idea (uh oh!) And call it a “tourism allowance”

HobbitFoot ,

When I, as an American, arrive at a hotel or rental in Mexico…

When you cross a border.

When you, as an American, travel to Florida, do you need a visa?

GBU_28 ,

Hardly the same…the Schengen zone is not a “United States”.

Further, I’m all set here cause you clearly want to just jerk off on the idea that existing law doesn’t allow for improvements on the system, when I’m clearly discussing moderate, wellness based changes to particularly impacted areas.

If this is how everyone involved.thinks, enjoy your puking tourists in silence

HobbitFoot ,

What is the Schengen Area and what does it do?

GBU_28 ,

Apparently pack tourists on a Mallorcan beach, much to my not-concern-at-all 😉. Apparently you too

HobbitFoot ,

That isn’t what I’m arguing. I’m just aware of European law.

stopthatgirl7 OP ,
@stopthatgirl7@kbin.social avatar

That’s not how the EU works. The EU allows freedom of movement from any member state to another. You don’t need a visa, or even a passport, to go across borders in the EU; you just go. Be it for tourism or working.

Rev3rze ,

One time I went to a bar in Mallorca, asked “dos cervezas, por favor” and the guy went: “Was? Zwei bier??”

It was surreal to realise that nobody there actually spoke any Spanish. Outside of the tourist traps Mallorca still has some authenticity here and there but it’s like the locals just hide in the shadows for the most part.

TheOctonaut ,

Are you counting by individuals or by volume?

(sorry)

Madison_rogue ,
@Madison_rogue@kbin.social avatar

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tourism_in_Spain

No worries. There’s a chart on the Wikipedia page above. The U.K. boasts over 18 million tourists per year while the U.S. is just over 3 million.

charlytune ,
@charlytune@mander.xyz avatar

I’m surprised there’s that many Americans tbh, I wouldn’t have thought it would be on their radar, I think of Mallorca as a package holiday destination for Western Europeans.

Madison_rogue ,
@Madison_rogue@kbin.social avatar

The tourism figures were for the totality of visitors to Spain, not to Mallorca specifically.

charlytune ,
@charlytune@mander.xyz avatar

Ahhh ok that makes more sense. They probably tend to go to Madrid, Barcelona, Granada etc.

nxfsi ,

Haha amerifat joke funny

GBU_28 ,

Lol but the gap is closing, US is 36 % obese and uk 27%.

fubo , (edited )

Hmm. Consider what folks would think if someone put up signs in Spanish and English on a US beach, where the Spanish text had scary (and false) warnings and the English text did not.

Lemmylefty ,
@Lemmylefty@lemmy.world avatar

There isn’t a large influx of Spanish speaking tourists who demand that the locals speak in their language in the US. This is more akin to a shopkeeper blaring speakers with high pitched tones that only teenagers can hear.

probablyaCat ,

You're fucking kidding right? Spanish is the second most spoken language in the US. It is the second largest first language as well. It is the second largest monolingual language.

I'm all for multiculturalism. I'm an immigrant. But let us not live in a pretend world.

Lemmylefty ,
@Lemmylefty@lemmy.world avatar

What you’ve said is true, but it doesn’t negate my point: the frustration felt by locals dealing with entitled tourists demanding their language be accommodated. The US doesn’t have a similar problem to Spain on that front.

PowerCrazy ,

The US has the world’s largest spanish speaking country sharing a 2000mile land border from coast to coast with it. Do you think that Mexican’s don’t travel to the America? What is exactly disqualifies the above sentiment from applying to America, vs applying to Spain?

regul ,

When Mexicans travel to the US they don’t demand that everyone else speak Spanish.

PowerCrazy ,

Why would UK tourists be uniquely entitled compared to any other nationality?

regul ,

I guess you’d have to ask them.

AGTMADCAT ,

Have you met Brittons? Especially the kind that typically go on package holidays to Spain?

monsoonstorm ,

Eh… it’s probably not so much that they are demanding their language be spoken…

More a case of the tourists are probably being dickheads in general and the locals have had enough of their shit. That and the locals would like to be able to enjoy their own beach without having to wade through masses of tourists.

NuPNuA ,

I mean, it depends where you go in Spain right. If you’re working in an office in Madrid and someone gets annoyed that you don’t speak English that’s one thing, if you’re working a restaurant in an area that makes all its money from tourism, then surely it makes sense to make those people bringing in the dough feel comfortable.

Franzia ,

You’re so right but we’ve also codified that in the US. We intentionally have no official language and provide our legal and government documents in more than one language. This is a unique quality and knowing the official language is a cultural and legal expectation in many other countries.

sab ,

A little context: There's more than 40 million native Spanish speakers in the US, whose language has the same legal standing as English. That's more people than the entire state of California. More than ten million more than Texas.

Whoever assumes they're all "illegal" or "unwanted" immigrants should take a moment to reflect on why the cities of California have all these strange names like "Los Angeles" and "San Diego". They were there before the English speaking. And we all know who were there before them, making the whole "immigrant" argument kind of moot anyway.

Zippy , (edited )

Actually Spanish is the largest spoken ‘native’ language in the world. English is the largest spoken language total because so many people have it as a second language.

Edit. I have to make a correction. Mandarin is the most spoken. I had not looked this up in about ten years but they combined two dialects to make near a billion native speakers. Spanish next at 485 million then English at 380.

burningmatches ,

That is definitely not true.

Zippy ,

Actually you are correct. It is Mandarin than Spanish than English. For native speakers that is. A couple of Mandarin dialects were combined since I last looked.

NuPNuA ,

Where else is Spanish a “native” language other than Spain? It’s spoken across South America and some of Asia, but that’s due to colonialism the same as how English spread. The natives of South America didn’t speak Spanish before they turned up.

Zippy ,

Lots in the US speak it as their first language. I have not seen it broken down or country. There are 485 million people that speak Spanish as their native language. English comes in third at 380 million.

sab ,

While your correction is important, the whole idea of Mandarin being one language is also a bit messed up. The different Spanish speakers of the world will have a much easier time getting together and understanding each other than the various groups of Mandarin speakers.

Where one language ends and another begins is largely political, which makes it difficult to make a fair count.

blkpws ,

No Spanish here, it’s Catalan…

blkpws , (edited )

Those signs are written in Catalan, not Spanish. And they do that because of the mass tourist invasion. (the article already says all this)

Spzi ,

Under an image of a swimmer surrounded by jellyfish, it reads: “Open beach. Not to jellyfish or foreigners.”

Another, this one apparently related to a rockfall, points out that there is no landslide but that the danger is due to overcrowding.

teft ,
@teft@startrek.website avatar

deleted_by_author

    •
    Sentinian ,

    On the topic, what do you recommend to learn another language for a trip. I have one next year and wanna try to be decent

    teft ,
    @teft@startrek.website avatar

    deleted_by_author

    •
    monsoonstorm ,

    Rofl…

    Let me guess… you’re American and ‘travel’ to you is a quick trip across the border

    I’m not sure how many Cambodians are wandering around rural UK, and I’m fairly certain that Duolingo doesn’t have Khmer.

    Guess I’d better cancel my trip.

    teft , (edited )
    @teft@startrek.website avatar

    deleted_by_author

    •
    monsoonstorm ,

    Ahhh it’s a lot easier to learn through immersion if you live there ;)

    (A Brit who has lived in two other countries). I’m well aware of the resources on the internet. I’m also aware of the fact that this issue with the signs has bugger all to do with language barrier and everything to do with the people visiting being ignorant and inconsiderate tourists.

    You are better off brushing up on the culture than you are the language. Simply looking at the sign through your phone camera would automatically translate it for you - yet another internet resource ;)

    Franzia ,

    Immersion. News in target language. Childrens TV in target language. Besides that, any resource. After a month or even two of immersion only and intent listening, begin studying for real. Nit 5 minutes a day but rather 30 minutes. You can reach basic fluency in 6 - 9 months, and then before your trip ensure you learn more specific grammar and vocab in topics you feel you need.

    usrtrv ,

    The “learn a language before traveling” always seemed like gatekeeping to me. I’ve traveled a decent bit, and I would not have had the time to learn a dozen or so languages. Especially when you have to learn entire new writing systems. I’ll learn a little bit while I’m visiting because I’m immersing myself.

    if someone wants to study another language, all power to them. But it shouldn’t be a barrier from experiencing other cultures.

    teft ,
    @teft@startrek.website avatar

    deleted_by_author

    •
    usrtrv ,

    I’m not saying you shouldn’t try to learn language while you’re there, I’m saying the requirement of learning before you travel is counterintuitive for wanting people to experience other cultures. I think it’s detrimental to try to force or shame people into learning the language before travel, you’ll end up discouraging people from traveling. They’ll just stay in their own bubble and not experience other cultures.

    Cosmonauticus ,

    Yeah but that doesn’t really help if you’re planning on going through Europe where if you drive for 7 hours you can interact with three different languages and 5 different cultures. If you’re gracious, polite, and not a pain in the ass you should be able to move through a country without being spit on or treated as less than. Especially on a continent where the majority have some profencisy in English

    Of course this article is specifically talking about English and German tourist. The most loud and obnoxious (English lads) and arrogant (considered the most arrogant in the EU) Germans

    drmoose ,

    Learning a few phrases is not going to help you with the language barrier. Suggestion to become fluent enough for conversation before visiting a foreign country is just absurd lol

    It’s clear that ppl in this thread have never attempted to learn a foreign language as an adult huh

    teft ,
    @teft@startrek.website avatar

    deleted_by_author

    •
    magicalbeast69 ,

    Let me guess, it’s all use the same writing system, from the same background (germanic languages).

    RogueBanana ,

    I mean learning 2 languages isn’t hard but to learn one spending so much time to get fluent enough to converse just for your one week trip is just stupid on multiple levels

    monsoonstorm ,

    And they’ve probably never travelled outside of English speaking counties.

    I’d have to be a genius to speak the language of every country I’ve travelled to, and that’s ignoring the countries that have several distinct and active languages (looking at you, Austria…)

    monsoonstorm ,

    For shits and giggles I’m going to list the countries I’ve travelled to:

    France, Spain, Greece, Austria, Italy, Finland, UAE, Dubai, Qatar, India, Sri Lanka, Nepal, Cambodia, Vietnam, Thailand, China, Hong Kong, Macau, Singapore, Philippines, Palau, Malaysia, Indonesia - then Australia, US and Canada which don’t count for this I guess. I’m possibly missing one or two, I’m tired.

    So, I’m supposed to have learned the language, and respective writing systems, of each of these places before going there?

    I guess I should just quit my job and take up learning language full time…. Either that or just stay at home so that I don’t get ridiculed for being an ignorant tourist.

    probablyaCat ,

    So you'd be cool with people doing this in Spanish on Texas and Florida beaches right? And I mean people should definitely never travel to a foreign place without a decent grasp of the local language. Not like world exploration is something that can be a life altering experience. Or could help people empathize with different types of culture. Nope. Everyone should stay in their own little bubble. And honestly that applies to states, districts, etc. Hell even towns. Because Alabama and California are super different and have different customs. But even Houston and Austin Texas are way too different to go into each other's areas without having a firm grasp on local customs. Barcelona and Aragon are so very different that many of them don't even speak the same language. One of my neighbors and I don't get along real well. Perhaps we should really only stay in our houses.

    Franzia ,

    No, because in the US we have a different legal and cultural stance on language.

    Gsus4 , (edited )
    @Gsus4@feddit.nl avatar

    How much is “a bit” ? I’ve got the hiragana, the katakana, a few Kanji and all the korewa, sonowa etc grammar rules. Will it be enough to visit Tokyo? No. But the way it works is sometimes a stupid attempt at speaking will trigger the “poor stupid helpless tourist” reaction that gets you help, which you won’t get if you don’t make yourself “vulnerable” as people say today, but do the opposite: implicitly demand that others make themselves vulnerable to you.

    Franzia ,

    Amazing amount of strawmans saying they need to learn the entire language and not a small amount of it, as you clearly stated.

    SymphonicResonance ,
    @SymphonicResonance@lemmy.world avatar

    The small text is in Catalan (not Spanish). I’m curious how many people learn more than Spanish before going to Spain .

    NuPNuA ,

    Yeah, how dare they expect one of Europes most popular holiday destinations to make things easy for people speaking the de facto Lingua Franca worldwide.

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