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bappity , in Java
@bappity@lemmy.world avatar

the programming language Java meaning coffee is perfect because, like coffee, it tastes like shit but gets the job done

MrGeekman ,

I think you need to try some lighter-roasted, higher-quality beans which were roasted fairly recently and only grind them a day or so before you use them. There are also different brewing methods and coffee/water ratios that you can try.

mestari ,

I love and consume lots of coffee but I sincerely believe it only tastes good because I associate the taste with the boost it gives. Exactly like cigarettes taste tolerable, good even, when you smoke them regularly.

MrGeekman ,

If you don’t know what you’re drinking, it’s probably dark roast. Dark roast is like charcoal compared to light roast.

The coffee most folks use (i.e. Folgers, Maxwell House) is low-quality coffee made in haste to keep the price low enough for folks to be willing to buy it. They only offer darker roasts because disguise the inferior nature of the beans, or rather the inferior process. The unfortunate truth is that good coffee costs more to process because it takes longer to process and most folks don’t want to spend that much on coffee. So, you get what you pay for.

cia ,

It is shit, Austin

MrGeekman , in Java

Try Math.round. It’s been like ten years since I used Java, but I’m pretty sure it’s in there.

Acetamide , in Java
@Acetamide@lemmy.world avatar

AFAIK most typed languages have this behaviour.

Lmaydev ,

Because ints are way smaller. Over a certain value it would always fail.

larvyde ,

Yea but at those values floating points can’t represent fractions anyway

Lmaydev ,

Exactly. So if cast to int you’d either get an error or 0 for everything above a certain value.

MrGeekman , in Always write comments

Yeah, he’ll beat deadlines by a longshot.

iByteABit ,

I wish, companies just expect you to write garbage code as quick as possible, only to create tens of bugs afterwards that will take way more time than it would if they had left you enough time to do it correctly

jayrhacker , in Java
@jayrhacker@kbin.social avatar

It's the same in the the standard c library, so Java is being consistent with a real programming language…

idunnololz ,
@idunnololz@lemmy.world avatar

Implying java isn’t a real programming language. Smh my head.

BlackVenom ,

Nice ATM machine.

idunnololz ,
@idunnololz@lemmy.world avatar

Smhmh my head

Glome ,

Java has many abstractions that can be beneficial in certain circumstances. However, it forces a design principle that may not work best in every situation.

I.e. inheritance can be both unnatural for the programmer to think in, and is not representative of how data is stored and manipulated on a computer.

whats_a_refoogee ,

You don’t have to use inheritance with Java. In fact, in most cases it’s better that you don’t. Practically all of the Java standard library doesn’t require the use of inheritance, same with most modern libraries.

On the contrary, I think inheritance is a very natural way to think. However, that doesn’t translate into readable and easy to maintain code in the vast majority of the cases.

I am not sure what you mean by how it’s stored or manipulated on a computer. A garbage collected language like Java manages the memory for you. It doesn’t really care if your code is using inheritance or not. And unless you’re trying to squeeze the last drops of performance out of your code, the memory layout shouldn’t be on your mind.

shotgun_crab ,

Composition + Interfaces is love

Von_Broheim ,

People hating on Java because “inheritance” usually don’t know the difference between inheritance and polymorphism. Stuff like composition and dependency inversion is black magic to them.

lightsecond ,

We’re gate-keeping the most mainstream programming language now? Next you’ll say English isn’t a real language because it doesn’t have a native verb tense to express hearsay.

kaba0 ,

And it is not forced at all. Noone holds a gun to your head to write extends. “Favor composition over inheritance” has been said as a mantra for at least a decade

jayrhacker ,
@jayrhacker@kbin.social avatar

Java is, of course, Turing Complete™️ but when you have to hide all the guns and knives in jdk.internal.misc.Unsafe something is clearly wrong.

kaba0 ,

Memory is an implementation detail. You are interested in solving problems, not pushing bytes around, unless that is the problem itself. In 99% of the cases though, you don’t need guns and knives, it’s not a US. school (sorry)

LeFantome ,

I do not like Java but this is a strange argument. The people that invented Java felt that most of the C language should be wrapped in unsafe.

Opinions can vary but saying Java is not a real language is evidence free name calling. One could just as easily say that any language that does not allow you to differentiate between safe and unsafe baheviour is incomplete and not a “real” language. It is not just the Java and C# people that may say this. As a C fan, I am sure you have heard Rust people scoff at C as a legacy language that was fine for its day but clearly outclassed now that the “real” languages have arrived. Are you any more correct than they are?

RoyaltyInTraining , in Java
@RoyaltyInTraining@lemmy.world avatar

Makes sense, cause double can represent way bigger numbers than integers.

pomodoro_longbreak ,
@pomodoro_longbreak@sh.itjust.works avatar

Yeah it makes sense to me. You can always cast it if you want an int that bad. Hell just wrap the whole function with your own if it means that much to you

(Not you, but like a hypothetical person)

lysdexic ,

Also, double can and does in fact represent integers exactly.

Killing_Spark ,

Only to 2^54. The amount of integers representable by a long is more. But it can and does represent every int value correctly

parlaptie ,

*long long, if we’re gonna be taking about C types. A long is commonly limited to 32 bits.

Aux ,

C is irrelevant because this post is about Java and in Java long is 64 bits.

vox ,
@vox@sopuli.xyz avatar

you should never be using these types in c anyway, (u?)int(8/16/32/64)_t are way more sane

karlthemailman ,

How does that work? Is it just because double uses more bits? I’d imagine for the same number of bits, you can store more ints than doubles (assuming you want the ints to be exact values).

nile ,
karlthemailman , (edited )

No, I get that. I’m sure the programming language design people know what they are doing. I just can’t grasp how a double (which has to use at least 1 bit to represent whether or not there is a fractional component) can possibly store more exact integer vales than an integer type of the same length (same number of bits).

It just seems to violate some law of information theory to my novice mind.

towerful ,

I’m going to guess here (cause I feel this community is for learning)…
Integers have exactness. Doubles have range.
So if MAX_INT + 1 is possible, then ~(MAX_INT + 1) is probably preferable to an overflow or silent MIN_INT.

But Math.ceil probably expects a float, because it is dealing with decimals (or similar). If it was an int, rounding wouldn’t be required.
So if Math.ceil returned and integer, then it could parse a float larger than INT_MAX, which would overflow an int (so error, or overflow). Or just return a float

EvilHankVenture ,

It doesn’t store more values bit for bit, but it can store larger values.

karlthemailman , (edited )

I don’t think that’s possible. Representing more exact ints means representing larger ints and vice versa. I’m ignoring signed vs. unsigned here as in theory both the double and int/long can be signed or unsigned.

Edit: ok, I take this back. I guess you can represent larger values as long as you are ok that they will be estimates. Ie, double of N (for some very large N) will equal double of N + 1.

Akagigahara ,

I would need to look into the exact difference of double vs integer to know, but a partially educated guess is that they are referring to Int32 vs double and not Int64, aka long. I did a small search and saw that double uses 32 bits for the whole numbers and the others for the decimal.

karlthemailman ,

Yeah, that was my guess too. But that just means they could return a long (or whatever the 64 bit int equivalent in java is) instead of an int.

Akagigahara ,

Okay, so I dug in a bit deeper. Doubles are standardized as a 64 bit bundle that is divided into 1 signed bit, 11 exponetioal bits and 52 bits for decimal. It’s quite interesting. As to how it works indepth, I probably will try to analyze a bit conversion if I can try something

unawareallium ,

You can think of a double as having a fixed precision, but, in contrast to an integer, this precision can be moved over the decimal point depending on the value you want to represent. Therefore, despite representing floating-point numbers, a double still has discrete steps determined by its binary representation of 64 bits. If the value of a double gets larger, it reaches a point where the smallest difference between two subsequent doubles is greater than one. For float (32 bit), you reach this point at 16777216. The next larger number to be represented as a float is 16777218 (i.e., +2).

Here is a nice online tool that demonstrates this (and contains much more information on the encoding of floating-point numbers): www.h-schmidt.net/FloatConverter/IEEE754.html

karlthemailman ,

I agree with all that. But I’m talking about exact integer values as mentioned in the parent.

I just think this has to be true: count(exact integers that can be represented by a N bit floating point variable) < count(exact integers that can be represented by an N bit int type variable)

whats_a_refoogee ,

It doesn’t. A double is a 64 bit value while an integer is 32 bit. A long is a 64 bit signed integer which stores more exact integer numbers than a double.

LeFantome ,

Technically, a double stores most integers exactly ( up until a certain value ) and then approximations of integers of much larger sizes. A long stores all its integers exactly but cannot handle values nearly as large.

For most real world data ranges, they are both going to store integers exactly.

nile ,

Oh now I get what you mean, and like others mentioned, yeah it’s more bits :)

fsxylo ,

Also because if you are dealing with a double, then you’re probably dealing with multiple, or doing math that may produce a double. So returning a double just saves some effort.

disencentivized ,

Why not just return a long?

thegamer ,

A double could also be NaN and any operations with NaN should return NaN afaik

Beanie ,

doubles can hold numbers way larger than even 64-bit ints

RoyaltyInTraining ,
@RoyaltyInTraining@lemmy.world avatar

A double can represent numbers up to ± 1.79769313486231570x10^308, or roughly 18 with 307 zeroes behind it. You can’t fit that into a long, or even 128 bits. Even though rounding huge doubles is pointless, since only the first dozen digits or so are saved, using any kind of Integer would lead to inconsistencies, and thus potentially bugs.

korstmos , in Java

Doubles have a much higher max value than ints, so if the method were to convert all doubles to ints they would not work for double values above 2^31-1.

(It would work, but any value over 2^31-1 passed to such a function would get clamped to 2^31-1)

affiliate ,

what about using two ints

idunnololz ,
@idunnololz@lemmy.world avatar

What about two int64_t

affiliate ,

yeah that would be pretty effective. could also go to three just to be safe

hariette ,
@hariette@artemis.camp avatar

Make it four, just to be even

korstmos ,

A BigDecimal?

karlthemailman ,

So why not return a long or whatever the 64 bit int equivalent is?

korstmos ,

Because even a long (64-bit int) is too small :)
A long can hold 2^64-1 = 1.84E19
A double can hold 1.79E308

Double does some black magic with an exponent, and can hold absolutely massive numbers!

Double also has some situations that it defines as "infinity", a concept that does not exist in long as far as I know (?)

whats_a_refoogee ,

To avoid a type conversion that might not be expected. Integer math in Java differs from floating point math.

Math.floor(10.6) / Math.floor(4.6) = 2.5 (double)

If floor returned a long, then

Math.floor(10.6) / Math.floor(4.6) = 2 (long)

If your entire code section is working with doubles, you might not like finding Math.floor() unexpectedly creating a condition for integer division and messing up your calculation. (Have fun debugging this if you’re not actively aware of this behavior).

parlaptie ,

But there’s really no point in flooring a double outside of the range where integers can be represented accurately, is there.

WtfEvenIsExistence , in Shit Happens

Website down? Watch me travel into another one of the many universe instances of the multiverse fediverse.

impossible_silver , in Always write comments

Is the Pic AI generated? Lol

BluesF ,

I wouldn’t be surprised if the whole meme was. What on earth does the picture have to do with the text lol

Zorque ,

Have you not heard of rubber duck debugging?

VigilantQuasar ,

The image is definitely AI, but I assume the rubber duckies are in reference to this en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rubber_duck_debugging

TheGreenGolem ,

Rubber duck debugging

BluesF ,

Tangentially related at best.

name_NULL111653 ,

‘Rubber duck’ debugging is a thing…

icepuncher69 ,

It just looks silly

Cat ,
@Cat@kbin.social avatar

Yes it is. Look at the eyes on the ducks. Also the guy's hands and nose. Dead giveaways.

cake ,
@cake@lemmings.world avatar

Alien ducks

mriormro ,
@mriormro@lemmy.world avatar

Why tf does someone need ai to make memes?! Jesus Christ…

Sotuanduso ,

You expect a meme maker to photograph that themselves?

BoiLudens , in Shit Happens

So I wanna a report on performance.

Sir this is one endpoint with no batch capabilities of which I have no access to change. There is no “performance”

i_need_a_vacation , in Always write comments
@i_need_a_vacation@kbin.social avatar

Yeah, this grinds my gears. I use to comment my code when I'm working on my personal projects, then at the office I have to waste time trying to decipher my boss's code because he won't comment absolutely anything.

That plus the ridiculous deadlines means that I don't have time to comment my own code, fast forward several months later without working on a particular project and now I have to decipher his and my own code.

One day he actually had the nerve to say to me: 'Yeah, you should comment your code'. How I refrained of commiting murder that day I don't know.

wdx ,

Could a pre-commit hook have caused the murder to not get committed?

UsernameIsTooLon , in Always write comments

Oh no. 2 weeks ago ThioJoe created a program that allows you to AI generate memes and this looks scarily similar.

PipedLinkBot ,

Here is an alternative Piped link(s): piped.video/7LBLESXAJh0

Piped is a privacy-respecting open-source alternative frontend to YouTube.

I’m open-source, check me out at GitHub.

sj_zero , in Always write comments

Don't write comments for someone else. Write comments for yourself because you might write a million lines of code and then be told you need to do something to this now ancient legacy code at 3am because some nightmare scenario happens and you need to get it fixed and deployed before they'll let you go back to sleep.

rh4c6f ,

This is why I leave my phone in the basement when I get home.

sj_zero ,

This man works

rev , in Java

python is like this also. I don’t remember a language that returned ints

shotgun_crab ,

Python 2 returns a float, Python 3 returns an int iirc.

sj_zero , in Shit Happens

Can confirm. Sauce: Posting from my instance, it was down yesterday.

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