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rbesfe ,

Oppression Olympics

x4740N ,

It wasn’t even the last supper, it was referencing Greek stuff from what I have heard

clot27 ,
@clot27@lemm.ee avatar

Religious bigots offended, yet again

xenoclast ,

Let them cry.

glizzyguzzler ,
@glizzyguzzler@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

Dipshits don’t even get it’s this based on this painting musee-magnin.fr/en/node/19 which is in a French museum, about the gods of Olympus, and includes the lyre you see in the recreation. It’s not the last supper which is in Italy and not in France. Similar framing of course - clearly on purpose - but who cares. What dumbasses, outrage machine go burrr

jimmycrackcrack ,

Imagine you’re the master race, confident and strong and then some people wear different clothes than you expected on TV and your whole world is just shattered lol.

bcgm3 ,

Some people really just wake up looking for something to get rankled about.

Tinks ,

I find it funny that this is what they’re up in arms about, not the happy little threesome. I saw it and was shocked that NBC actually aired it, because that’s just much too controversial for we puritanical Americans to handle.

WiseWoodchuck ,

NBC’s coverage only detracted from the ceremony. They cut most of the fashion show. And the hosts did nothing to explain or put the various acts in cultural context.

For those who don’t like the queer fashion show, no one is forcing you to watch it. It’s a cultural expression of the host country. It’s like going to Gramany and hating the beer or the Netherlands and hating the tulips.

aidan ,

It’s like going to Gramany and hating the beer or the Netherlands and hating the tulips.

Happily, alcoholism bad and the tulip bubble was dumb.

Halosheep ,

Some people just live in anger, don’t they?

aidan ,

It was a joke

Halosheep ,

Guess we all missed the joke, sorry fam

LaterRedditor ,

olympic is now cancelled.

eramseth ,

Pretty sure when I counted, the numbers were off. Not even 13 people in the supposed last supper shot.

Flanders_Poppy ,

I wish conservative Christians were educated enough to know what a bacchanalia is.

nieminen ,

Interesting (had to Google it)

some_guy ,

bacchanalia

I literally looked up this word when it came up in a book on Friday. What timing. Also, Type O Negative ftw.

Alenalda ,

Only time I’ve heard it in use is in the film, A Christmas Story.

mPony ,

I wish conservative Christians were educated

SSJMarx ,

I wish conservatives were educated

RagingRobot ,

They got a bbw Jesus!

andrewta ,

Let me explain it this way. If I am going to sit somewhere, if we as left leaning individuals are going to sit and say “it’s not what you say it’s how others take it and be sensitive to that” then we need to follow the same rules.

If I tell a joke or do something that others take offense to, then maybe it wasn’t ok to say that, or to have done that.

If I am going to tell people to pay attention to how others respond to what they are doing or saying. Then i need to follow those same rules.

It is not ok for me to tell another person, you can’t say that (what ever that thing is) because of how others are viewing it or how it makes them feel. Then turn around and say but i can do what ever I want even if it offends others.

It is not relevant if we are talking about drag, or trans people, or black people, or minorities, or white people, or religions. What is relevant is that we are running around saying “you can’t do that because it is offending others”. Yet look through this thread, go all the way up to my top comment and look at all the responses. Notice something? People are acting like this was totally ok even though there are a shit ton of people that it offended.

So it’s ok for the left to put in rules that says “you can’t do that because it is offending others, but we the left can do what ever we want”. That makes sense?

and you are telling me to change my tune?

return2ozma OP ,
@return2ozma@lemmy.world avatar

It wasn’t the last supper or anything with Christianity. Maybe if they were actually educated instead of being anti-schooling…

x.com/AukeHoekstra/status/1817569151432458399

EatATaco ,

I would like to hear from the actual people, rather than some historian just coming up with something that could be an excuse.

Additionally, I regularly go to museums, I took art elective art classes in both HS and college, including art history, and I’ve never seen this painting. Im willing to bed 99% of people haven’t even heard of the artist. So attacking people for not making this connection ss “ignorant” seems to be a bit much.

return2ozma OP ,
@return2ozma@lemmy.world avatar

Here you go…

Conservative critics widely denounced the act, featuring Katerine lounging on a table surrounded by drag queens, as mocking the Last Supper. But director Thomas Jolly told BFM-TV on Sunday that his inspiration was not the iconic New Testament scene painting by Leonardo da Vinci, but “a pagan feast linked” to the gods of Olympus.

“I’m a bit of an exhibitionist,” said Katerine, 55, whose modesty as Dionysus, the god of fertility, ecstasy and wine, was covered by a meager garland of leaves and fruit.

nbcnews.com/…/french-entertainer-performed-blue-g…

EatATaco ,

Thanks.

jispal01 ,

I saw people pissed off about this on social media last night. I didn’t even really understand what they were upset about. Other than the fact that it’s a handful of people sitting at a table, I didn’t really see any similarities with the Last Supper. Christians don’t own the concept of people sitting on the same side of a table.

TV shows put all the people on one side of a dinner table all the time - because of camera/blocking reasons. Is every episode of Eight Is Enough blasphemous?

WanderingVentra ,

Is there a way to read the thread without having an X account? Because all I see is the first post saying it’s supposed to be the other picture and they don’t look that similar to me. I’m guessing he goes on to explain some of the context? In other self replies that I can’t read?

I wish people would stop using X/Twitter because of this kind of shit. Everyone needs to move over to Mastadon or at least Blue Sky, something I can read without having an account and being logged in.

return2ozma OP ,
@return2ozma@lemmy.world avatar

Yes, here’s the unroll…

threadreaderapp.com/…/1817569151432458399.html

WanderingVentra ,

Thanks!

aidan ,

Maybe if they were actually educated instead of being anti-schooling…

Half of “Against School” is incredibly based, half is a bit rambly.

BallsandBayonets ,

Religion has been behind so much discrimination over the centuries. I, as a leftist, will never care to not offend religion.

Also I’m very strongly of the opinion that being a leftist is about ending capitalism. The acceptance/bigotry spectrum is a different axis. And while ending bigotry is an important fight, it’s a separate one from ending capitalism.

aidan ,

Religion is not and has not been particularly different from ideology historically.

Online Marxism really demonstrates that with the read “theory”(scripture). But of course it’s just as true on the right, not only for religious texts.

ImADifferentBird ,
@ImADifferentBird@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

You’re right, what’s good for the goose is good for the gander. And in that spirit, I will treat these complaints exactly the way right wingers treat it when others point out that they’re being offensive and gross.

In other words, I will mock you for being offended and suggest that you’re trying to kill free speech any time you try to voice your point of view.

fukurthumz420 ,

hard disagree. you assume that if you give them the same respect that you ask for, that they will give it back in return. you’re talking about christians. they just want to subjugate everyone else to their standard of living.

nope. fuck them. they are the enemy. they are the barrier to living in a better world. they do not understand cultural differences and don’t want to. they are a problem to be solved, not a class of people who must be tolerated. goose and gander thinking will get you nowhere.

andrewta ,

so because I’m a christian … it’s fuck me? ignoring the fact that i do my best to treat everyone equally. ignoring the fact that I want a constitutional amendment that says “on average for a given voting precinct the people shouldn’t be standing in line for 8 hours, the average should only be 30 minutes so minorities aren’t disenfranchised from voting” … ignoring the fact that I believe everyone should have the right to marry who ever they choose (as long as they are consenting adults… your statement is

“you’re talking about christians, they just want to subjugate everyone else… fuck them”

that’s also ignoring the fact that I do not believe that the bible should be taught in public school.

you didn’t say some christians are that way … you basically said all christians. … so it’s fuck me. … nice way to enter the conversation there.

fukurthumz420 ,

ACAB

DmMacniel ,
@DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

It is not relevant if we are talking about drag, or trans people, or black people, or minorities, or white people, or religions.

then why are you doing that?

also, username checks out.

Cethin ,

If the offense is that something exists, it’s not worth bowing down to. If the offense is that it is potentially harmful or dangerous, then it should be considered. Conservatives don’t get to just say they’re offended by others and get them to disappear.

NikkiDimes ,

Nah en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paradox_of_tolerance

aidan ,

Btw, someone saying something in the past doesn’t make it true.

NikkiDimes ,

Well, that’s a horrible argument.

aidan ,

Paradox of tolerance doesn’t really have an argument other than it being declared “this is what happens when you tolerate intolerance”

NikkiDimes ,

You’re right. Let’s all hug some nazis

prole ,

Good point… So how does that relate to this thread?

funkless_eck ,

Why can’t drag queens portray the last supper, even make fun of it, when

a) Jeezy Creezy himself invited sex workers to his shin digs. Also cracked a few jokes himself (“Why were you looking for me? I was in my father’s house”)

b) veggie tales is about sentient vegetables giving Bible lessons, Narnia is about a fursona giving Bible lessons

c) if Jesus can take being crucified I imagine he can take a joke

Socsa ,

Paradox of tolerance. Christians are actively trying to invite violence against LGBT people by calling them groomers. That’s the basis of their outrage, so it is simple to dismiss it as hateful or inauthentic.

Gloomy ,
@Gloomy@mander.xyz avatar

I kind of see where you are coming from, but doesn’t it make a difference WHY somebody is offended?

If I, for eclxsmple, use the N-Word, the offence this rightfully causes is rooted in it being used to speak about slaves in the past. I can understand that. I understand why this could hurt black peoples feeling. So I don’t use it.

The root of offence on the Paris case seemes to be that some Christian Fundamentalist (wrongly) think that Drag-People imitated the last Supper. Their offence is based in them hating Drags. That is nothing I can emphatize with. So I don’t see their offence beeing justified, since It is rooted in hate.

Would they be offended if white males immitated the last supper during the ceremony? Possible, and if so then I’d be interested to hear on what basis, since the scene has been mimiced in pop culture a lot without it causing any offence (on a level that would have made it noticeable to me).

Ao that’s the difference. I don’t blindly stop to do things the left labels as offensive. But If I understand how and why it causes people harm using phrases or doing things then I might change my behaviour on that base. Not because “the left says so” but because I can emphatize and understand the point. In this case I can do neither.

prole , (edited )

Major false equivalency. One side is intentionally offending marginalized groups, knowing that they’re much more likely to commit suicide, etc. They only punch down. They literally think a significant number of normal, innocent people don’t have the right to exist and they base that belief on (I guess one of) the dumbest, most grotesquely disgusting holy books ever. And it’s not even a good story. None of them are any good.

The rest just want to be able to exist, and if criticizing the most popular religions in the world for teaching their followers that they shouldn’t be allowed to exist is offensive to them, well then I don’t know what to tell them.

See the difference? One group wants to eradicate entire groups of law-abiding, productive citizens because they have delusions that don’t comport with reality and are not compatible with modern society, the other is pointing that out and mocking them for it.

I would only say one of those things is actually offensive… Objectively. So I’m not sure why I should care if a conservative snowflake gets his coal rolled over it.

nimomycelium ,
@nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

deleted_by_moderator

    •
    sparkle , (edited )

    Are you seriously comparing clothing and makeup to skin color and ethnicity my guy?

    Blackface demonizes/makes fun of being black. Drag does not demonize femininity; quite the opposite actually. Your logic doesn’t logic.

    Considering you post a lot of porn of women with objectifying remarks all over your profile, it’s unsurprising you have misogynistic views… at least keep them to yourself man.

    nimomycelium , (edited )
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    deleted_by_moderator

    •
    Dkarma ,

    Not at all. Drag does not mock women. Guarantee you’re a dude.

    fukurthumz420 ,

    in some ways, drag does reduce a woman’s identity to just the clothes she wears and some makeup. he’s not completely wrong.

    sparkle ,

    No. He is completely wrong. Drag isn’t “reducing a woman’s identity” to anything, because femininity isn’t a woman’s identity. People who do drag aren’t pretending to be women. Drag partially exists to blur gender lines and challenge our perceptions of gender, and mostly exists because many people feel affirmed by femininity and are most comfortable when they’re participating in what we see as feminine culture.

    Cultural perceptions of femininity aren’t equivalent to womanhood. Femininity does not “belong” to women and masculinity does not “belong” to men. Imagine how insane it would be if we called women wearing pants and other clothes that used to be associated with men “blackface for men” lol.

    fukurthumz420 ,

    you have a point.

    NikkiDimes ,

    There it is. The dumbest comment I’ll read on the internet today. And it’s barely even noon.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    You obviously don’t proofread yours then.

    NikkiDimes ,

    Ratio.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    And I’m really not surprised by your response…

    Socsa ,

    Least braindead TERF

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    It’s amazing how far a culture can plummet.

    Cethin ,

    Yeah, we can have people like you not understanding things and you still get a voice. It’s pretty sad how low we’ve gotten.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    deleted_by_moderator

    •
    Cethin ,

    Ah, yes. People enjoying themselves and making art that hurts no one is degenerate. Please, oh enlightened one, what is the proper form art should take? Were Victorian plays with men playing female characters degenerate? What about the Greeks and the Romans (who I should mentioned loved to have sex with men frequently and with vigor)? What point in time was ideal humanity, and when did it start degenerating? Was it only when white men were in power in the US and women couldn’t voice an opinion and black people were property? Please, let me know which time period we should return to to make the sky daddy (or mommy) happy!

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    deleted_by_moderator

    •
    Cethin ,

    Of course, no real response other than dismissal. You’re the one who came here to claim some decline in civilization. I’m not the one who needs to calm down.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    deleted_by_moderator

    •
    nova_ad_vitum ,

    Case in point.

    Cethin ,

    You still haven’t answered the question. Which point in time are we degenerating from? Anyone can make an assertion. You can’t back yours up, which is why it is less than worthless.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    Not to know what happened before you were born is to remain always a child. Open any history book, perhaps “Mankind and Mother Earth” by Toynbee. Examine the rise, decline, and fall of any of the civilisation. Then come back.

    Cethin ,

    I do know history. That’s why I asked with very specific examples of time periods. I know the point of the comment is to be on the offensive because you don’t actually have an answer, but know that I see you.

    I know every civilization falls, because that’s a tautology. It has to be the case. That does not mean anything towards your point. The US must fall eventually, even if that’s just the heat death of the universe. Again, admitting this doesn’t provide any reason for why.

    Which civilization was the greatest, in your opinion, and at what time? I can promise you they were performing acts both of us would agree were horrible at that moment. “The past” isn’t the best time just because we are past it, and we aren’t necessarily in decline. That can only be decided in the distant future, and it won’t be because of drag shows. It’ll be because of actual policies.

    Dkarma ,

    Go read your Bible… then follow it

    nimomycelium , (edited )
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    deleted_by_moderator

    •
    Evilcoleslaw ,

    degeneracy

    There it is. Wannabe Nazi detected.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    The term is brandished around to such an extent it has no meaning.

    Olhonestjim , (edited )

    Nazis certainly would like everyone else to believe that.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/075c0b1c-82fa-4b5b-b46c-6109184d730b.jpeg

    Evilcoleslaw ,

    Nope, it’s specifically when people start talking about the degeneracy of culture, behavior, etc. It’s a giant raging clue.

    Cethin ,

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Degenerate_art

    For someone who claims to like history, you seem to be missing some major parts. Degenerate art is a specific phrase used by the Nazis during their short time in power. They claimed gays, jews, and other scapegoat groups were degenerate and blamed their issues on them instead of addressing their actual issues. One of their first book burnings was at the Institute of Sexology, which was targeted for it’s study and treatment of homosexual and transgender (at the time more commonly called transexual) people. This was a civilization soon to decline, not the one that was open to new ideas.

    Olhonestjim ,

    Yeah, imagine if America fell to the conservatives. It would be hell on earth.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    You’re living in “hell” now.

    Olhonestjim , (edited )

    LoL. Wherever people like you are in charge, that’s hell.

    nimomycelium ,
    @nimomycelium@lemmy.world avatar

    America is lost - no matter who wins the election. It is over.

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