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x4740N ,

Reason number * I’m glad I don’t live I’m america

MonkderDritte ,

How can you teach Bible? Which historical happening in Israel influenced what part, which pagan deity Beelzebub was, etc?

JohnOliver ,

‘Teach Bible’… only churches should ‘teach bible’ and nobody should be forced to go to church.

Is it even christian to force a sermon onto people?

freeman ,

Is it even christian to force a sermon onto people

Well historically Christian denominations have been quite pushy to say the least.

nucleative ,

No way this isn’t struck down. It’s got to just be a political signaling play.

FlyingSquid OP ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

They want it to go to SCOTUS so SCOTUS can (and probably will) make it legal.

01011 ,

If more people actually read the Bible there would probably be fewer xtians.

uis , (edited )

School teachers, complying with letter of the law: “Bible says there was flood. Science shows there wasn’t. Bible says diseases appeared as result of sin. Science shows diseases existed long before humans.”

dhcmrlchtdj__ ,
@dhcmrlchtdj__@lemmy.world avatar

And this is the same cunt that was blaming “the radical left” for “politicizing” the death of a child under his care. nytimes.com/…/oklahoma-nonbinary-student-superint…

abbiistabbii ,
@abbiistabbii@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

Teachers can make this backfire by teaching kids about how Jesus said, among other things:

  • Rich people don’t go to heaven
  • Jesus’s answer to religious people not wanting to see things was for the people complaining to pluck out their eyes.
  • How Jesus told his followers to sell their shit and give it to the poor.

All things republicans hate because it goes against their ideals. Also they can talk about how in Acts it says Christians lived communally or just read James 5:1-6 verbatim.

But I guarantee the schools will force their teachers only to read parts of the bible that the state demand, because it’s not about Christianity, it’s about using religion to control people.

CileTheSane ,
@CileTheSane@lemmy.ca avatar

Teach them the story of Lot and his daughters, let them go home and ask their parents about it.

Valmond ,

Also, who says it’s the christian bible 😁 ?

kamenoko ,

America was founded on the principle of no official state religion and has fought against it ever since.

abbiistabbii ,
@abbiistabbii@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

You’ve not fought against it very well, have you?

  • You have school “voucher” schemes for religious schools, which do shit like teach kids that Evolution is wrong because of the bible.
  • You added “In God we Trust” do your money and added “Under God” to the pledge of allegiance in the 1950s (The pledge, with or without it, is in itself a form of state worship).
  • You have had presidents (Reagan, Bush II) openly promote the idea that America is a Christian state through historical falsehoods.
  • One of the most powerful factions in your government are American Evangelicals who have used their power to promote religious based laws, especially against women and minorities.
  • Every President in recent times has had to show themselves to be openly Christian, with “not being christian (enough)” being a common attack strategy.

And that’s just Christianity, if I was going to go into how you worship the state…

  • You have Four Faces of Presidents carved on a literal sacred mountain.
  • You make your kids pledge allegiance to the state every morning (I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands).
  • You have two (2) congress funded art pieces that depict George Washington as a God (Washington Enthroned and The Apotheosis of Washington), the latter of which is in the oculus of the Rotunda at Congress for everyone to see.
  • The Lincoln Memorial is straight up designed like a Greco-Roman Temple.
  • You have, as a social norm, displaying your flag outside your house.

How is that not going to be interpreted as “religious”?

Now, I know someone is going to be all “lol aren’t you from the uk where you worship the royal family” well guess fucking what:

  1. Barely anyone in the UK worships the royals, especially where I’m from (Scotland) and the people who do even in England are considered weird. Our relationship with the Royals as a country is usually one of aggressive irreverence. My family’s nicknames for the king includes “The Jug Eared Dwarf”, “Chuckie III” and “Tearlach an Chluas”.
  2. Despite having two (2) established churches (Church of England and Church of Scotland), non religious people make up the majority and the UK is aggressively secular.
  3. Despite the established religion and having the (in practice) head of state also be the (in practice) head of the Church, none of our politicians try and use religion to justify their bullshit and those who do are considered wankers.

America, in the eyes of most of the world, is aggressively religious, not just in terms of christianity but also in worship of the state.

kamenoko ,

Death by a thousand cuts kills us all.

AncientMariner , (edited )

What they failed to realise is teachers can have a unique ability to make kids hate a subject.

If you force them to do it, they can do it really badly without it being obvious.

I can imagine reading the Bible word for for in monotone from day 1 won’t be a good experience.

RagingRobot ,

Just read only the parts about incest and rape and waiting for all the parents to complain

zazilicious ,

I’m so fucking tired of the US. Shit just always seems to get worse, and for every little victory, we take another huge leap towards a fascist theocracy.

dsco ,

I like to tell myself that these are the death throes of a dying ideology.

zazilicious ,

I really hope you’re right…

orcrist ,

Oh yes, one way or the other. Things are certainly crashing, and the question is what will happen in the aftermath.

SpiceDealer , (edited )
@SpiceDealer@lemmy.world avatar

Any of you remember Kitzmiller v. Dover? It was a case that essentially ruled that teaching ID/creationism was a theological doctrine and thus couldn’t be included in the biology curriculum of schools across the country. While the issues here at not the same (teaching creationsim vs mandatory bible studies), they have the same ideological underpinnings. Unless we’re talking about Sunday school*, schools must remain secular institutions where discussions of religions are from a neutral perspective in regards to the humanities. As to regards to a hypothetical Supreme Court case: considering how ultra-conservative the Supreme Court has become in recent years, I fear that they might side the theocrats.

*Are those still a thing?

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Every time Democrats have an opportunity to increase the number of seats on the SCOTUS, they punt.

skuzz ,

Short of congress impeaching Supreme Court members (which they can do), it seems the only real answer is to just expand it so that it has so many seats, it is effectively as useless as congress.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Or begin federally indicting Justices, but I find that even less likely

Railing5132 ,

I wonder if the thinking is that once the proverbial seal on that lid is broken, the next administration would just Uno-reverse it by adding more of its preferred justices?

And, it’s not like (aside from the first two damn years when it should have been done) they had a trifecta; although you could be assured Manchin or Senema(?) would have fucked them over.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Setting aside the fact that this would require a Senate majority, that’s not even the worst outcome.

A broader spectrum of conservative judges means they need to triangulate across their generational and niche personal views. There is legit some amount of political space between Gorduch, Roberts, ACB, Judge Likes Beer, Uncle Thomas, and Discount Scalia.

Adding three more of them to match three more liberal judges means even more dissonance.

And who knows? Maybe we even start getting judges who didn’t fall directly out of the Harvard pipeline.

orcrist ,

I think the reason the Democrats haven’t tried to add members is the same reason that they didn’t mean to coin to handle the debt ceiling and they didn’t bother to either use or destroy the filibuster.

Many entrenched Democrats in Washington are happy to be the second worst party. That’s their identity. And it makes sense if you consider their funding source. Big money comes from big companies, and they give it to people who will represent their interests.

jj4211 ,

Sunday school is not a public institution, which is why it gets a pass. Similarly private schools are free to do this all week long.

I think even this supreme Court would rule the correct way. I wouldn’t be surprised if it were even unanimous, but at worst I’d expect the 6/3 split with Thomas, Goraych, and Alito. There’s only so far they can go when the Constitution was very blatantly clear on this matter.

FlyingSquid OP ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

And we should let it get a pass. Sunday School is the place to teach kids about the Bible. That’s what it’s for. That’s not what public school should be for. If parents want to indoctrinate their kids into religion, there’s no really effective way to stop it. But at least we can tamper it by keeping it out of our schools.

AA5B ,

they’d face the same consequences as one who refuses to teach about the Civil War

Now I’m really afraid to find out what this includes

teawrecks ,

Which is a hilarious Freudian slip on their part. Who is it that they think don’t want to teach about the Civil War? Could it be the ones who instead refer to it as the “war of northern aggression” and try to erase the context of slavery by saying it was about “states rights”?

JimSamtanko ,

Oh I can’t wait for the lawsuits to follow this bullshit.

Chocrates ,

I’m still pissed we are spending tax payer money defending this shit. We are doing something similar in La.

PsychedSy ,

As much as it sucks, at least it’s being adjudicated.

Chocrates ,

I fear what the fedsoc six will do with it. They already want a theocracy.

PsychedSy ,

Get a poverty pony and some ammo.

GroundedGator ,

Looking at recent decisions, it’s going to go badly for those of us who believe in the anti-establishment clause.

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.

Congress shall make no law, this actually could be interpreted quite literally by the courts that it is perfectly acceptable for a state to not only establish a religion but to criminalize other beliefs.

I think this would be a 5-4 decision with SCOTUS. I think Barrett would be against it, because she is Catholic and would see that her beliefs may not be the ones promoted. Kavanaugh and Roberts could be a toss up.

chiliedogg ,

Kavenaugh has been better than expected (still bad). Actually, all of the Trump appointments have been less-bad than Alito, Thomas, and Scalia. If it weren’t for the fact that Kavenaugh replaced Kennedy and Barret RBG it wouldn’t be so bad.

The good news is that the next 2 up for replacement are probably Thomas and Alito. If we can hold onto the White House we may be able to unfuck this.

Evilcoleslaw ,

Congress shall make no law, this actually could be interpreted quite literally by the courts that it is perfectly acceptable for a state to not only establish a religion but to criminalize other beliefs.

Reading one piece of the Constitution or the text of any specific statute is kind of useless in our legal system. Other parts of the Constitution, the laws, and the case law that’s been established over centuries and decades also have parts to play.

This particular legal situation has been argued before, and it’s very settled law (at least for now.) Specifically, the 14th Amendment has been viewed to expand many of the Constitutional provisions that originally only restrained Congress to apply to the state governments as well.

It’s most likely to be slapped down in district court, slapped down in the appellate court, and then declined by SCOTUS.

exanime ,

So it can get to the Supreme Court and be overturned there?

teawrecks ,

The Superintenant of OK apparently stated plainly that he believes Trump’s appointment to the SC were specifically done to protect states doing this.

MyOpinion ,

I am sorry no. I don’t want this garbage taught in schools.

Viking_Hippie ,

The goal is, here, to have an accurate view of American history

By teaching bronze age fairy tales set in the Middle East.

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/41f1d51a-b8cb-4dc1-b4ae-268436bdb6e8.jpeg

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