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Why do people still recommend Thinkpads for Linux when there are Linux-oriented manufacturers now?

I’ve noticed in the Linux community whenever someone asks for a recommendation on a laptop that runs Linux the answer is always “Get a Thinkpad” yet Lenovo doesn’t seem to be a big Linux contributor or ally. There’s also at least six Linux/FOSS-oriented computer manufacturers now:

So what gives? Why the love for a primarily Windows-oriented laptop when there are better alternatives?

WeAreAllOne ,

I used this guy in the past. They deal clevo.

configurelaptop.eu

Great service.

Drito ,

15 years ago I would have been surprised to hear that Thinkpads are cheap laptops !

space ,

Because these are small shops that have limited availability outside North America, and are fairly expensive compared to Thinkpads which are widely used by corporations, and can be found pretty cheaply.

RegalPotoo ,
@RegalPotoo@lemmy.world avatar

Exactly this - none of those vendors will sell to me, but I can get a ThinkPad shipped from any of the major local retailers, or direct from Lenovo themselves. I’d love a Framework, and I’m trying to set it up so I can get one shipped to a friend in the UK who will be visiting next year but I’m sceptical that the timing will work out or that Framework will accept my credit card

space ,

What I don’t like about buying things from abroad is that RMA-ing gets difficult and expensive.

oscar ,

My thinkpad model officially supports linux, so there is no problem there. It is also much cheaper than any of those brands, and it’s also available from the regular stores.

const_void OP ,

Officially? Got a link?

oscar , (edited )

At least to my understanding. My model is the T14 Gen 1 (AMD). But I would recommend checking newer models.

A few points that indicates this:

  1. It’s possible to order it with linux preinstalled:

    In limited countries or regions, Lenovo offers customers an option to order computers with the preinstalled Linux® operating system. - User Guide, Appendix C

  2. Ubuntu 20.04 certification: ubuntu.com/certified/202006-27980

  3. RHEL 8.3 certification: catalog.redhat.com/hardware/detail/71625

  4. There’s a “Linux Certification” page (whatever that means): support.lenovo.com/au/en/solutions/pd500492

  5. The BIOS software comes with linux instructions. Though I just use whatever is available with fwupd, which is a CLI application but has GUI support through Gnome with gnome-firmware.

More info about linux support here, under “Notebooks and Laptops”: www.lenovo.com/linux

A million edits later: I got confused by what the product ID was but I think I finally figured it out.

provomeister ,
@provomeister@lemmy.ca avatar

I’d say lack of marketing and higher price tags. Money / Performance ratio is also better with a decent Thinkpad.

Some of these options can’t (or not without high markups) be bought and shipped to Canada.

Because it use common hardware and bought “en masse” by enterprises; they tend to be more supported with FOSS than other options.

I’ve been happy with my used T480 so far.

nomadjoanne ,

I second price to performance ratio. If I had more money to burn I probably would go all in on some of these Linux-targeted laptops.

I’d also add a lot of them seem overpowered for my needs. I do like me a big screen but I don’t need a powerful GPU to go with it. I have a desktop rig for that. I can always just ssh into it if I need to do GPU heavy calculations.

provomeister , (edited )
@provomeister@lemmy.ca avatar

Same scenario for me! My laptop only serve to have a device when I’m on-the-go, but at home, I use my desktop. It was one of the reason why I went with an older Thinkpad, it’s well supported and with no dedicated GPU, it’s dead silent most of the time. I’d love a 16:10 screen, but the options are pretty expensive and often not as repairable as my T480.

nomadjoanne ,

Haha, I think we’re similar people. I also want a 16:10 screen. Maybe someday.

rich ,

Not everyone lives in America and has access to all, if any, of those options.

garam ,
@garam@lemmy.my.id avatar

System76 and Pinebook never ever ship to Indonesia even they have branch in Singapore, or even sorting center in Batam Area (which is Indonesian soil), :/

IverCoder ,

At least you still have a lot of options shipping to Indonesia. Of all the listed options above, only Starlabs ships here in the Philippines 🥲

garam ,
@garam@lemmy.my.id avatar

They aren’t shipping here at all… Like I said, even they have warehouse in Indonesian soil, it only used for… supporting Singapore… it’s strange condition tbh…

erasebegin , (edited )

Thinkpads tend to have excellent build quality, solid firmware and well thought out design. Price to performance on second-hand models is always outstanding and their popularity ensures hardware compatibility with Linux.

Of the brands you named, I just don’t trust the hardware. Tuxedo computers for example uses Tongfang white-label computers that they just slap their logo on. Quality control isn’t as thorough as Lenovo’s, firmware is sketchy, TDP tends to be all over the place and keyboard quality doesn’t come close.

Thinkpads also have-- and I can’t stress the importance of this enough-- a nipple. I don’t really use it, but if you try to take it away from me I’ll bite you.

BubblyMango ,

Some of these dont really ship worldwide. Not all of them offer a good bang for the buck in terms of hardware specs, and big companies sometimes offer more options (system76 traditionally didnt offer screens over FHD, most laptops are only 14"…).

Gnubyte , (edited )

Those are all expensive, used Thinkpad is below the ground-dirt cheap…$150?!

My Thinkpad Ultrabook was insanely cheap even with a docking station. I do donate to Pop OS once a year though as a thanks for their work and I recommend the same. It’s like $12 a year on their site and they do great work.

Trying to get one of their laptops but thats in short order for me, for now.

Adding on:

  • lack of quick shipping
  • proxied payments like PayPal or apple gpay
  • some use laptop kits that are supposedly cheap
  • hardware different from software if it breaks and there’s no store or big company to ask for a refund from, you’ll be pissed
  • some of the hardware reviews about bugs and their handling of them are damning
Pika ,
@Pika@sh.itjust.works avatar

I never have heard of any of those companies, so I expect PR might be a huge reason. Can’t buy what you don’t realize exists.

Reva ,
  1. Thinkpads are popular, well supported, generally well built and sturdy. The indie startups may or may not provide proper support, have the proper experience to build a good product and are harder to find resources for.
  2. Thinkpads are cheap and easy to get for the power they contain. Devices like the Purism phone are extremely expensive for just a tiny bit of the power and plenty of problems in tow.
robinslave ,

I didn’t know about Starlabs but apparently THEY HAVE SHIPMENTS TO MEXICO YES!!! regarding your question these are these major reasons:

  • for the most purists, the vendor should have a certificate from FSF saying that “it respects your freedom” a thing that almost no company have (at least that’s what I saw in modern vendors)
  • in my case and other regions, it’s way more probably you can get a Thinkpad easily and more cheap than one from those mentioned
xXthrowawayXx ,

Because those laptops suck.

Thinkpads are good and cheap. If someone has a bunch of money to spend on a computer they buy a Mac.

limelight79 ,

I bought a Lenovo last year to install Linux on. I’ve never heard of most of those, but I have been keeping an eye on System 76 for years and researched their offerings.

I don’t recall everything that made me go with the Lenovo, but after my last (Dell) laptop started developing issues that appeared to be related to it flexing, I wanted something with a stronger case, and System 76’s laptops appear to have plastic cases. I help run a trade show-type thing, and I sometimes walk around with the laptop, and I will occasionally balance it with one hand, while entering info with the other. I think the case started flexing, and the touchpad (I’m guessing) started giving spurious inputs, causing all kinds of headaches last year. So I wanted something with a solid case like my old aluminum body Macbook Pro had.

I recognize this is limited requirement, most people aren’t going to have this issue.

PhictionalOne ,

For people starting with Linux I am more comfortable to recommend them second hand/used laptops. And Thinkpads are prime examples for repairability and upgradability so you find a loot more Thinkpads that go for cheaper.

Besides that. My next Laptop is either gonna be a framework or something from Tuxedo.

PS: I know that newer Thinkpads lack in repairability. I have a X1 Carbon with soldered-on RAM… Suffice to say I wouldn’t buy that again…

TheButtonJustSpins ,

Ew, wtf. Every machine should have replaceable RAM and SSDs.

pingveno ,

The X1 Carbon as far as I know has a replaceable SSD. My understanding with the RAM is that it enables lower energy usage.

PhictionalOne ,

Yes replaceable M.2, but the 8 GB soldered-on RAM is not enough these days

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