Alternative plan: we all are stuck on this rock together and maybe we should prioritize maintaining its habitability over bickering about who is allowed to provide the solution.
Perhaps we should put some significant effort into not being stuck on the this rock. If humanity surviving is the goal, there are several cosmic events that could wipe us out much faster than climate change if they occur.
Yeah no such catastrophic celestial events are likely in the next few millennia, and we’re pretty good at predicting those things now. The impact of climate change is already affecting a billion or more people right now.
I spent a few years in England as a kid (I’m from the U.S.) when they only had 4 channels, two of which were boring (to a kid) BBC shit. That was a hardship. Having nothing at all would have been preferable because I wouldn’t have wasted so many hours flipping between 4 fucking channels hoping for something, anything interesting to watch. I usually found it more fun to play with the teletext thing they had, but there wasn’t anything interesting on that either.
There are plenty of first hand videos of people talking to people making dangerous crossing and they are doing to because they think they can get money in the new country.
I’m not saying people aren’t displaced around the world. Europe for example has a lot of Ukrainian refugees that should be taken in, legally.
A lot of the illegal migration is for money. If they got sent straight back they would have no reason to make the journey and they wouldn’t be at risk of drowning.
I have not seen the TV you have seen. If there are “plenty of first hand videos,” you can provide one.
A lot of the illegal migration is for money.
Yes, I know this is your claim. Feel free to provide actual evidence for it beyond telling me that anecdotal videos exist but only on TV shows I haven’t seen at your leisure.
Nah you spend enough time on the internet go look. I don’t have every TV show I ever watched recorded and categorised. I doubt anything I show you will change your mind so why bother? Economic gain is clearly a documented reason. People burning their passport is clearly documented. All these young men coming over must be so much more desperate than everyone else right? Otherwise why would it be just them? If you are open to your pre conceived notions being wrong go look, if you are going to keep them anyway no point me wasting my time.
I did not use the word ‘all’ or the word ‘everyone.’ That would definitely be a lie.
Now, you have claimed that there is plenty of video and clear documentation. This is your last chance to provide them before your comments get deleted for violating the misinformation rule (rule 6).
Lack of evidence isn’t misinformation. You being ignorant isn’t misinformation. If someone has been reported by the news and I mention it. It isn’t misinformation.
They’re coming over because the people around them are dying.
Do you really think they’d risk their lives like this for anything less?
So if they are coming over because they are dying… You then imply through a sarcastic means that no one would come over for anything less than life or death.
So what is it? Are you saying people would come over for less or wouldn’t? If they would come over for less maybe they would come over for what? Money?
It’s kinda sad that when pressed in a reality you don’t agree with you are going to abuse your power and silence me just because you don’t want to be wrong.
You’re really not worth this because I don’t think anything will change and the comment will still probably get deleted. But at least it will amuse me.
“More than 80% of the group are unaccompanied minors, aged under 18. Many of the boys had started their journeys years earlier, when they left home hoping to make money to send back to their families.”
There you go :) proved it’s not misinformation.
I don’t have the opportunity to go through video archives now so you can either take my first hand account I seen them and linked with the news articles giving the same information or I’ll say now that I don’t have video evidence at hand, just the articles
I would appreciate you honouring me with taking the time to show how people are coming only to avoid death and nothing less? As you made out.
Thank you for actually providing something approaching evidence for your claims. Of course, your claims discount the fact that those families themselves will die if that money isn’t earned, so it’s still a life-or-death situation, but at least you backed up your claim rather than just stated it as if it were true.
I have no idea why you think destroying a passport has any relevance to anything though. You’ve brought it up more than once as if it has to do with economic migration.
Sorry could you provide evidence that people are coming over for life or death situations please? Do you not hold yourself to the same standard as others? Your comments look like misinformation from my side.
Economic migrants aren’t refugees. If you burn your passport you can claim to be a refugee. There was reports of people flying from Pakistan to north Africa destroying their passports and travelling to Europe illegally for monetary reasons, not because of life and death.
And no I’m not going to go find that for you because I have already proven my word and I’m waiting for you to do the same. If this comment and this comment alone needs proving or it will get labeled as misinformation then I’m not going to waste my time on it. If you don’t trust and and don’t want to check me, delete it.
I did read it. That is talking about refugees looking at asylum. You understand the difference right?
Asylum seekers are covered under international law. That is about legal movements.
We aren’t talking about that we are talking about people illegally crossing borders. It seems like you are trying to make out one thing is something it isn’t. It seems to me you are trying to make out illegal migrants are refugees. That seems a lot like misinformation to me and you need to provide sources for your claims.
That’s why I’m asking for a source. Are you saying all illegal migrants are refugees even though I have showed evidence of them just doing it for money?
You do know that we have no idea whether or not someone is seeking asylum when they’re dead, right?
Are you saying all illegal migrants are refugees even though I have showed evidence of them just doing it for money?
No, I’m saying you have no idea what reason they’re coming over for in general, you’re basing your claim on TV and YouTube videos. And I’m saying they wouldn’t risk their lives if they weren’t desperate.
The funny thing is, you don’t realize that if someone is doing something for money which might kill them, they really need that money. It’s a life or death situation, if not for them then for their families.
Now, are you ever going to explain the significance of burning a passport?
So all the claims you make are unfounded and not backed up by any evidence or source and go contrary to what I said.
Your only explanation is a feeling you have.
Face it if I did that you would have deleted all my comments. I based my comments and sources on reporters from some of the most well regarded news sites. One rule for you, one rule for everyone else. I did everything you asked of me and you done nothing, you’re moving the goalposts for yourself and you won’t do anything to back up your claims. You just want to argue but won’t admit I provided everything to back up my claims are yours are unfounded.
Fuck man I did. If you have a country that does not have refugees you can burn your passport and lie and say you are from a different a country to gain refugee status. Legally you refugee but actually they are just economic migrants abusing the system and breaking the law.
This conversation is over until you provide something that’s more than just your feels.
Sorry, I am not going to continue this discussion if you insinuate that is the kind of moderator I am.
I also highly encourage you to report me to lemmy.world admins if you think I would delete all of your comments for any reason that didn’t violate community rules, because that would be beyond the pale of any moderator.
After all, I’m sure you have some basis for making such an accusation, right?
You are free to end this discussion whenever you like, but your attempt to goad me into doing something like deleting all of your comments is not going to work.
Again, if you feel that I am doing such things as a moderator, by all means contact the lemmy.world admin about it because it would be absolutely unacceptable for a moderator to behave that way.
I will be very surprised if you actually put your money where your mouth is and don’t reply again.
Haha all I want is sources. I know you’re entire life is this website so I know you will go on forever. I don’t expect anything else.
Or for you to show some honour and growth and actually admit you are wrong, have no claims and I think I’m owed an apology for how you have treated me.
And all I want is evidence that as a moderator that I would delete all of your comments for disagreeing with you.
See… the problem here is you claim you just want sources but then you tell a lie like that. So what’s the point in providing you with any sources when I already know you lie about me?
If I did provide you with a source, you’d lie and say I didn’t.
You were close to deleting my comments, you gave me a last warning, yet you did not provide any sources yourself. That’s not a source as mentioned because it isn’t about illegal crossing, it’s intentionally misleading. So provide a source. You know if this was the other way around and you provided the sources I did and I just gave you a misleading source my comments would be deleted.
You know things I say to be right you’re just hoping I conceded my position. You thrown your weight around and keep talking about your powerful position as a mod to intimidate me.
All I asked was for sources and the conversation has degraded to this.
This will be my last comment because why would I talk to you? You care more about winning and being a mod than you do about discussing or learning. I hope you learn to improve yourself. Good day.
I gave you a warning that I would delete your comments for misinformation. You supported them so I did not delete them. I said as much at the time, so I’m not why you’re engaging in this fantasy.
We will see if your ‘this will be my last comment’ claim will be true.
I’ve watched YouTubers who film and interview for example the u.s. southern border migrants the vast majority like 95% will say they cross for money and opportunity, occasionally they’ll say because political persecution or communism or civil war or whatever. They never look malnourished or anything. The article you linked to says 120 million are displaced but links about 15 million to war. Which you claim they are migrating because people around them are dying which isn’t too true. So this brings us to our next problem. Should they stay in their own country and fight their own damn problems? Should another country do it for sudan? Should the u.s. arm a stabilizing militia in sudan and aid them in the liberation with thousand pound freedom bombs? If migration is such a problem?
For one, that is totally anecdotal. YouTubers can interview whoever they want and edit and present those interviews however they want.
Secondly, displacement is always a life-or-death matter. Do you think being homeless in a rich country like America is easily survivable? Now imagine it in an African country.
There are various different channels and people who film and interview people illegally crossing. I’ve just never seen a malnourished group of illegal migrants on any news platform. It’s just not common at all. Ive even just now tried finding it and I can’t. The vast majority wear new clothes and new shoes. Which leads me to imagine it’s not all that hard surviving where they come from. They just want more new shoes and clothes and more soda to gulp in their fat stomachs.
Well you have not showed me a single crap. I only know what I know I can’t know what I don’t. And I’ve tried looking for what I don’t and didn’t find it, as I said.
Climate change driving entire populations to migrate is going to prove disastrous over our lifetime. Already we’re seeing voters turn to the far-right in response to rising immigration rates, and I fear it will get worse before it gets better. It’s real easy for bad faith politicians to take all the legitimate grievances of the working class, and then blame it all on migrants. We’ve seen it time and again in the United States, and no matter how often they do it, they still find traction among their voter base.
Senegalese refugees comprise the bulk of the migrants, and all sorts of things like drought and commodity prices (due to the invasion Ukraine among other things) are driving their economy into the ground. In the end, climate change is definitely a non negligible component of the problem which is only going to get worse.
It’s gonna get real scary. Military is watching climate change like a hawk. It’s real and what you said is going to lead to insane destabilizing factors we aren’t prepared for.
Trump, at the very least, told leaders to quash the bill so Biden did not get a win. The bill was basically everything Republicans were asking for.
Not that I think it was a good bill nor do I agree with Biden’s EO on immigration. But it’s kind of hard for Republicans to complain when they reject implementing what they want.
But it’s kind of hard for Republicans to complain when they reject implementing what they want.
I agree with you in principle, but clearly it’s not that hard since they are actively complaining and polls show voters trust Trump and Republicans over Biden to handle immigration. Somehow, they’re never really constrained by reality.
That sounds like a failure of Democratic messaging which is unfortunately not uncommon. Every Democrat should be pointing out that Republicans killed an immigration bill that implemented what they wanted all because Trump asked them to. Immigration is one of the top issues for most voters (no idea why). I really wish Democrats didn’t suck so bad at marketing.
One other thing I often see that Democrats suck at talking about is inflation. Most of it has been from price gouging and Biden floated the idea of a windfall tax which was completely rejected by Republicans. Now companies are lowering their prices because people are not as willing to accept the supply chain and wage increase bullshit.
Democrats are bad at marketing because a lot of them come from the school of political jousting. It’s easy to lose touch with what the regular person believes politics is rather than the reality of the system where you can’t make solid promises because things can go very wrong and playing the game means setting up long term strategy where best case scenario you have to suck short term losses. They are mostly invested in long term preservation of the system so over promising and under delivering is a held fear. In vulgar terms it is shitting where ideologically eat.
Republicans however basically promise the moon the sun and the stars and then when it doesn’t happen they just rile up their base with anti-federal sentiments to make them rabid. There’s no brakes on the anger machine which means there isn’t a cohesive long term strategy. It’s whatever does the job right here and now so they can as a group benefit off the short term gains. It’s why so many of them are individually crashing and burning. No exit strategy - just commitment to scalp what you can out of the system and ditch before you get consequences. They know they can basically say anything and get what they want.
It’s a major FUBAR situation and Democrats are only now learning how to publicly perform a sense of political urgency.
It’s exacerbated by the right-wing having a propaganda machine too. Democrats can communicate their wins (ineffectively as they do) but they don’t make headlines like the outrage bait Fox airs. Bullshit asymmetry principle and all that.
Forced? No one forces a member of Congress to do anything. All of them have successfull careers outside of Congress and more money than me or you will ever see.
Let’s not pretend that most politicians go into Congress out of the goodness of their hearts. And let’s not be naive enough to think that rich people are immune from wanting more money which being a Congress person tends to help with.
So yes, ignoring the requests of a vindictive presidential candidate means a Congress person stands a good chance of losing their seat which means less money for them.
They go in for power. If they want only money Congress is not the way to the best way to accomplish that. Nearly every single member of Congress was a lawyer with their own firm or partner at a firm.
kids rooting for fucking hamas - but they openly hate gays, womenrights, trans…well everything. say hamas is a POS and any thread derails.
pope does the same shit those christian-fruitloops did for 2000 years and people think an ANSA report was an enlightment. wtf? religion = shit. always has been. each and every one of them.
and now there’ll be plenty of ppl saying thats not true, not to generalize, dont hate on ppl. just to cry out when the religions do what they always do - hate the others. or as the fruitloops call it “speading love” like an israeli settler, ISIS or The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints. why would your church need 200billion dollars (e.g.The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints)? if you believe in the god of any religion how can you not be an asshole for claiming to know better than everyone else just based on your shitty beliefs??
fuck religion. fuck hamas, the prophet, jesus and the pope. any in that regard any entity of any religion.
Actually, you can disapprove of both hamas and the murder of tens of thousands of Palestinian civilians. Simultaneously. Without self-contradiction, even. Give it a try!
They won’t say it out loud…even though it’s a massive part of it. The youth are staring at a shit load of immigrants from hard right religious countries yelling at how they want to turn their country into a Shira law shit hole…but no it’s the social media…
They meddled with the Islamic countries beyond what befalls them, and they helped the worst of the extremists come out in the instability they helped create.
Besides, being some of the worst offenders on climate pollution per capita by far and making someone else’s homes burn to global warming first was bound to create these refugees whether those ecuador countries were stable and tried to counter the local symptoms or not. I’m not saying advancing the comfort of human living is a sin or anything zealous like that. All I’m saying is that glossing over personal and corporate consumption while neglecting apt measures in favor of decoy policies and trying to reflect the blame somewhere else was bound to have the problem become bigger and more apparent.
They reap what they have sown over the last few decades. Trying to put up a gunship and gunboat barrier over Greece while bribing the corrupt Turkish president to keep over millions of Syrian refugees, let aside others flooding illegally in groups of hundreds from Afganistan, Pakistan, Lebanon, etc. will work so far to keep the facade on.
Rising fascism in Europe is not a defense against the religious extremists. It is due to desire for continuity of personal comfort and freedom in the face of reckoning day, by ensuring those who they fucked over can’t come near and try to share in their abundance of resources.
I think you’re missing my point, I’m not defending what we have done over there, I’m explaining why the right has gained more traction. It’s got nothing to do with the other crap they’re trying to explain away as the cause. It’s literally because of immigration, the amount of new violence that has shown up in the last 2 decades because of how they’re letting in these extremist.
Rising fascism in Europe is not a defense against the religious extremists. It is due to desire for continuity of personal comfort and freedom in the face of reckoning day, by ensuring those who they fucked over can’t come near and try to share in their abundance of resources.
It absolutely is, and the extremist who are showing up and marching and wanting to bring the issues and rule of law into democratic countries. The people see this, don’t like it and vote for the group that says they put a stop to it.
The truth sometimes hurts, but that’s what’s happening here.
Good, Microsoft needs to face the consequences caused by their preventable security lapses. Keeping corporations honest by punishing their security lapses with strong penalties is needed! Companies and services collect so much personal data that they need to have stronger security to deter malicious actors from attacking their systems. Cybersecurity needs to be made a priority in this age of cyber-terrorism, identity theft, scams, and fraud.
[Microsoft Security Team Director]: yeah to take good care we need to promote our good talent with desirable wages, offer competitive wages and hire more heads. It’s really that simple.
[VP]: what about this AI stuff we’re spending billions on? Can we CoPilot thos problem away?
[Microsoft Security Team Director]: what?! No. Obviously not. We saw how well Recall went. Are you kidding me? Trust me. We need to invest in the talent.
reuters.com
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