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prenatal_confusion

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prenatal_confusion ,

Also wrong. Rigged elections would imply there ever was a communist Russia. There never was. It was (maybe at its best, in part) socialist and most of the time after the zars a military state. That is true for all states that were left leaning btw. No communists to be found.

prenatal_confusion ,

Yes working towards as in socialism is the first stage to communism. But they didn’t get far thus my argument was there wasn’t communism in the USSR.

prenatal_confusion ,

Great argument. What do you base this on?

It’s like china calling itself communist right now.

Yes there was rhetoric in the USSR that suggested they were but it was an instrument to legitimate the horrible things that they did to their people.

From en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Communist_society

A communist society is characterized by common ownership of the means of production with free access[1][2] to the articles of consumption and is classless, stateless, and moneyless,[3][4][5][6] implying the end of the exploitation of labour.[7][8]

That was not the case. It was state owned, as the transition from whatever system was there before to socialism plans. Communism is supposed to be something different.

I am not arguing that it would be good or better than anything we have today but am saying that we never saw communism in the modern world.

Change my mind with arguments and not down votes.

prenatal_confusion ,

Yes arguing that Russia was never socialist (or tried hard to be) would be nonsense. I am not arguing that though. I said that there was never communism. As in, archived and not used as veil to hide the failing government and society.

prenatal_confusion ,

You are right, I mixed something up

Same argument though for socialism. They are a capitalist country that calls itself something else. You don’t seriously believe they are socialist In any other way than their name.

prenatal_confusion ,

Thanks for a proper response. More than others in this thread are capable of.

The clear distinction is hard, I accept that point. The phases at least how I learned it are clear. First state owned then truly society owned as a goal. They never got anywhere near that. Nor a classless society. It wasn’t the old classes from before 1900 but classes as in power structures were very much present.

And yes it was their expressed and I believe trat they were truthful about that to create a communist state. But there were power struggles and the clear ideas became unclear and what remained (intentionally or not) was the name of the goal justifying all the horrible things.

Again, I am not arguing against or for communism, just making the argument that there was never a communist country as in the sense they reached something resembling the idea of the word. Keeping in mind that there is not a clear line of demarcation, this much is clear to me.

prenatal_confusion ,

Check out ventoy

prenatal_confusion ,

Can you give us some names? Sounds intriguing

prenatal_confusion ,

I like yunohost but I think it is a independent image you install. It might be based on Debian but you start from scratch and don’t add it.

prenatal_confusion ,

Interesting, TIL

Thanks

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