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Is it only me, or do you find all those "I deleted Windows"-posts annoying too?

TL;DR: I wonder why we always have the same 2 posts as top posts of the day. They appear a bit unnecessary and mildly annoying to me.
Do you think the same? Or do you like them, and can explain me why, so I can change my view?
Please don’t just blindly downvote, writing this post took a lot of time. And if you feel the need to do it anyway, tell me why first.

Maybe I am the only person who thinks that.
I probably am, at least according to numbers.

Basically, I’ve got the feeling that every top post of the day for the last weeks is something like “I’ve freed myself from evil Windows’ shackles and finally switched to Linux.”, or “What distro do you recommend?”.

Don’t get me wrong.
I feel super happy for every newcomer discovering the wonderful world of Linux and FOSS.
I, just like most others here, always try to help them in finding their right distro and guiding them in their first steps.
We all have been there.
And I’m super proud of us all, as a community, that we happily embrace every new member. We definitely have to keep that behaviour, it’s what connects us and makes us strong.

I just think we should redirect them a bit onto the specific communities.
Not by banning or censoring, just as friendly reminder, e.g. by a sticky post, comments like “Hey, check out !linux4noobs” or something else.

It doesn’t help much if there are the same threads every day, with people circlejerking on hating Windows and recommending Mint a hundred times, just like 100 people before did on the same thread.

I hate Windows too, but it feels like we’re identifying and comparing ourselves with the bitter ex-partner we had a while ago. No, not being Windows shouldn’t be the main reason Linux is great.
There are so many great posts and discussions, that are all going missing in this swamp of “Winblows bad, hehe”.
We should focus on what makes our software great, and not what the “bad ex-partner” did wrong.

Same with newcomer posts.
I think if the posters get redirected to the correct sub, they will receive more help, since the people partaking in the community are there because they wanna see exactly that.

At the same time, I’m afraid this would undermine our openness and friendliness of this community, and result in being as shitty as Reddits’ sub.

!Just as an anecdote, when I was a noob, I posted a question there, and, like 5 minutes later, I got a dozen of non-constructive, offensive comments. 10 minutes later, my post got removed. This was my first contact to the Linux world btw. Guess who switched back to Windows for another half year because of that?
We have to prevent this at any costs.
Anyway… !<

I really enjoy this community here and wanna keep it this great.
I just wanted to ask you, what you think about those everyday-top-posts.
If you like them, please try to change my mind and explain me why :)

Edit/ Additional stuff/ Learnings:

  • I don’t hate those “I switched to Linux”-posts, just to clarify. They’re fine for me, they just feel like white noise. But I’ve read many times in this thread that a lot of people enjoy those posts. If that’s the case, I’m totally fine! :)
  • I think putting those posts in a weekly sticky thread could be worth an idea? Then everyone could describe their experience of this week of switching from one distro to another, e.g. “My first week of Gentoo” or something like this. Would be an interesting read for everyone.
  • I also believe those “Fuck Windows”-posts can be kind of therapeutic for some people, since Windows became really shitty and annoying in the last years. And when you feel the relieve from finally getting rid of it, you tell that everyone. Understandable.
  • Splitting the community isn’t the best idea too. We can always learn from each other and I like the diversity of this community.
  • Thank you for your kind and constructive answers! ✌️
flashgnash ,

It’s nice to get some idea of how many people are switching over, it seems to have had an uptick recently, 3 people I know in real life have tried using Linux as their daily driver in the past few months who hadn’t previously

Heratiki ,

The F Windows posts are great and can be very therapeutic. But guaranteed those users haven’t issued a command that accidentally wipes out their entire drive accidentally. Or they haven’t had their Window Manager just up and decide it doesn’t feel like working anymore because of an update.

I work with Linux a lot simply because of my 3D printers and I love it. But being on a community driven edge can be a nightmare sometimes when something updates and you’ve got to track down the problem. For me that’s half the fun since I usually get to help someone else out with the same issue.

CosmicCleric ,
@CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

But guaranteed those users haven’t issued a command that accidentally wipes out their entire drive accidentally.

Really?

Yeah, I can see the horde of Mint, PopOS, and a Ubuntu users running towards that command line prompt. /s

Heratiki ,

I meant it more as an inexperienced Linux user having to fix something and inadvertently causing havoc more so than drive wiping.

WeLoveCastingSpellz ,

I like to hear other peoples experiences

CosmicCleric , (edited )
@CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

Responding with a meta level tangent comment, but I can’t help feeling that when I read these type of comments that it’s just Microsoft astroturfing, trying to shape the narrative away from migration to Linux.

Especially when you see those “I still can’t get my favorite single game that uses anti-cheat tech or strange peripheral to work with Linux, so Linux sucks for all gaming” posts.

Just kind of seems like there’s this stealthy narrative warfare going on.

Guenther_Amanita OP , (edited )

Dang it, you got me!

Just kidding 🙃
I get why you think about that. I sometimes enjoy thinking about “conspiracies” like those too.
Especially with the rise of LLMs and bots, it doesn’t sound unrealistic tbh.

On the other hand, I don’t believe MS does care about us at all, or at least that much.
Years ago, yes. But they’re really good at their “Embrace, extend and extinguish” practice. They “love” Linux now, don’t forget that. Home users leaving Windows isn’t that big of a problem for them, as long as we continue using their services, like Edge, Outlook and Teams.
The MS ecosystem also dominates the business world and won’t get replaced anytime soon, and this field is where the paying customers are.

About the fake-accounts: if I’m not certain if I am reading a troll post, checking the profile helps.
For example, I’m a mod of some communities, have a very long and extensive post- and comment history, and behave like a human would (which basically means I’m very dumb sometimes 🌝).
So, the chances of me being a troll from Microsoft is there, but slim.

I have to admit: I was the same as the example from you in my beginning times.
Here’s my story if you wanna read it:

!I have never worked with IT things 3 years ago when I started, it was all new for me. I didn’t even find the download-button on GitHub.
But, dumb ass me, tried to install Arch (iirc) on a fucking Microsoft Surface tablet. Of course that didn’t work.
Then Manjaro, Fedora, Mint, ElementaryOS, and 10 other distros. I spent about 3 weekends burning USB sticks and installing distros.
Just because it didn’t work ootb. Of course it didn’t because I needed the surface-linux-kernel.
I can’t (couldn’t) deal with frustration (at that time) and posted a “I’ll go back to Windows” on Reddit because I was so fed up.
I’m still incredibly thankful for that one person that therapeutically asked me many questions on why and guided me step by step.
“Now, type in git clone xx && chmod xx. What’s the result?”, “Oh, you forgot sudo, try it again”, etc… !<

!He talked to me like a he would explain it to a 5 year old, but that was what I needed.
Somehow we got it working together after a few hours of troubleshooting, even though my frustrated dumbass failed in basically every task, including breathing.
I still can’t explain how he got the patience for that. !<

!I cried out of happiness and used the device for 2 more years because of that.
It was probably this one person that helped me stay on Linux, and I’ll never forget that.!<

I want to be the same as this mentor, and I think just offering frustrated noobs a helping hand and open ear will help a lot.
Being unconventionally/ unfittingly friendly can open many doors! They often need some type of vent, and if it helps them feeling better, great! Post like those usually don’t get much attention anyway, so I think the risk of them turning someone else off Linux is not that high.

CosmicCleric , (edited )
@CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

I get why you think about that. I sometimes enjoy thinking about “conspiracies” like those too.

Truthfully, your response was WAY too weirdly (no disrespect meant) verbose to reply to (apologies), but I did want to reply to this one point, that I’ve quoted above.

I truly don’t think it’s a ““conspiracy””, I think that really happens today.

I think there is a stealthy warfare of the management of the narrative that goes on between corporations and regular people/customers, especially when it comes to protecting their businesses, their profits, and their products. Astroturfing, etc.

I don’t believe it’s ‘tinfoil hat time’ (my phrasing, not yours) to express such a thing. I think its just acknowledging that such a thing truly exists, because any corporation would be foolish not to take advantage of the tools available to them to maximize their success/profits (unfortunately, even if it trashes the country).

kyoji , (edited )

I really like them, along with all the other repetitive types of posts people make. For people who have been using Linux awhile, or have been a part of this community (or any Linux community really) they get a bit old, sure, but each new post is an opportunity for other new Linux users to learn and contribute.

I think sequestering discussion like this into nicely planned neat boxes like sticky threads or weekly discussions is harmful in the long term. While it may keep the posts in this community “clean” I believe it will reduce interest and turn away fresh blood.

I think those of us who have been using Linux awhile should embrace these posts and view them as opportunities to mentor, and as opportunities to continue to stoke the fires of interest in Linux.

EpicFailGuy ,
@EpicFailGuy@lemmy.world avatar

Can’t have linux without a hint of elitism.

“Im much better than all my other friends who are still using Windows … yuck”

Tlaloc_Temporal ,

Eh, elitism seems to float around all tech communities. PCMasterRace, C, CLI, Apple, Tesla/cars, Snap-On, heck even bidets have elitist advocates. Any time there are multiple way to do something, someone will be snooty about it.

CosmicCleric ,
@CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

heck even bidets have elitist advocates

Learned something new today, had no idea.

Aelis ,

I really don’t get why anyone would be annoyed about this specifically when recurring topics and posts are just pretty common… about litterally anything. I find it even more weird since it’s about people ditching windows (I mean how many topics and posts hating on windows, praising Linux, suggesting Linux, and whatever else…just lots and lots, and somehow people are fine with that, so why would it be any different here ?)

Beside, people just want to share things, regardless if others did exactly the same an hour or a decade ago. Why care when it’s just so easy to move on to something you’d be more interested in ?

One thing I do find tiresome more than anything within the Linux community though is talks about noobs like they are some cringe childs being boring and acting childishly…everyone have been noobs seriously, even you mentioned toxicity and the lack of openness/friendliness towards noobs if we ostracized them…yet you are suggesting it anyway. I get noobs aren’t always fun but come on ! And about newcommer posts…noobs will seek help wherever they can seek it, having another place to help them is not going to change that, so we might just as well help them and redirect them to helping sites anyway.

Guenther_Amanita OP ,

I think you misunderstood my post.
I don’t have anything against newcomers - quite the opposite. I try help them a lot and support them as much as I possibly can, since I got the same help a few years ago.

The only thing I criticize is the lack of organisation. There’s a huge flood of those two types of posts, and other content just drowns in them.

Aelis ,

Nah it’s not what I meant, I think I just wasn’t clear (I am no native speaker, might be that or it just came out wrong) I didn’t mean to say you yourself have some ill will toward newcomers, you even spoke about your bad experience as one and how you don’t want this to happend to others. I was generalising about the ambiant toxicity you can sometimes find on most platforms and that’s what tires me more than simply noobs enjoying their discoveries or seeking a helping hand, sometimes even people with good intent get condescending for no reason and I find it dumb, but I wasn’t aiming at you at all. May be you took it this way because I abruptly came back to you in almost the same sentence.

I only meant that I get the impression people sometimes (on diverse sites, not just lemmy) get burned over noobs, and start noticing them more often than they sould, starting to wish for more peace, or more intersting stuff on their feeds and what not. Wich, as understandable as it may be, is not very welcoming (and not too hard to overcome). Or may be it’s just that sometimes people have weird takes about newcomers and I just mix it all up and get the wrong overall impression, cannot say.

But going back to you, you are mentionning “flood of those two types of posts, and other content just drowns in them” and that’s what I find odd (if you are talking about only [email protected] specifically), because yeah there are a good number of them…but not so many (at least to me) that you can’t just ignore them without paying no mind to it. And again, may be it just doesn’t show up us much on my end for some strange reason, but I checked to be sure, and still can’t find that much to agree. Even the “the lack of organisation” is a strange way to put it since there are broad topics to have on just Linux and posts usually talk about diverse stuff (security, softwares, news, distros, experiences, unixporn…) besides the fact some recurring stuff always come back since people have their favourites topics (favourite distros, dick contest between this and that, “what do you prefer”, and on and on).

And in the end, some noobs will just end up talking or asking about stuff everywhere they can, down to the worst places up to the best, only because they simply will go to places they find or know. And I don’t think isolating them, or making another space for them will ever change that, and it might just send the wrong message. To me, unless there is a truly dire need for another noob space to give them better help (wich I really can’t assess here), I think the best way to deal with it and stay welcoming is by just paying no mind when you don’t feel like it and just go to them when you want to. Not implying that’s your case but, I know some people don’t know when to let go, but we all can’t be patient or interested in things all the time, may be that’s why I think people get burned sometimes. Reminds me that joke about the best way to get help on linux : you simply say «Linux is so bad I can’t do this» anywhere and Linux people won’t let it slide and give you the best help right away.

Crashumbc ,

I find them mildly annoying, but generally tune them out.

The offensive responses, are much worse. Linux users can VERY much be a “boys club” and treat newcomers as lower life forms.

c0mbatbag3l ,
@c0mbatbag3l@lemmy.world avatar

The issue is if you tune them out what’s left? It’s most of the content here.

Hell just the other day there was a “what new tech thing have you done this year?” And 95% of the responses were just some variation of “Installed Mint/PopOS!/Endeavour and started using Firefox.”

Like it’s great that you’re making the transition, but I was hoping to hear what new self hosting service people got working on their home server, some new residential network installs for security platforms, etc.

Not just “I changed browsers.”

Crashumbc ,

Check out the self hosting community.

CosmicCleric ,
@CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

Linux users can VERY much be a “boys club” and treat newcomers as lower life forms.

I mean, the OP linked to the Linux beginners forum in their comment, so it can’t be that much of a boys club.

cmlael67 ,
@cmlael67@lemmy.world avatar

I don’t mind them. If this type of social media had existed when I first installed Linux 24 years ago, I would have probably done the same thing.

pixelscript ,

I don’t really mind either way whether these posts are allowed to remain or should be culled.

If you keep them around, they will just keep shitting up the feed. The overall browsing quality of the community goes down, hindering the user experience. I don’t think it’s uncontroversial to say these posts have next to no value; they’re essentially equivalent to birthday notifications or “I voted” stickers. Like… congrats! You and everyone else! Now what? Where’s the discussion here?

On the other hand, I do want to think thrice about controlling this with moderation. All too often on Reddit I’ve see the trope of a sub that appears to be crawling, and you get the idea to join in with an enthusiastic post, only to get removedsmacked by automod because you posted this on the wrong day of the week, or this post type is outright banned because the community is sick of seeing it. It’s sensible, yes. But ugh, what a demoralizing filter for newcomers. Overly curated subs/communities are not public forums, they are increasingly impenetrable cliques. That may not necessarily be a bad thing if we think the tradeoff is worth it. But we have to keep in mind what we become when we make that trade.

The one thing I will say willl absolutely not help anything at all is making a designated containment community for this specific kind of post. The whole complaint here is rooted in there being no discussion value for these types of posts. You think a community comprised entirely of those would be a community anyone would want to post in? It’d largely be the Lemmy equivalent of a donotreply@ email address. A dumping ground where unwanted posts go to die. And I don’t know about anyone else, but somehow I find being directed to a designated dead-end forum by mods is an even bigger slap to the face than simply having my post removed.

gravitas_deficiency ,

Maybe we can just fire up a new community specifically for that - /c/linuxevangelists or /c/linuxplunge /c/linuxswitch or something conceptually similar, and then direct posts of that nature to that community.

Don’t get me wrong, I like seeing more people get into it, but I’ve always thought of /c/linux and adjacent/similar communities as community technical support, so I just tend to ignore or hide “wooo I switched to linux” posts.

corsicanguppy ,

Yes.

These posts are the “I voted for peace” decorative lapel button of the '60s and '70s. These posts were the leading edge in the '90s and a little of the '00s.

Now they’re tiresome. It’s like people who’ve come late to the party and want their fanfare; people who came last in the race and proclaim themselves the leaders. The race is over, the banners are down, the spotlight’s off and the newsmedia’s gone home. No need to proclaim victory, nor virtue-signal inclusion in a group that isn’t exclusive.

SuperSpruce ,

Perhaps we can make a new community here: c/ditchedWindows, for example.

Papanca ,

Personally, i would prefer it if the linux 4 noobs community would be brought back to life, or if we have dedicated threads here where we can discuss newbie stuff.

If we would go the route of threads, some helpful people who have a lot of experience could decide to help out and others could just skip the thread.

And if people would want a new community, i would hope that it is not called something like ‘ditched windows’, because that sounds like a recipe to make it a community to complain about windows. For me as newbie, i’m looking for 2 things; info and howto’s and suggestions about everything linux, and the knowledge that there are others who are also new and ask things that would be interesting for me as well.

XTL ,

I don’t remember seeing a single one, so they’re probably not annoying me.

Exaggerated complaint posts about non problems there are way to many, though.

doingless ,

I’m working on phasing out windows in my office as much as I can entirely because of the end of win10 and the dumb requirements of windows 11. I’m still running it on my main home PC though because I’m insanely busy and like to game for like 5-10 hours a week and and want to spend zero hours getting games to run. If I buy a game on steam and it doesn’t work I instantly I refund it even if I could probably figure it out.

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