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thalamus ,

White bread, cheese (at least not the one on burgers) and red meat aren’t exactly known as healthy foods. Definitely not in the proportions of a burger. Even more definitely not when you boil the meat in oil (often together with the onions).

eestileib ,

She also is showing lean meat not 20% burger meat, it’s just dumb.

HeyThisIsntTheYMCA ,
@HeyThisIsntTheYMCA@lemmy.world avatar

Look my internal butter system carries oxygen to my cells that’s why the doctor says I have IBS

Sankta ,

you forgot the most important ingredients: salt, oil

HiddenLayer5 ,

Ratios and amount are the most important thing in healthy eating. For reference, vegetables should be more than half your food intake, the rest split between whole-grain carbs and protein (either meat or plant based) in order to be healthy. And we need to pay attention to how much total food we eat too since our monkey brains that evolved under extreme food scarcity don’t do a good job of moderating nutrient input.

Reo ,

Based on this thread I’ve decided that all food is bad for me.

Shardikprime ,

From a certain point of view

Kolanaki ,
@Kolanaki@yiffit.net avatar

It’s really only unhealthy if you’re eating that every time you eat. And mostly what makes it unhealthy is the fat/lean ratio. Hamburgers usually use fattier hamburger. You can make them with leaner meat tho. They just don’t taste nearly as good.

milady ,
@milady@lemmy.world avatar

Hamburgers use hamburgers

BitsOfBeard ,
@BitsOfBeard@programming.dev avatar

I’ve always been a proponent of full-fat products. Give me cream and I’ll drink it! It is the sugar that I am wary of, even though it is so delicious!

dangblingus ,

Literally nothing is healthy about eating any part of a cow’s flesh. Red meat is, entirely, bad for your health.

BeeOneTwoThree ,

Is that really true? Guess it depends on what we define as healthy, but I would assume that eating varid is the way to go.

Yeah eating red meat every day is probably not good, but once a week or less might be ideal?

Jiminybillybob ,

You are wrong, eating meat and vegetables is natural for humans.

dub ,

How could that possibly be true? We are omnivores and have evolved as such. There are many animals that only eat meat lol

croobat ,
@croobat@lemmy.world avatar

I always thought it was the proportions that weren’t healty. You get 50% bread, 50% meat, with a tiny slice of lettuce in the middle.

Ocelot ,

Yogurt is an accepted and perfectly healthy snack, unless you put it in the freezer first, then its bad for you for some reason.

jaschen ,

Unflavored Greek yogurt is great for you. Its the sugars and fructose they add that is bad for you.

olutukko ,

It’s really not the burger that’s unhealthy, but the fries and soda you get with them

Zyansheep ,

Fries could be argued for, its the sugary soda that is the real issue. Sugar is absolutely terrible in large amounts frequently…

Not_Reddit ,

Absolutely this. Sure the fat and salt and lack of veggies isn’t great for you, but the fries and soda is way worse.

kidnose ,

The burgers are unhealthy too. With all the dressing, roasted onion, fatty cheese, oil, salt…

Diprount_Tomato ,
@Diprount_Tomato@lemmy.world avatar

I think it’s because of the quality of the ingredients. If you make a burger with homegrown vegetables and high-quality meat it would be healthy

psud , (edited )

I’m fat by nature (and environment) so I have examined and tried many diets, and I think I can only say for sure a few thing about healthiness of diets:

  • if you eat carbs, fats beyond what is necessary to eat, are unhealthy
  • If you don’t eat carbs you need to eat fats, some fats are better than others
  • If you don’t eat carbs and you don’t eat fats you starve - to thin then to death
  • Sugar is unhealthy and wrecks your teeth
  • Highly processed foods are not healthy
Diprount_Tomato ,
@Diprount_Tomato@lemmy.world avatar

So it’s as easy as eating a balanced diet?

EncryptKeeper ,

If it fits your macros bro

psud , (edited )

Indeed, though it’s hard to get fatter on fat in absence of carbs or dairy

psud , (edited )

Becoming less fat? It’s hard.

I cannot do it eating a low fat diet. I find portion control impossible, I get very hungry when I eat carbs

The only success I have had has been on very low carb diets, but they are hard to stick to long term. I found the only one I can do easily is “zero carb”

Ed. It’s unbalanced - choose either:

  • Carbs, protein & minimal high quality fats; or
  • Fats, protein & minimal to zero carbs

If you eat balanced fat, carbs, protein then you will not be healthy

doggle ,

What about protein? There’s a whole other macro you can use to make up for calories with if you cut out carbs. Eating near exclusively protein probably isn’t good for you, but you won’t starve. From what I’ve seen there can even be a lot of advantages to eating a little more protein, especially if you’re doing some strength training.

psud , (edited )

Protein is vital and is available on any kind of diet. Many vegetables, all meats, all fungi

Humans can either live on carbs or live on fats, in both cases we must also eat protein

Humans cannot (though cats can) live on protein, look up rabbit starvation. You will starve if you eat only protein, where eating only fat or only glucose will kill you much more slowly with vitamin deficiencies

visnae , (edited )

On the sugar note: Meat you buy in the store (for instance bacon) often have sugar additives. Better to visit the butcher.

psud ,

Butchers won’t save you from sugar in bacon, many bacon brine recipes call for sugar, but a butcher will be able to tell you what the bacon was pickled in

Raw, unprocessed meat (steak, chops, chicken) is generally fine

visnae ,

Ah didn’t know that, thank you. I’ve just started to read the ingredients list on most of the products I buy from the store and realised I can’t even buy ham or many other kinds of meat, because of the sugar additives that they syringe into it.

psud ,

additives that they syringe into it.

It’s usually only water they syringe into meat - so they can sell a 1.5kg leg of lamb as a 1.7kg ;) but only if your food supply is really badly regulated

The sugar in bacon is from the brine it is soaked in; in ham it’s from the glaze it was coated in before it was sliced - the sugar on sliced ham is all in the edge

Salami might have sugar to promote fermentation

visnae ,

Glazed sliced ham? No I’m talking a bout a big piece of meat without glace. I’m not in the states though so might be different there.

psud ,

Sliced ham is cut from the big piece. And you’re right, aside from Christmas, ham isn’t usually glazed. I guess there’s sugar in the pot when the ham is cooked, so I think my advice is right - the sugar will not have penetrated far

I guess I haven’t thought much about sugar in smallgoods, as it was within the 20g allowance on keto (even with a bowl of salad) and now I’m on “zero carb” I don’t bother with ham because it doesn’t have enough fat

I’m also not in the states, g’day from Australia

darcy , (edited )
@darcy@sh.itjust.works avatar

calling meat, cheese, and bread healthy

wow that food pyramid propaganda really did a number on you all didnt it.

Edit: im talking about the meat and dairy industies lobbying too, not just bread

abraxas , (edited )

It seems odd putting meat in the same category as bread.

In terms of pure health, there’s not much out there better than most meats. Yes, beef is a bit lower than pork and chicken, but properly portioned (looking at most of us Americans) it has very few downsides.

Bread on the other hand can be one of the worst foods we can eat. Of course, it is still all about moderation.

EDIT: Why the reddit-like downvotes folks? There’s really no cohesive argument that puts meat below bread healthwise in most situations. If you want to avoid meat, avoid meat. If you want to be morally opposed to anyone eating meat, so be it. Facts are still facts and misinformation isn’t the right way to fight that battle.

gummybootpiloot ,

Bread can be healthy, just make sure it’s wholegrain. Read meat is acosiates with bad health outcomes..

But yeah nobody is going to put a wholegrain bun on their hamburger.

abraxas ,

Yes, bread can be healthy. The right one in moderation. The same as red meat (per your reference), actually :).

But 80/20 extra-fattened with liver for a delicious burger? Definitely not healthy (but like a candy bar, it’s ok to have one every months or two)

swordsmanluke ,

The doctor in your link says processed meat is likely bad all around, presumably due to additives, but that red meat in lower amounts (specifically, he says “2-3 times a week” and to use red meat as a side, instead of a main) is actually associated with lower health risks.

willeypete23 ,

Your “source” is one doctor speaking out against and entire study where the researchers found “low” evidence that either red meat or processed meat is harmful. That’s not low health risks, or low percentage of affected individuals, but low evidence that here are any risks at all.

darcy ,
@darcy@sh.itjust.works avatar

But yeah nobody is going to put a wholegrain bun on their hamburger.

yeah people do its not uncommon here

Daisyifyoudo ,

But yeah nobody is going to put a wholegrain bun on their hamburger.

Uhh. Why not? Whole Grain comes in all shapes and sizes now. Hell, most higher end restaurants use whole grain buns. Not sure why you would conclude that?

gummybootpiloot ,

This makes me think you’ve never had a 100% wholegrain bread

Daisyifyoudo ,

Do you live somewhere in the world where it’s hard to get? I rarely eat bread, but when I do buy from the store it’s always 100% wholegrain. I just bought some a few weeks ago and there were plenty of different choices on the shelf.

gummybootpiloot ,

No wholegrain is easy to get. Just nog as burger buns in a restaurant. I wasn’t talking about bread in a supermarket

RobbieGM ,

Bread can be one of the worst foods we can eat

Why?

abraxas ,

I said it elsewhere. Basically, it combines low nutritional value with a high density pack of too-easily-digested carbs.

The effect is that it increases blood sugar and hunger, which very easily leads to higher weight. Higher weight alone is not immediately unhealthy, but it can get unhealthy pretty fast if you get heavier and heavier.

And the only objection is “well, better than sugar, so it’s not THAT bad”… But we have a lot of added sugar in bread here in the US.

Diprount_Tomato ,
@Diprount_Tomato@lemmy.world avatar

Well, they sure have necessary nutrients

darcy ,
@darcy@sh.itjust.works avatar

i love the greatest source of carcinogens in an average diet 🤤🤤

Diprount_Tomato ,
@Diprount_Tomato@lemmy.world avatar

Everything is a fucking carcinogen, get over it and eat an actually balanced diet with exercise

darcy ,
@darcy@sh.itjust.works avatar

nah meat and dairy is kinda gross

BuboScandiacus ,
@BuboScandiacus@mander.xyz avatar

Meat ?

JH6 ,

Step one is to ask yourself what you think healthy means. Generally it’s used as a catch-all by people to justify whatever shitty diet they have.

HawlSera ,

Yeah, I’ve never understood why burgers are unhealthy if beef, grain, and vegetables are healthy.

KairuByte ,
@KairuByte@lemmy.world avatar

Burgers aren’t inherently unhealthy, in moderation. The problem comes when you’re buying the burgers from fast food joints.

HardlightCereal ,

People eat too much burgers

tryptaminev ,

Because the stuff is heavily processed using a lot of sugar, saturated fats and salt. Also the gravy the meat is fried in. Also the poor quality of the meat, being made from god knows which scraps of the animal, that couldn’t sell otherwise.

specfreq ,
@specfreq@lemmy.world avatar

The grain/carbs is the unhealthiest part. The low quality fat is next.

I’ve thrown away all the carbs in my pantry and went from keto to now carnivore. My wife’s diabetes is reversing and I’ve lost 35lbs this year!

MercuryUprising ,

Look, I’m not gonna tell you how to live your life, but you should consider eating some nuts and veggies. Your guts are going to fall apart if you eat nothing but meat, and you’re simply not going to get enough nutrients. The entire carnivore diet is unfortunately pseudoscience and no different than other fad diets of the past.

Just balance your diet and you’ll likely see many of the same benefits, but you’ll a) have less negative impact on the environment and b) have fewer long term health issues down the line.

specfreq ,
@specfreq@lemmy.world avatar

I thought it was a bad diet until I learned about it more from doctors and nutritionist showing the data from blood work. I get what you’re saying that it’s pseudoscience, sorry to be blunt, prove it. You haven’t said anything I haven’t heard already.

MercuryUprising ,

I get what you’re saying that it’s pseudoscience, sorry to be blunt, prove it.

But medical experts have pointed out that there is absolutely no scientific evidence to back up these claims, pointing out that the diet could lead to vitamin deficiencies.

The carnivore diet has evolved from the keto and paleo diets, which eschew carbs in favour of protein and fat. Some followers of the lifestyle include fish, dairy products and eggs in their diets too.

Although there are health benefits to meat - it’s a great source of protein, B vitamins, iron, zinc and magnesium - many nutritionists and dietitians have raised concerns that following the carnivore diet is unhealthy.

“I honestly think one of the biggest risks of the carnivore diet is colon cancer,” nutrition professor Rachele Pojednic told Lifehacker. “But we won’t have data on that for years to come (and this would also mean that someone needs to do a study on this diet, which I honestly don’t see happening).”

As the lifestyle advocates focussing on fatty meats, followers run the risk of raising their levels of LDL cholesterol, which can lead to an increased risk of heart disease and heart attacks.

“One thing you can’t ignore is there are some nutrients you just can’t get from meat,” Harley Street nutritionist Rhiannon Lambert wrote on Instagram.

She explains that only eating meat deprives your body of folate, vitamins C and E, and fibre, which are all essential for good health: “that’s why sailors used to get scurvy with not enough vitamin C in their largely fish diets.”

What’s more, subsisting on meat alone doesn’t provide the body with fibre, which is essential to promote a healthy gut.

“Meat also tends to push the balance of our good and bad cholesterol (called HDL and LDL) towards the bad end,” the Re-Nourish author adds.

independent.co.uk/…/carnivore-diet-plan-results-m…

GeoGio7 ,

Like some else said a balanced diet is important, minimize carbs but have at least some, also vegetables and some grains is good too. Your gut bacteria loves diversity.

heimchen ,

Beef ain’t healthy, White bread isn’t either and don’t forget, the McDonalds Cheesburger doesn’t even have vegetables.

Obi ,
@Obi@sopuli.xyz avatar

Well, there’s a pickle.

heimchen ,

And there are the people that open their cheesburger to remove it.

ssboomman ,

Yup. I am people

Diprount_Tomato ,
@Diprount_Tomato@lemmy.world avatar

Hello people

GeoGio7 ,

Red meat is bad, white bread is bad, cheese is also shit. Also like others have said heavily processed

Rinox ,

First of all there’s a huge gap between home made hamburger and, well, anything else tbh. Actually, let’s expand it, there’s a huge difference between home made anything and any other kind of food, be it restaurant or assembly line made.

Backing up a little though, if you make a hamburger at home, with lean good quality beef that you grind up yourself or ask them to grind it for you at the counter, lots of veggies and very little oil, on a home made bun or on actual bread (the kind made with flour, water and salt, that’s it), then it’s quite healthy. Still wouldn’t eat it more than once a week since red meat yada-yada, but still, not that bad.

What you get at a fast food though is very low quality meat with lots of fats, dipped in other fats, sugar and spices to mask the flavor, processed bread, processed cheese, very little veggies and, usually, a side of french fries and a soda, which are a meal onto themselves. Let’s take McDonald’s, looking at their website a quarter pounder is 500+ kCal, the medium fries are 300+ kCal and a medium coke is 200+ kCal. That’s 1000+ kCal for a “meal” full of fats, sugar and processed food. Also it’s a huge spike in insuline which will lead you to a huge crash just a few hours later leaving you hungry and craving for more.

Restaurants are also a bit guilty of this. They tend to add much more fats than you’d ever do at home in order to drastically improve the flavor of their dishes. Can’t even fault them for it, if I wanted a bland healthy meal, I’d have eaten at home. If I’m going to the restaurant it’s because I want a great tasting dish. Ready made meals you can get at a supermarket are also full of fats, vegetable oils and preservatives in order to mask the shitty flavor.

So at the end of the day I’d say the best thing is to avoid as much as possible processed foods, avoid all take outs and deliveries, go out to eat maximum once a week and cook all your meals yourself starting with simple ingredients. It’s not that hard either and cooking can be fun.

HawlSera ,

Very helpful and interesting too!

grue ,

if you make a hamburger at home, with lean good quality beef that you grind up yourself or ask them to grind it for you at the counter

If you use lean beef to make a burger, you’re Doing It Wrong™. Make the burger smaller or eat them less often if necessary, but don’t go below about 20% fat.

More concretely, I recommend using brisket to grind for your hamburgers. It has the correct amount of fat, plus a whole brisket is among the cheapest cuts of beef you can buy.

MeatsOfRage ,

My method is two or three ~1" cubes of beef then one 1" cube of pork belly, repeat. Hella juicy.

abraxas ,

Hell yes.

My method is smoked pork bellies and hold the hamburger till next week. I’m a huge pork belly fan. I know they’re horrible for me, but I don’t eat em often.

abraxas ,

Real answer (since there’s a lot of crap going around).

Grain really isn’t that healthy in large quantities, but isn’t bad. But if you grind it into flour and bleach out the bran and germ, it’s far less healthy. When you bake it into a bread, you create this extremely high-density/high-calorie end product with very little nutritional value.

And beef, similar story. Beef is below-average on healthiness of meat (high cholesterol, though it’s complicated the same as high-salt foods would be). But in a burger, you usually use especially fatty beef, like 80/20. Restaurants will sometimes supplement the fat in the beef with pork fat to make for an even tastier (and more unhealthy) burger.

Nobody will ever say that tomato, lettuce, or pickle on a burger are unhealthy.

dangblingus ,

Beef, under no circumstances, is healthy. Raw beef, beautifully seared beef, ground beef, AAA Chuck Sirloin whatever, doesn’t matter. Animal fats are linked to diabetes, cardiovascular disease, and cancer. The maillard reaction when you cook any meat at all is carcinogenic.

GroggyGuava ,

Can I get some sources? Im seeing opposing arguments about red meat being healthy or not in here and I’m seeing basically no sources.

doggle ,

Afaik the least healthy part of that is the grain. Most breads, aside from a handful of micronutrients, are pretty close to empty calories. The killer with fast food is the soda and fries, usually.

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