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JakenVeina , to games in Hotly anticipated 'Black Myth: Wukong' is delayed on Xbox Series X|S — and now, Microsoft has responded

friendly reminder that the game developer himself said this game ‘needed no female players’" and claimed “some things are made only for men”

I anticipate this game dying in a hot fire.

Article for reference. Unfortunately all the original source (twitter posts and whatnot) seem to have been deleted.

IHeartBadCode , to android in This is Microsoft's canceled Surface Duo 3 foldable smartphone

Remember those ads long ago from Microsoft where everything was a to the edge display? And your taxi cab window was also a display? And the sidewalk was a display? And some random piece of plastic was also a display? And your fucking desk, surprise, is also a display but also one you type on! And so on...

Good times.

I mean all of that looked cool I'm sure at the time, but all of that would be horrible to use, structurally unsound, and require device interactions unheard of.

Unfortunately, this patent is likely just an echo of a project that will never see the light of day

This patent is likely a "we would love to use this to sue someone remotely trying anything that might look like this, but isn't someone who has a legal team that could convince a judge to send us home with our tails between our legs." This kind of shit gets pulled by Apple, Samsung, Microsoft, et al all of the time. It's to ensure their continued ability to keep new entries in the industry away.

Toribor ,
@Toribor@corndog.social avatar

Everything’s a drum!

Stovetop ,

To me, the most unrealistic part of that ad is not the edge to edge displays, or the holograms emanating from them, or the overall inefficiency of it all, but rather just that you could never have a place that full of screens without ads being everywhere.

I remember first watching that video on my first smartphone and thinking “When will they ever make a phone without bezels?” And now they pretty much have, but my experience was not some artistic interface full of aesthetically pleasing data and art. It was a YouTube video completely surrounded by ad content.

IHeartBadCode ,

you could never have a place that full of screens without ads being everywhere

I audibly laughed.

codenamekino , to technology in Microsoft accidentally lists the benefits of not using a Microsoft account on Windows 11

Since they mentioned the workarounds but didn’t explain them, I’m copying my comment from another post a couple of weeks ago.

Lemmy probably isn’t the target audience for this, here’s the steps to bypass the MS account requirement when setting up W11:

Configure your keyboard, but before you select your wifi network press Shift+(Fn)+F10 to open Command Prompt.

Type in the following command and press enter. Your computer will reboot: oobe\bypassnro

After the reboot, configure your keyboard and location settings, and click the option at the bottom of the page to say that you don’t want to connect to the internet

Click the link on the next page to “Continue with limited setup”, then follow the prompts to enter a username and password.

deweydecibel , (edited )

Thr FN part is notable if you have a recent computer. A lot of laptops and keyboards ship out with media keys as the default on the top row now, and you must hold the FN key to use F10. Lot of people don’t realize this and think Shift+F10 isn’t working.

Possibly an easier option: you can let it connect to the internet, and then when it tells you to set up a Microsoft account, click on “Other sign in options” (or whatever it says beneath the text box). Then select “Domain Join instead”. It’ll let you use a local account, expecting you to join it to a domain later, then you just…don’t join it to a domain.

Always be sure to use something like O&O ShutUp10 or Winaero Tweaker after you reach the desktop, so you can shut off all the bullshit, otherwise it will keep harassing you to make an account. I think you need to uninstall OneDrive too, to stop it hijacking the address bar in file explorer with constant nagging to set it up

CarbonatedPastaSauce ,

Good info, but everyone should know that Windows 11 Home can not join domains, and the option will not be there. Only Pro, Enterprise, and Education versions can do that.

deweydecibel ,

Yes, that’s true. But I’m kind of going off the assumption anybody that actually wants to use a local account is somebody who knows better than to use the Home edition. Without group policy and a couple of the other configurable points, I’m not sure how viable it even is to use Home anymore if you want Microsoft off your back.

Rentlar ,

There is a 3rd party tool that gives you some GP functionality even on home edition: PolicyPlus

Appoxo ,
@Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Everyone that buys a laptop with home and “is into IT” shouldnt buy a laptop anyway. And you can get cheap sealed OEM stickers on ebay.

4am ,

Instructions unclear, I installed something called “Project Bluefin”?

dan ,
@dan@upvote.au avatar

. A lot of laptops and keyboards ship out with media keys as the default on the top row now

That’s always the first setting I disable in the UEFI. I hate it.

Appoxo ,
@Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Usually notebooks ship with a fn lock function.
On our hp notebooks its fn + shift.
Now the keys work like regular Fx keys and for the function you need to press the fn key first.

kilgore_trout ,

I use the media keys much more frequently than I need Function keys.

dan ,
@dan@upvote.au avatar

In that case, it makes sense. I’m a developer and am stepping through code in a debugger pretty frequently, which makes heavy use of the F keys. I use the F keys far more often than the media keys.

nuggsy ,
@nuggsy@lemmy.world avatar

Thanks for reminding me about this!

We used to use that method for the company I was working for. We would setup laptops in advance and they were in the early process of setting up intune. Since we didn’t have a user account, we’d use your method to continue setup to get to the desktop.

I think we’d then run commands in pwershell to have the machine appear on intune.

It was a good few years ago and it was a very annoying, arduous time. They worked out the kinks eventually and that was no longer required.

danh2os ,

Good to know. thanks!

cley_faye ,

or write your windows ISO using rufus and check the “no MS account” checkbox.

Facebones ,

That was SO TIGHT when I saw that option recently when I reinstalled windows ❤️

B16_BR0TH3R ,

Or just select local domain login.

Appoxo ,
@Appoxo@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

I still find it funmy how seemingly everyone in an earlier threat knew about a dummy e-mail to bypass it but not about the oobe command.

crank0271 ,

Lemmy probably isn’t the target audience for this, here’s the steps to bypass the MS account requirement when setting up W11:

“Install Linux”

lauha ,

I use arch btw

GeorgimusPrime ,

Newer versions won’t allow you run the command prompt in the initial setup environment.

codenamekino ,

I successfully did it on a brand new Inspiron laptop yesterday morning. I do regular device configs for my organization, and the moment this stops working, I’ll be here to rage about it!

GeorgimusPrime ,

That’s good. I had to install from and older iso.

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/d9a562f1-b78b-4ad0-a0d0-a5209742f7cf.jpeg

ordellrb ,

there is another way in W.Pro: choose “for Buisness or education”, and then “To later join a domain”

YourPrivatHater , to android in This is Microsoft's canceled Surface Duo 3 foldable smartphone

Looks like it was canceled for a reason…

muse ,
@muse@fedia.io avatar

Name checks out

Aielman15 , to games in Hotly anticipated 'Black Myth: Wukong' is delayed on Xbox Series X|S — and now, Microsoft has responded
@Aielman15@lemmy.world avatar

“We’re excited for the launch of Black Myth Wukong on Xbox Series X|S and are working with Game Science to bring the game to our platforms. We can’t comment on the deals made by our partners with other platform holders, but we remain focused on making Xbox the best platform for gamers, and great games are at the center of that.”

It’s a generic copy-pasted non-response.

ZoraMystery ,

Xbox hasn’t been the best place for gamers for several years now.

RightHandOfIkaros , to games in Hotly anticipated 'Black Myth: Wukong' is delayed on Xbox Series X|S — and now, Microsoft has responded

Sony needs to be punished for this trash. No chance that this wasn’t the result of Sony paying money to prevent this from dropping on Xbox.

It’s anti-consumer and needs to stop.

woelkchen ,
@woelkchen@lemmy.world avatar

Sony no longer needs to convince anyone to give beneficial treatment to PlayStation because Xbox failed so hard. You can complain about exclusivity deals Sony made with a few publishers all you want, the fact is that only Microsoft is to blame for not developing any 1st party games people want. Xbox flat lined so hard, it’s a genuine “why waste money on porting and QA?” at this point.

Games like God of War drive platform sales. The few good games out of Microsoft are usually better on Windows anyway, so really no need to get an Xbox at all.

RightHandOfIkaros ,

The problem is if Sony has a monopoly on the premium console market, they can charge any number they want and consumers have no other option. Less competition always means prices go up.

Sony’s practice of paying money not for exclusivity for their platform, just to stop developers from developing for Xbox for a period of time, is anti-consumer and needs to stop.

woelkchen ,
@woelkchen@lemmy.world avatar

The problem is if Sony has a monopoly on the premium console market

“premium console” is such a weird qualifier to get around the fact that Nintendo Switch is the best selling console and Sony has no monopoly anywhere. Microsoft is the company that bought Activision-Blizzard, Bethesda, Minecraft, and more. They are the one with anti-consumer practices, scooping up everything with their money from their Windows and Office monopolies. You’re just bitter because you sank a lot of money into a bad system nobody likes. It really is not Sony’s fault that everybody wants God of War, Spider-Man, etc. and nobody wants mediocre games like Starfield, Redfall, Halo, etc.

Blame Microsoft for promoting the Series S to customers as being identical to Series X, other than games are just lower resolution and lacking a disk drive. It is Microsoft’s fault that the performance profiles of their two distinct consoles is that the Series S cannot play Baldur’s Gate multiplayer and that the policies prevented Larian to port their game to Xbox until they got a special exemption for feature disparity. It is Microsoft’s fault that the proclaimed 1440p system (Series S) needs further resolution, graphics quality, and framerate downgrades compared to Series X. It’s Microsoft who don’t even care that much about Xbox because all their games are better of Microsoft’s other platform (Windows) anyway.

RightHandOfIkaros ,

Yeah, defend the mega corporation more. Good job lickin’ them boots.

woelkchen ,
@woelkchen@lemmy.world avatar

Yeah, defend the mega corporation more. Good job lickin’ them boots.

You speak of yourself and Microsoft’s boots, right?

ogeist , to games in Hotly anticipated 'Black Myth: Wukong' is delayed on Xbox Series X|S — and now, Microsoft has responded

Microsoft is getting a bad rep because they don’t want to let the Series S go. They are not handling these problems very well. The Series X should be the “cheap” platform and they should have a “Pro”, called Series XS (pronounced excess, you are welcome Microsoft), so they are the platform that people want and not the platform that’s holding back games.

tabris ,

The problem is the Series S sold a lot, last I read it was about two thirds of their user base. Microsoft also want to push platform independence using X Cloud, which solves their Series S issues, but with the feature parity requirement in the Series X and S, they keep hitting this issue.

ogeist ,

That’s a very bad business strategy, it should be one or the other, X Cloud or in Console parity. The parity being the weak one. I would like to know the defense arguments for this strategy.

Katana314 ,

The thing is, if a game releases on Series X without any bonus bells and whistles like (pick one) 4K, 60fps, or ray tracing, it’s kind of failed the move to next gen. If it then cannot scale any of those things back for the Series S, then it’s failed at designing scalability.

The new consoles do not exist to serve programmer inefficiency.

ogeist ,

Very much agree

TonyTonyChopper ,
@TonyTonyChopper@mander.xyz avatar

Do developers still make different games for different consoles? I thought the Xbox X was just a stronger Xbox One. Does MS disable these high quality graphics options in the menus?

Katana314 ,

Xbox has a packaged release system designed for that. Since the Series S isn’t really meant to go over 1080p, developers are encouraged to only include smaller versions of textures since anything too detailed would be wasted.

PS5, by contrast, tends to have simplified video settings panels so gamers can prioritize what they want - be that raytracing, 4K, or 60fps. Often, just having the extra power doesn’t necessarily matter if the game is coded against taking advantage of it. (I think Bloodborne is infamous for this - it hasn’t gotten an update, so even on PS5, everyone must play it locked at 30fps).

woelkchen ,
@woelkchen@lemmy.world avatar

Series X was promoted as the 4k system and Series S as the 1440p system.

Katana314 ,

Similar to how the PS5 had “8K” on the box; it’s only technically capable of that for the sake of videos, but most games tend to go a bit smaller resolution for practical rendering.

woelkchen ,
@woelkchen@lemmy.world avatar

No, early S/X marketing said that the games would be identical on both, just that X games would be 4k and S games 1440p.

The specifications of the HDMI ports are the same. A Series S has no problems putting out super high definition 2D games.

Katana314 ,

I mean…I think yes, at some point a marketing department made that claim, which is unfortunate because that’s ultimately far from reality and most people know it. The claims made of the Series X and PS5 are also usually exaggerated, because most salespeople can get away with prefixing any claim with the words “up to”.

Chronographs ,

Xbox One X was a stronger Xbox One Xbox Series X is a stronger Xbox Series S

_sideffect ,

I read that it has nothing to do with the hardware, and is in fact because of Sony having an exclusive deal to release only on their platform the first few months.

ogeist ,

It might be possible but as far as I know that it is not “a big secret”.

mysticpickle , to games in Hotly anticipated 'Black Myth: Wukong' is delayed on Xbox Series X|S — and now, Microsoft has responded

I take issue with labeling this game as “hotly anticipated”. Literally did not hear about this game until now and from what I’m reading it seems like another boring ARPG with a new coat of paint slapped onto the same mechanics.

retrovg ,
@retrovg@cwb.social avatar

I'm into ARPGs and had never heard of it either.

gcheliotis ,

It’s the most impressive video game to come out of china, the first that seems poised to generate significant buzz internationally. Whether it will be any good I do not know, but early demos had been very impressive. So I’d say it is hotly anticipated, you were just late to the party. It may not be that original in gameplay but how many AAA productions are strikingly original nowadays? None that I can remember.

RightHandOfIkaros ,

It’s the most impressive video game to come out of china, the first that seems poised to generate significant buzz internationally.

Uh, Genshin Impact? Massive global buzz around that game, and makes a huge amount in revenue yearly.

gcheliotis ,

Ah sure I was afraid I might have forgotten something. Though again a very different category and not the kind of game I’d play. It would be more accurate to say I guess that Black Myth is the first game out of China that seems like it could make it big in the full price AAA single player action market. I can’t recall another Chinese game of this type that has held similar promise.

RightHandOfIkaros ,

That may be true. I don’t play many games from China, not because of any reason its just the games that come from China usually don’t appeal to me. I mean sure, I am concerned about Chinese government spyware, but also I am not anyone that is important so them having my data is completely valueless. I have a lot of fun with Super Mecha Champions, but when I tried out Genshin I just stopped playing after the big controversy of Rosarias bust size getting nerfed and the ice area was added to the game. I just didn’t find the game much fun anymore, but it has made a massive amount of money.

Wukong looks like a fun game though, I look forward to its release.

simple OP ,

Insane take. There’s been a lot of hype every time one of its trailers came out, just because you never heard of it doesn’t make it unpopular…

woelkchen ,
@woelkchen@lemmy.world avatar

No, 61k subscribers of their YouTube channel and a mere couple of hundred thousand trailer views is not “a lot of hype”.

simple OP ,

The gameplay trailer has over 10 million views… The release date trailer has 3 million. What are you arguing about, really? Does “hotly anticipated” mean it has to reach GTA 6 levels of hype?

woelkchen ,
@woelkchen@lemmy.world avatar

The gameplay trailer has over 10 million views…

Videos on IGN’s channel get lots of views. News at 11.

Their own channel OTOH recently:

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/0f304084-e14f-4559-8797-78dc139bda82.png

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/9ae5ca00-4e0e-4b0f-82cc-b82ea528d728.png

I give you that years ago IGN may have managed to generate a bit of hype but recent uploads on their own channel are anything but “hotly anticipated”. If that game was actually “hotly anticipated”, the hype would have persisted and not winded down to “mildly anticipated”.

simple OP ,

No those trailer views don’t count because they’re not on the official youtube’s channel

People watch trailers in well-established channels rather than hunting for a new studio’s official channel. More news at 11. Who cares where views come from when you search “game trailer” and click the first thing in front of you? Do you get off being pedantic?

Search the game name anywhere and you will see a slew of popular articles and videos on it. But clearly you, the main character of the universe, never heard of it so it’s just not popular.

woelkchen ,
@woelkchen@lemmy.world avatar

Yes, I’m a gamer and I’ve heard of actually anticipated games, even if a game might not be my cup of tea. One trailer had 15 minutes of fame three years ago. Amazing. Current anticipation is way down. They can’t even get 100k of YouTube subscribers.

You’re in a bubble of a handful of die hard fans.

Doom ,

never heard of it

Thcdenton , to games in Hotly anticipated 'Black Myth: Wukong' is delayed on Xbox Series X|S — and now, Microsoft has responded

Anyone else hate Wukong because of MOBAs?

Stopthatgirl7 , (edited ) to games in Hotly anticipated 'Black Myth: Wukong' is delayed on Xbox Series X|S — and now, Microsoft has responded
@Stopthatgirl7@lemmy.world avatar

Yeah, I’m leaning against it being a timed exclusivity thing, just because those are normally for much longer than just a month. I think it’s the S not having enough RAM causing problems.

Potatos_are_not_friends , (edited ) to games in Microsoft has begun sending out refunds for both the Xbox and Steam versions of the Redfall 'Bite Back' Edition

Users who purchased Redfall’s “Bite Back Edition” were promised additional DLC, which ended up being cancelled.

I am having an extremely hard time that there were many affected.

autotldr Bot , to pcgaming in Microsoft has begun sending out refunds for both the Xbox and Steam versions of the Redfall 'Bite Back' Edition

This is the best summary I could come up with:


Developed by Arkane Austin of Prey fame, Redfall looked like it had some promise in its initial marketing cycle, but the full game sadly fell far below expectations.

A general lack of polish flanked by uninspired gameplay saw Redfall struggle to stand out in a busy crowd, and thus, unable to find an audience.

Roughly a year after Redfall’s disappointing launch, Microsoft shuttered Arkane Austin, alongside Tango Gameworks and other Bethesda Studios, as part of restructuring efforts.

Incidentally, Redfall’s promised DLC plans were shelved, leaving users who had purchased season passes and associated content early with the game’s “Bite Back” Edition out in the lurch.

One user also informed me that they were able to work with Bethesda Customer Support to receive a refund for the physical version of the Redfall Bite Back Edition as well after submitting a ticket.

If you picked up the Redfall Bite Back Edition, keep an eye on your inbox for a refund, or drop a line to Bethesda Customer Support if you’re a physical version owner.


The original article contains 468 words, the summary contains 172 words. Saved 63%. I’m a bot and I’m open source!

Quintus ,
@Quintus@lemmy.ml avatar

Good bot

Cosmicomical , to technology in A PR disaster: Microsoft has lost trust with its users, and Windows Recall is the straw that broke the camel's back

I don’t want to be the guy that always says Linux, but… …Linux

dumpsterlid ,

It is okay to be the person that always recommends Linux, especially if you are a kind person with the patience to explain things to people in approachable terms (and you don’t just scream at people SOMEBODY ALREADY ASKED THIS QUESTION USE SEARCH whenever a newbie walks in the door and asks the obvious questions a newbie would ask).

Now is the time, Linux is pulled up out front waiting to pick us up (with bags packed) and Microsoft is loudly shitting the bed upstairs, NOW is the time to walk straight out the front door, jump in the car with Linux and never look back. We owe it to Microsoft’s long relationship with consumers to leave Microsoft sitting confused on the porcelain throne wondering why they were abandoned and where all the toilet paper is (we are the toilet paper in this metaphor).

FilthyCheese ,

Most people aren’t going to bother when the specific software they want to use aren’t supported.

explodicle ,

Microsoft has been relying on that for >20 years now and it’s starting to show signs of strain.

FilthyCheese ,

I’ve heard this before.

explodicle ,

So you don’t think there’s a straw breaking the camel’s back?

FilthyCheese ,

I think people are happy to eat shit. They’ll complain about it, sure. But they’ll slurp it up like ice cream.

Otherwise, MTX heavy games wouldn’t be rewarded so heavily.

Early on, you’ll see some movement. Some people will transfer to Linux - most will go back. A bunch of outraged threads.

But it will die down. People will just accept it. They always do. They always will.

dumpsterlid , (edited )

But it will die down. People will just accept it. They always do. They always will.

I understand the frustration and cynicism that comes from wanting something to happen and waiting a good stretch of your life for it to do so but I am sorry, this is not reflective of reality.

Don’t mistake your own fatigue for the behavior of people in general.

Support for software on Linux or Wine is now orders of magnitude more complete and functional than it was 5-10 years ago. There are fundamental changes going on, just because we operated in a paradigm that suffocated the possibility of Linux adoption in the past doesn’t mean that paradigm will continue indefinitely.

There is a difference between being permanently powerless and being powerless under a certain arrangement of forces and actors.

We are entering a period of the status quo being smashed for better or worse in almost every dimension of our lives, what was likely to happen in the past 20 years does not reliably predict what is likely to happen in the next 20 years.

There is actually a true opening for Linux here in a way there never has been.

Cosmicomical ,

Well they said the same about AI and at some point it became true enough to be a problem

FilthyCheese ,

I’m trying to see a correlation.

Cosmicomical ,

True but there is less and less stuff that you cannot do properly on linux.

dumpsterlid ,

I mean… how big really is the category of software tasks that you can’t properly do on Linux in 2024? I feel like it is getting to the point where you do genuinely have to be specific about what Linux can’t do that is a dealbreaker for you rather than just falling back on “Linux can’t do what people need to do” as a general criticism of it.

Windows can’t do what people need it to do, and it fails to do so while sucking up your private data (which if you work at a business with confidential information IS a dealbreaker). At least when Linux fails it usually isn’t simultaneously violating the IT security structure of your organization….

The funny thing is businesses and government entities can’t even claim with a straight face that they can trust Microsoft to adhere to the meager insufficient data privacy laws that do exist when there is zero evidence Microsoft would behave that way based on the track record even if the financial penalties for failing to do so were actually real to the ruling class and not just theoretical thought experiments that involve a slap on the wrist or more like a light tickling with a feather on the nose.

Cosmicomical ,

Oh i totally agree with you. I have a feeling that the only real obstacle on the way out from windows is proprietary software, especially adobe and some custom apps for specific hardware.

Cosmicomical ,

SOMEBODY ALREADY ASKED THIS QUESTION USE SEARCH

I don’t understand this approach, if you don’t want to answer, just don’t answer. Why would you waste time writing that you won’t answer?

Sawzall ,

I will not answer this. Just search.

Cosmicomical ,

I thought you were a search engine.

piecat ,

HISTTIMEFORMAT="%d/%m/%y %T "

Then

history | grep -i “09/06/2024”

I_Miss_Daniel ,

Yeah but there’s like 20 of them, and many are half-baked. How is a n00b to choose one?

Cosmicomical ,

Ubuntu is fine for all uses, and so are some of the others

I_Miss_Daniel ,

Not sure about that. They try to get you to sign up for services, and they deliberately broke something with installing from certain file types.

Cosmicomical ,

It’s still perfectly functional and easy to use, just say no if they ask you to sign up to a service, if you come from windows you’ll ve surprised of how easy it is to dismiss those offers

NegativeLookBehind , to technology in Microsoft postpones Windows Recall after major backlash — will launch Copilot+ PCs without headlining AI feature
@NegativeLookBehind@lemmy.world avatar

How this usually goes:

  1. Introduce new controversial feature
  2. Backlash
  3. Postpone deployment
  4. Soften public opinion with marketing, rename product, change minor features, etc
  5. Deploy product regardless
  6. Enshittification complete (Until next time!)
QuantumSoul ,

You forgot put the option back in a random windows update without prior knowledge

NegativeLookBehind ,
@NegativeLookBehind@lemmy.world avatar

Yup, you’re right. I had a bullet for that originally, but changed it.

octopus_ink , (edited )

You are absolutely correct. All the focus groups and consultancies that were surely involved in something like this and we’re supposed to believe the backlash was a surprise?

This is what is happening at Redmond right now:

https://lemmy.ml/pictrs/image/a36ed83e-fd65-4fb5-b929-2dcdd718eae2.jpeg

MudMan , (edited )

This is hilarious.

I love the faith, too. Like, of Microsoft, of all people. The "your Xbox is your cable box now" Microsoft. The "Here's mandatory Kinect, the Wii killer" Microsoft. The Windows Me Microsoft. The "Windows 8 is now a touch OS" Microsoft.

I gotta say, you guys really give tech companies the benefit of the doubt. I've seen too much, perhaps.

In that vein, let me propose a more accurate picture:
https://img.movieboom.biz/movie/screen/681/19.jpg

octopus_ink ,

I love the faith, too. Like, of Microsoft, of all people. The “your Xbox is your cable box now” Microsoft. The “Here’s mandatory Kinect, the Wii killer” Microsoft. The Windows Me Microsoft. The “Windows 8 is now a touch OS” Microsoft.

The EEE Microsoft…

In that vein, let me propose a more accurate picture:

Unless not attaching one was your punchline, I think you forgot to attach one. :)

MudMan ,

No, I did. I can see it.

Welcome to the Fediverse, where me attaching a picture and you seeing the picture are not necessarily the same thing.

Hey, I am an equal opportunity criticiser. Fedia/Kbin/Lemmy suck at this.

I added a text link, at least, but that's already way too far to go for that joke.

octopus_ink ,

Ah thanks. I think you underestimate them, they’ve proven they are capable of executing even if everything hasn’t landed.

But I’m never unhappy about a Spaceballs reference. 🙂

MudMan , (edited )

Before I had to try twice for Fedi reasons, I was mostly pushing it for the joke.

But honestly, this is so on brand for MS. They came up with a superficially marketable idea, botched the execution, then botched the marketing even harder. Then Apple came up with the same feature and everybody liked it.

The idea that this is them playing the long game is hilarious. Not only is that not how big software companies work, it is definitely not how MS works. People just want to sound worldly and cynical and instead come across paranoid and delusional. The idea that everybody working on this knew it sucked and they shipped it anyway is extremely plausible.

Can they execute? Sure! But can they also get stuck failing to push back on a bad idea until they end up shipping something nobody likes? Often, objectively. And almost always subjectively because they also consistently suck at branding their stuff, both the good and the bad.

MudMan ,

At some point I'm gonna get bored of reminding people of this.

Hey, remember Timeline?

That's how you know this isn't how it works.

ChaoticEntropy ,
@ChaoticEntropy@feddit.uk avatar

Did MS derive any particular benefit from Timeline? It was a lot more localised as far as I recall. Recall seems geared to give them a lot more data that they could monetise.

MudMan , (edited )

Nope, it's the exact opposite. Timeline looked a lot more like Apple's Recall equivalent they're rolling out. It monitored your activity, not just your screen, and then stored the output on the "cloud" so it could be shared across computers.

I don't want either, but if you ask me if I want my screen recorded on-device or my logged activity shared across all machines and stored on MS's servers I'll take Recall any day.

So my point is, Timeline didn't "soften" anything. It went away on the launch of Win11. And nobody was "softened" because when it resurfaced as "Recall" everybody freaked right out immediately all over again. Bad ideas are bad ideas. You can wait for people to get over minor inconveniences or tradeoffs, or just live with whatever percentage of people find something to be a dealbreaker if the value you extract from it is way higher than the business you lose. But a bad idea is a bad idea.

Also my point: people here don't know how to take a win. Recall is gone, I'd expect it to never come back, unless Apple does MS's job for them and when it resurfaces it works exactly like the Apple feature that works exactly like Recall without anybody freaking out about it.

brbposting ,

Apple’s Recall equivalent

Makes me think of Rewind.ai but you’re referring to how Siri can use context from your screen when you ask it? A feature distant from Recall/Rewind.

Might be missing something.

MudMan ,

They just announced an AI integration across the entire OS for iOS, iPadOS and MacOS. Basically they'll log all your activity and feed it to multiple AI models to let you ask for what you want, as they describe it. It mostly looks like Timeline but with AI search and assistant features bolted on to it.

They did a good job of not making it sound as creepy as Recall... but it kinda is.

brbposting ,

Gotcha, made a couple posts about their announcements.

https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/cb5bda38-0e5f-48ba-83f6-9aebc9b9d207.jpeg

https://sh.itjust.works/pictrs/image/b619e6b7-604a-4cff-96a3-b3c913225b94.jpeg

Techies - AI skeptics - seem widely impressed (per ArsTechnica and Hacker News and Mastodon posters). Since your description is at odds with my understanding, I will review some more details. Thanks.

MudMan ,

Yeah, I've been talking for a few days about how bizarre it is to see the difference in reception to what is conceptually a couple of very similar features. It's nuts how good Apple are at selling this sort of stuff almost with zero correlation to what it is that they're selling.

Which is, I suppose, why nobody will ever bring up having said that the Vision Pro was an iPhone 1.0 moment. They know who they are.

Or maybe I'm giving them too much credit and they aren't that good. Admittedly MS did an amazing job at making this Recall thing seem as unappealing as possible at every step, so... maybe the bar was just that low.

brbposting ,

Interesting. Gonna find the source of “they’ll log all your activity and feed it to multiple AI models”

Petter1 ,

Lol, apple is not logging what your doing, the apple AI just has access to that data directly, no need to copy data from apps you already Control. AppleAI is just a Process that has Access to a lot of data, un fact, any data that any app offer through the API Apple Designes. So that means the AppleAI sees only what the dev of the app want the AppleAI to see. Best case, you can set what you want to give appleAI access to in each app.

I want to ask you, where do you see the difference to Spotlight? Spotlight is also a Process that scanns all your data…

MudMan ,

For the record, MS also had stated that users can exclude specific applications from Recall and devs can exclude specific screens or content from being recorded.

I'm not sure that "Apple already indexes and has unfettered access to all your granular data" isa good defense, either. That's... worse. Although for what it's worth it does seem like this AI thing is way more intrusive than Spotlight, in that it's not just searching keywords inside files it can parse, it is connecting data from multiple sources to generate context about you, some of which is being processed off-site. I don't think it's as easily expoitable as the 1.0 version of Recall MS described, but if your concern is with an AI or a corporation having access to information, or to compromising information being accessed through easy search by anybody with local access... well, yeah, it's all degrees of bad here.

Didn't you and I already litigate this in a different thread? I'd rather not rehash that.

Petter1 ,

It is not defence for god sake 😂 I wanted to Point out, that apple has not planned to add somthing like recall to their Systems.

Recall is not the same as copilot!

Racall is not the same as AppleAI.

But AppleAI is pretty much the same as Copilot.

AppleAI does nothiing, if you don‘t use a Feature that sends a promt to it.

Copilot neither.

Only the recall Feature Collecting data that did not exist before that Feature started.

And I think apple has not more data now with appleAI about you than before. If they want your data, iCloud has it all, either you use apple and don‘t care or not. Suddenly stopping to use Apple devices because of AppleAI makes no sense, most likely the same for Microsoft, if recall is opt in.

MudMan , (edited )

I don't think that's correct. Recall will not draw any data from any app you don't actively display onscreen. In fact it will not draw any data you don't specifically display on screen. Apple's Recall will know about data that is stored in applications whether you open it or not, as it's been explained, but it will work with specific applications drawing from specific data (and it does also look at your screen, although it's not clear if it does that constantly or on demand).

Just to quote the current Apple Intelligence landing page. This is posted by Apple itself as promo materials:

Apple Intelligence empowers Siri with onscreen awareness, so it can understand and take action with things on your screen. If a friend texts you their new address, you can say “Add this address to their contact card,” and Siri will take care of it.

Awareness of your personal context enables Siri to help you in ways that are unique to you. Can’t remember if a friend shared that recipe with you in a note, a text, or an email? Need your passport number while booking a flight? Siri can use its knowledge of the information on your device to help find what you’re looking for, without compromising your privacy.

Seamlessly take action in and across apps with Siri. You can make a request like “Send the email I drafted to April and Lilly” and Siri knows which email you’re referencing and which app it’s in. And Siri can take actions across apps, so after you ask Siri to enhance a photo for you by saying “Make this photo pop,” you can ask Siri to drop it in a specific note in the Notes app — without lifting a finger.

That sure sounds to me like Siri now looks at you screen, logs your past activity, or at least searches through pre-existing system logs of your activity, and has access to and processes all your information.

Again, Recall and "AppleI" will both draw different sets of data, but they are both drawing new data at the system level. And they're both making context inferences on your data. Sure, the process is different, they each have issues the other doesn't (MS's 1.0 version had glaring security holes and it's too human-readable, Apple's version is sending your data to a server for processing, instead of being all on-device), but it's fundamentally doing the same thing with the same startling access to your data. Both companies insist they're not logging your data anywhere outside your device. To me, that's not enough in either case.

ChaoticEntropy ,
@ChaoticEntropy@feddit.uk avatar

“We listened.”

01189998819991197253 ,
@01189998819991197253@infosec.pub avatar

They did. That’s how they know this tactic works.

werefreeatlast ,

Holf off the release, half of America is currently in the restroom…

1984 ,
@1984@lemmy.today avatar

Entire tech industry does this over and over again. The only way to stop dancing along is to switch to Linux instead of praying to Microsoft or Apple corporations.

NegativeLookBehind ,
@NegativeLookBehind@lemmy.world avatar

All hail Linux, the One True King

eltrain123 ,

You also forgot that the first mover takes the heat, then all the other competitors quietly roll out the same feature with no or minimal backlash…

Linkerbaan ,
@Linkerbaan@lemmy.world avatar

And they will be sure to make every “mistake” people warned them about in stage 2 when they reach stage 5.

ArtVandelay ,
@ArtVandelay@lemmy.world avatar
  1. GOTO 1;
NutWrench ,
@NutWrench@lemmy.world avatar

5.1 Toggle the customer’s opt-out setting back to opt-in every time there’s a Windows update.

5.2 Remove the opt-out setting completely.

tootoughtoremember , to technology in Microsoft postpones Windows Recall after major backlash — will launch Copilot+ PCs without headlining AI feature

Nope, Windows will still not be my next PC. Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me twice, you can’t get fooled again.

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