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bugs , (edited )
@bugs@lemmy.world avatar

Downvote me if you want but using ai images in an article bashing the rich is extremely hypocritical. AI is a content theft machine that takes from artist so websites like this can generate images without paying actual artist.

TheBat ,
@TheBat@lemmy.world avatar

Even Henry Fucking Ford knew to let his employees have disposable income. Who are these dumbfucks?

jjjalljs ,

If we know who the billionaires are, why don’t we, like, just get rid of them? This is the easiest trolley problem.

Milksteaks ,

There’s easily enough walls for every single one of them

jkrtn ,

The switch in this trolley problem is inside a room and the door locks permanently if you use the switch.

VindictiveJudge ,
@VindictiveJudge@lemmy.world avatar

I could tape a stick to an RC car and use that to flip it.

bane_killgrind ,

Because that's terrorism or something when you start talking about the brass tacks.

chicken ,

Wonder why they’re so afraid of UBI

zerkrazus ,

Because if we get most of our needs met by UBI, we’d have less reason to work their horrible low paying jobs and less likely to stay a wage slave.

penquin ,

Yup. And they know we know that. It is now officially a fight between us and them, quite literally.

ChicoSuave ,

Why is no one also mad at the lobbying group? They come up with ideas to thwart any improvement for us all and don’t see any ethical issues with what they are doing. Being paid to be genuinely evil is something that shouldn’t exist as a job.

Pieresqi ,

Because there’s a lot of naive people who think that we can fight lobbying of big corporations by bunch of people and small business cooperation with each other.

Lol.

Imagine bunch of people trying to cooperate in lobbying vs 1 paid lawyer with unlimited budget

Endmaker ,

The conspiracy theory that there’s a small group of evil, rich people controlling the world keeps getting validated.

Swedneck ,
@Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

it’s really astounding how many people choose to believe that poor people and minorities are the REAL problem, despite the fact that rich people are consistently and quite obviously being cartoonishly evil

penquin ,

There HAS to be a good chunk of the population that are poor as fuck, that way rich folks can keep getting those who work for them by the balls “you fuck around and I’ll hire that person who’s dying to take your job with a lot less pay than you” . Why do you think they hate unions and UBI and other things that could make people live a bit comfortable?

Here is a good video about it

Kiryu ,
@Kiryu@lemmy.world avatar

This really speaks to the issue of the ultra-wealthy being more interested in power over others than satiating their own needs or desires. Pathetic on their part, like a mental illness for power, manifest through the accumulation of money.

bobs_monkey ,

It’s not really much of a surprise, human beings have been lying for power and influence over a dominion for thousands of years. The modern iteration isn’t much different, aside from the modern global reach.

https://lemm.ee/pictrs/image/105319b8-1716-4a1b-94af-4703339e6100.jpeg

circuitfarmer ,
@circuitfarmer@lemmy.world avatar

Whenever anyone tells me that capitalism leads to efficient solutions or some such BS, I point them to things like this.

fine_sandy_bottom ,

Come on. You realise things aren’t all bad or all good right?

Yes it’s true that capitalism hasn’t worked out, but it’s not true that capitalism has no beneficial qualities whatsoever.

bane_killgrind ,

What? Capitalism has no intentional benefits that aren't personal.

Every single feature benefits specific people instead of... Everybody.

Are you high?

treefrog ,

Capitalism is a domination based economic strategy that’s killing most of the life on this planet.

There’s also partnership based economic strategies that probably would be more in harmony with the earth as well as other human beings, like cooperatives, non-profits, and of course socialism etc.

So, I guess as far as domination based strategies go, Capitalism is very efficient. And offers a veil of autonomy that feudalism and slavery didn’t. But it’s only a veil. The rich get richer, the poor relatively poorer. And while the planet burns, most human beings are still slaves to their paychecks while the oligarchs call the shots.

I don’t see any benefit in this, but you do?

fine_sandy_bottom ,

I don’t really understand. Perhaps you’re looking for a net benefit. As I said, things aren’t all bad or all good.

As you said yourself, Capitalism is very efficient.

It’s technological or administrative requirements are minimal. If you want to get from a pre-industrial feudal society to a sophisticated modern utopia, you can’t go straight to socialism. We needed capitalism.

treefrog ,

It’s very efficient at extracting resources from the environment and working class. It’s more efficient than slavery and feudalism. That doesn’t make it a net benefit for either the planet or the working class.

And plenty of non-Western cultures had economic systems similar to socialism before we colonized them and forced capitalism down their throats. So no, your socialism must follow capitalism equation isn’t real. Sorry.

What Marx meant was if we don’t evolve past Capitalsm, we’re fucked. That’s what he meant by socialism must follow capitalism. It’s a moral must if we want the planet and species to survive. He wasn’t talking about causation.

fine_sandy_bottom ,

Like it or not, contemporary tech was created from those resources extracted from the environment and the working class.

treefrog , (edited )

First of all, you’re cherry picking one paragraph out of three while ignoring my point. Second, you seem to be doing so in hopes of creating a false dichotomy (technology is dependant on capitalism, it’s not) and a strawman (that all extraction is bad).

Non-captalist economic systems can certainly extract resources from the environment and they’re quite capable of producing new technologies without worker explotation. Capitalism is ruthlessly effecient at it because it ignores things like negative externalities while passing them onto local governments, workers, and consumers. Ruthless being the keyword here. In fact, I’d say it’s inefficient and simply irresponsible.

If you want to argue that the economic system we’re all watching literally destroy most life on this planet has some benefits the burden of proof is on you. List the benefits and compare them to other systems. If the benefit is that it’s better than slavery well, you’re basically comparing two diseases to each other and saying the benefit of disease A is at least it’s not cancer. If my Dr used language like this I’d fire him.

Capitalism is a disease on this planet. Diseases don’t have benefits. Only worse choices. Feel free to prove me otherwise, but you’ll have to do better than tired right wing and neo-liberal talking points. I’ve been through them to many times, sorry.

fine_sandy_bottom ,

you’re cherry picking one paragraph

Cherry Picking means selecting a single set of data that supports my argument while ignoring other data to the contrary. It does not mean selecting only a part of your argument to rebut.

in hopes of creating a false dichotomy

A false dichotomy means reducing a large set of choices to merely two. an assertion that technology is dependent on capitalism is not that.

a strawman

Pretty much any argument can be categorised as a strawman.

Listing logical fallacies in order to make yourself appear more knowledgeable would work better if you could identify them correctly.

Regardless, I’m not going to be able to reason with someone who makes ridiculous claims like “Capitalism is a disease on this planet” (which is an appeal to emotion by the way), so I’ll leave you to congratulate yourself on winning this little tete-a-tete. I look forward to reading your parting witticism.

treefrog ,

Okay, I don’t know the logical fallacies by name. I do know when someone isn’t arguing in good faith and being dismissive. I do know when they’re resorting to passive-aggressive personal attacks, too. So, I’m just going to restate my argument that you continue to dismiss, in plain English, not for you, but for anyone else that comes across this.

Capitalism is a primary contributing factor to global mass extinction that is currently taking place. That’s comparable to a disease. Its competitive advantages are not showing to be beneficial because they’re based on negative externalities. In the long wrong (i.e. right now), those negative externalities are proving to be destructive, rather than beneficial, for almost everyone that lives on this planet. Its advantage is that’s irresponsible. It’s aggressive. Most of the life on this planet is not benefiting from this aggressive behavior. And, there were, and still are, less aggressive options.

I may not know all my logical fallacies, but I do know economics.

And you’ve done nothing to change my mind because ultimately you refused to engage with the argument in good faith.

Sanctus ,
@Sanctus@lemmy.world avatar

One thing I can say, if I had UBI, I’d try to start my own business.

Cyclist ,

Yeah that might cut into the billionaires profits, so no UBI for you. Here’s a UTI instead.

RamblingPanda ,

That’s not a bad deal. Without healthcare or a steady income that’s something that’ll last a while.

jonne ,

I think the main reason is that if you had an UBI, you’d be way more eager to join a union, strike, or quit a shitty job. They know their fortune is built on labour exploitation, even the supposed ‘tech’ companies.

solarvector ,

Other businesses are competition. Arguably worse than quitting that shitty job; not only aren’t you willing to work for them for a shitty job/wage, you’re making it more likely they’ll have to compete for labor and profits.

Sanctus ,
@Sanctus@lemmy.world avatar

Tbh I’d just make the 10 millionth indie game company. So in reality I’d probably pull 0 labor lol

metaStatic ,

doing what and why can't you do it without UBI?

NoneOfUrBusiness ,

I mean presumably because they can't afford the risk of failure?

Milksteaks ,

One thing I can say, if I had UBI, 100% of it would go to my landleech to line his pockets

secundnature ,

The richest one percent spending their money to keep everyone else poor. I’m shocked, shocked i tell you. Well, not that shocked, maybe just hungry? Eat the rich.

AngryCommieKender ,

Trebuchets won’t give you indigestion, are environmentally and economically friendly, easy to assemble, and require no permits to own or operate. They are also capable of flinging the fattest of fatcats at least 150m, which is either far enough, or we fire again.

^(this message brought to you by the trebuchet meme gang)

https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/e461a41d-2781-4aa6-9efa-e137adbaeff3.webm

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