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TheGrandNagus , (edited )

They sell everything they put into laptops, in that market they can’t keep up with demand. Similar story for enterprise.

In the DIY desktop market, which this article is about, It’s been instilled into everyone to wait for the X3D chips, by basically every reviewer. And for good reason.

Certainly doesn’t help that:

  • a Windows 11 bug made performance look over 10% worse than it actually was on release, which is when all benchmarks are done and opinions are set (E: btw this has been fixed, and the fix also helped older CPUs too)
  • AMD decided to massively lower energy usage at the expense of out-of-box performance (I actually love this decision, I’m sick of components getting more and more power-hungry, and I’m sick of a hot stuffy room, most gaming-focussed reviewers hated it though, which bugged me tbh because they also moan when power usage is high). At previous-gen TDPs, Zen 5 gains a lot of performance, but that’s not how they are benchmarked.
  • the price of Zen 4 has dropped, and the 7800X3D in particular looks compelling to those who might’ve wanted Zen 5.
  • most DIY PC builders are PC gamers, and what do we need new CPUs for? Most gamers are more GPU bottlenecked right now, especially as people are moving to 1440p, 1440p ultrawide, or 4K. Add to that the fact that there have been very few good PC game releases this year and of course we’re in a slump.
  • the only people who can buy a Zen5 CPU and drop it in their machine easily are Zen4 users, who won’t see a large uplift and likely won’t bother. People with earlier systems are looking at a significant investment - new motherboard and DDR5 RAM, why bother with that when the 5700X3D is such an insanely good value proposition that still won’t be bottlenecked unless you’re running an insanely good GPU?
givesomefucks ,

the price of Zen 4 has dropped, and the 7800X3D in particular looks compelling to those who might’ve wanted Zen 5.

This is the big one.

Literally the best gaming chip from any company is a Zen 4 and surprisingly cheap

For most people they won’t need anything more than a 7800x3d for 5 maybe even 10 years?

I’d hate to say what GPU it takes to make cpu the bottleneck on one of those.

MrSnrub ,

Agreed, I bought a 7950X3D over the 9950X as it was $150 cheaper. Seemed like the smarter move.

sunzu2 ,

What's up with 5800x3d prices being all wacked out

Telorand ,

deleted_by_author

    •
    sunzu2 ,

    Thats 5700x3d, 5800 is well over 300

    Telorand ,

    Doh! You are absolutely right.

    infinitevalence ,
    @infinitevalence@discuss.online avatar

    100%, it’s the lack of the X3D parts. Zen 5 on its own is compelling but not for gamers and DIY, would I buy it in a pre-built desktop or a business machine, Yes I would all day long. But if I’m gaming and there’s no X3D part why would I get anything else other than a 7800 X3D. AMD really shot themselves in the foot and what’s worse is we warned them it was coming yet they chose not to listen.

    Fisch , (edited )
    @Fisch@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

    I just wrote a reply to this post as well, where I wrote that I’m going to upgrade my CPU soon but I’m probably going to get a Zen 4 X3D because they’re faster than a Zen 5 CPU but based on what you wrote, should I change my decision? They’re a good bit cheaper and without that Windows bug (I use Linux anyway) and if I overclock it to the TDP of the Zen 4 X3Ds, might they be faster after all? I saw something about that Windows bug and that they run at a lower TDP out of the box but I didn’t find anything about how they run now and if you can overclock them since there’s more headroom.

    Edit: Also to just give a little context, I’m currently running a Ryzen 5 3600 with 16 gigs of DDR4 RAM but since I need to get a new mainboard and RAM anyway, I’m upgrading to 32 gigs of DDR5 RAM

    TheGrandNagus ,

    If you’re gaming tbh I’d rather go with Zen4X3D or if you really want to, wait for Zen5X3D. Standard Zen5 isn’t really worth it considering the dropping of Zen4 prices IMO

    Even with the performance boost of turning up the TDP, you’re looking at pretty similar performance to the X3D chips, and in some games that really love cache, still a decent amount worse

    I also just upgraded from a 3600, but I did it to a 5700X3D, because it barely cost anything and only required dropping in a new CPU

    Fisch ,
    @Fisch@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

    The thing is, the Zen 5 CPUs are actually cheaper in Germany than the Zen 4 X3D CPUs but if the performance of Zen 4 X3D is still better, I’m getting that, thanks

    cm0002 ,

    Standard Zen5 isn’t really worth it considering the dropping of Zen4 prices IMO

    Unless you’re like me and upgrading from something quite old like an i5-6600k. I switched to a R5 7600 for now that’s at least on the AM5 and was less than 200 so I have a lot of upgrade paths later on when I have more funding (blew my entire budget on a 4080 LOLOL)

    Still miles better than the i5/1060 setup I had lmao

    CheeseNoodle ,

    I still have my 3700X and it keeps up well enough with a 4070 even on cyberpunk.

    gravitas_deficiency ,

    Yeah I’m still on my 5950X and it’s an absolute champ in terms of CPU load. Its second incarnation when I eventually upgrade is going to be a proxmox box.

    My 3080 FE is starting to choke though… starting to get stutters and freezing and framedrops, and once in a while a full system lockup when I’m in Forza Motorsport… thinking of doing a coppermod to see if that addresses it, but I’m worried the GDDR may have just had to put up with too much heatsoak and might be going out :(

    hardaysknight ,

    We’re all broke and performance improvements have been basically stagnant?

    MangoPenguin ,
    @MangoPenguin@lemmy.blahaj.zone avatar

    I thought about an upgrade for a minute from my 3700X, but I realized none of the games I play or programs I use are demanding on CPU enough that it would make any real difference in my experience.

    Games have kind of stalled out for me too, I haven’t played a AAA game in years it feels like, and the other games I do play are not that demanding on modern hardware.

    I would also need to upgrade to DDR5 RAM which is just more cost for a marginal upgrade.

    sqibkw ,

    Waiting for 9000 X3D. For most people, 7800X3D is more performant than anything 9000 series.

    db2 ,

    I wouldn’t say nobody, but most people with a working Zen 4 don’t see the need.

    Concave1142 ,

    I think I am going to be one of the people buying into Zen 5 but mainly for the longevity of the platform aspect. I’m in the preplanning stage of my next ProxMox server that will be my NAS (unRAID VM), local infrastructure (Samba AD, Adguard, etc.) & Gaming PC via Parsec/Moonlight or plugged directly into the PC with GPU/NVME passthrough to a VM for gaming.

    Firewall is on a separate ProxMox host so if the ProxMox host needs a reboot internet will be fine.

    InvertedParallax ,

    I’m considering it, but only just, my 5800x is good enough for most gaming, which is GPU bound anyway, and I run a dual xeon rig for my workstation.

    zen 2-4 took care of a lot of the demand, we all have 8-16 cores now, what else could they give us?

    twoface ,

    I have a 5900x and honestly don’t see any need for an upgrade anytime soon.

    A new CPU would maybe give me like 10 fps more in games, but a new GPU would do more. And I don’t think the CPU will be a bottle neck in the next few years

    InvertedParallax ,

    Even beyond that, short of something like blender, Windows just can’t handle that kind of horsepower, it’s not designed for it and the UI bogs down fairly fast.

    Linux, otoh, I find can eat as much CPU as you throw at it, but often many graphics applications start bogging down the X server for me.

    So I have a windows machine with the best GPU but passable cpu and a decent workstation gpu with insane cpu power on linux.

    floofloof OP ,

    They do still seem to be making advances in single-core performance, but whether it matters to most people is a different question. Most people aren’t using software that would benefit that much from these generation-to-generation performance improvements. It’s not going to be anywhere near as noticeable as when we went from 2 or 4 cores to 8, 16, 24, etc.

    BigDaddySlim ,
    @BigDaddySlim@lemmy.world avatar

    My gaming desktop has a 5950x, I can run virtual machines and all games just fine. No reason to upgrade.

    My Plex server runs an Intel 10400, handles everything I throw at it just fine. No reason to upgrade.

    My home theater PC runs a Ryzen 1700 and again, runs just fine. No reason to upgrade.

    I think the newest CPU in my house is either my Steam Deck’s APU or the one in my PS5.

    ghashul ,

    I bought a 7800x3d, so I’m not in the market for a new CPU for years to come. If I hadn’t already bought it, I’d buy it now.

    UnpledgedCatnapTipper ,

    Same! I went from a 2700x to the 7800x3d. I’ll probably upgrade in 4-7 years depending on my financial situation and the specs for new hardware.

    Fisch , (edited )
    @Fisch@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

    I’m currently in the market for a new CPU for my PC, so I did my research and I’m not going to buy a Zen 5 CPU either. The reason is simple: The Zen 4 X3D CPUs are faster. Because of that, everyone who wants a new CPU now is getting the Zen 4 X3Ds and everyone who can wait, is waiting for the Zen 5 X3Ds. There’s no point in getting the Zen 5 CPUs that are currently out.

    Edit: Actually, after reading the top reply, I’m not sure anymore if the Zen 5s aren’t the better choice after all

    JoeKis ,

    Who TF is Ryen?

    0x0 ,

    Let’s see… seems like i can upgrade my Asus PRIME X70-A to a Ryzen 9 5950X for about 300€… interesting…

    floofloof OP , (edited )

    The 5950X is now pretty midrange when it comes to some desktop benchmarks, but mine is still serving me well and I don’t feel I’m hitting the limits of the CPU. If I were shopping now I’d certainly find that price appealing for what it offers. I’m not considering Intel these days, but the price premium on latest-generation AMD CPUs is high.

    0x0 ,

    It’s one of the latest my mobo can handle AFAIK, and i like to maximize my hardware for longevity (one of the reasons i prefer AMD over Intel, their CPU generations span multiple sockets).

    Also, not a gamer.

    alsimoneau ,

    I’m still using a i7-3630QM and a R5-1600.

    They are both enough for what I do with them. Why would I upgrade?

    cm0002 ,

    What are you using your computer for?? Just web browsing or something‽ I just upgraded from an i5-6600k/1060 setup and for like the past year and some change I’ve been hitting 100% CPU usage with just a few programs open, not even gaming lol

    And that was with a CPU 3 generations newer lmao

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