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Reality_Suit ,

An electric motor placed in the differentials is more environmentally friendly than producing more cars. The first rule of recycling is to REDUCE. You have to reduce first, then reuse, then recycle. Tesla jumped on electric vehicles to exploit the technology and not help the environment.

Vodulas ,

Yes they did, but not every car can be retrofit, and it is not a simple process. If you drive a car until the wheels fall off, trying to do that would probably be inefficient and prohibitively expensive. Plus that motor has to come from somewhere, so do the batteries that power it. You can’t just throw a motor in and call it good.

Stillhart ,

My Tesla has been in the shop since November (!!!) because Tesla isn’t making enough repair parts. I love my Tesla, but nobody should be going anywhere near them until they get their supply chain shit together.

Vodulas ,

That is really terrible. They have always had a bad reputation in the repair department, but that is ridiculous. Seems like they have been getting worse, not better. Hopefully you get your car back soon. Hope they at least provided a loaner?

Stillhart ,

Nope. No loaner on my 6 digit car. They might have been motivated to get it repaired if it actually effected them.

Vodulas ,

Ugh, what a shit show.

dark_stang ,
@dark_stang@beehaw.org avatar

With all the issues Tesla has (poor build quality, lying about range, blatant racism in factories, Union busting, Elon) I don’t know why anybody would buy one. There are several better options at this price range.

realcaseyrollins OP ,

I hear that their cars are nice. I would buy one if they made a plug-in hybrid.

andrew ,
@andrew@lemmy.stuart.fun avatar

I’m very much in the market at the moment but I’ve not seen the other options in the price range with what appeals to me the most: the quickness and fun to drive aspect. Are there actually others comparable to say an m3 performance?

Dark_Arc ,
@Dark_Arc@social.packetloss.gg avatar

Pretty much any BEV is going to have a similar driving profile. Electric motors imply the high torque that gives you the crazy acceleration and resistive breaking. It’s not really a “Tesla thing”, it’s an electric motor thing.

Now, some models might not have as much oompf, similar to how some Teslas are faster than others … but all the ones I know of from GM or Ford are going to be pretty fun to drive.

middlemuddle ,

It’s not really a “Tesla thing”, it’s an electric motor thing.

Seriously. My Nissan Leaf in Eco mode (which limits acceleration) feels peppy and is super fun to drive.

dark_stang ,
@dark_stang@beehaw.org avatar

Even my Volt can do a burnout, every EV is going to have a lot of torque. But in this price range, a Kia ev6 or a Ford Mach-e would be better choices. You also have the Nissan Leaf or the Chevy Bolt for fwd options.

andrew ,
@andrew@lemmy.stuart.fun avatar

It’s not so much the burnout that I enjoy (I’d rather not keep buying tires 😅) as sustained actual acceleration. Which means ideally two powered axles for traction, and at least from what I’ve read it’s hard to beat a model 3 performance for the price. Especially since it comes under the cap for a $7500 tax credit.

stilgar ,
@stilgar@infosec.pub avatar

I’ve got a MYLR and the sustained acceleration is terrifying, its very seldom that I floor it.

The M3P must be bonkers since its lighter, lower and more powerful.

dark_stang ,
@dark_stang@beehaw.org avatar

Maybe you should check out the polestar 2 if you’re interested in a sporty sedan. I seriously considered one of those but couldn’t find a good 2" receiver for it.

Vodulas ,

Like others have said, that is an BEV thing, not just a Model 3 thing. Here is a fun video to showcase this (note they are in Colorado, so the vette is slightly hampered).

youtu.be/yXfZVq2ZvVo

andrew ,
@andrew@lemmy.stuart.fun avatar

Oh man, EV drag race protip right there. Just move to Pikes Peak and you’ll win more.

Vodulas ,

If you are against naturally aspirated, yeah.

boonhet ,

What’s with the fact that the model 3 is the only one to commonly get shortened when it’s also the one where the shorthand clashes with a car with way more history, the BMW M3?

andrew ,
@andrew@lemmy.stuart.fun avatar

I normally wouldn’t but figured in context it made sense. But tbf they’re similar 0-60 times at least. I’m sure the rest of the handling is significantly better in the BMW, as well as quality, but I’m at 100k miles on my C63 and ready for some lower maintenance fun at this point. Until I can afford a 3 car garage and lift, or something, which probably isn’t for a while.

Paradox ,
@Paradox@lemdro.id avatar

Subaru Solana or whatever it’s called. I bought an ascent earlier this year, but it basically came down to splitting hairs when I went with it over the Solana. Absolute blast to test drive that thing, and I’d love to take it down to Moab or similar places.

Probably going to wind up leasing one next year, so I don’t have to worry about battery decline down the road

Vodulas ,

I like the Mach E. It is a ton of fun to drive. I suggest just test driving a bunch. The shortage of EVs is long since over, so you should be able to drive any of them. If you have it in the budget, try out a polestar too. I have heard good things, but it is one of the few I haven’t been able to drive myself.

Vodulas ,

There are so many good EV options out there. Pretty much something for most folks. Tesla gets credit for pushing EVs into the limelight, but I’m not really sure why you would get one today with all the things you mentioned.

ono ,

Also: hostile to independent repair, and terrible for privacy.

stilgar ,
@stilgar@infosec.pub avatar

Yes, the Model Y is the best selling car in Norway ever, but your smooth brain knows much better than everyone who has been in the market and purchased one because it was the best option for them.

sin_free_for_00_days ,

Don’t underestimate the herd instinct in humans to have the same shit Håkon does.

alyaza ,
@alyaza@beehaw.org avatar

i feel like people have more than substantiated down thread why it’s not a “smooth brain” take to think Tesla cars aren’t actually that good relative to other options on the market.

Sneptaur ,
@Sneptaur@pawb.social avatar

Rolling e-waste

realcaseyrollins OP ,

I don't think it's that bad. But it's a shame how unfriendly EVs are for the environment, the whole process is borderline worse than using fossil fuels when you consider emissions as well as potential fire hazards and poor disposability

Vodulas ,

the whole process is borderline worse than using fossil fuels when you consider emissions as well as potential fire hazards and poor disposability

That is not really true, especially when you consider lifetime emissions of ICE cars and the refining of oil.

www.epa.gov/greenvehicles/electric-vehicle-myths

It is true that there should be more done about using cobalt and to a lesser extent lithium, but even with those issues it is better in the long run. There are companies that are focusing on recycling those minerals and new battery chemistry is moving away from cobalt.

As far as fires go, yes battery fires can be very hard to contain. That being said, EVs catch fire far less often than ICE cars.

electrek.co/…/government-data-shows-gasoline-vehi…

realcaseyrollins OP ,

Ah, interesting. I did not know this! But I had thought that the concern with the EV car fires was mostly because the cars can set fire unexpectedly, they are hard to contain, and carry more hazardous fumes than a traditional vehicle, not that they catch fire more often.

Vodulas ,

There have been a couple recalls with LG batteries that had the potential, but AFAIK the number of times it happened is very low, and again more likely to happen with ICE cars. They tend to err on the side of extreme caution with EV batteries.

Lithium fires are for sure harder to contain, and I won’t deny that not all Fire Departments are equipped. There is special equipment needed, but once you have that it becomes much less of an issue. As far as fumes, I don’t know which is worse. There are a lot of nasty things in both EVs and ICE cars. I’ll have to look into it.

Sneptaur ,
@Sneptaur@pawb.social avatar

I say this because Teslas are unreliable heaps of garbage with very poor quality control. Not because they’re EVs.

agegamon ,

I’m sorry, I hate Elon and Tesla (and with good reason) but saying that an EV is rolling e-waste is going too far.

My model 3 has been bulletproof for the last five years. It’s a 2017 model, one of the earliest, so take that for what you will. The earliest models like mine were apparently some of the better ones until 2021+ model years. I wouldn’t consider buying one now due to Elon’s tomfuckery and the unresolved racism issues within Tesla, but to claim that they’re rolling trash isnt correct.

Plus, the fact is that virtually all cars (ICE models as well!) are rolling out of factories with dozens of integrated computers and touchscreens. It’s very hard here in the US to get something cheap that doesn’t have any electronics - basically imposible. And, if you do the compromise on cheaper and fewer electronics, the reality is that the poor grade of those cheap electronics will actually lead to a shorter lifespan and more overall repairs.

I’m not suggesting for that reason to go buy an EV - certainly not a new Tesla. A used one might be fine. But more broadly, electronics in cars (not just EVs) are really a huge problem. Unless they’re designed with repairability and durability in mind, all new cars have this issue, and you can’t single out Tesla for this.

NeadReport ,
@NeadReport@vivaldi.net avatar

@agegamon @Sneptaur
What's the end-of-life plan for disposing of EV car batteries?

anderfrank ,

https://youtu.be/s2xrarUWVRQ?si=9lz6Sxi9uFFB59Yi

Harlan_Cloverseed ,
@Harlan_Cloverseed@kbin.social avatar

Have you ever heard of Google

Paradox ,
@Paradox@lemdro.id avatar

Throw them into the ocean, same as all car batteries

Sneptaur ,
@Sneptaur@pawb.social avatar

I’m glad you’ve had a good experience with your Model 3. Genuinely. I hope it serves you very well and remains reliable for years to come! Nobody is judging you for adopting an EV prior to knowing how much of a fool Elon is.

My issue isn’t with the ethics there. It’s with Tesla’s notorious build quality and reliability issues. And with them making things cheaper and cheaper, this can’t bode well.

businessinsider.com/most-reliable-car-brands-toyo…

thenextweb.com/…/study-tesla-likely-us-worst-carm…

It’s just like how I consider Jeeps to be junk as well.

LastYearsPumpkin ,

Not only does is it rear wheel drive only, but it also has about 10% less range than the AWD option. There’s a reason it’s significantly cheaper.

stilgar ,
@stilgar@infosec.pub avatar

Presumably because it uses LFP battery cells? If that’s the case, then the lower rated range is not as important since those cells tolerate many charge cycles to 100%.

One typically only charges to 80% with other Li battery chemistries so one effectively loses that top 20% of range.

dawnerd ,
@dawnerd@lemm.ee avatar

I’d argue you’re not really losing it if you never use it all in the first place. People put too much thought into range when all they’re doing is short trips most of the time.

Actaeon ,

But is it 10% less than the touted range or 10% less than the actual range

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