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Teacher says contract wasn't renewed because he wouldn't use trans students' preferred names

The Wisconsin English teacher, Jordan Cernek, argues in the suit that the district violated his freedom of religion and free speech in mandating the use of the students’ preferred names and pronouns.

A high school English teacher is suing a Wisconsin school district, alleging it did not renew his contract last year because he refused to use the preferred names of two transgender students.

Jordan Cernek’s federal lawsuit alleges the Argyle School District violated his constitutional and civil rights to be free of religious discrimination and to be able to express himself according to his religious beliefs when it did not renew his contract because he refused to abide by a requirement that teachers use the names or pronouns requested by students.

Mediocre_Bard ,

Yep, and good riddance.

If students do not feel respected, then they will neither give respect nor learn. You call a kid what they want to be called. Without a sense of shared community, the classroom will fail.

Additionally, there is not a religion on earth that says you can’t use people’s nicknames, preferred names, chosen names, or whatever. This guy can go eat a bag of Dicks.

Wrench ,

We had two kids my age that wanted to be called by Final Fantasy character names. AFAIK, no one had any problem with it.

snek ,
@snek@lemmy.world avatar

Good.

callouscomic ,

“Your contract WAS renewed, but I don’t think we used your information, like your name or identity or anything. I’m not sure how we referred to you in the paperwork, so I guess we won’t be able to find it.”

dhork ,

I bet his mom called him “Jordy” when he was little

Exusia ,
@Exusia@lemmy.world avatar

Man how hard it must be to suck it up, and just do something you don’t agree with because your job said to. What a fucking child of an adult.

This isn’t a new debate, he chose to work in a field where he was gonna be asked to do this eventually. I have to call people “valued customers” all day and don’t agree with it, I don’t see how this is any harder for him to adapt to in his field. (Not that pronoun requests are frivolous and dumb, they’re easy to just…do)

lath ,

As an employee of the school, the only names he should be using are those registered in its official documents. Personal desires should not matter for either side.

Einstein ,

Uh no. Not that hard to call a person by the name they prefer. Don’t be a bigot.

lath ,

Bigotry has nothing to do with it. The name registered is the one that should be used. If your registered name with the school is Richard, but you wanna be called Private Dick, then register it. If you can’t, then that’s another issue entirely.

Dasus ,
@Dasus@lemmy.world avatar

deleted_by_moderator

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    DmMacniel ,
    @DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

    It was your personal desire to comment this right? Better delete it because according to you your personal desires don’t matter either!

    Fuck off bigot.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    Let it stay so people know what kind of person they are

    lath ,

    deleted_by_moderator

    •
    DmMacniel ,
    @DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

    Bigotry doesn’t make an exception wether it is showcased in an official capacity/private or personal capacity. As you demonstrated with your comment.

    You believe in objective morality, don’t you?

    lath ,

    Belief and application are rarely the same. I can say I do and so can anyone else. But when it’s time to apply it, well, that’s subjective to the individual in question.

    Objectively speaking, it’s better for a teacher to focus on teaching their subject and ignore all other unrelated issues. It’s not their job to cater to other people’s needs. It’s also not their job to cater to their own personal whims while working. Do the work, then go home and be themselves.

    DmMacniel ,
    @DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

    it’s better for a teacher to focus on teaching their subject and ignore all other unrelated issues. It’s not their job to cater to other people’s needs.

    Look up special needs students, and hopefully realise that you are clearly in the wrong.

    Belief and application are rarely the same. I can say I do and so can anyone else. But when it’s time to apply it, well, that’s subjective to the individual in question.

    so, you are a Prager U “”“”“”““christian””“”“”“” then? Cool cool.

    lath ,

    Oh. Is now having your nickname/preferred name used a special need?

    I did not know that. Guess they should be placed in a specialized class with a trained specialist in charge then.

    …

    DmMacniel ,
    @DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

    Oh. Is now having your nickname/preferred name used a special need?

    no its not, its common decency. My statement simply showcases that a teacher does not just have to teach their subject and ignore all other unrelated issues SINCE THERE ARE SPECIAL NEEDS STUDENTS.

    lath ,

    Your common decency is only common in your region. Different regions have different ideas of what is common decency.

    In some parts of the world, common decency is to give the name you expect to be used when writing it down for someone else to make use of it.

    And if some students have special needs, then the teacher also needs to be hired with proper information and resources given to them by the school.

    Special needs kids need an environment properly suited to their needs. Anything else would be negligence.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    I’m sure he would have no problem calling a, let’s just say, James David JD if that is what James David preferred. This is just bigotry for the sake of hate

    lath ,

    I’d rather they didn’t. As an official, fraternizing individually only creates problems overall. A teacher should teach a class objectively.

    However, any other extracurricular activities should be separate from regular classes and the relationship is more tight knit, so in that circumstance, nicknames wouldn’t be an issue.

    Ir you don’t separate work from personal life, you’re going to have a bad time.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    What is your government name so I don’t accidentally call you the wrong thing?

    lath ,

    I don’t work for the government and neither am I here as an employee, so have fun with that thought for a while and see what you can learn from it.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    That’s what I figured

    conciselyverbose ,

    As a fucking educator, you should be connecting to every single student in your classroom on a personal level, or you’re unredeemably shit at your job.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    Bro sounds like he was part of Hitler’s Youth

    Ilovemyirishtemper ,

    A good chunk of a teacher’s job is to build appropriate relationships with your students. Students don’t want to learn from someone they dislike, and you have significantly better learning outcomes when the students feel safe, accepted, and cared about. Appropriate nicknames, like Tim for Timothy, help in that relationship building. I don’t know what your position is at that school, but Wisconsin teachers are literally taught stuff like this in college so that we know how to manage a classroom with the best learning outcomes and the fewest number of behavioral disruptions. We are taught how to keep those relationships appropriate and healthy, although much of that is just common sense.

    Yes, you should separate work and home life for both your own sanity and for modeling good boundaries and work-life balance. But that doesn’t mean you have to drop your decency at the door. At the end of the day, the goal is learning, and not being a douche is one of the easiest ways to get to that goal.

    Extracurricular activities are an extension of these same principles, not an exception or something with a different set of standards. I think you might be mixing up appropriate relationship building with inappropriate fraternizing, and I’m concerned that you are having difficulty finding that line.

    lath ,

    Your expectations of teachers and the resources actually given to them are so far apart from each other that you need to take a step back and actually provide them what is needed, not just your expectations of their personalized behavior in regards to how they should treat their students.

    Teachers, parents and the school need to work together and give the support kids need. But what it’s actually like is that both school and parents dump on teachers with their own expectations on how students should be handled, which often contradict each other.

    Teachers don’t actually have to do all of that though. Their job is to impart their knowledge of the subject they were hired for. Everything else is just extra, an option they should be allowed to refuse.

    If you want them to do more, then pay them appropriately. Give them the equipment, the training and the support.

    Ilovemyirishtemper ,

    I definitely agree that there aren’t enough resources given to teachers, but the expectation of using common decency to reach the goal of educating our students is not too high of an expectation. Focus on the end goal. How you get there can vary (assuming it’s appropriate), but you are still trying to reach the goal of educating the students. If your teaching style is prohibiting people from reaching that goal, why wouldn’t you change it?

    It’s nice to think that as an English teacher, I only have to worry about how well they can interpret the modern applications of the lessons in Macbeth, or whatever literature we’re studying, but in reality, teachers are teaching a whole heck of a lot more than their specific subject area. We’re simultaneously modeling how to behave appropriately, teaching how to navigate complex social situations, and mentoring students on how to achieve their goals and deal with set backs. Teachers have always worn more than one hat. It’s not only an expectation for the job; it’s an absolute requirement for success.

    Should they earn more money for having to do all of that? YES! That’s why we’ve been complaining about the low pay and lack of resources for at least 40 years. The effort and skills are non-negotiable. Kids shouldn’t get a crappy education just because some politicians are using their teachers’ wages as political leverage. People go into education knowing that the pay sucks, but they actually care about other people and future generations. They don’t go into just for the paycheck, and I don’t know a single educator who wouldn’t put in some extra effort to help a student succeed.

    You’re basing a lot of your opinion on the assumption that kids come to school ready to learn and healthy. The reality is that parents and home lives come in a wide variety of flavors. Some parents do exactly what you said: dump on teachers with their own expectations on how students should be handled. But others don’t get involved at all. Some don’t care about their child’s life beyond how it affects them. Some are so busy working to make ends meet that they don’t have time to be much more than an absent parent. No matter what life the student has, it’s still my job to give them a quality education, so of that means giving them a granola bar or calling Joe Suzie, then that’s what it takes.

    We’re basically fighting for the same thing here: better pay, better resources, and support for teachers so that students can get a better education. The difference is that I don’t think students should get the short end of the stick for something they can’t change (i.e. low pay), whereas you’d rather a teacher not do extra because they aren’t getting paid to do extra. But my method reaches the end goal of educating students well, and yours instead basically says, “Reach the goal or don’t. I don’t really care since I did my part.”

    prole ,

    Every teacher I ever had in public school throughout the 90s and early 00s asked students to tell them if they had a nickname or a name they preferred to be called on the first day of class. And then they would do their best to adhere to it.

    Every single one. Nobody gave a shit. There were more important things going on like, I dunno, educating children?

    lath ,

    Most of my teachers in the schools i went to never used a nickname for their students. Those that used nicknames were the exception, not the rule. And guess what happened to them. Parents complained of favouritism and the grades they gave were questioned.

    Every single time. People do give a shit about the non-educating part and it’s an issue schools have to deal with when they’d rather not.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    Confirmation bias. Got it

    Eggyhead ,

    Are you telling me that if a kid named Timmy wants me to call him Tim, I should only be calling him Timmy? Fuck that noise.

    lath ,

    If you’re the teacher of a classroom and it’s not part of your contract to call Timmy as Tim, then little Timmy can go legally change his name to Tim.

    rand_alpha19 ,

    Do you realize how disconnected from reality you sound? Kids' legal names aren't as important as you think they are. Honestly, neither are adults' legal names.

    If someone comes up to you (outside of a school) and says their name is Will, do you say you're only going to call them William? If yes, wow, you are so weird. If not, why does it matter inside of a school and not outside?

    lath , (edited )

    Your teachers seem to have failed you as your reading comprehension is lacking.

    In school, a teacher is an employee. It’s their job. Outside of working hours, they’re not an employee. It’s their personal time. Job, personal time, very different things. If you expect them not to be this way, you’re kinda being an asshole towards them as a person.

    To take the IT guy as an example. Do you expect to call them outside of their working hours to come fix your internet and call you pet names in the process? If so, wow do I have news for you!

    Edit: Talk about disconnected…

    Sharkwellington ,

    The fact that you think a pet name and a preferred name are the same thing shows how much you understand what you’re talking about.

    masterspace ,

    Lmfao, shut the fuck up dumbass.

    We don’t care how fucking dumb you are. Stop coming out here and trying to prove to everyone that you’re too stupid to remember what elementary school was like and that you don’t remember kids having some crazy long foreign name and preferring to go by Tony or whatever. That literally fucking happened to like half of my Italian family when they immigrated here.

    Jesus fucking Christ pull your head out of your ass and stop embarassing your friends and family with your dumbassery.

    lath ,

    I’d give you a picture of a mirror, but you’ll probably think it really is one.

    masterspace ,

    Whiny cry baby running to the mods cause I hurt your feelings.

    Do you enjoy being an embarrassment to your friends and family?

    Bridger ,

    So the name on your birth certificate is “lath”?

    lath ,

    On Lemmy, I have registered with that nickname and as such I expect it to be used.

    Is that so hard to comprehend?

    Cadeillac , (edited )
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    If you call him Tim bad things could happen. It’s a slippery slope to child abuse

    Edit: /s

    MediaBiasFactChecker Bot ,

    NBC News - News Source Context (Click to view Full Report)Information for NBC News:
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    Search topics on Ground.Newshttps://www.nbcnews.com/nbc-out/out-news/teacher-says-contract-wasnt-renewed-wouldnt-use-trans-students-preferr-rcna166500

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    alienanimals ,

    Someone should start going by the name, “I owe you 5 dollars”. It’s a fool-proof way to get rich quick.

    NoIWontPickAName ,

    Seems like this whole problem could have been avoided by just using everyone’s last names.

    NoIWontPickAName ,

    Seems like this whole problem could have been avoided by just using everyone’s last names.

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