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Teacher says contract wasn't renewed because he wouldn't use trans students' preferred names

The Wisconsin English teacher, Jordan Cernek, argues in the suit that the district violated his freedom of religion and free speech in mandating the use of the students’ preferred names and pronouns.

A high school English teacher is suing a Wisconsin school district, alleging it did not renew his contract last year because he refused to use the preferred names of two transgender students.

Jordan Cernek’s federal lawsuit alleges the Argyle School District violated his constitutional and civil rights to be free of religious discrimination and to be able to express himself according to his religious beliefs when it did not renew his contract because he refused to abide by a requirement that teachers use the names or pronouns requested by students.

Zahille7 ,

Idk man. When I was in school before everyone started coming out as trans and such, all my teachers would still ask if there was a different name you preferred on like the first day of school. And they suck to it. It didn’t matter if the student was gay, straight, trans, or whatever; they still had a preferred name they liked to be called by, the teachers asked, and they respected it. I’d like to think those teachers of mine would continue this practice and not have an issue with it, but you never really know.

TallonMetroid ,
@TallonMetroid@lemmy.world avatar

That was my experience as well, but then I grew in San Francisco, which is like the gay hippie commie Mecca that the Christofascists jerk themselves off on hating. Plus we had a lot of minority students with potentially difficult to pronounce ethnic names, so that might also have been a factor.

callouscomic ,

“Your contract WAS renewed, but I don’t think we used your information, like your name or identity or anything. I’m not sure how we referred to you in the paperwork, so I guess we won’t be able to find it.”

acchariya ,

After careful deliberation, we have decided that Jordan is a female name and are unable to renew your contract until you have completed an official name change to Joseph

harrys_balzac ,

Thomas Jefferson wrote that there should be “a wall of separation of Church and State.” Meaning no religion in government matters. Meaning, no tax breaks, no National Cathedral, no “In God We Trust”, no “one nation under God.”

Of course the people who scream about what the Founding Fathers wanted tend to ignore what the Founding Fathers really said.

kibiz0r ,

You’re free to say whatever you want. Nobody’s stopping you. But if you choose to work a job where 80% of it is talking, don’t be surprised when your performance is measured by what you say.

flicker ,

I’m not trans.

I hate my legal name. I will change it when I’m ready to do the paperwork. Until then, everyone calls me the name I prefer.

I would have been a thorn in this teacher’s side. I’m not answering to that name, asshole. I’m not writing it on any documents. I’m allowed to tell you what to call me for whatever reason I want. My mother’s best friend, who I was named for, was an abusive fucking cunt to me and every time you say her name I’m reminded of her.

What a douche. Stop policing names. The only names worth policing are the ones that are remarkably dumb.

watersnipje ,

Byeee

lath ,

As an employee of the school, the only names he should be using are those registered in its official documents. Personal desires should not matter for either side.

Einstein ,

Uh no. Not that hard to call a person by the name they prefer. Don’t be a bigot.

lath ,

Bigotry has nothing to do with it. The name registered is the one that should be used. If your registered name with the school is Richard, but you wanna be called Private Dick, then register it. If you can’t, then that’s another issue entirely.

Dasus ,
@Dasus@lemmy.world avatar

deleted_by_moderator

    •
    DmMacniel ,
    @DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

    It was your personal desire to comment this right? Better delete it because according to you your personal desires don’t matter either!

    Fuck off bigot.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    Let it stay so people know what kind of person they are

    lath ,

    deleted_by_moderator

    •
    DmMacniel ,
    @DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

    Bigotry doesn’t make an exception wether it is showcased in an official capacity/private or personal capacity. As you demonstrated with your comment.

    You believe in objective morality, don’t you?

    lath ,

    Belief and application are rarely the same. I can say I do and so can anyone else. But when it’s time to apply it, well, that’s subjective to the individual in question.

    Objectively speaking, it’s better for a teacher to focus on teaching their subject and ignore all other unrelated issues. It’s not their job to cater to other people’s needs. It’s also not their job to cater to their own personal whims while working. Do the work, then go home and be themselves.

    DmMacniel ,
    @DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

    it’s better for a teacher to focus on teaching their subject and ignore all other unrelated issues. It’s not their job to cater to other people’s needs.

    Look up special needs students, and hopefully realise that you are clearly in the wrong.

    Belief and application are rarely the same. I can say I do and so can anyone else. But when it’s time to apply it, well, that’s subjective to the individual in question.

    so, you are a Prager U “”“”“”““christian””“”“”“” then? Cool cool.

    lath ,

    Oh. Is now having your nickname/preferred name used a special need?

    I did not know that. Guess they should be placed in a specialized class with a trained specialist in charge then.

    …

    DmMacniel ,
    @DmMacniel@feddit.org avatar

    Oh. Is now having your nickname/preferred name used a special need?

    no its not, its common decency. My statement simply showcases that a teacher does not just have to teach their subject and ignore all other unrelated issues SINCE THERE ARE SPECIAL NEEDS STUDENTS.

    lath ,

    Your common decency is only common in your region. Different regions have different ideas of what is common decency.

    In some parts of the world, common decency is to give the name you expect to be used when writing it down for someone else to make use of it.

    And if some students have special needs, then the teacher also needs to be hired with proper information and resources given to them by the school.

    Special needs kids need an environment properly suited to their needs. Anything else would be negligence.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    I’m sure he would have no problem calling a, let’s just say, James David JD if that is what James David preferred. This is just bigotry for the sake of hate

    lath ,

    I’d rather they didn’t. As an official, fraternizing individually only creates problems overall. A teacher should teach a class objectively.

    However, any other extracurricular activities should be separate from regular classes and the relationship is more tight knit, so in that circumstance, nicknames wouldn’t be an issue.

    Ir you don’t separate work from personal life, you’re going to have a bad time.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    What is your government name so I don’t accidentally call you the wrong thing?

    lath ,

    I don’t work for the government and neither am I here as an employee, so have fun with that thought for a while and see what you can learn from it.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    That’s what I figured

    conciselyverbose ,

    As a fucking educator, you should be connecting to every single student in your classroom on a personal level, or you’re unredeemably shit at your job.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    Bro sounds like he was part of Hitler’s Youth

    Ilovemyirishtemper ,

    A good chunk of a teacher’s job is to build appropriate relationships with your students. Students don’t want to learn from someone they dislike, and you have significantly better learning outcomes when the students feel safe, accepted, and cared about. Appropriate nicknames, like Tim for Timothy, help in that relationship building. I don’t know what your position is at that school, but Wisconsin teachers are literally taught stuff like this in college so that we know how to manage a classroom with the best learning outcomes and the fewest number of behavioral disruptions. We are taught how to keep those relationships appropriate and healthy, although much of that is just common sense.

    Yes, you should separate work and home life for both your own sanity and for modeling good boundaries and work-life balance. But that doesn’t mean you have to drop your decency at the door. At the end of the day, the goal is learning, and not being a douche is one of the easiest ways to get to that goal.

    Extracurricular activities are an extension of these same principles, not an exception or something with a different set of standards. I think you might be mixing up appropriate relationship building with inappropriate fraternizing, and I’m concerned that you are having difficulty finding that line.

    lath ,

    Your expectations of teachers and the resources actually given to them are so far apart from each other that you need to take a step back and actually provide them what is needed, not just your expectations of their personalized behavior in regards to how they should treat their students.

    Teachers, parents and the school need to work together and give the support kids need. But what it’s actually like is that both school and parents dump on teachers with their own expectations on how students should be handled, which often contradict each other.

    Teachers don’t actually have to do all of that though. Their job is to impart their knowledge of the subject they were hired for. Everything else is just extra, an option they should be allowed to refuse.

    If you want them to do more, then pay them appropriately. Give them the equipment, the training and the support.

    Ilovemyirishtemper ,

    I definitely agree that there aren’t enough resources given to teachers, but the expectation of using common decency to reach the goal of educating our students is not too high of an expectation. Focus on the end goal. How you get there can vary (assuming it’s appropriate), but you are still trying to reach the goal of educating the students. If your teaching style is prohibiting people from reaching that goal, why wouldn’t you change it?

    It’s nice to think that as an English teacher, I only have to worry about how well they can interpret the modern applications of the lessons in Macbeth, or whatever literature we’re studying, but in reality, teachers are teaching a whole heck of a lot more than their specific subject area. We’re simultaneously modeling how to behave appropriately, teaching how to navigate complex social situations, and mentoring students on how to achieve their goals and deal with set backs. Teachers have always worn more than one hat. It’s not only an expectation for the job; it’s an absolute requirement for success.

    Should they earn more money for having to do all of that? YES! That’s why we’ve been complaining about the low pay and lack of resources for at least 40 years. The effort and skills are non-negotiable. Kids shouldn’t get a crappy education just because some politicians are using their teachers’ wages as political leverage. People go into education knowing that the pay sucks, but they actually care about other people and future generations. They don’t go into just for the paycheck, and I don’t know a single educator who wouldn’t put in some extra effort to help a student succeed.

    You’re basing a lot of your opinion on the assumption that kids come to school ready to learn and healthy. The reality is that parents and home lives come in a wide variety of flavors. Some parents do exactly what you said: dump on teachers with their own expectations on how students should be handled. But others don’t get involved at all. Some don’t care about their child’s life beyond how it affects them. Some are so busy working to make ends meet that they don’t have time to be much more than an absent parent. No matter what life the student has, it’s still my job to give them a quality education, so of that means giving them a granola bar or calling Joe Suzie, then that’s what it takes.

    We’re basically fighting for the same thing here: better pay, better resources, and support for teachers so that students can get a better education. The difference is that I don’t think students should get the short end of the stick for something they can’t change (i.e. low pay), whereas you’d rather a teacher not do extra because they aren’t getting paid to do extra. But my method reaches the end goal of educating students well, and yours instead basically says, “Reach the goal or don’t. I don’t really care since I did my part.”

    lath ,

    You are right.

    But that’s a choice each teacher has to have. Because just like everyone else involved, teachers are only human. Each has their own motivation for teaching and doing more than what’s needed because it’s the right thing to do simply isn’t good enough a reason to force them. Not everyone wants to be a hero.

    prole ,

    Every teacher I ever had in public school throughout the 90s and early 00s asked students to tell them if they had a nickname or a name they preferred to be called on the first day of class. And then they would do their best to adhere to it.

    Every single one. Nobody gave a shit. There were more important things going on like, I dunno, educating children?

    lath ,

    Most of my teachers in the schools i went to never used a nickname for their students. Those that used nicknames were the exception, not the rule. And guess what happened to them. Parents complained of favouritism and the grades they gave were questioned.

    Every single time. People do give a shit about the non-educating part and it’s an issue schools have to deal with when they’d rather not.

    Cadeillac ,
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    Confirmation bias. Got it

    Nastybutler ,

    Bullshit

    lath ,

    Thank you for the manure. It will fertilize the crops nicely.

    ninjabard ,

    Every teacher, instructor, professor I’ve had from kindergarten through graduate school across three states and as many decades has asked every class I’ve been in if a student has a preferred name over the name they’re officially registered with. Every one made a note in their register to call them as such. Refusing to call a student by their preferred name is a new level of pettiness at best and discrimination at worst. A teacher’s job is to make their classroom a place where children feel welcome and safe. Regardless of whatever their personal views are. So, I say with all sincerity and with no irony, fuck your feelings.

    lath ,

    Is that why you’re such a delightful and happy person?

    Eggyhead ,

    Are you telling me that if a kid named Timmy wants me to call him Tim, I should only be calling him Timmy? Fuck that noise.

    lath ,

    If you’re the teacher of a classroom and it’s not part of your contract to call Timmy as Tim, then little Timmy can go legally change his name to Tim.

    rand_alpha19 ,

    Do you realize how disconnected from reality you sound? Kids' legal names aren't as important as you think they are. Honestly, neither are adults' legal names.

    If someone comes up to you (outside of a school) and says their name is Will, do you say you're only going to call them William? If yes, wow, you are so weird. If not, why does it matter inside of a school and not outside?

    lath , (edited )

    Your teachers seem to have failed you as your reading comprehension is lacking.

    In school, a teacher is an employee. It’s their job. Outside of working hours, they’re not an employee. It’s their personal time. Job, personal time, very different things. If you expect them not to be this way, you’re kinda being an asshole towards them as a person.

    To take the IT guy as an example. Do you expect to call them outside of their working hours to come fix your internet and call you pet names in the process? If so, wow do I have news for you!

    Edit: Talk about disconnected…

    Sharkwellington ,

    The fact that you think a pet name and a preferred name are the same thing shows how much you understand what you’re talking about.

    lath ,

    For both the beauty of understanding and its ugliness is that the more your think you understand something, the less you understand it.

    Sharkwellington ,

    The metaphor was bad, just take the L.

    lath ,

    I see. You understand it perfectly then.

    rand_alpha19 ,

    A reading comprehension insult from someone who didn't even answer my actual question?

    Thank Christ you're just working at a school and not an actual teacher.

    lath ,

    I did answer it, you simply failed to recognize it as such.

    A school is an organization with a specific purpose. A teacher is an employee of that organization working there under a contract within a set of rules. The students are the beneficiaries of the services that organization offers. The teachers obligation is to provide those services as specified in their contract. Beyond that and other than the laws of the city and country they reside in, they are not obligated to provide any other service that is requested of them.

    Demanding something that is beyond their obligations and expecting them to accomplish it unconditionally is an assholeish thing to do.

    Ps: You presume too much. Just stuck to the written words and refrain the imagination that flows far beyond them. It will serve you better in the long run.

    rand_alpha19 ,

    My guy, your writing and communication skills clearly just suck if you need to keep clarifying with pretentious drivel. "It will serve you better in the long run," as if you know how anything in the real world works.

    Teachers who don't respect their students' human dignity shouldn't get their contracts renewed. They're not obligated to be a swollen dickhole since that service was not requested of them. You've simply failed to recognize that as such, I suppose.

    masterspace ,

    Lmfao, shut the fuck up dumbass.

    We don’t care how fucking dumb you are. Stop coming out here and trying to prove to everyone that you’re too stupid to remember what elementary school was like and that you don’t remember kids having some crazy long foreign name and preferring to go by Tony or whatever. That literally fucking happened to like half of my Italian family when they immigrated here.

    Jesus fucking Christ pull your head out of your ass and stop embarassing your friends and family with your dumbassery.

    lath ,

    I’d give you a picture of a mirror, but you’ll probably think it really is one.

    masterspace ,

    Whiny cry baby running to the mods cause I hurt your feelings.

    Do you enjoy being an embarrassment to your friends and family?

    Bridger ,

    So the name on your birth certificate is “lath”?

    lath ,

    On Lemmy, I have registered with that nickname and as such I expect it to be used.

    Is that so hard to comprehend?

    Cadeillac , (edited )
    @Cadeillac@lemmy.world avatar

    If you call him Tim bad things could happen. It’s a slippery slope to child abuse

    Edit: /s

    FlyingSquid ,
    @FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

    He better not fucking win. Apart from it being bigoted against trans kids, this opens the door for teachers to give kids whatever insulting nicknames they want. Call the clumsy kid the r-word? Don’t violate his free speech! Call the black kid the n-word? The Book of Mormon clearly says black people are inferior! Don’t violate his freedom of religion!

    Samvega ,

    He better not fucking win. Apart from it being bigoted against trans kids, this opens the door for teachers to give kids whatever insulting nicknames they want.

    Put Elon back in school and call him Cis.

    Viking_Hippie , (edited )

    No need. He’s already getting schooled on his own platform daily by trans, intersex, nonbinary, and cis people of all ages, sexualities, races, and nationalities.

    He’s a unifier: uniting the world in opposition to his bigotry and general obnoxiousness!

    Samvega ,

    I don’t think he is capable of learning, sadly.

    Viking_Hippie ,

    True, but you don’t have to in order to be schooled.

    Samvega ,

    I believe that being schooled requires being humiliated and/or punished. I don’t think he’s up to the former, and I’m not sure who will do the latter.

    joyjoy ,

    Only the Spanish teacher is allowed to do that. Michael -> Miguel.

    Viking_Hippie ,

    Yo soy Cancun!

    rc__buggy ,

    He better not fucking win because a public school teacher needs to check their religion at the door. The SC said that private businesses can practice their religion as part of commerce but this is the public sector. Kim Davis lost her case about refusing the same sex marriage license due to “her religion” and this should follow.

    helloharu ,
    @helloharu@lemmy.world avatar

    We had a similar case in the UK, and the teacher lost their case after taking it to an employment tribunal. Hopefully this one goes the same direction.

    norimee ,

    It’s discrimination because he can’t discriminate others?

    Freedom of discrimination for me, but not for thee?

    Klnsfw ,

    Ban the bully from the school where they harassed kids. It should always be like that.

    Mediocre_Bard ,

    Yep, and good riddance.

    If students do not feel respected, then they will neither give respect nor learn. You call a kid what they want to be called. Without a sense of shared community, the classroom will fail.

    Additionally, there is not a religion on earth that says you can’t use people’s nicknames, preferred names, chosen names, or whatever. This guy can go eat a bag of Dicks.

    Wrench ,

    We had two kids my age that wanted to be called by Final Fantasy character names. AFAIK, no one had any problem with it.

    mosiacmango ,

    I had a classmate that hated her name that went by Peaches. She would politely correct each teacher each year, and it was done.

    The only time I ever saw her have an issue was with a shitheel sub who refused to call her that, and the class literally revolted. Started yelling “thats her name” and “what’s your problem!” We just brutalized that dude for the whole class hour about it. Never saw him again.

    It was great.

    zbyte64 ,

    If your religion tells you to be an asshole to kids, find a new religion. Weird how there are many Christians who don’t have this problem, almost like this is not how normal people act but we have an asshole looking for an excuse 🧐

    SapphironZA ,

    Also weird that they have no problems with that same religion being a hotbed for pedophiles.

    Socsa ,

    Oh no.

    Anyway

    NauticalNoodle ,

    Good.

    Ilovemyirishtemper ,

    Whelp, Walker neutered our teachers’ unions, and the conservatives pushed for being a right to work state, so here are some unexpected consequences of that. They do not have to tell him why his contract wasn’t renewed, and now he doesn’t have a union backing his position. Plus, he wasn’t even “fired,” just not renewed.

    F this teacher for creating an environment of hate.

    jerkface ,
    @jerkface@lemmy.ca avatar

    Teachers don’t even have a union? WHY DO YOU HATE YOURSELVES SO MUCH??

    Maggoty ,

    Because unions are villainous commie organizations who do nothing but sap your paycheck and eat god fearing children. The worst part is they have a better villain laugh than the politicians. Really they just had to be stopped!

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