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The problems and shortcomings of Cosmic (According to Hyprland Dev, Vaxry)

My first impressions with cosmic were terrible to say the least. Amongst the sea of complete dealbreaker issues (horrible stutter and lag, inability to use 240hz, mouse sensitivity not working, etc) the general implementations atm are janky to say the least, tons of empty menus, wasted space, small annoying bugs.

I do realize it’s an alpha, though, so I won’t focus on the “small bugs” that can probably be fixed in 15 mins and will be fixed… in the future.

The current design language, IMO, is one of the worst I’ve seen in a while, but I don’t wanna focus on this as it’s all subjective, after all.

In this blogpost I want to focus on the broader ideology behind it, the direction and selling points.

…

Are we out of our minds? It’s a barely functional alpha. All those quotes (and those are just a few) are at best running on “hopes and prayers” and not the actual experience. What foundation? Moving floating windows? MS Windows 3.0 had that. What potential? To… add more code? Just like to… anything at this stage?!

…

Cosmic is a desktop that, for now, to me, has no goal. Is not catchy. Has not much to offer. I don’t know where System76 wants to take it, but if this doesn’t change, it’s not difficult for me to imagine a future where Cosmic ends up like Unity or Mir. Forgotten and barely used.

It’s receiving a lot of overly-positive reviews based on hopes and prayers, with little to be based on reality, or what we have right now.

This, adding to the aggresive marketing, makes the developers already quite hostile to negative feedback.

Cosmic is, in my opinion, on a not-so-good path at the moment, despite what those news outlets might claim.

…

Even though this is a quite negative blogpost, if any of the developers at Cosmic are reading this: Stop riding on the great reviews. Accept criticism, because you know full well Cosmic is very rough at the moment. Criticism is the thing that will drive your code forward.

astro_ray ,

There are valid criticism to be made about cosmic desktop, like

  • their very liberal customization options that doesn't stop users from ruining the look of the desktop
  • their insistent to theme libadwaita apps disregarding app developers wishes against supporting custom themes.

But those are just subjective criticism and it's still in alpha. All his "criticism" amounts to is whining about the software having glitches in alpha stage.

pastermil ,

Now I know how the Hyprland community got so toxic.

sunzu2 ,

Clicked the link expecting analysis of the architecture or implementation... Got some clown spazzing. WTF

Peasley ,

Couldn’t finish it: too much whining, not enough substance.

I haven’t tried hyprland yet but if this is the guy developing it than maybe I’m good.

Cosmic seems promising. Best of luck to system76, happy to see an alternative opinionated desktop getting some momentum.

thingsiplay ,

The Hyprland devs (or one of them, I don’t exactly know who) is toxic and known for it. Is that person this guy? But I give him his critique, regardless of who the person is. He even acknowledge his bias. Because we should look it from every angle; something we Linux should take this to heart and not forget in general.

I’ve seen a few posts / videos that criticize Cosmic get downvoted and bullied to hell, especially on Reddit.

As if it is a Cosmic only thing. This happens with everything.

System76 is not helping either, as they will proudly claim every 30 minutes that another person said “cosmic looks cool hehe!” and quote it on their twitter and website.

I don’t understand this statement. What does he expect? That System76 talks shitty about Cosmic? What help does he refer to System76 should have done?

Are we out of our minds? It’s a barely functional alpha.

Are you even a developer not recognizing what has been accomplished in such a short time? The team behind Cosmic not only works on a window manager, but on a whole desktop environment. And they needed to build the foundation by working on iced first (the GUI library behind Cosmic).

Basically, System76 will | grep “modern|cool|good” > ~/posts/newBlogpost.txt.

Ah, your toxic comments are so helpful. We are grateful for such a brain shit. (Commenters note: I just try to communicate with him, as that’s the language he speaks.)

… At this point I have enough. I gave him the benefit of doubt, but was disappointed.

e8d79 ,
@e8d79@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

Lol Vaxry is jealous. The part about accepting criticism is especially rich coming from him.

thingsiplay ,

This blog post is barely any critique, just toxicity and shitting. Nothing worth reading or learning from, so the devs could make it better. I hope KDE devs don’t waste their time with this useless post.

simple ,

So basically “there weren’t enough mean spirited reviews on Cosmic so I’ll write my own”. The OP can say he doesn’t like it without making fun of the fanbase and trashing the company for checks notes reporting people’s positive experiences.

Sooo… Cosmic is for the tiny sliver of users that want a DE… that tiles? Or those that buy a System76 machine and never change the DE?

Those that are fed up with GNOME and/or are looking for an alternative DE are a huge chunk of the Linux userbase. That’s literally why they created it. With Gnome reducing customizability and having 5-year old bugs never get fixed and breaking necessary extensions every update, it was warranted.

it feels like the developers are already riding on the endorphins from all the praise and forget their software is after all in a rough state.

Why? They have public milestones and bug trackers while things seem to move at a good pace. At no point are they just sitting on praise doing nothing.

Telorand ,

As you may know, I am the creator and lead developer of Hyprland and the entire ecosystem around it. You might say I’m biased, but I try to approach this from a quite objective side.

Cosmic is not my direct competitor - Hyprland is a compositor for advanced users, Cosmic is (what it’s meant to be, at least) a user-friendly DE.

The lady doth protest too much, methinks. Cosmic has Wayland and tiling, it has the backing of a profitable company, and he’s very obviously salty about it.

BaalInvoker ,

Congratulation System76!

You got your first hater on Cosmic DE!

vikingtons ,
@vikingtons@lemmy.world avatar

I was about to ask, isn’t this guy a prolific dickhead?

axum , (edited )

Vaxry is yes, and also is a nazi sympathizer.

Which is one of several reasons why FreeDesktopOrg banned him from using any resources

vikingtons ,
@vikingtons@lemmy.world avatar

Yikes I wasn’t aware of the second part

deathmetal27 ,

He was actually banned for condoning a toxic anti-trans culture on his Discord. Violating FreeDesktop’s code of conduct.

He also once said “I do believe there could be arguments to sway my opinion towards genocide.”

Estebiu ,
@Estebiu@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

really? seemed a pretty decent guy tbh

axum ,

Hardly

Even on github, it doesn’t take long to find an example of them just acting like an ass. github.com/hyprwm/Hyprland/issues/1817#issuecomme…

refalo ,

I wouldn’t consider that acting like an ass… users often make loads of super-niche requests that most people will never use, and then they’re ungrateful when you don’t do it, so I’m not really surprised at the tone of responses I read in that thread.

It’s easy to judge someone when you haven’t walked in their shoes.

axum , (edited )

This is a pretty clear cut case. Vaxry is:

Edit: fixed first link

refalo ,

The first link doesn’t show what you say it does.

I read the entire second link and I do not agree with your conclusions. Do you have any specific examples that illustrate them?

deathmetal27 ,

This one is pretty comprehensive

drewdevault.com/…/2024-04-09-FDO-conduct-enforcem…

axum , (edited )

I’m not here to persuade you. If the fact the FreeDesktop.org and Void linux have outright refused to interact with Hyprland over this is not enough and you still dont see how this is problematic to developers that might be alienated by how vaxry carries themselves, then you’re not going to be convinced. Either that or you support the toxicity.

Edit: I fixed the link above now, but here it is directly web.archive.org/web/20231106152846/https:/…/3775

Peasley ,

That first link doesn’t have anything like what you describe

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