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jaxxed ,

Zed seems cool, but not much better than other options. I am still kind of thrown off by the immediate GH/CoPilot integration. Am I the an old man left in the caves of feeling that I don’t need the AI help?

crispy_kilt ,

They’ll probably dial it back once the hype settles

AVincentInSpace ,

I still do not understand why Zed makes such a big deal about being GPU accelerated when you’ll be hard pressed to find a single text editor nowadays that isn’t.

bilb ,
@bilb@lem.monster avatar

Yeah, I don’t see why I should care about that. Gimme some crazy graphical effects, particles and shaders!

Thcdenton ,

Ohhh shiiit

potosi ,

text editor

GPU-accelerated renderer

What the fuck?

Thcdenton ,

Sounds pretty cool. Sometimes ill do a quick series of edits in vim and it fuckin chugs. I’m definitly gonna try it

Cube6392 ,

Pretty common feature. Sublime, Lapce, VS Code, certain Emacs distributions, certain NeoVim GUIs… We live in a world where a lot of people have GPUs and CPUs aren’t getting faster so if you want to get more work done (ie, running LSPs, tree sitter, completion engines, snippet engines, debuggers etc) you need to offload some of that work somewhere

crazyminner ,

I tried saving to a file that required root and it didn’t give any prompt to enter the password. On VSCodium normally if you are trying to write to a file that requires sudo then it prompts you.

Is there a way to save to root files with Zed?

cy_narrator ,

Maby launch editor with sudo?

adamnejm ,
@adamnejm@programming.dev avatar

Found the Windows user. On Linux we actually have polkit that can elevate privileges with a GUI prompt.

cy_narrator ,

On Windows you can just right click and run as administrator bro

e922857 ,

Use sudoedit

Simmy ,

Great another editor. Now what we need is a good PS alternative so we can all move away from Windows.

sag ,

PS?

sorter_plainview ,

Most probably Photoshop, else PowerShell

sag ,

Probably, Photoshop because …microsoft.com/…/announcing-powershell-7-1/

Simmy ,

Correct Photoshop.

blackboxwarrior ,

I am BEGGING for any editor other than VSCode to have decent remote development. I want to go open source but everything I’ve tried (remote-nvim, distant, tramp, vscodium, etc.) just doesn’t cut it.

crmsnbleyd ,
@crmsnbleyd@sopuli.xyz avatar

Tramp is awesome :)

Warsk ,

Is VSCode not open source?

Cube6392 ,

It has Microsoft BLObs baked in as part of the build process. VS Codium is the FLOSS distribution of VS code’s open source code. Liveshare doesn’t appear in the package repo Codium uses (because of the Microsoft BLObs it contains as an extension). For work I manually download the live share extension VSX and load it into vscodium

ILikeBoobies , (edited )

Vscode is like Chrome

And

VS Codium is like Chromium

flux ,

Apparently Lapce has remote development as its core feature. But I only (re?)learned of it today…

warmaster ,

What about gitpod?

finestnothing ,

Have you tried running doom emacs in tmux on the remote server and accessing it with ssh? Doom emacs is all the good of an emacs environment, all the good of vim keybinds, and they worked in a decent amount of optimizations so it only loads the necessary stuff on demand (mine has a startup time of just over 1 second, slower than vim but barely an inconvenience). Can write a quick script to ssh copy (or git pull) your current configs on the server so you only have to maintain one set of configs if you want


<span style="color:#323232;">scp ~/.config/doom/config.el username@server:~/.config/doom/config.el
</span>

Run emacs in tmux if you want to keep the emacs session open across multiple ssh sessions

AVincentInSpace ,

holy mother of latency

potosi ,

What in hell is remote development? You mean openssh and vim, right?

Cube6392 ,

Pair programming over the net. The old school way is tmux and vim but to do that you and your partner need port 22 open and most enterprises are gonna be like “hell no you can’t let people connect to your company owned work laptop SSH into your machine”

gkpy ,

would wstunnel help? just run that between both machines and pick whatever works best, even if that is ssh

ErnieBernie10 ,

What I do is use distrobox or any devpod and install it in the container and launch from cli. Works perfectly for me.

janabuggs ,

IntelliJ products my dude! If you go on there education side you can find the packages for free to compile yourself. There’s tons of guides online to do it.

peppy ,

How’s Lapce?

thevoidzero ,

Not much documentation. I tried to use it, but it was really hard to figure out anything.

fin ,

I tried to read the code but the underlying concept was too complex for me to understand

vrighter ,

built from the ground up with rust. Why the fuck is that the first and usually only (non-)feature to mention in any project written in rust? Who the fuck cares?

I fucking hate the rust cult.

UnfairUtan ,

Because most things built with Rust are faster than their equivalent, especially electron-based apps.

So as a user, regardless of the cult following, i’m happy that this tech exists and is being adopted so fast.

Mihies ,

It’s primarily about safety, not speed. Any C or C++ program should match the speed but not the correctness.

eager_eagle ,
@eager_eagle@lemmy.world avatar

no, it’s primarily about speed and resources because the comparison is often not against a hypothetical C/C++ alternative, but against an existing one that is slower and more resource intensive.

vrighter ,

So they should say that it is written with performance in mind. I don’t care how you achieved that. rust, c++, assembly, whatever.

Mention that it has very good collaborative editing.

Mention features.

upto60percentoff ,

VS Code is written with performance in mind. Compared with other electron apps, it's very performant.

Compared with even a sloppily written native app though, it's not great.

vrighter ,

so fucking say that. Designed to be fastest editor. Show benchmarks. Talk about your features. I still don’t care what tools you used to achieve it. It being written in rust does not automatically make things fast. It may even slow things down, in some cases.

upto60percentoff ,

I think you might care about this a touch too much

ParetoOptimalDev ,

So they should say that it is written with performance in mind. I don’t care how you achieved that. rust, c++, assembly, whatever.

I care because performant and secure C++ is much harder to achieve while rust “shepherds” you towards it.

See …blogspot.com/…/its-not-what-programming-language…

vrighter ,

I don’t care how easy it is for the developer. And modern c++ is slightly harder than rust, but not all that difficult to get right with smart pointers and iterators etc.

ParetoOptimalDev ,

If you care about your software being stable and secure, you should care about how easy the programming language used makes and encourages that.

People aren’t robots and make mistakes often.

vrighter ,

translating readable, maintainable code to an unmaintanable mess to solve a couple of issues thit might not be there in the first place, is not so much a winning proposition.

An os? sure. A text editor? not so much

crispy_kilt ,

Everone claims their software is fast. When stating that it is written in a native language it is actually believable.

vrighter ,

but it didn’t do jack shit to help me believe that. Because they did not say that that was the goal. So there was no credibility to affect in the first place.

Also, your argument does not make sense anyway. As a native language, due to some extra copying needed and some runtime checks that cannot be elided, it is slower than c++. It can be almost as fast, really close, but ever so slightly slower.

Electron is written in c++. A native language. A native language faster than rust (we’re talking about speed not safety here). And yet, it is the canonical example of “bloated and slow”. If you were to rewrite electron in rust, it’d be safer, but also at least just as slow.

So if the editor really is faster, it’s not because the code was written in rust. It’s because the devs are writing better code. That’s why just saying it’s written in rust is useless.

DieserTypMatthias ,
@DieserTypMatthias@lemmy.ml avatar

Because most things built with Rust are faster than their equivalent, especially electron-based apps.

And safer, since Electron is just Chromium, which is mainly written in C++.

ProtonBadger ,

You seem upset. Blink twice if someone is forcing you to use it.

DieserTypMatthias ,
@DieserTypMatthias@lemmy.ml avatar

Just go outside and touch some grass.

ParetoOptimalDev ,

I care because I know the values of those programmers in a narrow scope and won’t be as annoyed when I inevitably have to go debug the rust code instead of C.

However, that values statement was challenged by automatic binary downloads without user confirmation.

Luckily the fix is already in progress, but its concerning it was ever implemented.

cy_narrator ,

In an era where every single good code editors are built on Electron, its good to know something isnt

gortbrown ,

I was so happy about this! Been using it on my work MacBook and have been excited to use it on my main laptop!

possiblylinux127 ,

I never understood the need

Rin ,

Vscodium but not running in a browser.

toastal ,

If it can’t run in a terminal, what is the point?

eager_eagle ,
@eager_eagle@lemmy.world avatar

gpu accelerated editor with remote development > terminal editor

ma1w4re ,

There are gpu accelerated terminal emulators… Not sure what you mean by remote development though.

eager_eagle ,
@eager_eagle@lemmy.world avatar

remote development for connecting to a machine without a display server; basically covering the main use case for being constrained to a terminal.

Remote Tunnels in VS Code or JetBrains Gateway for example

I do use a GPU accelerated terminal, but it’s still very limited compared to a GUI; they serve different goals.

ma1w4re ,

Fair

toastal ,

I like to be just as comfortable coding remotely as I do locally. I have the same setup on my machine & on servers. TUIs are sometimes a better UI/UX since they tend to not come with so much bloat & compatibility with all window managers as well as working great for extremely lightweight, low-latency pairing like the experience provided by upterm. My terminal is also GPU-acceraletd too for performance.

possiblylinux127 ,

VScodium is running in the browser. It is electron based.

Rin ,

Zed is native

BB_C ,

It’s not you who needs it.
It’s for buzzword chasers and cost cutters.

Rust (=> fast and hip)
Shared (=> outsourced)
AI generated (=> robot devs)

Get it?

DieserTypMatthias ,
@DieserTypMatthias@lemmy.ml avatar

The Rust hype at least makes sense. The other two are just utter bullshit.

BB_C ,

The Rust hype at least makes sense.

In technical context, yes. I’m a Rustacean myself.
In business/marketing context, …

crispy_kilt ,

It also makes sense in a business context, because Rust enables memory safety at native speed, and enables building more reliable software due to its strong type system.

Safety and reliability are business critical in many industries.

LunarLoony ,
@LunarLoony@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

Rustacean

Is that why the mascot’s a crab??

aramus ,

I still don’t understand why I should need GPU acceleration for my fucking TEXT EDITOR

sorrybookbroke ,

Sppeeed

FlorianSimon ,

Think about battery life too 🎉

FlorianSimon ,

Probably because it’s more efficient. GPUs are designed to render things, which editors do. In a text editor, you’re effectively rendering fonts over a fixed background, which I assume is pretty efficient using the GPU.

We’re not talking about crazy 3D effects here.

Yay to battery savings!

booly ,

Shouldn’t the DE/Window Manager be handling that? Seems like doing it on a window by window basis would be inefficient (and look inconsistent).

leopold ,

The job of the window manager is to manage windows and very little else. Font rendering is done by the widget toolkit, usually via freetype/harfbuzz.

AProfessional ,

That’s a totally unrelated part of the stack. These days you just have a compositor that combines the output of applications.

The model of out of process rendering in Xorg was done pre-2000s but GPUs became the norm and don’t work well this way.

ParetoOptimalDev ,

The model of out of process rendering in Xorg was done pre-2000s but GPUs became the norm and don’t work well this way.

Thats where we get into explicit and implicit sync right?

AProfessional ,

Also very unrelated, that’s about graphics apis like opengl.

www.khronos.org/opengl/wiki/Synchronization

electricprism ,

Smooth scrolling? Maybe I’m wrong

naught ,

I mean, it should be clear. Smooth and fast and snappy. If you don’t want that, use neovim like me :)

ma1w4re ,

But… Neovim is smooth, fast and snappy 😭

naught ,

Hold down j and lmk how smooth it is 😅

ma1w4re ,

😭😭😭

shy_mia ,

Terminals applications are, by definition, not smooth. You can’t have smooth scrolling, or anything else really, with a text grid.

ma1w4re ,

Idk I’m so used to working in terminal I don’t really notice that. For my eyes, it’s smooth enough

ryannathans ,

Same reason you need it for your terminal (see kitty terminal). It’s surprisingly slow to cpu render text, gpu rendering is more power efficient and far more responsive

fruitycoder ,

It was surprising how gpu accelerated rendering helped read logs better. Niche case, but better was better.

laughterlaughter ,

Better in what sense?

fruitycoder ,

More readable on my part. The speed at which logs could write to the screen and still be readable was faster for me compared to before.

laughterlaughter ,

Interesting! I’d like to experience this at some point.

laughterlaughter ,

Surprisingly slow compared to GPU rendering. But… is it really “surprisingly slow”? If it was some 10mhz machine, then sure… I’d agree with you.

ryannathans ,

Look at the benchmarks on kitty sw.kovidgoyal.net/kitty/performance/

Phoenix3875 ,

Maybe I’m missing something, but shouldn’t the benchmark be a good approximation to the real workload? I don’t see how the measurements reflect the performance difference in real life usages.

Why would I need 100MiB/s processing as opposed to 20MiB/s processing, when I can only read maybe several lines per second?

ryannathans ,

Faster processing means more efficient processing which means less power draw.

github.com/kovidgoyal/kitty/issues/2701#issuecomm…

How about keypress latency? Over 3x faster than gnome terminal and 4x faster than alacritty

atzanteol ,

Same reason you need it for your terminal

So I don’t.

boredsquirrel ,
@boredsquirrel@slrpnk.net avatar

github.com/zed-industries/zed/issues/7054#issueco…

They auto download binaries, even proprietary ones, unsigned and without user interaction.

YEAH security!

savvywolf ,
@savvywolf@pawb.social avatar

So they’re doing the equivalent of VSCode(ium)'s extensions, but installing them automatically and not giving you the option to use alternatives?

Blegh.

eager_eagle ,
@eager_eagle@lemmy.world avatar

Why are copilot and some other functions not extensions?

tl;dr: General purpose extensions are not even implemented yet

zed is very much an early stages editor; it’ll look very different a year from now

aaro ,

I think they auto install some binaries like nodejs that are required for baseline functionality, but have a popup window for additional language LSPs

hswolf ,
@hswolf@lemmy.world avatar

what if I wanted to use deno or bun? I don’t think that should be their decision to install “default” stuff that have alternatives

I’m all for their improvement tho

aaro ,

I don’t see your point? Nodejs is installed in a custom directory and not added to PATH. It is used by Zed for providing npm support for extensions, and other things. I’m not a Zed developer so I don’t know exactly.

It doesn’t prevent you from using deno or bun in any way.

hswolf ,
@hswolf@lemmy.world avatar

I see, that’s greatif it is only locally installed and used, messing with PATH could, probably, break stuff like nvm or others

PushButton ,

Quoting the guy:

“that rewriting those in Rust will take an eternity, so not sure what is actionable here, hence closing.”

That’s Rust shining from all its glories here gentlemen…

The best language, if there is nothing changing.

That’s a thing to make a web server or a library that displays Fibonacci, that’s something else when there are humans with changing scopes…

boredsquirrel ,
@boredsquirrel@slrpnk.net avatar

Its not Rusts fault, the devs are simply lazy and making insecure products, as they dont want to rewrite everything.

PushButton ,

That’s what I am saying.

To quote you: “they don’t want to rewrite everything” …

Writing Rust often implies major refactoring and it takes so much time to write that your requests go: “pewf” closed due to the amount of effort it takes.

Anyway, been there, done that! Zig is probably the real future; it’s a joy to write, it compiles fast, clear to read, and safe.

It has shared libraries and a proper integration with existing C/CPP code base.

You should try it, that’s an amazing language with a real potential to replace the legacy.

AVincentInSpace ,

I dunno man… I’m not sure I’m so keen on a language that prides itself on not having macros

PushButton ,

Comptime replaces macros/reflection.

It’s basically Zig code that runs at compile time in your code…

No other “weird” language to learn; it’s zig all the way. What you would have written in macro is written in zig comptime.

Even the build system is zig…

Same for generics, it’s comptime…

ParetoOptimalDev ,

They were exaggerating to avoid work. Look at the PR diff to determine whether your anti-Rust bias is true.

PushButton ,

There are no patch, the issue has been closed as in rejected.

There are a few tasks that are open that are loosely related, but let’s not mix things up.

Moreover, I will take the words of the maintainers over a random potato on a forum.

No offense…

ParetoOptimalDev ,

The issue was closed, but a draft PR was linked… potato:

github.com/zed-industries/zed/pull/14034

PushButton ,

As I mentioned, a couple of tasks loosely related. The patch you are mentioning isn’t complete nor address the real problem.

It is an ugly hack at best.

Refrain from your urge to defend rust at all costs. You are sliding more and more toward the specifics of a project than the fact I stated about rust in general.

If you still not get my initial point I’ve made, read this.

That’s a long read explaining what I meant. My point was about Rust, not Zed or the developers of Zed in particular.

And for the Zed editor, I wish them the best luck, it seems like a great project that people enjoy.

Please feel free to comment and share your thoughts on the article above, my dear favorite nutritious veggie.

fxdave , (edited )

I use rust only if we need performance, for small services. The industry does the same. People use node for backend but e.g. redis is in rust. It’s a good tool if you use it for the right stuff.

EDIT: redis is not in rust, but e.g. aws writes many services in rust

PushButton ,

Wtf are you talking about? Redis is in C…

fxdave ,

yeah I’m a fucking idiot because I thought wrongly the redis’ language…

crispy_kilt ,

You’re not an idiot, you just misremembered. It happens

chemicalwonka ,
@chemicalwonka@discuss.tchncs.de avatar

Always

RacoonVegetable ,

Zed is now officially the best editor ever

EarthShipTechIntern ,

Why?

RacoonVegetable ,

Because I like it

TeryVeneno ,

What a lovely answer, made my day fr

RacoonVegetable ,

https://reddthat.com/pictrs/image/5bcc4d87-0553-405b-88f1-9813e946dac6.jpeg

EarthShipTechIntern ,

Because it was all picture, I had to search around to upvote (using Boost, voting is hidden until you select the comment. Comment is picture? It takes you to the picture (without voting options)).

Worth it. Otter & cat pic brightened my day.

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