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Transcendant ,

Never too late. Rote memorisation becomes more difficult as we age, but it’s not impossible. I’ve been learning one of the more difficult languages (Finnish) in my 40s for about 300 days now, and I am making progress.

Look into ‘active learning’, it’s far more effective than apps like DuoLingo (which I use heavily, it does have its place)

bionicjoey ,

I work for the Federal Government of Canada, and for reasons that are hopefully obvious, it’s important that they are able to have a pipeline that teaches French to people over the age of 25 in about a year. It’s not as simple as just watching media though. The French training for public servants starting at 0 French is a full-time job. People literally disappear from their jobs for a year or more in order to learn French.

cheese_greater OP ,

Is there a way to access this as a fellow Federal employee (dont wanna elaborate over here)

bionicjoey ,

Ask your manager. Different departments have different amounts of training available. Also look into the CSPS French training.

At my department, there is also in-house part-time training. It just varies a lot from department to department.

The full-time training I mentioned is usually offered to people who are lined up for a manager/director job since there’s the baguette-glass-ceiling

PerogiBoi ,
@PerogiBoi@lemmy.ca avatar

It probably would be a good idea not to publicly identify as a goc worker in a social media forum.

bionicjoey ,

We’re allowed to. We just can’t claim to speak for the government.

1bluepixel ,
@1bluepixel@lemmy.world avatar

Yes you can, with one caveat.

According to Stephen Krashen’s input hypothesis, compelling, comprehensible input is sufficient to acquire a language. That means input that you find interesting and that keeps you engaged, and which you can understand at least in part. That evolving sweet spot can indeed take you from complete newbie to fluency without ever speaking.

In my experience, though, being able to speak with other native speakers is a huge source of motivation and creates its own compelling input. So I wouldn’t discount that.

I personally know someone who went from no English to being able to converse just by watching The Simpsons.

prunerye ,

Adults are worse at passive learning than kids, but focused learning works just fine. You’re probably better off buying/pirating something like rosetta stone than you are watching sitcoms.

sosodev ,

As others have said it is never too late to learn a language. Our brains are just as capable, if not more, when we’re adults.

I’m also a firm believer that comprehensible input (listening and attempting to understand) is the best way to learn a language. You can’t start with high level speech though. You need to start with speech that is aimed at beginners or you won’t understand enough for it to be effective.

Studying vocabulary in parallel helps a lot because it helps you learn niche words that don’t come up often in normal speech.

The typical recommendation with comprehensible input is to listen for around a thousand hours and then start practicing with conversation and books as well.

Good luck! Remember that with enough dedicated time you can learn anything. :)

Nevrome ,
@Nevrome@lemmy.ca avatar

It’s never too late to learn a language. However, French is one hell of a step coming from English.

French is my main language and even if I’ve been speaking it for close to 40 years now, I still learn language exceptions and rules today.

Still, I’d give it a go if I were you, learning something new is always fun. Enjoy!

bionicjoey , (edited )

French is tough, but I’d argue it isn’t that hard compared to some other languages. Grammatical gender and conjugation are a pain in the ass, but the vocabulary is very familiar to a native English-speaker because of the languages’ common history (thanks, William the Conqueror)

cheese_greater OP ,

Im Canadian and also already have a significant french education, just never got “conversational”, def have since like age 3 exposure if only Ontarioish

davel ,
@davel@lemmy.ml avatar

If you want a rough comparison of the relative difficulty for a native English speaker to learn different languages, the US military’s Defense Language Institute’s guidelines are well-regarded, and they consider Spanish, French, Italian and Portuguese to be the easiest.

Camus ,
@Camus@jlai.lu avatar

Hello,

Feel free to join us on !france or !forumlibre (our version of !casualconversation )

simple ,

It’s never too late to learn a language but it’s a bit of an uphill battle, and you’re not going to learn it by just watching shows. You need to practice regularly and understand the grammar and sentence structure. You also have to speak it with other people to get feedback, you can’t only learn to listen.

givesomefucks ,

It’s about brain plasticity and 25 is kind of the same as 45…

So they can learn French in an “anything is possible if you try” kind of way, but realistically unless they straight up move to France and completely dive into it, it’s going to be a massive struggle to get to where they can even understand French shows without English subtitles.

Like, at a certain point people should realistically evaluate the amount of work and payoff they get from stuff.

Marrying a French person and wanting to learn their language? Yeah. That’s probably worth the work.

Wanting to watch French TV without reading? Not so much

Squizzy ,

Learning a language has benefits beyond that, it can be it’s own reward to have dedicated time to something and have it pay off and it is good for brain health. Bilingual people suffer less from dementias.

givesomefucks ,

Bilingual people suffer less from dementias.

Pretty sure that’s people who were bilingual their whole lives, not people who learned another language later in life. It’s about how the brain deals with thinking in both languages.

Once you’re older it’s the same benefit as sudoku, which is still something

adam_y , (edited )
@adam_y@lemmy.world avatar

Yeah, no.

This is bullshit.

(Especially the stuff about brain plasticity and learning capacity)

https://www.thebritishacademy.ac.uk/publishing/review/30/neural-plasticity-dont-fall-for-hype/

cheese_greater OP ,

Can you please just edit and rephrase so its obvious as to what direction you are indicatingn in terms of BS?

adam_y ,
@adam_y@lemmy.world avatar

Sure, but just to be clear, it’s about the brain plasticity and diminishing returns. That stuff just isn’t true.

Here’s what the British academy has to say on the subject:

https://www.thebritishacademy.ac.uk/publishing/review/30/neural-plasticity-dont-fall-for-hype/

notfromhere ,

Sounds like you’re agreeing with GP that “it’s all babble”.

givesomefucks ,

That example about London cabbies is actually one of my favorite studies…

But changes to certain structures in the brain isn’t what I was talking about. And I’ve never heard of that being categorized as neuroplasticity.

Which makes it even weirder that the article is about how we should differentiate more.

So let’s stay specific?

www.frontiersin.org/articles/10.3389/…/full

ArcticDagger ,

But that study was done on people aged 65+ for 11 weeks? I mean, sure, they didn’t measure any significant changes to the brain, but that doesn’t preclude changes forever. 11 weeks is not long to practice a language

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