Gruvbox on a dark brown bg slaps. I wasn’t a huge fan of gruvbox but as I was working on this I couldn’t get the terminal theme to make sense and I saw a post with gruv and it clicked. Probably a gruvbox fan for life now
Someone mentioned antifa at work the other day, and I said, “Antifa? I’m in. Shitting on fascists has been an American pass time for a century or better.”
The looks of shock and horror on my coworkers faces was quite the sight to behold.
Well, I can tell you, in Europe Extremist Voters switch without thinking twice between far left and far right.
Methods, Objectives and Goals are the same, just the arguments differ slightly.
Both hate the West, especially the US and Israel, both hate the way we live but without offering a better way. Both want to burn down the house just to see who survives. Only the Arguments differ, the left hate the people running their own society, the right hate the people running other society.
And always remember, Hitler was a National-SOCIALIST.
The “Socialist” in the NSDAP is only a honeypot so they could claim ground and voters who leaned socialist without much thought (“I’m a mill worker like my father before me, we have always voted socialist. Buuut that National-Thing sounds nice”). Same with the “A” which stands for “Arbeiter” (Workers).
There’s the same with the conservative party (CDU = Christdemokratische Union, Christ-Democratic Union) today. Lots of old people say “I’m a christian and that party has a C for ‘Christianity’ in its name.” In fact, their regional party in Bavaria, the CSU is more conservative. And you have three guesses what their “S” is for.
I mean that would make sense if Antifa had anything to do with fascism. It’s just one of many movements wearing labels that intentionally misrepresent it’s members.
It’s like being anti-Patriot act and then others claiming that you’re against patriotism.
You wouldn’t know a fascist if it grabbed you by the pussy.
And that’s like saying “If Black Lives Matter were actually black” or something. Antifa isn’t a group, person, or organization…it’s an idea. Much like BLM or Occupy.
The real problem is that the idea ends up losing focus as it gains support, and then it gets spread out too far, and then it dies. Happens nearly every time.
You wouldn’t know a fascist if it grabbed you by the pussy.
You’re correct. I wouldn’t. Because I don’t have one.
Antifa isn’t a group, person, or organization…it’s an idea.
Tell that to it’s supporters.
Much like BLM or Occupy.
Wrong again.
The real problem is that the idea ends up losing focus as it gains support, and then it gets spread out too far, and then it dies. Happens nearly every time.
BLM and Occipy aren’t organizations. There is a BLM organization. But that’s like if I created an organization called Feminism. That wouldn’t make Feminism an organization. That just means there’s an organization based on the movement.
Yes, sure, it can, but I think it’s more of just a sign of the times. I think infiltrating and co-opting an ideology, intentionally, is pretty difficult…unless the infiltrator already has a large platform, they will likely be drowned out. Otherwise I think sabotage is a better (as in more effective) approach to slowing a movement (such as inciting riots).
For one, communication is rampant and anybody can get a platform. This is great for starting and growing a movement, but this makes it really difficult to maintain a movement. A large number of well-meaning people with a pre-existing platform (namely influencers and YouTube personalities these days) that each interpret and redistribute the message just sligntly different than original. From there it spirals into a huge, multi-pronged game of telephone.
For two, a lot of the leftist movements inspire democrats to join into the crowd. The democrat party has become the de facto big tent party. At this point it’s embodying the ideals of like 80% of the political compass. Naturally, this attracts a diverse range of idealogies, who want to interpret and spread the movement slightly differently.
Lastly…it’s fucking tough to lead a movement man. I couldn’t imagine what it takes to essentially corral millions of people around an idea.
The first and third points are probably why we don’t see a lot of celebrity activists these days to the level of MLK or Malcom X. The increased scale and speed must make it incredibly difficult to get and maintain control.
I don’t support fascisms, but I also don’t support violence and property damage to get the message across. I will never take a “movement” seriously that uses vandalism to get a message across.
One is an attempt to overthrow democracy and install a fascist theocratic dictatorship. The other is protesting directly against that. While you may not agree with their methods, which is frankly childish and placing the responsibility for our social climate in the laps of the oppressed, you cannot in good faith smile smugly and say “same”.
In that case, I suppose you also oppose the Civil Rights Movement, considering it too was often violent and had a significant amount of property damage.
But their methods were a result of their material conditions, and resulted in the liberation of Black Americans from segregation. Do you not equally take fault with the white moderates who opposed ending segregation and used disapproval of their methods as rhetoric?
Unfortunately, when protests get extreme, there is inevitably some level of violence, whether that be to people or property. It is the responsibility of the state to prevent it from getting this bad. People don’t just think “hmm, today I will do some violence,” violence erupts as a consequence.
Not what I said. If protests last long enough and are founded on unsustainable material conditions, the State has failed and protests will become Riots. “Riots are the voice of the unheard,” after all.
If you think peacefully asking people to stop being pieces of shit works, then you learned a completely whitewashed version of the Civil Rights Movement. MLK led marches and tried to maintain peace, but alongside the militant Black Panthers there was genuine revolutionary pressure that forced the state to act.
I shank them with a rusty scrap of metal to the neck
One of these is obviously worse. Yes, both are violence. Yet to simply try and paint them as such would show you’re either not arguing in good faith, or, as respectfully as possible, your brain hasn’t fully developed.
But let’s mix it up. I slap someone. But I, a man that’s 6’2" and does physical labor, slapped an infant for crying. Seems a little worse than it did at first, huh?
I am being attacked by a random person who is trying to murder me, and in a panic, I grab something, and attack him with it. Turns out it was a rusty piece of metal. Now we have hints of self defense.
Once again, still violence, but both were to different degrees, and the context changed both of them.
We live under a hostile occupation by security forces employed by the wealthy class, there are deaths everyday due to the systems maintained by wealth and greed.
I didn’t say the US was fascist, I’m saying our world is controlled by hoards of wealth and nearly all state actions are to protect that wealth and the people that hold it at the cost of the well-being of the proletariat.
Do you think people normally resort to mass murder in protest of, say, slightly decreased toilet paper thickness? If there’s an issue that is so pressing that there’s actually mass murder, then the State is an utter failure for not addressing said issue before it got to that point, and is almost certainly a fascist system.
yes, let’s hope the protestors are well adjusted and their measures are proportional. After all ideologies have never caused anyone to commit a tragedy.
People are driven by their material conditions far more than ideas. Mass protests happen for a reason, there are genuine grievances that are not being addressed. It is the responsibility of the state to properly address protests, and if they fail, they become riots.
No, violence is not good. Nobody is saying it is. However, people are correctly placing the responsibility of the origin of said violence on the oppressor, not the oppressed lashing out.
That’s quite the slippery slope fallacy. I replied to your comment of:
I don’t support fascisms, but I also don’t support violence and property damage to get the message across. I will never take a “movement” seriously that uses vandalism to get a message across.
Which at no point mentions mass murder. “Oh, you support people protesting? What about BLOWING UP THE PLANET IN PROTEST?! Is THAT okay then?”
The fact that you equate property damage with mass murder really says a lot about you.
As you can see, a good part of the diff (+17048) is actually data or autogenerated stuff. There’s not much review that has to be done, outside of a quick glance to verify those claims. I swear I didn’t put any malware in there :P
every time someone reposts this I wonder if this is one of those AI generated photos in which everything in the photo looks vaguely identifiable but it’s not really identifiable because it’s AI and not real. But the man is a man. I know that much.
the strawman is “vote blue no matter who”
…
no, it’s vote blue whenever “red” is a literal dictator, who promises to be a dictator when elected, who tried a coup once already, who leads a fascist gop splinter group…
vote any fucking color against that shit, not no matter who.
there’s bad, and there’s barely distinguishable from hitler bad…
stop lying
i haven’t seen a single “vote blue no matter who” since hillary…
yet i keep seeing it over and over again on lemmy, as an intentional misrepresentation of people who just want to stop drumpf…
well, mostly from hexbeer
If you are against people who are against fascists, wouldn’t that indirectly say you don’t care about fascism? And that’s how fascism gets a foothold. And with that logic, you indirectly support fascism.
That’s true in some cases, like being anti-microsoft doesn’t mean I love Linux. But when you are against an ideology that opposes the othering of groups of people to the point of mass suffering and murder that’s different.
Choosing not to support a fight against Fascism is inherently in support of Fascism. The ideology uses manipulation and violence to oppress people, the end goal being a hyper capitalistic ethno state. So opposing the force which seeks to overcome fascism makes it easier for fascism to prevail.
lemmy.ml
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