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fckreddit ,

We really are fucked aren’t ?

theblueredditrefugee ,

Once again, when we talk about geoengineering we are focusing on blocking the suns rays instead of removing CO2 from the air. How is blocking out the sun going to help with ocean acidification? That’s caused by CO2 dissolving in the water, not by global temperatures. Every fucking time. Do these people never think?

LeZero ,
@LeZero@lemmy.world avatar

These people don’t want to upset their masters, otherwise their political opponent will get funding and they’ll be out of a cushy job. Also, they probably have some wealth stashed away and think they wont be affected by climate change, as for the common people, they give zero fucks about them.

This is an expensive bandaid that will or will not work, and adress merely one of the problem caused by human industrialisation, it doesnt adress soil depletion for an example…

Akasazh ,
@Akasazh@feddit.nl avatar

Well the wildfires did a great job of preventing those pesky solar rays of reaching the earth

u_tamtam ,

This thread’s take is pretty naive. The topic of geoengineering predates the 80’s if not longer, and is a typical case of Tragedy of the Commons.

Let’s suppose, for the sake of the argument, that the technical side of the issue (how, how much, to what extend) is solved. Now we have our best scientists planning accurately what to spread where and in which amount to make the planet cool to its pre-industrial levels. This is a gigantic effort, and mobilizes all countries on Earth. The perfect ground for some countries to think “well, if I spray X% less, my climate will be milder, I will outgrow the neighbours’ country crops and provide a better future for my people”. Sabotages are discovered, pledges are broken, wars are fought.

Anticipating on that, undisputed World Leader Country X plans for everyone everywhere all at the same time for what it consider is only fair: maintain the status quo. And proceeds unilaterally with the plan. Sabotages are made, wars are fought.

Back to today’s world. We currently can’t collectively solve climate change by reducing emissions, although the course of action is dead-simple, because millennia of geopolitics and self-serving policies get in the way. The technical ability to geo-engineer the problem away could be nothing more than more complex way to shout ourselves in the foot, faster and louder.

kinther OP ,
@kinther@lemmy.world avatar

So you’re saying we should do nothing, or?

u_tamtam ,

I expect we will end up doing it anyway (because no other option), so better research it more so we have better models, but fundamentally it won’t solve the core issue.

LeZero ,
@LeZero@lemmy.world avatar

US & EU quietly begin to huff copium at an accelerated rate

Mf will do anything except acting against corporations

How about you send BP (and other petro companies) shareholders to solitary confinement instead of spending who knows how many billions to modify the atmosphere (which won’t have any unintended consequences of course)

kinther OP ,
@kinther@lemmy.world avatar

More drastic suggestions will become common in the next few years. We won’t stop BAU, so logically geoengineering comes next

HobbitFoot ,

Because people bitch like hell whenever gas prices go up.

Environmental regulations have political backing when you can see the affects. Climate change is a lot less defined.

NuPNuA ,

People are moaning about ULEZ zones and the electric car switchover in the UK, we’re still doing them and ignoring the luddites. You could do the same in the US.

HobbitFoot ,

New York City is trying to put in a ULEZ zone into lower Manhattan right now, but it is taking a while and may end up with New Jersey suing New York City at some point.

Even then, the explicit goal of the zone is to raise money, not reduce emotions. I expect that a waiver for electric vehicles will not be provided.

theblueredditrefugee ,

Eating oil barons is vegan

TomHardy ,
@TomHardy@lemmy.ml avatar

The EU & US are gonna fight the sun before they fight capitalism. Every year they announce X billions of investment, and in the following years nobody even remembers where all that money went. Then they repeat the process, increasing the numbers each time. Isn’t this the peak of neoliberalism?

InverseParallax ,

FINALLY!!

It’s the only solution we could possibly execute on, the longer we take to figure that out the worse it is for everyone.

kinther OP ,
@kinther@lemmy.world avatar

Sadly I think you are right. We have to stop the warming or slow it down somehow. Considering we are never going to stop the wheels of civilization, people won’t stop driving, won’t stop eating meat, and otherwise won’t accept a decrease in their standard of living, it leaves us no alternatives.

We either geoengineer our way out of this mess, or we die.

sovietsnake ,
@sovietsnake@lemmygrad.ml avatar

The climate crisis is not because of the wheels of civilisation or because that or this, it’s because of capitalism. There are alternatives, but these alternatives hurt shareholders profits, so they are not discussed.

InverseParallax ,

The climate crisis is not because of the wheels of civilisation or because that or this, it’s because of capitalism.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aral_Sea

u_tamtam ,

I mean, maybe, if that makes you feel better (because the argument is purely an exercise in epistemology).

Fact is, humans didn’t need to invent capitalism to collapse whole ecosystems (Easter Island is often brought up as an example here). I don’t think other economical systems would fare much better, to be honest. I think what we see is the result of individualistic societies, of generally placing comfort and immediate needs above sustainability, of being organized in competing tribes (who prefer to be above the neighbour than higher with them), and of playing with a science we barely understand as an amplifier.

InverseParallax ,

We need to be careful and smart, but yeah, this is the only way out, better we start now.

We can cut down on meat and gas cars too, the low-hanging fruit, but pretending we’re all somehow going back to hunting-gathering while sustaining our current population is some kind of delusional fantasy that only comes from drinking too much LSD.

bezerker03 ,

While this terrifies me it is also probably the only way to actually get something done. The idea that we as a species will give up quality of life to cool the planet is absurd. We as rich nations won’t and developing nations can’t afford to give up the edge it gives them to continue at the current rate.

Also this will give the conspiracy theorists something to tout as a win because they think we’re doing this anyway. :)

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