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june ,

What’s the ‘terminated’ language mean if not ‘dead’?

Daveyborn ,
@Daveyborn@lemmy.world avatar

Good question. Fired maybe?

june ,

So 9 people got fired and one murdered. Sounds like there’s a bit of inequity with how they handle these issues

ShroOmeric ,

That is so clearly bullshit is almost comedy.

Rapidcreek ,

My guess is that by the way the unfunding quickly played out that the proof is substantial. It’s going to be more than a dozen before they see countries tax dollars again.

OccamsTeapot ,

Does anyone know what this proof is? Seems odd that you have to guess

Rapidcreek ,

You can go back through the years and see Israel complain that the UNRWA was fostering hate. Madaris in that part of the world have been known to do that. The proof that they’re actively involved in terrorism is above our pay grade, but we do know various hostages were being held by teachers and doctors.

OccamsTeapot ,

The proof that they’re actively involved in terrorism is above our pay grade

How convenient. So we’re just supposed to take it on trust.

Of course I have seen the Israeli claims and read the UN Watch report where they quote some social media posts. Probably not enough to stop aid to a humanitarian organization but maybe it’s because my “pay grade” is too low to find out the really juicy facts they have which definitely totally exist and aren’t just made up ad hoc justifications for cruelty.

Rapidcreek ,

Dude. If you think you should be able to walk into intelligence agencies and get their information on a particular topic, that’s truly sad.

OccamsTeapot ,

Source: bro trust me

Lol what a joke

Rapidcreek ,

I don’t think anyone really cares who you trust.

OccamsTeapot ,

The fact remains that the source for this claim is bro trust me. Nobody should care who I trust. But I’m sure most people can see that “bro trust me” is completely useless. I will believe it when I see evidence

Rapidcreek ,

You are not asked to believe it.

Deceptichum ,
@Deceptichum@kbin.social avatar

Than we won’t support our governments for blindly believing it.

Rapidcreek ,

They have the information so they’re not blind. At least not as blind as you.

Deceptichum ,
@Deceptichum@kbin.social avatar

Yeah sure, like they had the information on Saddams WMDs!

assassin_aragorn ,

Yeah, or about Russia invading Ukraine! Wait.

If you look at documents at the time, intelligence agencies said there was a possibility he had WMDs, but there was no conclusive evidence nor assurances.

The Bush Administration lied to Congress and said we knew for sure they had them.

Edit: It’s good to have healthy skepticism – it hasn’t escaped my notice that the majority of evidence behind this claim is coming from Israel. I don’t think it’s wise to deem it automatically false however, and pulling funding is premature. There should however be a serious internal investigation. And if they already have smoking guns, the UN should release them in the interest of transparency.

Apologies for starting out my comment as a bit of a jackass.

snek ,
@snek@lemmy.world avatar

So “trust me bro” then?

BigDill99 ,

deleted_by_author

    •
    Rapidcreek ,

    Random insult back atcha.

    BigDill99 ,

    Not random. Genuine observation.

    Rapidcreek ,

    Your online observations are Insults. I see.

    BigDill99 ,

    Just for you today, bub.

    OccamsTeapot ,

    Nobody should believe anything because of a “bro trust me” and if you do you have a serious problem. I know nobody cares if I believe it, I am not stupid

    Rapidcreek ,

    Denual is a refuge for weak arguments. Obviously the the countries that control fund8ng are not in denial.

    snek ,
    @snek@lemmy.world avatar

    Bruh, “above our paygrade” is a prime example of denial, deflection, and appeal to authority.

    Rapidcreek ,

    Another way of saying I do not have the information that the various countries have is not denial.

    OccamsTeapot ,

    Scepticism in the face of a lack of evidence, especially for a claim from one side involved in a war, is not only a good idea but necessary. Would you just believe a Russian claim about Ukranian schools, no questions asked?

    Rapidcreek ,

    You can be a skeptic as much as you want. But, the funding countries aren’t. The UN having already fired personnel aren’t.

    OccamsTeapot ,

    Never mind

    DarkGamer ,
    @DarkGamer@kbin.social avatar

    During the 2023 Israel-Hamas war one of the hostages said after having been freed that he had been held in a house of a UNRWA teacher. UNRWA said that it is aware of the claims and is investigating it.[144] Additionally, teachers and other educational staff of UNRWA have been reported praising Hamas's terrorism on social media, referring to it as an "unforgettable glorious morning" and a "splendid sight."[145][146][147] The IDF uncovered assault rifles, ammunition, grenades and missiles with varying capacities of Hamas, hidden in and underneath UNRWA institutions.[148][149][150][151]
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/UNRWA

    This reminds me of the constant denials by haters of Israel regarding the rocket attack on the hospital.

    Lots more evidence of the connection between UNRWA and Hamas in that Wikipedia article.

    snek ,
    @snek@lemmy.world avatar

    Madaris? Just call them schools like a normal person. Anyone seeking English in Gaza would call that a “school”. Kinda weird, why would you choose a different word for this? Flaunting your Arabic, or what?

    Rapidcreek ,

    How many Gazians speak English as a fist language? Why do you have a problem with a word?

    Zaktor ,

    Most people here speak English as a first language and you’re making the choice to switch to the foreign word here for a reason.

    Rapidcreek ,

    Lots of foreign words in the English language. No reason to be afraid of them.

    snek ,
    @snek@lemmy.world avatar

    I think you are doing it to make it sound more like the Taliban for whom the word “madrasa” (and not “madaris”, but somehow you wanted the plural form) specifically means religious schools that indoctrinate children into political Islam. No one else tends to use the word to mean otherwise. Hamas doesn’t do that kind of stuff. Basically, education in Gaza is on par with the rest of the world. They have had excellent universities, they have had excellent medical centers that had to specialize in very specific types of injuries (thanks Israel!). The UNRWA school offer a normal education like any other in the Middle East (Arabic, English, Math, Science, and so on). There is nothing “madrasa” about it. And yet you chose to use that word.

    Now, I don’t want to go around accusing, I just can’t help but think, why did this person choose to use a Arabic variety of the word “school” to describe Gazan schools and education? Is it just, *“omg look at me I speak Arabic, yalla bro!” or is it something else?

    Zaktor ,

    You are very much not off target with your suspicions about this account’s motivations. And it’s not to show off their familiarity with Arabic.

    Zaktor ,

    This both isn’t one and I don’t for a moment believe you’re using it in the name of multiculturalism. You’re a reliable apologist for Israel and want to make “schools” sound like something scary.

    Rapidcreek ,

    Really? The word madrasa is scary to you? Whatever

    Zaktor ,

    You are very disingenuous.

    snek ,
    @snek@lemmy.world avatar

    As their first language? You just need to speak it. I think English education is compulsory in schools in Gaza so I’d safely bet almost everyone speaks a medium to advanced level of English.

    NoneOfUrBusiness ,

    Wait really? Unrelated to the wider topic, I'm finding it hard to believe the majority of any Arab nation's people speak a medium, let alone advanced, level of English.

    snek ,
    @snek@lemmy.world avatar

    It’s all thanks to the English for colonizing us. Usually, the second language spoken is either English or French, depending on who this country celebrates its independence from.

    I even was an English teacher in the Middle East at some point lol

    Yes, English is taught in most Arab countries starting in Grade 1 all the way up to highschool. Almost every upper educational organization will offer students English 101 if they fail a placement test or need extra help.

    NoneOfUrBusiness ,

    I know about English education in the Middle East since I'm from there; what I meant is: Does it actually stick in Gaza? At least where I'm from it goes like this: You just memorize the words and grammar, somehow pass the exam and then forget all of it, after high school you go from kinda sorta having intermediate level English back to only knowing the basics unless you study a field where you learn in English. I doubt the average person in the street from my country would be able to have a functional conversation with a, say, foreign tourist, so I'm wondering if it's different in Gaza.

    snek , (edited )
    @snek@lemmy.world avatar

    There are certainly problems with teaching it as a second language, but it’s still taught by UNRWA teachers (to at least one third of the kids there) from an early age.

    I grew up in Jordan and the average young person will in most cases speak good English. It fades with older generations given how much their education sucked, but a large portion of people speak it. I’ve even been told that it was taught better in the 80’s than now.

    Don’t think I’ve ever met anyone who doesn’t speak enough English to communicate with someone on the street except for my Grandma and she was basically illiterate.

    What country are you from?

    Ps: to answer the question specifically about Gaza, I don’t have any stats for that, but I know the UNRWA schools teach English

    NoneOfUrBusiness ,

    Egypt.

    snek ,
    @snek@lemmy.world avatar

    Curious: how would you describe your educational system with how they teach Arabic vs English?

    NoneOfUrBusiness , (edited )

    Both are bad but for different reasons.

    English education has one core problem: It focuses too much on vocabulary and grammar, and not enough on production. Your average Egyptian student should know a decent amount of vocabulary (until they forget it after their exams end anyway), but they have next to no idea how to create a natural sentence or actually write a passage or essay because while we do have essay writing on the exams (I think it was removed in favor of MCQ questions a few years ago, though) it's taught as a second thought or not at all. There's also a (heavily abridged) novel taught with every school year, but rather than treating it as a vehicle of language learning teachers (and exams) focus on the actual contents, so you end up with questions like "What was character X wearing in situation Y" that make just reading Q&A summaries a much more efficient way of tackling the exam than actually reading the novel. Also almost nobody does listening or speaking unless you're lucky or rich.

    As for Arabic, it's a different situation but the outcome is similar. The Arabic curriculum in Egypt is massive. There are about 5 sections, each with a ton of content that you need to memorize because the exam focuses more on content than the skills you're supposed to learn. For example in reading you have 5 or so passages whose contents (including metaphors the author used, for example) you have to memorize and regurgitate in the exam. Grammar is a little better, but it also has some issues. There's also a story but like in English the focus is on the contents and for some reason it's abridged. Writing is, like in English, an afterthought that is barely given any care in the classroom. The end result is that the curriculum does little to give students the ability or desire to read or write Arabic literature. I'm pretty sure you could get Al-Mutanabbi to take the Egyptian Arabic exam and he'd fail unless he studies about the same amount as a normal Egyptian student because of the amount of fact memorization that's unrelated to actual mastery of Arabic. Edit: If it sounds like I'm salty that's because I am.

    snek ,
    @snek@lemmy.world avatar

    Seems like you have every right to be salty. All of this totally sucks!

    Limitless_screaming ,
    @Limitless_screaming@kbin.social avatar

    Why do you have a problem with a word?

    ^^^ look guys, a prime case of definitely not bait or trolling ^^^

    Linkerbaan ,
    @Linkerbaan@lemmy.world avatar

    Like that time there was a Hamas base underneath the hospitalsand the IDF definitely didn’t lie about it?

    If the IDF has such amazing proof why aren’t they just showing it? Nobody trusts these people on their word.

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