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wjrii ,

So this claim seems well sourced, but I had to look it up because my bullshit detector always perks up when Sparta is discussed.

The surviving written sources are limited and largely from a non-Spartan viewpoint. Anton Powell wrote that to say the written sources are “‘not without problems’… as an understatement would be hard to beat”.

By Roman times, when a more organized and centralized polity was creating a pan-Mediterranean culture that had a lot to do with which works ended up preserved, Sparta was pretty much a theme park shell of its former self, and its former self is probably not so amazing anyway. In particular, their unusually thorough and unbalanced slave economy is overlooked when lionizing them, and their military record is rather underwhelming, possibly due to the incredible inefficiencies, even by ancient Greek standards, of said slave economy.

Don_Dickle OP ,

Now you make me question the movie 300 and what I learned in grade school.

CarbonIceDragon ,
@CarbonIceDragon@pawb.social avatar

They really do get a lot more reverence today than they deserve. Like, I get most historical cultures don’t stack up the best with modern moral standards applied to them, but like, based on what I understand about Sparta, if the place were somehow transplanted through history to the modern day as it’s own country, it would probably end up some sanctioned pariah state out of sheer disgust for how it treats it’s own citizenry and handles it’s foreign diplomacy.

I_Has_A_Hat ,

A highly militaristic society that isn’t all that strong compared to other militaries, that treats it’s people and outsiders poorly, and has glaringly obvious issues with its governance, all with an air of superiority and an emphasis on never appearing weak?

…Was Sparta just North Korea?

finickydesert ,
@finickydesert@lemmy.ml avatar

Either tomboy culture was steering or that they weren’t used to being with women

mozz ,
@mozz@mbin.grits.dev avatar

Surrrre that’s the reason

apfelwoiSchoppen ,
@apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world avatar

You should read the article, being bi was very much a part of their culture and not a trivial joke.

mozz ,
@mozz@mbin.grits.dev avatar

I was being sarcastic but I was in no way whatsoever joking

apfelwoiSchoppen ,
@apfelwoiSchoppen@lemmy.world avatar

OK, no harm. It very much read as a snide joke.

mozz ,
@mozz@mbin.grits.dev avatar

Ha, yeah, I get it. “lol they gay” is usually a joke. In this case it is not, as you mentioned:

In Sparta [...] the cropping of the bride’s hair and transvestism likely aimed to transform her temporarily into an adolescent Spartan boy – a less threatening figure to the groom, who probably had made his own transition to adulthood via a close emotional and sexual relationship with an older male

It is just what was up

VelvetStorm ,

So the adult men fucked little boys and that was seen as a normal and good thing?

olav ,
@olav@theweird.space avatar

@VelvetStorm
@mozz

Yes. With the caveat they were (usually) 12 or so

https://www.thecollector.com/pedophilia-ancient-greece-rome/

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