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How to avoid "things going wrong"? (Immutable distros?)

I’m working on starting up my first home server which I’m trying to make relatively foolproof and easily recoverable. What is some common maintenance people do to avoid dire problems, including those that accumulate over time, and what are ways to recover a server when issues pop up?

At first, I figured I’d just use debian with some kind of snapshot system and monitor changelogs to update manually when needed, but then I started hearing that immutable distros like microOS and coreOS have some benefits in terms of long term “os drift”, security, and recovering from botched updates or conflicts? I don’t even know if I’m going to install any native packages, I’m pretty certain every service I want to run has a docker image already, so does it matter? I should also mention, I’m going to use this as a file server with snapraid, so I’m trying to figure out if there will be conflicts to look out for there or with hardware acceleration for video transcoding.

Lifebandit666 ,

I see a lot of posts like this and it’s always people overthinking something they haven’t tried to do yet.

So my advice is to just do it.

You may lose everything at some point in the future, Satan knows I have a few times, but because you’ve actually done it, you can do it again.

Now, because you’re just thinking about doing it, it seems like a massive deal because you’ve not gone out and done it yet.

As for recommendations, I use a Proxmox VM with Debian and Docker. My Proxmox does backups, but my Docker compose is also a text document on my PC so I can recreate it all from scratch from that. I also have an idea what I did when I was learning how to do it, and have retained a good bit of that info so I could probably do it without either the backups or the Docker Compose, it would just take longer.

Just do it

anzo ,

This! And, baby-steps: don’t go about installing every app you see. Try backup strategies, put them to test (bring service down and up again with data from backup). Play, have fun.

Lifebandit666 ,

Yeah I mean I get it because I was also thinking about self hosting for a long time and had a bunch of questions myself.

The problem is that a lot of the questions were not needed, and a bunch of the other questions I answered myself by just tooling around with the stuff.

Great comment btw, it’s a good idea to have a list of the services you’d like to run, in order of importance z then work through it.

I did that then found ways to combine a bunch of services, to the point where I had multiple stand alone VMs that are now just one for Home Assistant and second for Plex and Docker

Illecors ,

dire problems, including those that accumulate over time

That’s not a thing. You create problems over time by experimening in what is, effectively, production load. If all you ever did was install any distro and kept it up to date - not much can break. Granted - shit happens, but it’s incredibly rare.

As an example - I’ve set up my mail server in May 2019. Chose archlinux, because I never wanted to go through a big upgrade. The only exta software installed there is mail-server related. Direct from the repos. I’ve become confident enough that now there’s a nightly cronjob to update the system with a hook to reboot if kernel or init gets updated.

In all those 5 a bit years I’ve had one issue where I hqd to revert a kernel update.

Another example is tang on an ubuntu server. This was at a previous workplace, but essentially it’s a piece of software from the repos. Originally installed on 16.04, has gone without reprovisioning all the way to 22.04. I’ve now left the company, but I hear it’s still running.

Upgrading an ubuntu desktop fleet with a myriad of custom software, on the other hand… let’s just not talk about it.

Max_P ,
@Max_P@lemmy.max-p.me avatar

If your stuff is all Docker then yeah, immutable makes sense as it makes the entire box declarative and immutable: you can get back the exact same operating Docker environment on the server, and then you can get back the exact same Docker workloads going with the Docker compose configurations.

If you ever need to run stuff you’d run on Debian, you can just shove it in a Debian container.

That said, if most of the stuff is containers, the risk of just the core Debian breaking is fairly low. Pick whatever is easiest for you to deal with based on your needs. Immutable distros have a bit of a learning curve.

drhoopoe ,

I mostly use debian + docker or alpine + docker for this kind of thing (usually running as VMs on a proxmox server). Both are utterly reliable in my experience, though I’ve been tending more often toward alpine these days, because it’s just so light and simple. I haven’t tried any of the immutable systems, in the general spirit of why fix what’s not broken. I don’t even bother with snapshotting either, though that’s mostly because I use some of the proxmox tools for backing up the VMs.

solrize ,

I used proxmox and have played a little with nix and guix, but simplest is just use debian, put /home on a separate logical partition from the system partition so you can reinstall the system without clobbering user files, and as people keep saying, backup early and often.

catloaf ,

Things always go wrong. Just be prepared to recover.

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