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blahsay ,

The asylum system is broken af. We need something but it’s not working as is. Millions displaced and more coming and they can’t all fit in the west.

How about a buddy system? Each country picks a couple of hopefully nearby countries with similar cultures and language. The buddy countries guarantee citizenship for displaced people from their country. The west agrees to assist financially with repatriation. For bonus points this also provides incentive for the buddy countries to push for stability.

blahsay , (edited )

As bonus bonus points it’d allow the millions of currently displaced to have a home and stops the source of people smuggling and ends a huge source of human suffering.

We need to start focusing less on admitting people in and more on improving countries so there’s less inequality. Asylum is fundamentally flawed at present.

roboto ,

Copy/paste because I’m lazy:

I honestly think that no matter what we’re doing the right would have a problem with migration because they want to go back to a white supremacist kind of society. We’re hearing the same shit how about Syrians and Ukrainians now that we heard in the 90s about Russian and Yugoslavian people, in the 60s/70s about Italian, Spanish, Polish, Turkish people and in the 40s/50s about German refugees.

blahsay ,

Well…it’s been broken for a while I’ll give you that. Not a reason to stop trying to fix things Also a world war is obviously not going to have similar levels of displaced.

Honestly asylum and illegal immigration is one of the largest levers the right has - easy to stoke fear right? Wouldn’t fixing it remove that lever?

blahsay ,

Side note literally everyone you mentioned was Caucasian 😂

Somethingcheezie ,

And they also migrated in small numbers. At least to Canada and where I lived.

roboto , (edited )

There were millions of deceased and millions others murdered in the holocaust, so overpopulation wasn’t an issue after world war 2. The displaced in Germany were Germans, so culture wasn’t an issue. Yet, refugees were discriminated against with pretty much the same rhetoric that is currently used against Ukrainians and Syrians.

I live in Germany and I have a lot of problems:

  • we already have water shortages due to climate change
  • the heat waves are a new phenomenon and they’re unbearable because no one has an A/C and due to the housing crisis I can’t buy my own home where it would be worth to shell out thousands to install one
  • the lack of digitalization in this country is crazy, I have to check my mailbox every day and many government tasks are still done by mail or fucking fax machine
  • the already mentioned housing crisis makes it impossible to find affordable housing and if you find it you’re trapped there forever, I can’t even think of having kids because I know I won’t be able to find a 3 room flat
  • public transportation in my place is already top notch for Germany and it still sucks, they had to reduce busses and metro because they can’t find enough drivers and they’re chronically underfunded. As a consequence you often have to go by car and be stuck in ridiculous traffic jams
  • the pension system will collapse when all the boomers retire, there won’t be enough people to pay for their retirement, politicians know this but are completely ignoring it
  • our infrastructure is rotting away and because of self-mandated austerity the state is incapable of making investments into our schools, roads, railways, hell even electricity grids
  • for a developed country our internet speed is ridiculous because we’re still mostly relying on copper cables instead of fiber
  • Our current governing parties are eroding our democracy through pushing mass surveillance, silencing the press and violently suppressing protests against climate change, genocide, etc. s.t. we don’t even need actual fascist parties to slide into a state of fascism

Asylum seekers and regular work migrants are not the problem, in a more pragmatic society they would be part of the solution. I have no negative impact in my daily live from some poor fuckers who are fleeing from warzones and crazy dictatorships but all of the above are affecting me constantly. Btw I don’t understand your remark about caucasians, can you explain what you mean with that?

blahsay ,

Oh you’re actually German? It’s been while since I was last there but it is less a race issue from what Germans mentioned- the issue with the Syrians was than a culture problem. Hard-line Islamic society meets liberal west was always going to be rough. Like having to ignore the paedophilia laws when they arrived with child brides…messy situation.

I’m definitely not saying the Syrians didn’t deserve sanctuary. However perhaps a country with a vaguely similar culture and language might have been better for them too? It’s a sensitive subject but surely you think every group of refugees can’t end up taking the train the Germany?

What’s your idea for the next wave? The one after, and so on?

roboto ,

Yeah I’m German and imo it’s totally xenophobia and with darker looking people a race issue, that’s why I said that they use the same rhetoric against Syrians and Ukrainians that they used against German refugees back in the day and against Spanish, Italian, Polish, Turkish people in the 60s/70s and against Russians and Yugoslavian people in the 90s.

I actually have some Syrian friends because I helped them in 2015 when the influx was peaking, and many of them are honestly just normal people who came here to work, go to school or study, party, check out Tinder and stuff. There were also some crazies that I stayed far away from but that doesn’t surprise me if people seek shelter from a warzone.

I think especially the more conservative type of people were a bit shocked by some aspects of German society and they tended to stick rather to themselves but they’re also the kind of people who wanted to start working immediately because in a conservative family the man has to provide. Some are also just lazy and don’t want to do anything but not more than my German friends from what I saw.

Syrian, Lebanese, Palestinian society are for middle eastern standards pretty liberal and especially Syria is very diverse in terms of ethnicity and religion from what I understood, so they’re not like Saudi Arabia or Taliban kind of horribly conservative. So stuff like wearing Burqas, or child marriage as horrible as it is is rather some racist stereotype than a problem that would hinder us from integrating refugees and benefiting from their labor. I think there were some cases where the bride and groom were teenagers and it was clashing with German law but iirc the media made it seem far worse than it was.

Sidenote they also told me that in Lebanon and sometimes Jordan they got treated like shit by the locals, so by now I’m pretty convinced that people are just xenophobic by default.

I personally would be happy about more refugees, because it’s the right thing to do and it has the positive side effect that they’re often willing to do shitty jobs that us Germans won’t do. I would have tons of examples for this apart from the bus. Stuff like old school German baking tradition is rapidly disappearing because no German is willing to get up at 4am anymore to have bread ready at 6am. If you need an electrician or other handyman it’s basically impossible because their books are filled for months ahead and they won’t come for small shit.

There’s a crazy labor shortage in low paying jobs and people are increasingly not willing to come to Germany because of all the racism, there was recently an article about Philippino nurses rather going to Saudi Arabia lol. So yeah, it’s frustrating.

FlyingSquid ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

You’re going to be in for a shock when climate change increases the number of asylum seekers exponentially. If you decide they can’t all come, they’re going to decide you’re wrong and they’re likely a lot more determined than you are because their life is on the line.

blahsay ,

Exactly. We need a working system for asylum before then! Open door really isn’t practical…if you have a better suggestion than mine I’m all ears

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