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intensely_human ,

I’ve got no loyalty at all to communism or marxism. But I do have a loyalty to honesty, and I have to object. I don’t see a denial of the Massacre in the screenshotted comment. I see a characterization of it as some kind of US-led attack.

They aren’t saying anything like “that didn’t happen” or “people didn’t die”. Maybe they say it elsewhere, but not here.

SmilingSolaris ,

Bingo. There’s a difference between saying it didn’t happen and “it happened but it was good”. I would say later is worse. But pretending they are saying something they clearly are not isn’t good

vga ,

Hmm. That reads just like the most sane lemmygrad.ml user. Could that whole place be just actual bots?

bloopernova ,
@bloopernova@programming.dev avatar

And yet they never seem to want to move to china or russia.

goat OP ,

No why would they do that

vlad76 ,
@vlad76@lemmy.sdf.org avatar

They need a Holiday in Cambodia

BaronVonBort ,

“Gotta say, I’ve noticed how many people are dressed in black around here…”

Gooey0210 ,

Cambodia is awesome, a holiday there would really be a great idea

DragonTypeWyvern ,

Bold of you to assume Lemmygrad isn’t already Russian

goat OP ,

Nah, lemmygrad is 100 percent American.

DragonTypeWyvern ,

Just a coincidence they spontaneously parrot all of Putin’s talking points?

Nah, I’m not saying they’re all Russian, but they’re clearly compromised somewhere. A lot of somewheres.

goat OP ,

I totally understand the reasoning behind thinking it’s state actors or certain members being shills–But there’s not much to gain for governments to shill in niche, extremist communities. Why shill your loyal followers when they parrot everything already? Instead, it’s much more effective to use large, mainstream social media websites, like Twitter, Reddit or Facebook, just check out anything politically trending to see the shills and contrast them with these users.

It is true, these small communities do swallow up state propaganda without much thought, but they aren’t shills. Most are just lonely people who hate everything and themselves.

DragonTypeWyvern ,

I think it’s fairly important to remember that Hexbear/Lemmygrad are basically why Lemmy exists, and largely emigrated after the Reddit Chapo ban, at least as far as I understand things.

They weren’t entirely niche communities at first, and now they’re the most active communities on Lemmy, which may or may not grow into something bigger, but most importantly they’ve inherited the damage the used to have.

I mean, have you ever listened to ChapoTrapHouse? They were pretty solidly democratic socialist. Something happened to that community to turn it into Hexbear. It could have been natural, but their messaging is just so consistent it seems unlikely.

Shardikprime ,

They never looked dem soc to me as they advocated liberally for the venezuelan militia to murder venezuelans protesting the socialist dictatorship and parroted Venezuela’s government party line to anyone that cared to listen

DragonTypeWyvern ,

Was never a big fan of the dirtbag left angle, so I’m afraid I’ll have to take your word for it.

intensely_human ,

Guys, this is fascinating as it’s all new to me. But if you’re having this discussion for the public you should be linking specific examples when you can.

I don’t know whether to believe what you’re saying or not.

ArcaneSlime ,

“No, I want to ruin my country!”

p5yk0t1km1r4ge ,
@p5yk0t1km1r4ge@lemmy.world avatar

https://s.studiobinder.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/08/Michael-Jackson-Popcorn-GIF-Meme-Eating-Popcorn-Featured-StudioBinder.jpg

Ashyr ,

This is a factor in why I really want kbin/mbin to succeed. I also think it has the potential to be the better platform, but only time will tell.

sugar_in_your_tea ,

I think both kinda suck, so I’m making my own that’s completely distributed instead of federated. That way hosting costs are near zero (just need some P2P nodes and a download server) and scaling to higher user counts should be automatic if I build it right.

The problem is that building it right is hard, and I don’t have a ton of time.

PutangInaMo ,

You got more details? Is it up on github?

sugar_in_your_tea ,

Not yet, but I’ll definitely post something when I get to a point where I’m ready to share the code. I definitely want it to be open source, I just want enough functionality there so the long term vision is clear.

But here’s some details of what I’m trying to achieve:

  • web of trust-based moderation - no “mods,” only metadata from people you trust (upvotes, downvotes, blocks, etc)
  • all storage on devices of users of the service - the more storage you provide, the better your experience; your preferred communities have first priority, but everyone stores something random from the service
  • text posts only, at least to start - images/videos need to be hosted elsewhere

I’m building it initially as a desktop app, but I’ll port it later to mobile and maybe web (still trying to figure out how web would work; maybe some notion of instances?).

I’m hoping to bridge to lemmy with an ActivityPub service to get content, but I’m not working on that until the above is ready.

PutangInaMo ,

Web of trust sounds interesting. What language(s) are you using to build it?

sugar_in_your_tea ,

Rust on backend, React frontend.

PutangInaMo ,

Sounds efficient. Lmk if/ when you make the repo public.

sugar_in_your_tea ,

Sure thing. I’ll probably make a post about it once I nail down the functionality and start looking for people to help out with UX and features and whatnot.

ThePinkUnicorn ,

This sounds interesting, but how do you plan on stopping illegal content being stored on users devices? If there is any chance a user could unknowingly be hosting illegal content that could lead to some very big issues.

sugar_in_your_tea ,

Still working on that, but I have some ideas:

  • text only - images, videos, and other binary content must be stored elsewhere (could still have links though)
  • data is stored encrypted (user option) - wouldn’t show up in scans
  • clear separation between “stuff I’m interested in” and “random stuff I’m hosting for the network” - plausible deniability
  • perhaps an option to opt out of random data storage - you’d still store stuff you’re interested in

But yeah, that’s a huge part of why I’m unwilling to share the code until I’m comfortable with the moderation engine. I think there’s an opportunity to use that moderation engine to reduce storage of CSAM (i.e. don’t store data from blocked users).

Natanael ,

You mean scuttlebutt? Or something with content addressing like a fork of bluesky?

sugar_in_your_tea ,

Content addressing. I’m using Iroh.

spaduf ,

Wouldn’t a fork be easier? I have high hopes for mbin but I really can’t understand why Lemmy hasn’t been forked yet.

el_bhm ,

Go to lemmygrad.ml and post about Russia or China. You will read insane ramblings about projections. Somehow the argument is always “look at this bad thing in the west, here is completely misinformed info about your country, look how good Russia/China, skip over genocides you are projecting it is happening in the West, to finish my argument Are You a Nazi?!”.

Yougoslavia was created by soviets/russia. His beloved communists. I am super interested in what mind gymnastics he has to excuse that.

He could have gone with Africa or Middle East, much better example of collosal fuck ups of Ze Bad West. But that would require knowledge of history longer than 50 years.

Also crying about Poland. As a guy living in Poland, hearing stories of people that fought in WWII and people that lived in communist Poland, I am so interested in how these first hand accounts are US misinformation.

TrismegistusMx ,

I was banned from Lemmygrad for statements that were critical of the authority of the USSR, and writings of their savior Karl M.

I was banned from Lemmy.world for anti-zionism. Most of the Lemmy side of the fediverse seems infested with authoritarianism that’s as bad as Reddit’s corporatism.

echodot ,

I will always advocate the people leave those platforms and go to other instances. I don’t know why everybody moved over to Lemmy.world when people left reddit. I assume it must have been heavily promoted over there although I never saw it.

Been on a smaller instance has only upside, it’s far less likely to go completely insane and then get itself defederated from other instances, it does not tend to get DDoS attacks as much, and you can still access all the content on those larger instances, assuming you want to.

TrismegistusMx ,

I should have known better myself. I’ve been around long enough to know that the biggest groups are the first targets for authority-minded people.

Cethin ,

I think it was the largest, and people just went to the largest group, making it even larger. That just accelerated the issues with that instance. There ideally would have been instance finding tools that prioritized spreading new users out, but oh well.

mindbleach ,

Been on a smaller instance has only upside

Unlike every previous service.

mindbleach ,

Lemmy.world is run by Enlightened Centrists. People who think we should all just get along, and calmly discuss these life-and-death matters, no matter how demonstrably wrong a lie is, or how much bad-faith abuse someone spits.

At this point - any internet community demanding “civility” is a red flag for bad moderation. “Be nice!” means they’re not prepared to treat ‘stop implying I’m subhuman, asshole’ as the justified response to a troll with a rear-mounted boot slot that needs filling. And even then it’s a coin-toss. You can spend immense effort restraining and editing responses to complete bullshit, guiding someone by-the-nose through why they’re blatantly fucking wrong, while they keep trying to make that personal through chest-beating and snide remarks… and then watch then give up all pretense and spit the worst insults they can imagine over dry criticism of what they choose to say… and see your reports of idiotic directed abuse go absolutely nowhere.

If your rules effectively run interference for bastards, fuck your rules.

TrismegistusMx ,

I like you.

Historical_General , (edited )

deleted_by_author

    •
    TrismegistusMx ,

    I’m very left wing. So left wing that I recognize that the USSR was a capitalist authoritarian state with central wealth distribution. Even Marxists can mistake the map for the territory. Marx isn’t Christ and Das Kapital isn’t a bible, but don’t tell them.

    Socsa ,

    As someone who has actually studied political science, they absolutely do not know their history well lmao. They are (shitty) Orthodox Marxists and react quite strongly to being shown anything outside of that 150 year old bubble.

    They know a few core historical anecdotes that MLs cling to. But their knowledge breaks down extremely quickly when you try to reduce political science and statecraft to academic first principles, even when those principles intersect strongly with their ML orthodoxy.

    They are campists. They form their philosophy around relitigating cold war drama more than anything to do with actual socialism.

    Historical_General , (edited )

    What would you have them read to remedy this?

    And to take a current event as a litmus test since I don’t know you or your bias, do you condemn Israel’s racism, zionist ideology and their war crimes etc?

    Socsa ,

    So many things. But I’d start with The Ethics of Ambiguity to temper the autocratic revolution fetish.

    Historical_General ,

    (I edited my comment apparently shortly after you replied btw).

    Socsa ,

    I’m not sure why you believe I owe you a litmus test.

    There is no right answer to the Israel situation, other than secular unification. You will not find me mounting a vocal defense of any theocracy or ethnostate.

    Historical_General ,

    Well, you’re not claiming to the arbiter of truth here are you? Hence you have a bias, and as a layman I’d benefit from knowing it.

    I appreciate the answer regardless.

    goat OP ,

    You can view lemmygrad and hexbear’s modlog. They ban anything they consider “liberal”

    Socsa ,

    My bans from lemmy.ml have all come from literally arguing that there are a solid 150 years worth of academic ideas building on Marx and that taking Marxist orthodoxy as the exclusive socialist dogma in that context is simply ignorant.

    I am starting to think that they hate revisionist socialists more than actual capitalists, because it seeks to deny them the thing they really want, which is a justification for violence and totalitarianism.

    Lucidlethargy ,

    Okay, yes, this was my exact experience as well. I don’t recall where I got banned, but I was simply making the point that we should use the best bits of socialism and merge them with more modern systems.

    They did NOT like that. It seems so incredibly reasonable, and mild to suggest stuff like this… Like, these people really are the “snowflakes” the right attests them to be.

    el_bhm ,

    I posted this before, but I really believe these instances are run by APTs.

    It is not the first nor last time that extremists are being used by state-run aparatus.

    mindbleach ,

    They’re conservatives. Hierarchy is the only way they decide what’s real. It’s the same tribalist thinking that produced the Lady Hope hoax - saying Darwin recanted on his deathbed, as if that would cancel out the last 150 years of evolutionary biology. They genuinely do not understand science or philosophy, because they don’t believe arguments can be evaluated, except in terms of interpersonal trust.

    So in their minds - if Marx was wrong, about anything, then the whole business might as well be made-up. It is impossible for someone to simply be wrong. They have to be lesser. They must be undeserving of their station, because their station is the only reason they get to decide what is true.

    In this worldview, it is your job to make whatever mouth noises justify that mutable truth. I say “your job” because this is all they think you’re doing. This is all they think there is. There is no other force in their moral universe. This is quite possibly the human brain’s default behavior, and it is not fragile.

    Justas ,
    @Justas@sh.itjust.works avatar

    Leftist fetishism for ideological purism is what will always lead to their demise any time they manage to get any meaningful power.

    elbarto777 ,

    Could anyone please add more context? I see some reddit user spewing some bullshit, but how do we know that’s Dessalines? Genuine question…

    goat OP ,

    Check out this comment for some more information.

    elbarto777 ,

    Thanks. Ugh, I don’t want to use lemmy anymore now…

    Eldritch ,

    Using their own creation against them is poetic justice though. Nothing stopping anyone from forking the backend either.

    DragonTypeWyvern ,

    Or you could just join an instance that isn’t federated with lemmy.ml

    Historical_General ,

    Is literature.cafe defederated with them?

    DragonTypeWyvern ,

    Nah, just Lemmygrad and Hexbear, but if it gets too annoying I’ll find one that is. I’ve gotten no pushbacks criticizing Marx, Lenin, or Stalin there, personally speaking.

    Historical_General ,

    lemm.ee is the opposite (doesn’t defed from them) and pretty liberal-minded for anybody looking for that.

    Socsa ,

    The irony that he started lemmy because he got a ban and then does the same shit on his own platform.

    Immersive_Matthew ,

    Power corrupts but as others have said, the joke is on them as it is decentralized and no longer theirs. They just helped start it.

    Jumuta ,

    I think that was intended

    There’s a section in the install docs about how Lemmy is designed to be anti censorship and for the people, and I think this lines up with the devs’ values

    18+ rambling_lunatic ,

    This leads me to think that the dev has very good intentions, but is supremely blind to his biases.

    18+ Jumuta ,

    yeah that’s what I think as well

    Hadriscus ,

    sounds like a regular human

    rambling_lunatic ,

    Yeah. Pretty much. Except his blindness is making him justify a genocidal regime.

    mindbleach ,

    Raddle isn’t an option obviously since it’s run by this arch anti tankie scum, ziq.

    I don’t see how that essay is about-- oh, ziq is the author. Ohhh this asshole thinks that’s a bad thing.

    … should we have been on Raddle?

    SkyezOpen ,

    Denying? That’s outright praise.

    18+ ShitOnABrick ,
    @ShitOnABrick@lemmy.world avatar

    All that organ harvesting torture and sexual assault of prisoners and human rights violations… uhm hmhm um ashtually you see it was all just a very successful deradiclisation campaign m’lady

    18+ ShitOnABrick ,
    @ShitOnABrick@lemmy.world avatar

    https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/3e3d491e-a8ec-40c3-8415-90e020174cb1.jpeg

    LOOK GUYZ I THINK HE MITHT HAVE A POIJT THERWA NOFFIN THERE

    AMillionNames ,

    Lemmy is a poisoned seed. Besides the questionable lead developers, you have the most popular lemmy instances enforcing rules arbitrarily while lying about it and removing entries from the modlog arbitrarily making them all but useless. At least it will be a good exercise in determining how well its federated nature allows it to survive.

    Given how often it has happened, I’d say it’s the fate of these sort of migrations from other major social networks to be spearhead by lying opportunists and people trying to hide their flaws through abuse of power. Unfortunately, social networks are far removed from the time when the people doing the spearheading where acting as good faith developers exploring what was possible - they’d probably be among the first to get gaslit and DDOSed.

    Outtatime ,
    @Outtatime@sh.itjust.works avatar

    Rules. Lame

    AMillionNames ,

    Gaslighting. Lamer.

    Socsa ,

    I’m curious about mod log editing, can you elaborate?

    But yeah, ml has basically marked my accounts at this point because I’ve repeatedly challenged their socialist orthodoxy and they seem really upset about it. Basically any time I comment I get another ban with no explanation.

    AMillionNames ,

    It comes from the IWB archivals mentioned here: kbin.social/…/Just-wanted-a-warning-Lemmy-World-i…

    Basically take web.archive.org/web/20231019235547/…/modlog and try to find the same in this later one web.archive.org/web/20231021224842/…/modlog . You’ll find a lot of missing gaps.

    Estiar ,

    Looks like they didn’t like somebody referencing Tiemaman square

    antik ,
    @antik@lemmy.world avatar

    No modlog editing happened. The modlog is federated so editing it makes no sense.

    Look up the user internettubes in the modlog and you will find it:

    https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/720bf73d-eb9d-4427-bd15-6b1cadda0296.jpeg

    AMillionNames ,

    Ok, so it seems that bans by admins don’t show up on the modlog after two days. There wasn’t anything that indicated the auto-filtering so it’s sort of a black box scenario, and it sort of defeats the purpose of the modlog if you have to know the event you are looking for to begin with.

    Regarding it being “federated”, I can find InternetTubes both on lemmy.world and lemmy.ml, but lemmy.world’s modlog also shows that kbin.social/InternetTubes has been banned YET lemmy.ml’s modlog doesn’t show it, so the claim that all that is modlog is federated seems sort of iffy.

    Now that you are here, as an admin of the instance, can you say anything else about the ban versus what the user is claiming, or is it supposed to be left to speculation?

    antik , (edited )
    @antik@lemmy.world avatar

    Regarding it being “federated”, I can find InternetTubes both on lemmy.world and lemmy.ml, but lemmy.world’s modlog also shows that kbin.social/InternetTubes has been banned YET lemmy.ml’s modlog doesn’t show it, so the claim that all that is modlog is federated seems sort of iffy.

    So my “claim” is “iffy”, ok. Any Lemmy admin can tell you there are issues with the code. And why would an action from LW purposely be removed from the modlog on lemmy.ml?

    You can’t convince me that you’re not internettubes yourself btw. You started posting as soon as Internettubes was banned and the few conversations you join is about the ban.

    Now that you are here, as an admin of the instance, can you say anything else about the ban versus what the user is claiming, or is it supposed to be left to speculation?

    What’s not clear? The user publicly said they did not agree to the TOS so they got removed. If you don’t agree during signup your account will be locked as well.

    AMillionNames , (edited )

    And why would an action from LW purposely be removed from the modlog on lemmy.ml?

    Are you asking me why instances who might want to abuse their power might not propagate certain actions to other instances so they aren’t as visible? Or why it might seem like a bug when attempts at removal don’t seem to work out? I’m not accusing you, but these are valid concerns lemmy has to face.

    But yeah, f it’s “bad server code” and not actually federated when bugs occur, there’s not much of a point to claiming they are. So far I don’t see that there might have been willing intent to screw with the modlog as the original complaint suggested, but it shouldn’t be left up to good faith. If it’s supposed to be federated, it should be. If everything isn’t getting federated, it should be clear what isn’t. If the modlog isn’t displaying everything, it should be clear when it isn’t. As of now, to anyone who can’t bother to look at the code, it’s a black box and it’s clear that the modlogs between servers aren’t lining up the same.

    The user publicly said they did not agree to the TOS so they got removed.

    Where did the user say they did not agree with the TOS? No point in not citing the original comment that was archived, because there’s no point there at which it does. It only contains criticism in a thread made by admins saying they were open to criticism. The closest it comes to not agreeing with the TOS is the criticism here:

    “You waive Lemmy.World … from any claims resulting from any action taken by Lemmy.World, and any of the foregoing parties relating to any investigations by either us or by law enforcement authorities.” - I see many lawyers try to sneak this one, but there are very few courts that wouldn’t allow me to file a claim even with this under a Terms of Service I haven’t even had to explicitly indicate I agree with if, say, lemmy.world decided to violate my GDPR protections because censors in China didn’t like a comment I made about Tiananmen Square, requested my personal private data lemmy.world has on me, and they decided to give it to them.

    But at least thanks for opening up on that. Is it also true that you haven’t contacted them or responded to them directly either?

    You can’t convince me that you’re not internettubes yourself btw. You started posting as soon as Internettubes was banned and the few conversations you join is about the ban.

    Considering how little it took for a user to get their entire user account purged and banned, I’m not sure why you would consider it surprising that anyone else who raises an eyebrow wouldn’t want to risk any previous account they made.

    It’s a testament that you haven’t banned this account already from the instance given how you treated the original user, but it still seems like hunting around for an excuse, like maybe being able to apply the label of “ban evasion” like that you gave kbin.social/InternetTubes, just to dismiss criticism.

    You and AvaddonLFC certainly seem to know each other personally and are the two most active admins on the instance, so if I do seem to be pushing this, it’s because I am definitely concerned about making any considerable amount of contributions over a considerable degree of time only to have it deleted or removed with a complete and utter disregard.

    I’d rather face the problem sooner rather than later. Allowing it or not saying anything about it is basically allowing a way to gaslight and remove the reputation a user might have built up over time to one where it’s just a random claim versus a position of seniority. I’ll give you that I am one of the few people who seems to care about the issue, so I probably won’t be returning to my lemmy.world account, at least not without a VPN proxy and a separate VM instance.

    MomoTimeToDie ,

    Lol you’re really working overtime to defend the utter bullshit your instance calls moderation standards

    mindbleach ,

    Geeks, MOPs, and sociopaths.

    AMillionNames ,

    Good read, but it should really say psychopaths instead of sociopaths. Sociopaths are those who really aren’t capable of influencing other people because of their social pathologies, although anyone in the mental health industry would probably say both terms are obsolete.

    mindbleach ,

    Recently had someone argue Palestine isn’t genocide because the Arab population in Israel is going up.

    Any obsession with birth rates is a red flag for brain worms, as surely as talking about skull shape.

    kleenbhole ,

    if you’re not trying to destroy a group of people in its entirety than it’s not really genocide, it’s just war. War is bad. Wars fought aggressively kill civilians. The US killed a million Iraqis, and that wasn’t genocide.

    Israel isn’t killing Arab Israelis. They’re not trying to kill all Palestinian Arabs. They’re just indiscriminately bombing Hamas. I think you can be much more effectively critical of Israel without losing your credibility through hyperbole. The person you were arguing with was right, and you’re wrong.

    But really though Jews>Arabs so it’s fine.

    mindbleach ,

    Any intent to destroy a national, ethnic, racial, or religious group - in whole or in part - is genocide.

    This includes killing people, causing severe bodily or mental harm, preventing births, forcibly transferring children to another group, or deliberately creating conditions calculated to bring about physical destruction.

    Doing it counts. Conspiring to do it counts. Publicly inciting it to happen counts. Trying to do it obviously counts. Being complicit in any of that, counts.

    This is the fucking UN definition of genocide. I am just barely paraphrasing from the relevant articles of convention. If you care more about tone-policing and gatekeeping than you do about an overt effort to dehumanize and kill a specific group in a specific region for ethnic and religious differences, you can eat shit.

    If not - we can talk.

    kleenbhole , (edited )

    Israel is not trying to kill a specific group in a specific region for ethnic and religious differences. Hamas is. Israel is trying to root out a terrorist organization that uses human shields, and has proclaimed that it’s fundamental purpose is to remove Jews from the Middle East and destroy Israel, which was set up by a collective of world powers specifically to protect Jews as an endangered ethnicity. When Germany was going to war with the rest of Europe, they were interested in genocide. Just because the rest of the world wanted to kill as many Germans as possible doesn’t mean that they also were engaged in genocide against Germans.

    Team J all the way baby. We’re better than you.

    mindbleach ,

    Hey buddy? They both are. Israel is why Palestine is an open-air prison. Israel is the side that keeps killing those human shields, indiscriminately, without one shred of remorse. Apartments, hospitals, refugee centers, whatever.

    Maybe inviting the world’s Jews to “go back to Africa” in the exact goddamn center of the Muslim middle-east was not a sensible idea, in terms of minimizing ethno-religious strife.

    No country wanted to kill as many Germans as possible - they wanted the fucking war to end. They wanted to kill Hitler specifically, disrupt the Nazi regime, and go back to merely civilized levels of hating one another. Israel hasn’t fucking done that, with Palestine. Mostly they’ve just continued bombing. They’ve made token efforts to claim they want a rehabilitated Palestinian state… but always alongside collective abuses like the strict blockade that obviously leaves Israel in de-facto control of the region’s survival.

    kleenbhole , (edited )

    first of all, I’m not your buddy.

    Palestine is not an open-air prison, Gaza is. Israel is the one killing human shields, Palestine is the one using human shields.

    award doesn’t exist as a tit for tat, You kill X number of us, and we get to kill X number of you. Hamas has very explicitly and openly called for the extermination of Jews and Israel and elimination of Jews from the Middle East. Israel has not made any sort of comparable claims about Palestine or Arabs or Muslims. If Israel gets their way then Palestine and Hamas will stop bombing Israel. If Palestine gets their way then there will be no more Israel.

    Palestine is a Muslim theocracy. Israel is secular and multicultural with a theocratic majority. There’s a difference.

    and it seems you understand my analogy about World War II perfectly, you just don’t seem to understand how it applies. Palestinians are the Germans. Israelis are everybody else.

    and yes the reason that Gaza is an open air prison is because THEY keep bombing Israel. The Iron Dome doesn’t exist to protect Palestine from Israeli bombs. It exists to protect Israel from Palestinian bombs. All of this, ALL OF THIS, is anti-semitism. Everything you’re saying is just liberal college kid idiocy buying into antisemitic propaganda.

    mindbleach ,

    Have it your way.

    Hey asshole - don’t split hairs about Gaza versus Palestine, then freely swap between Palestine and Hamas!

    For the second and final time: saying you’re gonna do it is not the only thing that counts. Israel’s actions constitute genocide. What they say does not matter. The fact Hamas says it out loud neither absolves Israel nor condemns the rest of Palestine.

    If Palestine gets their way, they’ll stop being a densely-populated ghetto amid fresh piles of rubble. Israel will stop using the actions of Hamas to justify killing X*10 number of Palestinians. Children and journalists will stop getting shot near the fuckoff enormous wall keeping them pressed against a sea they’re not really allowed to use.

    Human shields did not bomb Israel. Declaring “THEY” keep doing it is collective punishment - also a war crime, by the way. All of this is two sides that fucking hate each other and keep doing obscene violence to each other, and your dumb ass wants to pretend it’s just a poor widdle innocent nuclear power being existentially threatened by people without consistent access to food.

    kleenbhole , (edited )

    Disagree. If you’re a piece of crap enough to use human shields, and those human shields support your politics… bye bye human shields.

    Again, it ain’t genocide. Palestinians will stop getting killed when they kick out Hamas.

    Also, Palestine as a culture sucks compared it Israel. If all countries were like Israel humanity would benefit, if all countries were like Palestine humanity would suffer. I’m on team superior culture.

    mindbleach ,

    In light of the edit overtly declaring bigoted superiority, reported and blocked.

    kleenbhole , (edited )

    “I’m telling on you!”

    Child.

    Also, it ain’t bigotry, I’m just quoting the one true God. He’s the one who chose the Jews, take it up with Hashem. Or the Nobel Prize committe. Ask them why we are objectively smarter than everyone except the Koreans.

    MomoTimeToDie ,

    Don’t bother. Mindbleach has been a perpetual spammer who just yells his moronic political stances and then acts like he’s superior by ignoring everything anyone else says.

    goat OP ,

    We? You’re not from Israel, are you? If not, then you should probably shut up.

    kleenbhole , (edited )

    All Jews are from Israel. I had a birthright to citizenship. Plus I can join any group I want, based on modern rules of self identification. How about you shut up with your arbitrary gatekeeping.

    Mostly I’m just against any group trying to eliminate all Jews, like Hamas. And certainly Im against their apologists, like you, who would dare to use words like genocide to create a false. moral equivalency. Suck my kidney stones out my peehole.

    goat OP ,

    If you don’t have a citizenship, you don’t have much of an input.

    You’ll need to chill tho

    kleenbhole ,

    Motherfucker are YOU Palestinian?

    If you are, go oppress a woman and leave me alone.

    goat OP ,

    No, I’m a mod, just letting you know you need to chill.

    Epicurus0319 ,

    I’ve seen your comment history, you really need a snickers bar.

    goat OP , (edited )

    There’s some fair clause that it is a genocide, though if it is, it goes both ways. That and most of the conditions that Palestine and Gaza put themselves in are from their own mistakes and faults in the past, such as declaring war a few times (and losing all of them), attacking their neighbouring countries and attacking Europe.

    Not that this justifies Israel’s violence. They were killing innocent Arabs before Hamas.

    thisisnotgoingwell ,

    This comment is pretty old. Do we really want to demonize anything anyone has said? I’ve probably said some ideological embarrassing things in the past.

    Unless he’s still pushing these talking points, I really don’t see the point

    LifeOfChance ,

    2y is really not that old and they have had a track record with those comments starting from over on reddit which resulted in a ban and them developing this website. The plans for this site came from being so out spoken about it. Your point would be valid if they hadn’t said anything and showed to be actively correcting themselves for those last two years.

    thisisnotgoingwell ,

    I’ll be honest, not sure what it was about that day, but I thought the comment said 7 years, not 2. So my apologies on that. But apparently there’s enough recent dribble to that even if it was 7 years it wouldn’t matter. Thankfully, the nature of open source projects is that we can fork and continue onwards if this ever causes issues.

    goat OP , (edited )

    I considered that and removed the other threads. Though I think this one should be an exception (even if it’s from reddit), mostly because it’s almost a copypaste of Dessaline’s github–Hell this comment may have been where that part of the github originated.

    For those unaware, Dessaline has quite the extensive github of tankie ideology and talking points, I’ve read through most of it and it’s pretty fucking shit. Some of the “sources” are literally just random tweets. It’s very akin to those anti-vax gish gallop diarrhoea spiels where they think memes are sources.

    echodot ,

    This comment is pretty old.

    It’s from 2021, it’s post pandemic for god’s sake it’s hardly ancient history.

    I’ve probably said some ideological embarrassing things in the past.

    Yeah but no one cares about the things you say because you’re not a major software developer. If you were it would also be perfectly acceptable to have a go at you about some of your less desirable talking points.

    Unless he’s still pushing these talking points

    Yeah but he is isn’t he? That’s the point he hasn’t got any better he’s still out there doing it.

    mindbleach ,

    Everything is in the past. That’s when stuff happened.

    Jumuta ,

    why do you have to make it binary?

    mvirts ,

    You don’t have to like the artist?

    goat OP ,

    except they make decisions that affect the entirety of lemmy, such as introducing Hexbear into the fediverse

    mvirts ,

    Yeah … But that power is only in their hands because the rest of us are complacent, like for me I don’t think I have the time to take over lemmy development :/

    librechad ,

    What’s Hexbear?

    goat OP ,

    Another tankie instance

    librechad ,

    Oh, okay but do the Lemmy devs really have control over who starts an instance? Isn’t this the whole point of the fediverse or do I have it wrong?

    goat OP ,

    They don’t have control over instances, no. However they can deny tech support or delisting your instance with others across the fediverse.

    Gooey0210 ,

    Censorship, we need more censorship

    goat OP ,

    What do you mean?

    Gooey0210 ,

    More censorship to Lemmy, ban by IP, and defederate any instance that doesn’t only post about politics, and take them to the court

    calavera ,

    What are you talking about? What specific support hexbear needs?

    Honytawk ,

    Don’t the Lemmy devs and the Hexbears moderators have overlapping people?

    goat OP ,

    Nah, that’s lemmygrad

    Raffster ,

    I wondered the same for kbin.

    kirk781 ,

    Ah, so I am not the only one suffering from posts from that instance. Hexbear was so bad I had to block that instance from appearing in my feed.

    Raffster ,

    I wish I could. That does not work on kbin. Wonder why that is.

    loutr ,
    @loutr@sh.itjust.works avatar

    How do you mean? Lemmy is open source, anyone can create an instance, they don’t need the developers permission… And other instances are free to defederate from them.

    antik ,
    @antik@lemmy.world avatar

    How? Hexbear decided to make their fork compatible with Lemmy again and to federate. And as you know plenty of instances defederated with hexbear since.

    goat OP ,

    The devs helped assist with that.

    antik ,
    @antik@lemmy.world avatar

    I know - but how does that affect any other instance? Doesn’t stop us from defederating.

    Anonymousllama ,

    Exactly, we’d have no technology if we refused to use things that have been created from less than moral beginnings

    Honytawk ,

    Indeed. Like a ton of modern medicine is based upon the findings of Nazi scientists torturing Jews and others.

    It is bad that it happened, but we wouldn’t be saving so many lives if we denied the information.

    goat OP ,

    Bad is putting it lightly. It’s an atrocity.

    ChairmanMeow ,
    @ChairmanMeow@programming.dev avatar

    That’s not actually true as far as I know. The Nazi experiments were rarely truly ‘scientific’, instead being poorly documented and often having no or poor controls.

    A lot of their ‘research’ ended up being unusable, unreproducible or just plain wrong.

    FluffyPotato ,

    That’s a common misconception. Nazi scientists were surprisingly incompetent, like they didn’t document shit, no control or even reason for doing what they did. Most of it seemed to exist just to torture people and the results were just useless. Because of how shit they were as scientists they didn’t even learn about torture.

    Oh and another shining example was when Nazies got flat earthers in their rocketry department who did not account for the curvature of the earth thus missing every time at long range. Also any evidence that counteracted their science was called Jewish science and discarded.

    antifascist ,

    deleted_by_moderator

    •
    Gooey0210 ,

    Great post, nobody will probably listen. They are too busy wrapped up in their side choosing, watching news, reading posts of other drones about other drones being drones

    I don’t believe China is any good, neither I believe the american Burgerland of free is good

    Everyone has heard of brainwashing, propaganda, governments manipulating people’s opinions. But they don’t have a clue how they get lost in it and working for the machine

    goat OP ,

    No one in this community is calling America good – Makes your comment pretty damn ironic.

    Gooey0210 ,

    But why all of your posts about are about politics? 🙃

    goat OP ,

    Because I like posting about it?

    18+ Gooey0210 , (edited )

    Also, just look at the posts and comments of the TC

    Everything is about wars, russia, capitalism and democracy

    I have a strong believe that this person is a Mr federal agent officer sir Or just a brainwashed blue fascist that wants to provoke people on Lemmy

    (No surprise where all the registered bots went)

    goat OP ,

    Take this comment to the Tankie Thread and I’ll respond to it.

    donuts ,
    @donuts@kbin.social avatar

    I use Kbin so I don't really care, but couldn't someone with at least a little bit of sanity just fork Lemmy? Or at the very least create more instances that aren't run by brainless delusional extremists...

    goat OP ,

    I believe beehaw is currently doing that, and I wouldn’t be surprised if other instance developers are doing the same in their own time.

    Ignacio ,

    Beehaw is not forking Lemmy. It's just leaving Lemmy for their own webpage, a forum or something like that. I really appreciate the idea of forking Lemmy, but nobody seems to think about that.

    Aux ,

    I’m thinking about it, but I don’t have free time atm.

    ShitOnABrick , (edited )
    @ShitOnABrick@lemmy.world avatar

    I agree with the sentiment of forking lemmy. It’ll add more alternative platforms aswell which Is great

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