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AdlachGyfiawn , to technology in China AI and Semiconductors Rise: US Sanctions Have Failed
@AdlachGyfiawn@lemmygrad.ml avatar

Good. Capitalists sure seem to hate the free market when it’s China doing it, huh?

protist , to technology in China AI and Semiconductors Rise: US Sanctions Have Failed

Thanks for posting! The authors conclude the US can still put a stop to this with coordinated effort. They recommend the US implement these steps to stop China from further developing domestic semiconductor technology, and I fully support that!

Here are some steps that could be taken to ensure that China does not develop the ability to mass-manufacture the sorts of chips needed for high-end military applications in the coming years:

Limit ArFi immersion lithography tools.

Limit servicing of existing equipment.

Limit ArFi photoresist.

Limit masks.

Limit mask blanks, writers, and other associated infrastructure.

Limit metrology equipment.

Limit CMP equipment.

Limit epitaxy equipment.

Limit dry etch equipment.

Limit CVD and ALD equipment.

Limit advanced packaging equipment.

Limit ion implantation equipment.

Limit semiconductor manufacturing equipment subsystems and subassemblies.

Limit etchant gas.

Limit deposition precursors.

Limit chips that have >25.6Tbps of IO even if they have no compute.

Limit chips that have >1000TOPS of performance.

Limit the licensing of 200G SerDes.

Limit EDA tools.

Limit Joint Ventures and inbound investments.

queermunist ,
@queermunist@lemmy.ml avatar

I fully support industrial sabotage and hindering China’s industrial development through economic warfare uwu

quicksand ,

Good idea, well said! Much better option to military warfare in my opinion.

queermunist ,
@queermunist@lemmy.ml avatar

Give peace a chance.

protist ,

Sure, this isn’t counter to that

queermunist ,
@queermunist@lemmy.ml avatar

Sanctions are siege warfare.

protist ,

No they’re not. Economic sanctions meet no definition of siege warfare

queermunist ,
@queermunist@lemmy.ml avatar

Warfare in which the defender is trapped in a position (such as a fort or castle) while the attacker bombards and/or barricades them from outside.

It’s a barricade erected around a country to block the flow of goods and travel and finance, with the goal of subjecting civilians to economic hardship so they turn on their government. It’s a siege, with the goal of creating enough pain within the country to encourage internal sabotage, revolt, and treachery.

Sanctions are warfare.

protist ,

These sanctions would be to ensure the US maintains a technological advantage through prohibiting the export of cutting edge technology. I’m wondering if you actually read what you quoted above before continuing to say this.

If you’re interested in actual modern examples of siege warfare, please read on

queermunist ,
@queermunist@lemmy.ml avatar

I just quoted a definition. Here, I’ll quote from your link.

The essence of a siege lies in the encirclement of a defended area and the subsequent isolation of the enemy forces by cutting of their channels of supply and reinforcement with a view of inducing the enemy into submission by means of starvation.

How does this not describe a sanctions regime? Obviously the sanctions on China are minor compared to other sanctioned nations, but look at the sanctions on Iran or Russia or Cuba or the Taliban regime. Encirclement, isolation, cutting channels of supply and reinforcement, and the goal in all those casrs is to induce the enemy into submission. Starvation isn’t uncommon.

The sanctions are meant to hurt the enemy.

protist ,

“Starvation isn’t uncommon”

Since the whole point is starvation, you should probably expound on how a ban on semiconductor technology exports to China will induce starvation

queermunist ,
@queermunist@lemmy.ml avatar

I was referring to the other , more heavily sanctioned nations that I also mentioned. Obviously.

protist ,

Oh ok, I didn’t realize we had strayed off topic. So it sounds like we’re in agreement these semiconductor sanctions against China are not “siege warfare”

queermunist ,
@queermunist@lemmy.ml avatar

I say it’s an opening salvo. Do you think it’ll stop here?

Just because the siege hasn’t fully begun doesn’t change what it is at its core.

protist ,

I’m not buying your slippery slope fallacy, but again, I’m glad you came around

queermunist ,
@queermunist@lemmy.ml avatar

Came around to what? I’m saying this is the begining of another sanctions regime - actually it started with Trump’s tradewar bullshit. There’s a clear escalation that these wars follow.

In every country they’re used, sanctions only ever get worse until the government collapses. Iraq, Iran, Cuba, Sudan, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan, DPRK, and now Russia. It’s almost always a one way street to worse and harsher sanctions until it sparks a civil war. China is next.

Learn some fucking history.

quicksand ,

Thanks for the summary. It’s funny to me that they’re suggesting limiting imports on pretty much every tool that’s used in making chips. A highly detailed blanket ban lol

skullgiver , (edited ) to technology in China AI & Semiconductors Rise: US Sanctions Have Failed
@skullgiver@popplesburger.hilciferous.nl avatar

deleted_by_author

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  • abuttandahalf ,

    “the wrong hands” they are currently in the wrong hands

    ink ,

    This is the same drivel that people and “analysts” were saying when the sanctions started. And look what they’ve accomplished in this short duration. They just have to eat a part of the market, even if it is inside their own country. There’s much more to the market than just 5nm chips.

    . If China’s aggressive response to the export restrictions are anything to go by, they’re not there yet

    But the restriction set on China were so fair, right? Could it be because they are confident. no wayyyyy, that can’t be.

    I mean fuck the CCP but there’s some serious copium going on.

    ZephyrXero , to technology in China AI & Semiconductors Rise: US Sanctions Have Failed

    Of course it’s going to backfire. China will just make their own chips and probably outpace everyone at some point. They’re starting out behind, but they will catch up

    ikiru , to technology in China AI & Semiconductors Rise: US Sanctions Have Failed

    I suggest you guys read the article before commenting or voting based on the title.

    No, I will upvote you for sharing this article and content regardless.

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