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qarbone , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"

If, 24 months from now, most people aren’t coding, it’ll be because people like him cut jobs to make a quicker buck. Or nickel.

Cringe2793 , (edited )

Well if it works, means that job wasn’t that important, and the people doing that job should improve themselves to stay relevant.

Edit: wow what a bunch of hypersensitive babies. I swear, y’all just allergic to learning or something. I just said people need to improve themselves to stay relevant, and people freak out and send me death threats. What a joke.

qarbone ,

Define “works”?

If you’re a CEO, cutting all your talent, enshittifying your product, and pocketing the difference in new, lower costs vs standard profits might be considered as “working”.

Cringe2793 ,

Hmmm maybe you’re misunderstanding me.

What I mean is “coding” is basically the grunt work of development. The real skill is understanding the requirements and building something efficiently. Tbh, I hate coding.

What tools like Gemini or ChatGPT brings to the table is the ability to create small, efficient snippets of code that works. We can then just modify it to meet our more specific requirements.

This makes things much faster, for me at least. If the time comes when the AI can generate more efficient code, making my job easier, I’d count that as “works” for me.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

job wasn’t that important

I keep telling you that changing out the battery in the smoke alarm isn’t worth the effort and you keep telling me that the house is currently on fire, we need to get out of here immediately, and I just roll my eyes because you’re only proving my point.

Cringe2793 ,

Sure, believe what you want to believe. You can either adapt to what’s happening, or just get phased out. AI is happening whether you like it or not. You may as well learn to use it.

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

I get why you’re enthusiastic about AI. This whole comment reads like it was AI generated.

NocturnalMorning ,

AI can’t do anything that hasn’t been done before. That’s never going to change.

FlorianSimon ,

It has already happened… And the results are a bit… “Cringe”

TheGalacticVoid ,

You can adapt, but how you adapt matters.

AI in tech companies is like a hammer or drill. You can either get rid of your entire construction staff and replace them with a few hammers, or you can keep your staff and give each worker a hammer. In the first scenario, nothing gets done, yet jobs are replaced. In the second scenario, people keep their jobs, their jobs are easier, and the house gets built.

Cringe2793 ,

Yup. Most of us aren’t CEOs, so we don’t have a lot of say about how most companies are run. All we can do is improve ourselves.

For some reason, a lot of people seem to be against that. They prefer to whine.

JustJack23 ,

Like in Twitter?

Cringe2793 ,

Nah that was just a bad CEO

echodot ,

Oh perhaps the CEOs are the ones that need to be replaced?

Cringe2793 ,

Yup, notice nowhere did I say they shouldnt. People read and infer what they want

prole ,

Define “works.”

Because the goals of a money-hungry CEO don’t always align with those of the workers in the company itself (or often, even the consumer). I imagine this guy will think it worked just fine as he’s enjoying his golden parachute.

CondensedPossum ,

😜 👢

slimarev92 , (edited ) to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"

If that’s true, how come there isn’t a single serious project written exclusively or mostly by an LLM? There isn’t a single library or remotely original application made with Claude or Gemini. Not one.

woodgen ,

Lets wait for any LLM do a single sucessful MR on Github first before starting a project on its own. Not aware of any.

Hawk ,

My last employer had many internal tools that were fine.

They had only a moderate amount of oversight.

I had to find a new job, I’m actually thinking of walking away from software development now that there are so few jobs :(

It sucks but there’s no sense pretending this won’t have a large impact on the job landscape.

slimarev92 , (edited )

What did these tools do? I don’t see any LLm being used for creating anything working from scratch, without the human propmter doing most of the heavy lifting.

Hawk ,

Mostly internal data cleaning stuff, close etc, which I accept is less in scope than you’re original comment.

jeeva ,

The things you are describing sound like if-statement levels of automation, GitHub Actions with preprogrammed responses rather than LLM whatever.

If you’re worrying about being replaced by that… Go find the code, read it, and feel better.

Hawk ,

The code was non trivial and relatively sophisticated. It performed statistical analysis on ingested data and the approach taken was statistically sound.

I was replaced by that. So was my colleague.

The job market is exceptionally tough right now and a large part of that is certainly llms.

I think taking people with statistical training out of the equation is quite dangerous, but it’s happening. In my area, everybody doing applied mathematics, statistics or analysis has been laid off.

In saying that, the produced program was quite good.

jeeva ,

Certainly sounds more interesting than my original read of it! Sorry about that, I was grumpy.

Hawk ,

All good man.

I think the point is that LLMs can replace people and they are quite good.

But they absolutely shouldn’t replace people, yet, or possibly ever.

But that’s what’s happening and it’s a massive problem because it’s leading to mediocre code in important spaces.

utopiah ,

there isn’t a single serious project written exclusively or mostly by an LLM? There isn’t a single library or remotely original application

IMHO “original” here is the key. Finding yet another clone of a Web framework ported from one language to another in order to push online a basic CMS slightly faster, I can imagine this. In fact I even bet that LLM, because they manipulate words in languages and that code can be safely (even thought not cheaply) tested within containers, could be an interesting solution for that.

… but that is NOT really creating value for anyone, unless that person is technically very savvy and thus able to leverage why a framework in a language over another creates new opportunities (say safety, performances, etc). So… for somebody who is not that savvy, “just” relying on the numerous existing already existing open-source providing exactly the value they expect, there is no incentive to re-invent.

For anything that is genuinely original, i.e something that is not a port to another architecture, a translation to another language, a slight optimization, but rather something that need just a bit of reasoning and evaluating against the value created, I’m very skeptical, even less so while pouring less resources EVEN with a radical drop in costs.

Fosheze , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"

A company I used to work for outsourced most of their coding to a company in India. I say most because when the code came back the internal teams anways had to put a bunch of work in to fix it and integrate it with existing systems. I imagine that, if anything, LLMs will just take the place of that overseas coding farm. The code they spit out will still need to be fixed and modified so it works with your existing systems and that work is going to require programmers.

ammonium ,

So instead of spending 1 day writing good code, we’ll be spending a week debugging shitty code. Great.

UnderpantsWeevil , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Translation: “We’re going to make the suite for building, testing, and deploying so obnoxiously difficult to integrate with your work environment that in two years nobody in your DevOps team will be able to get anything to a release state.”

Me, fiddling with a config file for a legacy Perl script that’s been holding up the ass-end of the business since 1996: “Uh, yeah that’s great.”

EnderMB , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"

I feel sorry for all those people in AWS that now have him as a leader…

TriflingToad , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"

Seriously how can these CEOs of a GPU company not talk to a developer. You have loads of them to interview

fuck_u_spez_in_particular ,

They obviously have to sell something. I doubt that they honestly think that this will happen.

Dkarma , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"

How will federal contracts work?

sudo42 , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"

Sure, Microsoft is happy to let their AIs scan everyone else’s code., but is anyone aware of any software houses letting AIs scan their in-house code?

Any lawyer worth their salt won’t let AIs anywhere near their company’s proprietary code intil they are positive that AI isn’t going to be blabbing the code out to every one of their competitors.

But of course, IANAL.

hessenjunge ,

The LLMs they train on their code will only be accessible internally. They won’t leak their own intellectual property.

JustJack23 ,

Will that not be more experiensive than having developers?

echodot ,

Yeah which is why this is a dumb statement from Amazon. But then again I don’t expect C-suite managers to really understand the intricacies of their own companies.

androogee ,

Of course not. It will be more expensive and they’ll still have to pay developers to figure out what’s wrong with their AI code.

Hawk ,

Depends on the use case. Training local llms is a lot cheaper after Galore and there are ways to get useful local models with only a moderate amount of effort, see e.g. augmentoolkit.

This may or may not be practical in many use cases.

24 months is pretty generous but no doubt there will be significantly less demand for junior developers in the near future.

hessenjunge ,

Possibly. It’s hard to know without seeing the numbers and assessing output quality and volume.

Also it’s not unheard of that some bigwig wastes millions of company €€ for some project they fancy. (Billions if they happen to be Elon)

prole ,

If only we had an overarching structure that everyone in society has agreed exists for the purposes of enforcing laws and regulating things. Something that governs people living in a region… Maybe then they could be compelled to show exactly what they’re using, and what those models are being trained with.

Oh well.

Aurelius , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"
@Aurelius@lemmy.world avatar

All the manufacturers of mechanical keyboards just cried 🥺

TheObviousSolution , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"
@TheObviousSolution@lemm.ee avatar

Can I join anyone’s band of AI server farm raiders 24 months from now? Anyone forming a group? I will bring my meat bicycle.

IndustryStandard , to technology in Amazon cloud boss echoes NVIDIA CEO on coding being dead in the water: "If you go forward 24 months from now, it's possible that most developers are not coding"

Cloud tech seller sells cloud

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